Who's higher all-time: Kawhi or Harden?

[MalonesElbows]

Even taking the rings out of the equation, Harden's playoff numbers are just too low for me to choose him over Kawhi.

[Blame Rasho]

The reality here is, as per the usual, people are completely unable to process circumstance.

Kawhi in place of Harden ain't doing ****, probably not even making the playoffs.

Do you remember this?

https://www.espn.com/nba/game/_/gameId/400952495/spurs-rockets

Yeah… Harden didn’t do **** except go to a strip club the night before and have the worst game I have ever seen from a player in a playoff game. Some guy named Simmons outplayed him and get blown out without their top two players.

I can buy people picking Harden for their own reasons but the idea of picking Harden very comfortably is absurd. It does make me laugh though how people get all irksome when someone disagrees with their opinion.

[_NoMas]

Harden raises your floor. Kawhi raises your ceiling… I’d go Kawhi all time

[dhsilv2]

The reality here is, as per the usual, people are completely unable to process circumstance.

Kawhi in place of Harden ain't doing ****, probably not even making the playoffs.

Do you remember this?

https://www.espn.com/nba/game/_/gameId/400952495/spurs-rockets

Yeah… Harden didn’t do **** except go to a strip club the night before and have the worst game I have ever seen from a player in a playoff game. Some guy named Simmons outplayed him and get blown out without their top two players.

I can buy people picking Harden for their own reasons but the idea of picking Harden very comfortably is absurd. It does make me laugh though how people get all irksome when someone disagrees with their opinion.

I'll take Harden VERY easily given the insane gap in games played by the two. Harden even has a lead in playoff games.

[Patches Perry]

I'm not a big fan of either but give me Harden all things considered.

I will say that Kawhi is one of the harder players all-time to rank. Two titles, two FMVPs, two different teams. Has a DPOY to his name as well. Not a lot of players check those boxes. Still, his resume beyond that is very underwhelming. I am probably in the minority in thinking the regular season is crucially important to ranking a player because that's where your biggest sample size is. There is a lot of luck and circumstance in the playoffs.

[pr0wler]

Peak Kawhi was a gangster, but he was also fortunate to be among the trio of Spurs greats and also play against a beaten down Warriors team in the finals.

Harden had a 33 year old CP3 + role players vs the most talented team in NBA history. So IMO Kawhi has been fortunate to be in more favourable situations, and he hasn't really been consistently healthy for a long time, so I'd have to go with Harden overall.

[Homer38]

I am not sure that if the raptors had Harden instead of Kawhi,they would beat the 76ers in the second round in 2019

[ryguy613]

Kawhi has one of the most difficult careers to judge.

This!

I mean, thats totally fair.... but hes not being judged against goats in this debate. hes being judged again harden... who has ALSO had a pretty difficult career to judge.

[The High Cyde]

Actually pretty difficult players to rank, independently and in comparison as well.

Looking at Harden, he was a complete offensive engine, defense left a lot to be desired, but the entire ball club of Houston from owner down to players went all out for their analytical style of play, and it nearly worked in dethroning the greatest team assembled in the modern era at the peak of their powers. Harden has averaged ridiculous numbers, and not many players in history could carry his heliocentric load night in night out. He faltered in the playoffs many a times, but I think he just needed a little bit of help and luck to get over the hump. If Harden wins a ring back in 2019 I think he ranks right about even with, say Dirk, but he didn’t. Maybe he’s still good enough to be despite not winning one.

So Kawhi. A monster lurking in the water during the regular season, but you really see his teeth when he breaches the water in the post season with his solid and damn near unstoppable production. Sometimes one exploratory bite is enough to kill, and he did that with the Raps.

I still don’t know, their games are so very different as well. I guess playoffs I take Kawhi, regular season give me Harden. Guess it is nice to have them on the same team.

[MightyMouse10]

Kawhi and he probably never had the chance to reach his peak because of injuries.

His offence in the half court was comparable to jordan/melo/kobe and that wasn't even his best skill(defence).

I loved DeRozan but watching Kawhi in his place was truly a pleasure.

[bstein14]

I agree that Leonard was the better player at his best (motivated and dominant on defense) but overall body of work over a long career Harden's numbers are a lot more impressive.

[Lockdown504090]

kawhi is a better player, thats all i care about. miss me with the career accolades totals and rings

[Reeko]

We all watched old man Ginobili destroy Harden in the playoffs and have watched Harden underperform in series after series, yet some people still have the audacity to say he's better than Kawhi? It's the epitome of style over substance. One guy elevates his game when it matters most, the other is inconsistent at best when it matters most.

[RRR3]

We all watched old man Ginobili destroy Harden in the playoffs and have watched Harden underperform in series after series, yet some people still have the audacity to say he's better than Kawhi? It's the epitome of style over substance. One guy elevates his game when it matters most, the other is inconsistent at best when it matters most.

No one said he's better the question is who's higher all-time. Bill Walton was certainly a better player than Paul Pierce, but I don't think any legitimate all-time list has Walton over Pierce. You have to be on the court.

[Raps in 4]

Interesting question. Both are HOF locks. Harden was consistently a top-5 player over the last decade, with an underrated playoff record (he was the only player to nearly beat the Steph-KD Warriors in the playoffs). But Kawhi was arguably the best player in the NBA when healthy, which, unfortunately, was rare. But nonetheless, his peak was absurd.

[Raps in 4]

We all watched old man Ginobili destroy Harden in the playoffs and have watched Harden underperform in series after series, yet some people still have the audacity to say he's better than Kawhi? It's the epitome of style over substance. One guy elevates his game when it matters most, the other is inconsistent at best when it matters most.

Harden is the only player to take the Steph-KD Warriors to 7 games in the playoffs. Hell, he has 6 playoff wins against them. No other player has more than a single win against that team.

Kawhi was the far better playoff performer, but Harden gets criminally underrated.

[HMFFL]

Kawhi Leonard is the easy choice for me. James Harden has his MVP he can enjoy while Kawi is looking at his 2x Finals MVP's.  

James Harden was must see television for possibly most people but for me Kawhi was a superior talent.

Sent from my SM-S928U1 using RealGM mobile app

[luciano-davidwesley]

Kawhi comfortably. He plays defense and won in the playoffs.

Harden can be the system but it's not a championship winning system.

[Reeko]

We all watched old man Ginobili destroy Harden in the playoffs and have watched Harden underperform in series after series, yet some people still have the audacity to say he's better than Kawhi? It's the epitome of style over substance. One guy elevates his game when it matters most, the other is inconsistent at best when it matters most.

No one said he's better the question is who's higher all-time. Bill Walton was certainly a better player than Paul Pierce, but I don't think any legitimate all-time list has Walton over Pierce. You have to be on the court.

Walton was an MVP, Finals MVP, 2X All Star, 2X All NBA, 2X All Defensive, 1X Block Champ, 1X Rebound Champ, 1X Sixth Man of the Year. Yeah, I think you could make a pretty credible case for him over Pierce all time.

Kawhi is higher all time. Harden's accolades aren't that much better so that it negates Kawhi's clearly superior peak.

[Bloodbather]

For peak, it's Kawhi. For prime, it's Kawhi. For career, it's Harden. Kawhi has just missed too much time.