Butler to GSW, Wiggins to MIL (MIA-GSW-MIL-DET)

[Kineto]

In a nutshell :
Butler to GSW
Wiggins to MIL
Middleton and 2 FRP to MIA
Hield to DET


GSW
out : Wiggins, GP2, Anderson, Hield, GSW 2025 FRP (prot top 10/8/4/2 SRP), MIA 2025 SRP(#38-#60)
in : Jimmy Butler, -$4.2M

Why: All-in in the 2 timeline concept, with a very strong Curry-Butler-Green trio, Butler could sign a 2 year deal this summer and his contract will be aligned with Curry and Green until 2027.
Then it will be time for the young core to take over, and with only one 1FRP left and none of Kuminga, Moody, Podz or TJD involved in the trade, GSW will not have compromised its future on this last run for Curry.
And with no real veteran role players left in the teams, it will even force Kerr to play the young boys ^^.
The trade left them with 11 players and only $4.5M under the hard capped 1st apron. So GSW will have to find 3 or 4 very cheap players to complete the roster.

Curry - Schroder - Butler - Kuminga - Green
Podz - Moody - Santos - TJD - Looney

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MIA
out : Butler, Burks
in : Middleton, GP2, Anderson, GSW 2025 FRP (prot top 10/8/4/2 SRP), MIL 2031 FRP (prot top 4 or 1 SRP), -$1.3M

Why : get 2 FRP very likely to convey and end the drama with Butler.
None of Middleton, GP2 and Anderson have more than 2 years guaranteed contracts, so MIA can still offer a max contract in 2026 free agency. And it's 3 good veterans that can help MIA reach PO this year, send their pick to OKC this year, and not risk having to send some unprotected ones in 2026 or 2027.

Herro - Rozier - Middleton - Anderson - Adebayo
GP2 - JJJ - Robinson - Jovic - Ware

---------------------------------------------------------------

MIL
out : Middleton, MIL 2031 FRP (prot top 4 or 1 SRP)
in : Wiggins (W. Moore Jr. - cut, A. Burks - cut), WAS 2025 SRP, MIA 2025 SRP (38-60)

Why : This is Gianis prime, the kind of player that MIL will probably not see again for 20 year.
So yes, sending away a very lightly protected 2031 first is risky, but not less than gambling that Middleton will be at 100% in PO again in the future.
Top form Wiggins is not really superior to top form Middleton, but he offers way more guarantees, and he is the same age as Gianis while Middleton is already 34.
The two 2025 SRP are here to help lowered the protection on the 2031 FRP (and make it more likely to convey for MIA), and will also help MIL next year to maximize Gianis prime. (the WAS one will certainly be in the early 30s).

---------------------------------------------------------------

DET
out : W. Moore Jr, +$6.2M sal, WAS 2025 SRP
in : B. Hield

Why : With 3 apron teams that can't take back more salary than they send, a team with available cap space is needed, and DET is the only one left this season.
But they are not here just to salary dump a player, I think Hield's profile could be very appealing to them and even convince them to send a SRP for him.
DET have finally discovered that spacing is useful in 2020's basketball, and their two best providers of spacing (Beasley and THJ) are expiring. Hield is basically the same type of player as Beasley, and is under a very friendly contract for the next 4 years, whereas Beasley could be hard to keep for DET this summer.

[BBallFreak]

I wouldn't accept any trade where we aren't guaranteed a first.

[NW]

Definitely closer to the price point that the Warriors would consider a Butler trade from. Think there would have to be more haggling on the protections on the pick if it's included. IMO, the purpose of a Butler deal for GS would be to line him (and his extension) up with Steph, Dray and Kerr's deals so that they go hard to contend for the next two seasons after this one and then ride off into the sunset. Warriors start over with a clean cap, a new coach and all their first-which means that pick obligation has to be fulfilled in the next couple years.

Then the Lacobs can start their era of full control - God help us all.

[slos]

So Bucks pay Miami for Warriors to get Butler. Not happening.

Midds + MIL 2031 FRP >>>>> Wiggins + GSW 2025 FRP

Bucks just cut out the Warriors here and get Jimmy themselves.

[Ron Swanson]

I think they'd do it for Jimmy, but the Bucks aren't throwing in a 2031 1st round pick to turn Middleton into Andrew Wiggins contract. They're giving up the majority of the value, just to take on the worst contract/player in the deal while still locking themselves into the 2nd apron for the next 2-3 years? If Golden State wants Butler, then they can fork over both 1st round picks themselves. Otherwise Milwaukee just cuts out the Warriors entirely here.

[Kineto]

So Bucks pay Miami for Warriors to get Butler. Not happening.

Midds + MIL 2031 FRP >>>>> Wiggins + GSW 2025 FRP

Bucks just cut out the Warriors here and get Jimmy themselves.

Feel free to propose a Butler trade to MIL that sends 2 FRP to MIA, puts MIL under the 2nd apron (only way to get Jimmy) and still get a competitive roster after the trade.

Middleton's health is a big concern, and even if he is healthy, his defence will never be what it was, and he is a negative contract now.
Gianis is a unique player, MIL need to do everything they can to build a competitive team around him, even if it costs them some of their future.

Is Wiggins the best that MIL can get from this 2031 1st, maybe, maybe not, but Wiggins profile can be very useful for this team

[oldncreaky]

There are a bunch of teams that could absorb Buddy Hield into an exception for a SRP, including DET, but also including CHO, TOR, WAS and UTA and maybe a couple of others.

DET would hold out for something better until it has used its cap space.

[Kineto]

I think they'd do it for Jimmy, but the Bucks aren't throwing in a 2031 1st round pick to turn Middleton into Andrew Wiggins contract. They're giving up the majority of the value, just to take on the worst contract/player in the deal while still locking themselves into the 2nd apron for the next 2-3 years? If Golden State wants Butler, then they can fork over both 1st round picks themselves. Otherwise Milwaukee just cuts out the Warriors entirely here.

You value Wiggins as a negative contract ?

He had a bad season last year due to the death of his father, but he is still a very good player. Good defense, above league average 3pt shooter, and he was the 2nd best player in the 2022 NBA Finals, with an outstanding defense on Tatum.

[Ron Swanson]

I think they'd do it for Jimmy, but the Bucks aren't throwing in a 2031 1st round pick to turn Middleton into Andrew Wiggins contract. They're giving up the majority of the value, just to take on the worst contract/player in the deal while still locking themselves into the 2nd apron for the next 2-3 years? If Golden State wants Butler, then they can fork over both 1st round picks themselves. Otherwise Milwaukee just cuts out the Warriors entirely here.

You value Wiggins as a negative contract ?

He had a bad season last year due to the death of his father, but he is still a very good player. Good defense, above league average 3pt shooter, and he was the 2nd best player in the 2022 NBA Finals, with an outstanding defense on Tatum.

Most people likely have Wiggins as a neutral asset at best. The issue here is why is Milwaukee coming in and paying the majority of value to Miami just to send Butler elsewhere while settling for Golden State's salary filler? And they also clear GP2 and Anderson's contracts off the books? GS isn't giving up nearly enough here to dump a bunch of bad salary, let alone also turn that into the best player in this deal (Butler).

[cpower]

Curry - Schroder - Butler - Kuminga - Green
Podz - Moody - Santos - TJD - Looney

is this the worst spacing in the last 20 years?.... also what are you going to do with Kuminga who wants 30 M this off season? There is zero money left for him after this trade

[gswhoops]

So we’re all just pretending that Middleton hasn’t missed a million games over the last several years?

[Kineto]

I think they'd do it for Jimmy, but the Bucks aren't throwing in a 2031 1st round pick to turn Middleton into Andrew Wiggins contract. They're giving up the majority of the value, just to take on the worst contract/player in the deal while still locking themselves into the 2nd apron for the next 2-3 years? If Golden State wants Butler, then they can fork over both 1st round picks themselves. Otherwise Milwaukee just cuts out the Warriors entirely here.

You value Wiggins as a negative contract ?

He had a bad season last year due to the death of his father, but he is still a very good player. Good defense, above league average 3pt shooter, and he was the 2nd best player in the 2022 NBA Finals, with an outstanding defense on Tatum.

Most people likely have Wiggins as a neutral asset at best. The issue here is why is Milwaukee coming in and paying the majority of value to Miami just to send Butler elsewhere while settling for Golden State's salary filler? And they also clear GP2 and Anderson's contracts off the books? GS isn't giving up nearly enough here to dump a bunch of bad salary, let alone also turn that into the best player in this deal (Butler).

I think most people are wrong and Wiggins is a positive asset, but agree to disagree on this point.

MIL is paying a 2031 1st (after Gianis career) to improve now (during Gianis career). Middleton is probably washed up at this point, and even if not, he is not reliable enough to gamble on his good health.
Wiggins is perfect with Gianis and Lilard : he doesn't need the ball in his hand, he is a good 3 pt shooter, and he will defend on the best SF/Guard of the opposing team every night.
He has a lower salary than Middleton, and with the annual salary cap increase and Lopez expiring, MIL will probably be back under the 2nd apron next year.

And there are two 2025 SRPs to sweeten the deal. They can be used to trade Portis for a starting guard, for example.

As for GP2 and Anderson, they go to MIA, so it's MIA problems, and they are good players that a good coach like spoelstra will know how to use.


I'm not a warrior fans, but i feel like the analysis here is not on "is it a good deal for each team" but more "that's too good for GSW so I don't like it !"

[Kineto]

Curry - Schroder - Butler - Kuminga - Green
Podz - Moody - Santos - TJD - Looney

is this the worst spacing in the last 20 years?.... also what are you going to do with Kuminga who wants 30 M this off season? There is zero money left for him after this trade

At worst, it can be corrected this summer.

But the simple fact that Butler will initiate the attack will allow Curry to play off ball, and that will help GSW a lot!

Question: I understand that Schroder can be trade before the deadline if he is not aggregated with other players, is that right? If so, maybe he can be traded for a more 3&D guard profile?


edit : Forget the Kuminga part : No team will give him 30M, so GSW will just match the best offer, or he will not signed a offer sheet and he will just take the QO (most probable for me)

[Ron Swanson]

You value Wiggins as a negative contract ?

He had a bad season last year due to the death of his father, but he is still a very good player. Good defense, above league average 3pt shooter, and he was the 2nd best player in the 2022 NBA Finals, with an outstanding defense on Tatum.

Most people likely have Wiggins as a neutral asset at best. The issue here is why is Milwaukee coming in and paying the majority of value to Miami just to send Butler elsewhere while settling for Golden State's salary filler? And they also clear GP2 and Anderson's contracts off the books? GS isn't giving up nearly enough here to dump a bunch of bad salary, let alone also turn that into the best player in this deal (Butler).

I think most people are wrong and Wiggins is a positive asset, but agree to disagree on this point.

MIL is paying a 2031 1st (after Gianis career) to improve now (during Gianis career). Middleton is probably washed up at this point, and even if not, he is not reliable enough to gamble on his good health.
Wiggins is perfect with Gianis and Lilard : he doesn't need the ball in his hand, he is a good 3 pt shooter, and he will defend on the best SF/Guard of the opposing team every night.
He has a lower salary than Middleton, and with the annual salary cap increase and Lopez expiring, MIL will probably be back under the 2nd apron next year.

And there are two 2025 SRPs to sweeten the deal. They can be used to trade Portis for a starting guard, for example.

As for GP2 and Anderson, they go to MIA, so it's MIA problems, and they are good players that a good coach like spoelstra will know how to use.

I'm not a warrior fans, but i feel like the analysis here is not on "is it a good deal for each team" but more "that's too good for GSW so I don't like it !"

No, again, you haven't adequately explained why Milwaukee is just throwing in a lightly protected 2031 1st for the purpose of facilitating the player that they'd actually want to a 3rd team. Miami doesn't want Wiggins' contract (completely erases their future cap room), so why are the Bucks then paying them and taking it off their hands when they've been the team linked to Butler recently, not GS?

Throw in another GS 1st while taking out the MIL 1st and it makes more sense at least, but in the structure of this trade, you're just having another team bail Golden State out here by taking the long-term salary Miami doesn't want AND adding the more attractive pick to the pot (2031 Top-4 protected 1st >>>> 2025 Top-10 protected 1st for a playoff team after this trade would be made). You're not "sweetening the pot" with a couple 2nd round picks when you have them giving up a 2031 1st, man....

[Texas Chuck]

I mean we can debate Middleton vs Wiggins value all we want. But I can't see any scenarios where the Bucks trade their 2031 1st to swap the 2.

[Kalamazoo317]

Hield is 32, doesn't play defense, and has a $10 million player option when he's 35. Not someone Detroit needs to be sending out draft capital for. And, honestly, not a player profile we need more of, as we already have a lot of this type of player on the roster. We need another offensive creator, not another catch and shoot guy (especially an aging one who is a poor defender).

[BBallFreak]

So we’re all just pretending that Middleton hasn’t missed a million games over the last several years?

I think that, and the fact that we should be getting Portis or Lopez, is the reason we're getting two first round picks, but we should be getting at least one guaranteed first.

[NW]

Hield is 32, doesn't play defense, and has a $10 million player option when he's 35. Not someone Detroit needs to be sending out draft capital for. And, honestly, not a player profile we need more of, as we already have a lot of this type of player on the roster. We need another offensive creator, not another catch and shoot guy (especially an aging one who is a poor defender).

Player option year is non guaranteed. Year before that only $3 mil guaranteed

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[Chris Porter's Hair]

No thanks from this Warriors fan. I'm not happy with our current state of affairs, but I can't honestly convince myself we come out of this a better "win now" team, while simultaneously weakening ourselves in the future. And I still shake my head every time I see how much of this board (de)values Wiggins.

On the whole, I don't think there is a trade for Butler that is going to clearly make us better. I'd much rather see us step back and let someone else deal with him.

[Kineto]

I mean we can debate Middleton vs Wiggins value all we want. But I can't see any scenarios where the Bucks trade their 2031 1st to swap the 2.

The idea in the trade is
- MIA don't wants Wiggins (3 year contracts)
- MIL can find usefull to upgrade allways injured Middleton to Wiggins (who prove himself in PO)
- So MIL add value that GSW can send back to MIA, and MIL only asset left is 2031 first.
- This 1st is probably a little too much (that's debatable depending on how you value current Wiggins and current Middleton)
- I send back 2 SRP to mitigate that , but it can be more, depending on the negociating