Josh Hart and KAT call out the Minutes Police!

[MrDollarBills]

When we get to the playoffs we will have built up the stamina where playoff minutes will be easier for our players. When these other teams up their minutes against us and are gassed, going to hear crickets from the minutes police.

So do you seriously think that this is sustainable? Playing 6 guys nearly 40 mins a night?

Meanwhile, the Cavs minutes are capped at 30 mins or less a night. They are going to be fresh and ready for a long playoff run. I have serious concerns about this squad making it to April intact at this rate.

[JayTWill]

Minutes police: Thibs needs to play the bench!

The Bench:

Our bench sucks, and I don't expect them to develop into some productive unit by just giving them playing time.

But they should be splitting 12 additional minutes to manage the playing time of our key players, especially those who have a track record of injury, starting with OG and KAT.

It may cost a couple games but I think you still have to keep eyes on the prize and plan for the medium to long term.

Just cutting into OG's playing time by 3 minutes removes 7 (rounded up from 6.7) games from his season. It's a meaningful difference on the whole, even if it looks insignificant at first glance.

You say it may cost a couple games, what is the lowest playoff spot you would be comfortable going down to, to give OG three more minutes of rest?

But what is the purpose of having a higher seed when Thibs has lost as the higher seed so many times from his Chicago days until now? What did the 2nd seed get the Knicks last year? A tough first round matchup against the Sixers and multiple injuries? A loss against the 6th seed in the 2nd round?

What did 4th get them in Thibs first year other than being thoroughly outplayed by the 5th seed Hawks that they swept in the regular season?

Did being the 5th seed prevent the play-in 8th seed Heat from beating him and Spo out-coaching him?

[WargamesX]

Our bench sucks, and I don't expect them to develop into some productive unit by just giving them playing time.

But they should be splitting 12 additional minutes to manage the playing time of our key players, especially those who have a track record of injury, starting with OG and KAT.

It may cost a couple games but I think you still have to keep eyes on the prize and plan for the medium to long term.

Just cutting into OG's playing time by 3 minutes removes 7 (rounded up from 6.7) games from his season. It's a meaningful difference on the whole, even if it looks insignificant at first glance.

You say it may cost a couple games, what is the lowest playoff spot you would be comfortable going down to, to give OG three more minutes of rest?

But what is the purpose of having a higher seed when Thibs has lost as the higher seed so many times from his Chicago days until now? What did the 2nd seed get the Knicks last year? A tough first round matchup against the Sixers and multiple injuries? A loss against the 6th seed in the 2nd round?

What did 4th get them in Thibs first year other than being thoroughly outplayed by the 5th seed Hawks that they swept in the regular season?

Did being the 5th seed prevent the play-in 8th seed Heat from beating him and Spo out-coaching him?

This might be the most honest assessment of Thibs entire knick tenure and no one in the professional sports media has the courage to bring this up themselves.

[Fat Kat]

When we get to the playoffs we will have built up the stamina where playoff minutes will be easier for our players. When these other teams up their minutes against us and are gassed, going to hear crickets from the minutes police.

So do you seriously think that this is sustainable? Playing 6 guys nearly 40 mins a night?

Meanwhile, the Cavs minutes are capped at 30 mins or less a night. They are going to be fresh and ready for a long playoff run. I have serious concerns about this squad making it to April intact at this rate.

Nope, but I do hope that he trust Shamet enough to continue giving him minutes when Duece returns. So an 8 man rotation with Duece and a 9 man with Mitch. If not Mitch, then a trade for a rotation player.

[Gravy]

Our bench sucks, and I don't expect them to develop into some productive unit by just giving them playing time.

But they should be splitting 12 additional minutes to manage the playing time of our key players, especially those who have a track record of injury, starting with OG and KAT.

It may cost a couple games but I think you still have to keep eyes on the prize and plan for the medium to long term.

Just cutting into OG's playing time by 3 minutes removes 7 (rounded up from 6.7) games from his season. It's a meaningful difference on the whole, even if it looks insignificant at first glance.

You say it may cost a couple games, what is the lowest playoff spot you would be comfortable going down to, to give OG three more minutes of rest?

But what is the purpose of having a higher seed when Thibs has lost as the higher seed so many times from his Chicago days until now? What did the 2nd seed get the Knicks last year? A tough first round matchup against the Sixers and multiple injuries? A loss against the 6th seed in the 2nd round?

What did 4th get them in Thibs first year other than being thoroughly outplayed by the 5th seed Hawks that they swept in the regular season?

Did being the 5th seed prevent the play-in 8th seed Heat from beating him and Spo out-coaching him?

Would you rather play the Celtics in the 1st round, 2nd rnd or ecf?

[DOT]

So do you seriously think that this is sustainable? Playing 6 guys nearly 40 mins a night?

If it were a good strategy, everyone would be doing it

Here's the last 10 years' leader in starters mpg along with how their season went:

2024: Bulls - under .500, missed the playoffs
2023: Raptors - .500, missed the playoffs
2022: Raptors - won 48 games, lost in the 1st round
2021: Raptors - under .500, missed the playoffs
2020: Covid year
2019: Rockets - won 53 games, lost in the 2nd round
2018: Timberwolves - won 47 games, lost in the 1st round
2017: Timberwolves - under .500, missed the playoffs
2016: Pistons - won 44 games, lost in the 1st round
2015: Clippers - won 56 games, lost in the 2nd round

Really only the Rockets in 2019 and Clippers in 2015 could be considered "good" teams, the rest were all mediocre to bad

Meanwhile here's where each champion ranked in terms of starters mpg:

2024: 5th
2023: 15th
2022: 29th
2021: 16th
2020: Covid year
2019: 6th
2018: 18th
2017: 20th
2016: 10th
2015: 21st

No real correlation, but only 2 teams had their starters in the top 9, only 4 were in the top 15.

[Capn'O]

Players want to play, that's how they're wired.

That's why you need sober minds in the organization to manage their minutes.

It should be the coach, but ours plays basketball vicariously through his players, and he gets lost in the meat grinder as if he were wearing a headband and Patrick Ewing knee pads.

We have a good-to-great basketball coach, but also a mad general.

The front office should've put guardrails around the minutes management a while ago. Players who love basketball will play even at their own cost.

That's a bingo.

[Kampuchea]

When we get to the playoffs we will have built up the stamina where playoff minutes will be easier for our players. When these other teams up their minutes against us and are gassed, going to hear crickets from the minutes police.

So do you seriously think that this is sustainable? Playing 6 guys nearly 40 mins a night?

Meanwhile, the Cavs minutes are capped at 30 mins or less a night. They are going to be fresh and ready for a long playoff run. I have serious concerns about this squad making it to April intact at this rate.

Yes, I think we are building stamina and will benefit from it. I know when I start my bike riding just after winter, I wear down much faster than in summer when I have built up to go faster and for longer distances.

These other teams will not be used to the added minutes and tire out in the 4th when we will have a huge advantage.

[Gravy]

Would anyone expect them to say otherwise?

Players aren’t going to throw a coach that they respect under the bus. Which actually shows that they still respect him and believe in what he’s doing. It’s been a theme for Thibs’ teams, that’s why they all overachieve because players respect him and buy in.

This is also the coach thats giving them the best seasons of their careers and maybe the only chance to be on a contender. How many players did he get help get PAID recently; Ihart, IQ, RJ, OG, Randle, JB could have but chose to help the team

[Kampuchea]

The players and organization loves Thibs, he is going nowhere and the minutes issue is not even an issue to start with. All fans love to complain about their teams coaches and the same can be said about the Knicks, but he is one of the best in the league.



https://www.nba.com/news/nba-sends-data-load-management-study

The NBA sent data from an exhaustive study to its teams this week that showed no link between load-managed players and a decreased risk of injury.

[Luv those Knicks]

Josh Hart has one of those motors where he could play 48 minutes in a game, 5 minutes in OT, 53 total, then play 53 again the next day. I don't worry about him.

I do worry about players who are more prone to break down, like OG and to a lesser extent Kat & Brunson.

[JayTWill]

You say it may cost a couple games, what is the lowest playoff spot you would be comfortable going down to, to give OG three more minutes of rest?

But what is the purpose of having a higher seed when Thibs has lost as the higher seed so many times from his Chicago days until now? What did the 2nd seed get the Knicks last year? A tough first round matchup against the Sixers and multiple injuries? A loss against the 6th seed in the 2nd round?

What did 4th get them in Thibs first year other than being thoroughly outplayed by the 5th seed Hawks that they swept in the regular season?

Did being the 5th seed prevent the play-in 8th seed Heat from beating him and Spo out-coaching him?

Would you rather play the Celtics in the 1st round, 2nd rnd or ecf?

They never made it to the Celtics so who cares. They could have gotten just as far as they did last year without being a 2nd seed. Mitch might have actually survived a non-Embiid first round matchup. Thibs wasn't trying to avoid the Celtics until ECF. He is just doing what he does. Trying to win every game he can the only way he knows how. His regular season success has never been a true indicator of what should be expected in the postseason.

Year 1 in NY - Swept the Hawks the regular season. Lost to the lower seeded Hawks in 5 in the postseason
Year 2 - Missed playoffs
Year 3 - Beat the Heat 3 out of 4 games in the regular season. Lost to the lower seeded Heat in 6 in the postseason
Year 4 - Can't really judge with the amount of injuries but part of me does wonder if a healthy version of the Knicks with Thibs shortened rotation would have held up against the Pacers depth and pace.

Being a higher seed meant nothing in those matchups.

[Gravy]

But what is the purpose of having a higher seed when Thibs has lost as the higher seed so many times from his Chicago days until now? What did the 2nd seed get the Knicks last year? A tough first round matchup against the Sixers and multiple injuries? A loss against the 6th seed in the 2nd round?

What did 4th get them in Thibs first year other than being thoroughly outplayed by the 5th seed Hawks that they swept in the regular season?

Did being the 5th seed prevent the play-in 8th seed Heat from beating him and Spo out-coaching him?

Would you rather play the Celtics in the 1st round, 2nd rnd or ecf?

They never made it to the Celtics so who cares. They could have gotten just as far as they did last year without being a 2nd seed. Mitch might have actually survived a non-Embiid first round matchup. Thibs wasn't trying to avoid the Celtics until ECF. He is just doing what he does. Trying to win every game he can the only way he knows how. His regular season success has never been a true indicator of what should be expected in the postseason.

Year 1 in NY - Swept the Hawks the regular season. Lost to the lower seeded Hawks in 5 in the postseason
Year 2 - Missed playoffs
Year 3 - Beat the Heat 3 out of 4 games in the regular season. Lost to the lower seeded Heat in 6 in the postseason
Year 4 - Can't really judge with the amount of injuries but part of me does wonder if a healthy version of the Knicks with Thibs shortened rotation would have held up against the Pacers depth and pace.

Being a higher seed meant nothing in those matchups.

So you would be fine playing the Celtics in the 1st round as the 7th seed this season

[sol537]

Fact: We're one of the worst 4th quarter teams
Fact: We had leads on good teams like CLE and OKC entering into the 4th and ran out of gas
Fact: We have the bench with the lowest mins played and lowest points put up
Fact: We have two injury prone players in OG and KAT that are playing record minutes
Fact: Thibs played the starters an avg of 40+ minutes each in back to back losses within 24 hours (OKC-CHI)
Fact: Our 3pt shooting has fallen off a cliff in the past few weeks
Fact: Our team is an above average defense when well rested but one of the worst when fatigued
Fact: Brunson is playing hobbled, so is KAT, so is OG, and Deuce can't stay on the floor

Thibs is a problem folks. Don't need a minutes police to say so. Look at the facts.

[Jalen Bluntson]

When we get to the playoffs we will have built up the stamina where playoff minutes will be easier for our players. When these other teams up their minutes against us and are gassed, going to hear crickets from the minutes police.

So do you seriously think that this is sustainable? Playing 6 guys nearly 40 mins a night?

Meanwhile, the Cavs minutes are capped at 30 mins or less a night. They are going to be fresh and ready for a long playoff run. I have serious concerns about this squad making it to April intact at this rate.

Yes, I think we are building stamina and will benefit from it. I know when I start my bike riding just after winter, I wear down much faster than in summer when I have built up to go faster and for longer distances.

These other teams will not be used to the added minutes and tire out in the 4th when we will have a huge advantage.

They can build stamina on an exercise bike. Not running and jumping and banging their bodies around putting more wear and tear on them for 82 games. What they will actually be doing is beating on their bodies more than necessary for 6 months and then have to play in the playoffs. Your logic doesn't not equate at all.

[MrDollarBills]

The players and organization loves Thibs, he is going nowhere and the minutes issue is not even an issue to start with. All fans love to complain about their teams coaches and the same can be said about the Knicks, but he is one of the best in the league.



https://www.nba.com/news/nba-sends-data-load-management-study

The NBA sent data from an exhaustive study to its teams this week that showed no link between load-managed players and a decreased risk of injury.

Asking for a minutes reduction isn't load management though.

[MrDollarBills]

When we get to the playoffs we will have built up the stamina where playoff minutes will be easier for our players. When these other teams up their minutes against us and are gassed, going to hear crickets from the minutes police.

So do you seriously think that this is sustainable? Playing 6 guys nearly 40 mins a night?

Meanwhile, the Cavs minutes are capped at 30 mins or less a night. They are going to be fresh and ready for a long playoff run. I have serious concerns about this squad making it to April intact at this rate.

Yes, I think we are building stamina and will benefit from it. I know when I start my bike riding just after winter, I wear down much faster than in summer when I have built up to go faster and for longer distances.

These other teams will not be used to the added minutes and tire out in the 4th when we will have a huge advantage.

You're not factoring in the physical wear and tear that comes from playing though. KAT hits the floor hard at least once or twice a game. OG is historically prone to missing time. Stamina will mean little if guys' bodies are broken down by March.

[DaGawd]

When we get to the playoffs we will have built up the stamina where playoff minutes will be easier for our players. When these other teams up their minutes against us and are gassed, going to hear crickets from the minutes police.

So do you seriously think that this is sustainable? Playing 6 guys nearly 40 mins a night?

Meanwhile, the Cavs minutes are capped at 30 mins or less a night. They are going to be fresh and ready for a long playoff run. I have serious concerns about this squad making it to April intact at this rate.

Yes, I think we are building stamina and will benefit from it. I know when I start my bike riding just after winter, I wear down much faster than in summer when I have built up to go faster and for longer distances.

These other teams will not be used to the added minutes and tire out in the 4th when we will have a huge advantage.

this all sounds good in theory.. but these dudes are human.. the nba season is too long and the game is too fast and wide open for this to be sustainable. maybe you could get away with it in the 90s when pace was much slower.. but not in todays league

[Kampuchea]

So do you seriously think that this is sustainable? Playing 6 guys nearly 40 mins a night?

Meanwhile, the Cavs minutes are capped at 30 mins or less a night. They are going to be fresh and ready for a long playoff run. I have serious concerns about this squad making it to April intact at this rate.

Yes, I think we are building stamina and will benefit from it. I know when I start my bike riding just after winter, I wear down much faster than in summer when I have built up to go faster and for longer distances.

These other teams will not be used to the added minutes and tire out in the 4th when we will have a huge advantage.

this all sounds good in theory.. but these dudes are human.. the nba season is too long and the game is too fast and wide open for this to be sustainable. maybe you could get away with it in the 90s when pace was much slower.. but not in todays league

I don’t buy that, the 90s teams beat the hell out of each other. Especially the Knicks. Less cardio but more physical play.

[spree8]

Yes, I think we are building stamina and will benefit from it. I know when I start my bike riding just after winter, I wear down much faster than in summer when I have built up to go faster and for longer distances.

These other teams will not be used to the added minutes and tire out in the 4th when we will have a huge advantage.

this all sounds good in theory.. but these dudes are human.. the nba season is too long and the game is too fast and wide open for this to be sustainable. maybe you could get away with it in the 90s when pace was much slower.. but not in todays league

I don’t buy that, the 90s teams beat the hell out of each other. Especially the Knicks. Less cardio but more physical play.

Game has evolved significantly from the 90’s. These guys move so much more it’s insane. That’s what Thibs doesn’t even understand, but it’s a fact. 40 minutes now vs 40 mins then is nowhere near the same