The LeBron James All-NBA (2nd) and Luka Doncic - 24-25 Thread

[dcstanley]

I'm warming up to swinging for Ingram and Kessler.

AR/Max/Ingram/LBJ/AD
DFS/Kessler
Reddish/Wood/Knecht

Basically have 7 guys you can trust in the playoffs, maybe 8 if Wood gets healthy. Wood can be a reasonable facsimile of Rui if he returns in shape this season.

Max, Kessler, DFS, and AD are all two way guys. Ingram might be a one-way player but he's at least an all-star level talent. He has the tools to be a solid defender with a reduced offensive role.

Ingram and Kessler? How would that work?

I'm cool with Ingram but Kessler would be a mistake.
But I'm interested in why it's a no for DeMar but a yes for Ingram?

DeMar has had better impact stats than Ingram for every season, including this one.
DeMar has shown positive impact stats with Raptors, Spurs, Bulls and now Kings (roughly in the 50th to 80th best range every year the past 5 seasons). He's a reliable impact player and I'd bet he'd be the same on the Lakers.

He got a bad rep because he was played as a number 1 option, when he's really a 3rd option. He's also paid cheaply now.

Well, Ingram is a gamble. You're betting on him reaching another level in his prime, his ability to adapt, and his physical tools. He has the physical tools to be a plus defender in a different role. He could also play fast which the Lakers need, he's more of a 3/4 than a 4/3 and he attempts 6 threes per game (7 per 36), shooting 37% from distance. He has a difficult shot diet so you would hope that more catch and shoot threes and isolation attempts on inferior defenders (since Bron/AD are going to get the tougher matchups) will result in higher efficiency. But like I said, it's a huge gamble. You're betting on Ingram becoming a player that he isn't today.

With Derozan, you know what kind of player he is. He's a good player but not plug and play by any means. I don't think this team can afford a PF that doesn't shoot any threes and struggles on defense. He's also very slow and plodding, last night was a clear indication that the Lakers need athletes around Lebron/AD. Rui scored efficiently last night and was still a disaster because of his defense and lack of athleticism. Sure, Derozan is considerably better than Rui but he doesn't optimize Lebron/AD. The offense would be really clunky and the defense isn't any better.

The Kings situation is an interesting parallel-- Derozan is a superior player to Barnes, like he is Rui, but the Kings are worse with his addition. Fox/Sabonis/Derozan all need adequate spacing to operate on their preferred spots on the floor, similar to Lebron/AD/Derozan.

[dcstanley]

The hayes v adams backup 5 mismatch was so terribly apparent

sigh. que sera sera

And Rui had 1 rebound....crazy

1 more month before the deadline

My real worry is Pelinka and Jeanie cheap out like usual and dont really make a big move or two and settle for a smaller move or 2

For ex we just add someone like Nick Richards or JOnas and call it a day and say the additions of Vando and Gabe (1 would go if its Jonas) playing better are enough

Its got to be add 2 guys and keep Rui or its add 3 guys if Rui is gone

We have a solid base and foundation, I just hope these morons in charge understand that

Read on Twitter

Data on some of these other center targets isn't looking good. I don't think they're going to make another big move (meaning trading Rui or Vando) so just gotta hope they hit on the move they make for guys making 10 mil and under. If it's Jonas you can throw this season in the trash. Hopefully Ainge plays ball.

[Ian Scuffling]

Lebrons +/- are bad because he's expected to carry the second unit. He just cant do that anymore. Not for an extensive period anyway.

I seriously wonder what his +/- looks like this season whenever he plays with the second unit.

Bingo. He's not THAT Lebron, anymore. We were talking about unreasonable standards the other day. This fits into that.

[zimpy27]

sigh. que sera sera

And Rui had 1 rebound....crazy

1 more month before the deadline

My real worry is Pelinka and Jeanie cheap out like usual and dont really make a big move or two and settle for a smaller move or 2

For ex we just add someone like Nick Richards or JOnas and call it a day and say the additions of Vando and Gabe (1 would go if its Jonas) playing better are enough

Its got to be add 2 guys and keep Rui or its add 3 guys if Rui is gone

We have a solid base and foundation, I just hope these morons in charge understand that

Read on Twitter

Data on some of these other center targets isn't looking good. I don't think they're going to make another big move (meaning trading Rui or Vando) so just gotta hope they hit on the move they make for guys making 10 mil and under. If it's Jonas you can throw this season in the trash. Hopefully Ainge plays ball.

I agree with this. Kessler is the best of the named Center targets by a margin. But there are unnamed Center options and their are Vando and Wood yet to return.

Don't forget that Vando rebounds as well as Hayes does and he does it from the PF or SF spot.
Wood rebounds almost as well as Davis.

Wood and Vando were the 2nd and 3rd best rebounders on the Lakers last season. Once they return it's going to be a different team on the boards, and they return this month.

[dcstanley]

And Rui had 1 rebound....crazy

1 more month before the deadline

My real worry is Pelinka and Jeanie cheap out like usual and dont really make a big move or two and settle for a smaller move or 2

For ex we just add someone like Nick Richards or JOnas and call it a day and say the additions of Vando and Gabe (1 would go if its Jonas) playing better are enough

Its got to be add 2 guys and keep Rui or its add 3 guys if Rui is gone

We have a solid base and foundation, I just hope these morons in charge understand that

Read on Twitter

Data on some of these other center targets isn't looking good. I don't think they're going to make another big move (meaning trading Rui or Vando) so just gotta hope they hit on the move they make for guys making 10 mil and under. If it's Jonas you can throw this season in the trash. Hopefully Ainge plays ball.

I agree with this. Kessler is the best of the named Center targets by a margin. But there are unnamed Center options and their are Vando and Wood yet to return.

Don't forget that Vando rebounds as well as Hayes does and he does it from the PF or SF spot.
Wood rebounds almost as well as Davis.

Wood and Vando were the 2nd and 3rd best rebounders on the Lakers last season. Once they return it's going to be a different team on the boards, and they return this month.

Can't expect those guys to be difference makers after a calendar year off. And it's not like either performed at an exceptionally high level when they were healthy last season. They are extremely flawed players.

Ideally, they both can be 15-20 MPG contributors but I would like to get one or two more sure things, like DFS.

[nzahir]

Sidery reporting were taking a look at Vuc....

If its Vuc, then Rui needs to go

Would you guys want Lonzo as well? Would mean Vando and Vincent go (those 3 and Wood). I assume we can do a protected 1st and those 3 guys for Zo and Vuc

Reaves, Christie, DFS, Bron, AD
Lonzo, Knecht, Cam, ?? Vuc

I think we need a better 3rd wing than Cam at least. Still have salary with JHS, Shake, and Wood/Cam and a couple 2nds. Caleb martin? Cody martin? Oubre? Konchar? Okogie? Not a lot of great options, unless we maybe look to move another 1st for a younger wing?

Other option is get Vuc and White. Maybe move Knecht in that deal since White is young if they want him?

But maybe giving up too much defensively now. Still do have Vando though

[trickshot]

Can't expect those guys to be difference makers after a calendar year off. And it's not like either performed at an exceptionally high level when they were healthy last season. They are extremely flawed players.

Ideally, they both can be 15-20 MPG contributors but I would like to get one or two more sure things, like DFS.

Yeah not sure how common guys this injured for this long make it to the playoffs then stay healthy for the whole thing. Injured for the season too often means injured for the playoffs. Vando is a huge loss that might be worth the opportunity risk. Everyone else needs to start learning Chinese. These guys are making AD look like Karl Malone.

[ShaqAttac]

Lebrons +/- are bad because he's expected to carry the second unit. He just cant do that anymore. Not for an extensive period anyway.

I seriously wonder what his +/- looks like this season whenever he plays with the second unit.

Bingo. He's not THAT Lebron, anymore. We were talking about unreasonable standards the other day. This fits into that.

bron curry port off

[Tracymcgoaty]

Sidery reporting were taking a look at Vuc....

If its Vuc, then Rui needs to go

Would you guys want Lonzo as well? Would mean Vando and Vincent go (those 3 and Wood). I assume we can do a protected 1st and those 3 guys for Zo and Vuc

Reaves, Christie, DFS, Bron, AD
Lonzo, Knecht, Cam, ?? Vuc

I think we need a better 3rd wing than Cam at least. Still have salary with JHS, Shake, and Wood/Cam and a couple 2nds. Caleb martin? Cody martin? Oubre? Konchar? Okogie? Not a lot of great options, unless we maybe look to move another 1st for a younger wing?

Other option is get Vuc and White. Maybe move Knecht in that deal since White is young if they want him?

But maybe giving up too much defensively now. Still do have Vando though

Isn't Vuc defense negative across the board? Only way i take Vuc is if we somehow get Zo back.. No way am i taking Vuc by himself screw that. He's not a winnng player period.

[Mos_Heat]

We dont have enough to offer them w/o Reaves being included and Reaves has looked amazing without Dlo

Lakers have enough. 2 picks and Knecht is enough for an expiring all star guard

The fit is not ideal, but LA wants another star for the post Lebron era

Hou would outbid us

2 1sts, 2 swaps, Knecht, Vincent, JHS, and Rui/Vando+Shake+Hayes are salaries btw

Usually when a guy has one year left on his deal his agent can direct where his client goes via trade.

That's an off-season discussion anyways. i just think that Fox is good and realistic enough. So unless LAL can get a game changer or 2 rock solid role players, they probably should keep draft picks

[D.Brasco]

Read on Twitter

LeBron was (and is) the freakiest of athletes.

[nzahir]

Sidery reporting were taking a look at Vuc....

If its Vuc, then Rui needs to go

Would you guys want Lonzo as well? Would mean Vando and Vincent go (those 3 and Wood). I assume we can do a protected 1st and those 3 guys for Zo and Vuc

Reaves, Christie, DFS, Bron, AD
Lonzo, Knecht, Cam, ?? Vuc

I think we need a better 3rd wing than Cam at least. Still have salary with JHS, Shake, and Wood/Cam and a couple 2nds. Caleb martin? Cody martin? Oubre? Konchar? Okogie? Not a lot of great options, unless we maybe look to move another 1st for a younger wing?

Other option is get Vuc and White. Maybe move Knecht in that deal since White is young if they want him?

But maybe giving up too much defensively now. Still do have Vando though

Isn't Vuc defense negative across the board? Only way i take Vuc is if we somehow get Zo back.. No way am i taking Vuc by himself screw that. He's not a winnng player period.

Yes he is a very bad defensive player from all the stats

I would want Zo back with him as well, but then Vando is gone for salaries

Most logical easy trade to do, especially with new CBA, is Kessler and Sexton for Vincent and Vando. Unprotect 27, unrpotected 1st, and 1 pick with protections

Still have some salaries to move (JHS+vet min or just 1 of the two)

The deal isnt perfect b/c I wold prefer a 2 way guard with size, but its the most simple

Perfect trade would be a C like Kessler or Turner and a 2 way big

Dream scenario is that+upgrading Rui

I wonder if Indiana has any interest in Kessler and gives some value + Turner for him. Get a younger C who has another year of making little $

If we could get Nembhard (unsure how his contract works with extension) and Turner for Rui+2 1sts+salary if needed. I would feel great about this teams chances. I think I would move Knecht (and Vincent), but need to get a 2/3 or 3/4 back

Reaves, Christie, DFS, Bron, AD
Nembhard, Knecht/replacement? Vando, Turner

[nzahir]

Lakers have enough. 2 picks and Knecht is enough for an expiring all star guard

The fit is not ideal, but LA wants another star for the post Lebron era

Hou would outbid us

2 1sts, 2 swaps, Knecht, Vincent, JHS, and Rui/Vando+Shake+Hayes are salaries btw

Usually when a guy has one year left on his deal his agent can direct where his client goes via trade.

That's an off-season discussion anyways. i just think that Fox is good and realistic enough. So unless LAL can get a game changer or 2 rock solid role players, they probably should keep draft picks

Cant keep on waiting for the "right deal"

This team was stupid enough to not push in more chips in 2022-2023 at the deadline

Maybe we could have won the chip that year if we had another C to help vs Jokic and or if we got Conley instead of Dlo

If we can get Fox THIS deadline, sure. Rui, Knecht, Vincent, salary filler, 2 1sts, 3 swaps (26, 28, 30) for Fox and Len

Fox, Reaves, DFS, Bron, AD
Milton, Christie, Vando, Wood, Len

Does this even help us honestly? We got smaller and have very little depth

[zimpy27]

Sidery reporting were taking a look at Vuc....

If its Vuc, then Rui needs to go

Would you guys want Lonzo as well? Would mean Vando and Vincent go (those 3 and Wood). I assume we can do a protected 1st and those 3 guys for Zo and Vuc

Reaves, Christie, DFS, Bron, AD
Lonzo, Knecht, Cam, ?? Vuc

I think we need a better 3rd wing than Cam at least. Still have salary with JHS, Shake, and Wood/Cam and a couple 2nds. Caleb martin? Cody martin? Oubre? Konchar? Okogie? Not a lot of great options, unless we maybe look to move another 1st for a younger wing?

Other option is get Vuc and White. Maybe move Knecht in that deal since White is young if they want him?

But maybe giving up too much defensively now. Still do have Vando though

Isn't Vuc defense negative across the board? Only way i take Vuc is if we somehow get Zo back.. No way am i taking Vuc by himself screw that. He's not a winnng player period.

Yes he is a very bad defensive player from all the stats

I would want Zo back with him as well, but then Vando is gone for salaries

Most logical easy trade to do, especially with new CBA, is Kessler and Sexton for Vincent and Vando. Unprotect 27, unrpotected 1st, and 1 pick with protections

Still have some salaries to move (JHS+vet min or just 1 of the two)

The deal isnt perfect b/c I wold prefer a 2 way guard with size, but its the most simple

Perfect trade would be a C like Kessler or Turner and a 2 way big

Dream scenario is that+upgrading Rui

I wonder if Indiana has any interest in Kessler and gives some value + Turner for him. Get a younger C who has another year of making little $

If we could get Nembhard (unsure how his contract works with extension) and Turner for Rui+2 1sts+salary if needed. I would feel great about this teams chances. I think I would move Knecht (and Vincent), but need to get a 2/3 or 3/4 back

Reaves, Christie, DFS, Bron, AD
Nembhard, Knecht/replacement? Vando, Turner

Bulls get Rui, Vando, Gabe, JHS, Hayes
Lakers get Vucevic, Ball, Craig

It's a huge trade, seems unlikely to me.


Reaves, Christie, DFS, LeBron, Davis
Ball, Reddish, Knecht, Craig, Vuc

[zimpy27]

Would you guys do Rui+Vando+Gabe+Christie+JHS for Butler+Pelle?

The trade ends the team with Reaves, Butler, DFS, LeBron, Davis (seems like the best starting 5 in the NBA). But the bench would be relying on some buyout guys joining.. it would have Reddish, Knecht and Wood.

[jalengreen]

Read on Twitter

No words lmao

[AmIWrongDude]

Read on Twitter

No words lmao

Dude was fouled too lol

[Fadeaway_J]

Hayes = waste of time

[nzahir]

Would you guys do Rui+Vando+Gabe+Christie+JHS for Butler+Pelle?

The trade ends the team with Reaves, Butler, DFS, LeBron, Davis (seems like the best starting 5 in the NBA). But the bench would be relying on some buyout guys joining.. it would have Reddish, Knecht and Wood.

Ehh idk

I like our main core, think we need to lean into defensive identity as that may be our best shot

I think Max has helped us turn things around

Not sure if Jimmy will give enough defensive effort in the reg season, but havent watched him to really know

Spacing is the main concern there

Rather just give up the 1sts for a very good C and a 3rd guard to play with AR and Max

If Miami is willing to take literally just that package, a 26 swap, and a 28 swap with very limited protections, sure

Then I would flip both 1sts and unprotect 27 for Kessler. Protect 1 of them.

Reaves, Butler, DFS, Bron, AD
Milton, Burks (instead of Pelle), Knecht, Kessler

Seems like too complicated to make a Butler deal work honestly and have depth

[tone wone]

Lebron's been much better lately yet the Lebron+bench lineups are still way underwater.

Almost doesn't matter the combinations, they can't hold a lead nor erase a deficit without Davis.