DEN/TOR

[TheProfessor]

Denver in: Chris Boucher+Garrett Temple
Denver out: Dario Saric+ DeRon Holmes+ filler (Cancar/Deandre Jordon)

Reportedly, Denver seems interested in Boucher. Denver gets there guy while getting off Dario Saric's player option, a Corpse or end of bench player and an injured rookie.

Raptors in: Dario Saric+DeRon Holmes+filler (Cancar/Deandre Jordon)
Raptors out: Boucher+ Garrett Temple

Raptors embrace the tank harder and start the sell off, while getting a former first round pick to help the rebuild and only taking on 5m next year.

This trade can be done with or without Garrett Temple, and requires Cancar or Deandre Jordon to sign off. Can be subbed with Pickett or Tyson if needed.

[Thaddy]

An achilles injury at 22 isn't worth gambling on. The Raptors could do better than this and get a 2nd round pick from another team. If the Nuggets are willing to give up a 1st round pick that would change things. The pick would be in the early 2030s but the Raptors could use it as a tradable asset before that.

[Consequence]

An achilles injury at 22 isn't worth gambling on. The Raptors could do better than this and get a 2nd round pick from another team. If the Nuggets are willing to give up a 1st round pick that would change things. The pick would be in the early 2030s but the Raptors could use it as a tradable asset before that.

No way that Denver would include a 1st. Far too much downside. I think taking a chance on a recent 1st rounder that can play a position that the Raptors can use is fine. It's a rookie contract, the option years can always be declined if the injury has actually ruined him.

[Wigginstime]

Too good for Denver; however, I wouldn't include their 2031 1st to close the gap. Unless a 2nd is enough, I'm struggling to make this work value wise.

[Thaddy]

An achilles injury at 22 isn't worth gambling on. The Raptors could do better than this and get a 2nd round pick from another team. If the Nuggets are willing to give up a 1st round pick that would change things. The pick would be in the early 2030s but the Raptors could use it as a tradable asset before that.

No way that Denver would include a 1st. Far too much downside. I think taking a chance on a recent 1st rounder that can play a position that the Raptors can use is fine. It's a rookie contract, the option years can always be declined if the injury has actually ruined him.

Which player has had a achilles injury that required surgery and then came back to perform well? There isn't any? The Raptors aren't going to take on Zeke's bad contract and the Nuggets will need to give up a pick to get off it.

[MoneyTalks41890]

Imo there are better targets for Denver.

But Nnaji, Saric, 2030 swap top 4 prot for Boucher would be a good way to get an upside pick for Toronto.

[Consequence]

An achilles injury at 22 isn't worth gambling on. The Raptors could do better than this and get a 2nd round pick from another team. If the Nuggets are willing to give up a 1st round pick that would change things. The pick would be in the early 2030s but the Raptors could use it as a tradable asset before that.

No way that Denver would include a 1st. Far too much downside. I think taking a chance on a recent 1st rounder that can play a position that the Raptors can use is fine. It's a rookie contract, the option years can always be declined if the injury has actually ruined him.

Which player has had a achilles injury that required surgery and then came back to perform well? There isn't any? The Raptors aren't going to take on Zeke's bad contract and the Nuggets will need to give up a pick to get off it.

This trade doesn't have Zeke Nnaji in it, so that's not relevant. And as for history, Kevin Durant is a pretty notable player to perform well after an Achilles injury. Look, it's Chris Boucher. Even taking on a bit of salary for next year, there won't be much upside coming back in a trade. I think Holmes has enough of a chance that it's better than PJ Tucker and a 2031 Clippers 2nd or something.

[BelgradeNugget]

To get Holmes, Nuggets traded
28th pick, 56th overall pick, 2026 second-round pick and 2031 second-round pick.
They drafted him at 22.
Is this a value of Chris Boucher?

[MessiahUjiri]

To get Holmes, Nuggets traded
28th pick, 56th overall pick, 2026 second-round pick and 2031 second-round pick.
They drafted him at 22.
Is this a value of Chris Boucher?

You’re talking about a pre Achilles heel injury.

This ain’t the same world.

[oldncreaky]

To get Holmes Nuggets traded
28th pick, 56th overall pick, 2026 second-round pick and 2031 second-round pick.
They drafted him at 22.
Is this value of Chris Boucher?

I'll accept that Boucher has little value, but TOR needs some incentive, something positive

What you traded to get the 22nd pick really doesn't matter to Holmes' value today. What does affect the value of that 22nd pick is an injury that means he is yet to play a minute of NBA game time.

TOR already has 5 rookies, the highest picked #19, and adding a 6th in Holmes who can't play is not an incentive; adding Holmes arguable makes a trade worse because we'd have to cut someone to roster Holmes

[Godaddycurse]

To get Holmes, Nuggets traded
28th pick, 56th overall pick, 2026 second-round pick and 2031 second-round pick.
They drafted him at 22.
Is this a value of Chris Boucher?

You’re talking about a pre Achilles heel injury.

This ain’t the same world.

That and the matching (saric or nnaji, but esp the latter) are negative

[BelgradeNugget]

To get Holmes, Nuggets traded
28th pick, 56th overall pick, 2026 second-round pick and 2031 second-round pick.
They drafted him at 22.
Is this a value of Chris Boucher?

You’re talking about a pre Achilles heel injury.
This ain’t the same world.

I'll accept that Boucher has little value, but TOR needs some incentive, something positive

What you traded to get the 22nd pick really doesn't matter to Holmes' value today. What does affect the value of that 22nd pick is an injury that means he is yet to play a minute of NBA game time.

TOR already has 5 rookies, the highest picked #19, and adding a 6th in Holmes who can't play is not an incentive; adding Holmes arguable makes a trade worse because we'd have to cut someone to roster Holmes

In this moment we don't know value of Holmes. Nuggets were obviously high on him and gave a lot to get him. Don't forget when no one wanted to draft MPJ after 1 back surgery, Nuggets drafted him at 14, he had another back surgery, had good season in the bubble, than had another back surgery, recovered, helped them win championship as starting SF and is now having his best season as 26 yo.

Isn't it more resonable for Nuggets to wait and see what they can get from him. You don't trade players when they have lowest value possible. What if Holmes instead of becoming starter only becomes good bench player which is exectly what they need.

[islandboy53]

Denver in: Chris Boucher+Garrett Temple
Denver out: Dario Saric+ DeRon Holmes+ filler (Cancar/Deandre Jordon)

Reportedly, Denver seems interested in Boucher. Denver gets there guy while getting off Dario Saric's player option, a Corpse or end of bench player and an injured rookie.

Raptors in: Dario Saric+DeRon Holmes+filler (Cancar/Deandre Jordon)
Raptors out: Boucher+ Garrett Temple

Raptors embrace the tank harder and start the sell off, while getting a former first round pick to help the rebuild and only taking on 5m next year.

This trade can be done with or without Garrett Temple, and requires Cancar or Deandre Jordon to sign off. Can be subbed with Pickett or Tyson if needed.

Denver is 1st apron hard capped and needs to send out more salary than it brings back. With Saric & Holmes, that means 2 more end of bench/minimum guys. That's leaving Temple out of the equation. Toronto is thus doing a 1 for 4, which means waiving Temple and someone else to accommodate the trade, which seems unlikely. The only realistic way for Denver to acquire Boucher is by making Nnaji the main outgoing piece, which in turn means Toronto takes on his remaining 3 years/$24 million (including player option). Denver has nothing to incentivize Toronto to do this beyond Holmes. Nnaji may get back on track in new surroundings, and Holmes may make a full recovery and eventually become the player Denver thought he might be. It's tempting to go this route, but getting expiring salary and a 2nd or 2 for Boucher sounds like a better plan to me.

[Thaddy]

No way that Denver would include a 1st. Far too much downside. I think taking a chance on a recent 1st rounder that can play a position that the Raptors can use is fine. It's a rookie contract, the option years can always be declined if the injury has actually ruined him.

Which player has had a achilles injury that required surgery and then came back to perform well? There isn't any? The Raptors aren't going to take on Zeke's bad contract and the Nuggets will need to give up a pick to get off it.

This trade doesn't have Zeke Nnaji in it, so that's not relevant. And as for history, Kevin Durant is a pretty notable player to perform well after an Achilles injury. Look, it's Chris Boucher. Even taking on a bit of salary for next year, there won't be much upside coming back in a trade. I think Holmes has enough of a chance that it's better than PJ Tucker and a 2031 Clippers 2nd or something.

Boucher is a pretty good role player. He's capable of being a 6th man on a playoff team, and he's the only remaining Raptor from their playoff run. He'd do a hell of a lot more than a rookie.

[BelgradeNugget]

Imo there are better targets for Denver.

But Nnaji, Saric, 2030 swap top 4 prot for Boucher would be a good way to get an upside pick for Toronto.

This makes more sense...make it a top 10 protected 2030 swap.

[Godaddycurse]

Imo there are better targets for Denver.

But Nnaji, Saric, 2030 swap top 4 prot for Boucher would be a good way to get an upside pick for Toronto.

This makes more sense...make it a top 10 protected 2030 swap.

nobody is eating about 30M of dead money after this year for a top 10 protected swap

[BelgradeNugget]

Imo there are better targets for Denver.

But Nnaji, Saric, 2030 swap top 4 prot for Boucher would be a good way to get an upside pick for Toronto.

This makes more sense...make it a top 10 protected 2030 swap.

nobody is eating about 30M of dead money after this year for a top 10 protected swap

Fair. It can't work, no deal.

[TheProfessor]

Denver in: Chris Boucher+Garrett Temple
Denver out: Dario Saric+ DeRon Holmes+ filler (Cancar/Deandre Jordon)

Reportedly, Denver seems interested in Boucher. Denver gets there guy while getting off Dario Saric's player option, a Corpse or end of bench player and an injured rookie.

Raptors in: Dario Saric+DeRon Holmes+filler (Cancar/Deandre Jordon)
Raptors out: Boucher+ Garrett Temple

Raptors embrace the tank harder and start the sell off, while getting a former first round pick to help the rebuild and only taking on 5m next year.

This trade can be done with or without Garrett Temple, and requires Cancar or Deandre Jordon to sign off. Can be subbed with Pickett or Tyson if needed.

Denver is 1st apron hard capped and needs to send out more salary than it brings back. With Saric & Holmes, that means 2 more end of bench/minimum guys. That's leaving Temple out of the equation. Toronto is thus doing a 1 for 4, which means waiving Temple and someone else to accommodate the trade, which seems unlikely. The only realistic way for Denver to acquire Boucher is by making Nnaji the main outgoing piece, which in turn means Toronto takes on his remaining 3 years/$24 million (including player option). Denver has nothing to incentivize Toronto to do this beyond Holmes. Nnaji may get back on track in new surroundings, and Holmes may make a full recovery and eventually become the player Denver thought he might be. It's tempting to go this route, but getting expiring salary and a 2nd or 2 for Boucher sounds like a better plan to me.

Deandre Jordan makes 3.3m and can be used as filler, so it would be a 3 for 1 trade. We can waive Temple; he is 38 years old. He may be dead by the time the Raptors are ready to compete.

[BigGargamel]

Dorian Finney Smith isn't worth a first round pick, but Chris Boucher is?

I don't even know if Denver has any 2nd rounders to spare, but Boucher is only worth one of those plus salary filler to make it match.

Toronto wouldn't take Nnaji's contract and I really hope Denver doesn't include a first just to marginally upgrade the bench.

[oldncreaky]

Dorian Finney Smith isn't worth a first round pick, but Chris Boucher is?

No, Boucher isn't worth a FRP.

And I went back to re-read the thread, and exactly zero posters have argued that

I don't even know if Denver has any 2nd rounders to spare, but Boucher is only worth one of those plus salary filler to make it match.

Boucher = SRP plus neutral filler? Sure, sounds reasonable.

But Denver doesn't have any SRPs to trade that I can see on (top-50 protected SRPs don't count), and it also doesn't have neutral expiring filler to offer. And that's the problem: if you want to trade for $10.8M expiring Boucher by offering $41M in worse salary (Nnaji and Saric) you have to send some incentive along with the extra $30M in unwanted salary.

About all DEN has to offer is a swap on a distant FRP. If I'm DEN, I don't waste one of my few trade-able assets on Boucher