Ex-Knicks, Sh**posts, and Old Trades - OH MY!

[3toheadmelo]

December Knicks we had the easiest schedule in the league

[3toheadmelo]

Our Ihart replacement was right there for very cheap.

Read on Twitter

[sol537]

They got Richards for peanuts…

[JayTWill]

Our Ihart replacement was right there for very cheap.

Read on Twitter

How was his defense?

[3toheadmelo]

Our Ihart replacement was right there for very cheap.

Read on Twitter

How was his defense?

I didn't watch the game, but he's a solid defender. Currently has a better DFG% at <6feet at the rim than iHart.

iHart's dfg <6feet at rim: 58%
richards dfg <6feeet at the rim: 57.4%.

Could've ran it back with Richards who's just as good as iHart but instead we have the worst rim protector in the league. Yay!

[NoDopeOnSundays]

I've already gave you the stats of KAT's history of being an awful rim protector which you kept ignoring, Mikal's history of being an awful defender which you also kept ignoring. You keep blaming the coach but last year we had the same coach and was able to beat top teams of each conference. So the coach isn't the problem entirely.

You're being very inconsistent with your arguments. First you used to say it was "too early" when our defense was trash, then when KAT played better defense for like a week you went around posting saying "see kat needed some time to get familiar with playing the 5 again" and now that his defense fell back to earth like it always does you're putting all the blame on the coach. Which one is it?

My brother I'm not married to thibs like you think I am. I wanted to fire Thibs for proven upgrades. I said this in 2023 and you actually liked this post

I told you before you can't use the reversal play on me, I know the game too well.

And yet, you're still trying to run the reversal game on me? I feel disrespected that you'd try this. I hit you with years of KAT rim protection data and you ignored it, just like you're ignoring the defensive scheme the coach is running. He didn't even play last night, we gave up 22 threes, focus on that. We been locked in too many times for these plays to work on me, you faking one way and trying to double back the other, I'm there with my feet set about to take the charge. KAT was out last night, the defensive scheme is to sink to protect the paint, we gave up 22 threes, who is to blame for the scheme that works simply based on giving up open threes and leaving it up to fate on some "Hey, they can't make em all, right?".


You wanted Thibs fired before they changed the team, you don't like the team as it's currently built. If you blamed Thibs for the shortcomings on defense it would mean it's not actually a roster issue. I could throw more data at you about how we've always been a team that gives up threes outside of 1 season, and even in that season the teams were still taking a lot, we simply got lucky and that luck ran out in the playoffs. The numbers are there, you will not accept them though because it's easier to blame the players and not the guy telling them to do the things they're doing.


Guys getting tired playing crazy minutes isn't a problem, the defense has nothing to do with him either? If this is the case, and you don't want him to face any blame, he should get absolutely no credit since coaching doesn't matter in negatives, it only matters positively.

I hit you with years and years of data that showed KAT's defense at the 5 has been absolutely terrible and you made excuses like you are again this year. That isn't going to work on me there's a reason why the guy has a reputation around the league for being one of the worst defenders. You keep changing the goal posts. First it was "i's too early", then when he played better defense for a week you ran around here posting his DFG saying all he needed was time to get familiarized with being back at the 5, and since his defense was obviously a fluke and was going to come back to earth you're blaming it on "overuse of minutes". My brother, his defense at the 5 has been atrocious for YEARS. That's not an over use of minutes problem.

Your argument of me being married to thibs has already been disputed. I gave you receipts that I wanted him gone for proven upgrades, and if those guys were still available I would absolutely fire Thibs for them right now.

I don't agree with Thibs overplaying our guys. But putting that as our sole blame for our lack of defense is wild since our defense has been terrible since day 1 when those guys were fresh. We literally only have one above average defender in our starting lineup (OG). you're telling me putting a team together of Brunson,Mikal,KAT is supposed to be good on defense but it's not because of schemes and minutes is crazy. You want Brunson and KAT to switch more and think that's the cure? Good luck with that man.

Eventually you're going to see the light and will admit this team is ass and it's not due to coaching. Just because we have a lot of big names on paper, that doesn't mean we're supposed to be a championship contender. This isn't NBA 2k.

This is a tragedy, I called the reversals and you're still doing them, this type of thing is fine with Guan0 and ChaHell but still trying the spin move into traffic while I'm there with my feet is just appalling. This is not how gentlemen behave amongst one another, and this also goes back to you just tossing numbers out that don't fit your narrative. The teams defense from 1-3 quarters is elite, they fall off a cliff in the 4th, that is clearly because of minutes but you're now saying that isn't even the case? All the numbers show a drop off happening in the 4th, offensively and defensively. Elite to mid on offense, and good to horrible on defense.


You've spent 75% of this post talking about KAT, trying to shift the focus from the fact the team gave up 22 threes without him. That is because of the scheme, saying minutes aren't an issue too is wild. This is just transparent to me, you don't like the team, you're making bad faith arguments based on that and don't want to blame the coach because if it's not the roster it's the coach. You don't even want to concede that overplaying guys is an issue, because that makes the coach look bad, despite the fact we went over that last year and half the team nearly died or the fact the Wolves and Bulls went through the same issues. OG's defense in particular has fallen off a cliff in the last two weeks, he has a worse DRTG over the last 10 games than KAT, is that KAT's fault now too? Nobody plays their defensive wings as much as we do, nobody.

Saying you're not riding for Tom because of some post from years ago doesn't prove anything, you're defending him in the here and now and doing it at a time when his coaching is really bad.


I don't want to see you go out like this, not over a coach that has never led a team anywhere

[DOT]

D rating with KAT on is 111.1

When he's off it's 112.2

KAT also leads the team in Net rating at +9.7.

[JayTWill]

Our Ihart replacement was right there for very cheap.

Read on Twitter

How was his defense?

I didn't watch the game, but he's a solid defender. Currently has a better DFG% at <6feet at the rim than iHart.

iHart's dfg <6feet at rim: 58%
richards dfg <6feeet at the rim: 57.4%.

Could've ran it back with Richards who's just as good as iHart but instead we have the worst rim protector in the league. Yay!

Charlotte fans seem to think Richards has good touch around the rim, good rebounding, good screen setting, good free throw shooting, limited offensive creation with below average defense overall and questionable IQ.

Just from limited highlights of the game I can see he his finishing ability around the rim but all the shots are putbacks and assisted layups and dunks. The putbacks I can see translating to the Knicks but I don't imagine there would be too many assisted shots at the rim in a 2-man game on a team being led by Brunson and Randle offensively.

Defensively I can see he jumps very high so I can see the deterrence at the rim but I also saw him jumping at a few shots that he had no chance of blocking leaving easy rebounding opportunities for his man. Charlotte fans also said he is only effective in drop coverage with limited mobility on the perimeter. I saw him conceding the same space our bigs do in the highlights on pick and roll but guys like Cade missing the shots he made against the Knicks.

They did have a great defensive rating while he was on the floor but it's not obvious from the highlights why. Maybe they were less aggressive attacking the rim with him on the court or maybe they were simply just missing shots or something else. I don't know.

Either way KAT and iHart could have easily made the same shots and grabbed the same rebounds Richards did so i'm not sure how posting that stat line proves anything but I know you don't care about that.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

D rating with KAT on is 111.1

When he's off it's 112.2

KAT also leads the team in Net rating at +9.7.

Best DRTG among starters since Dec 1st too, 107.1 and highest NET rating on the team of 12.7. Quite literally the best player on the team.


Oh, and Mikal has a better DRTG than OG over that time period, imagine what he'd be like if he wasn't averaging 40mpg.

[mpharris36]

D rating with KAT on is 111.1

When he's off it's 112.2

KAT also leads the team in Net rating at +9.7.

Best DRTG among starters since Dec 1st too, 107.1 and highest NET rating on the team of 12.7. Quite literally the best player on the team.


Oh, and Mikal has a better DRTG than OG over that time period, imagine what he'd be like if he wasn't averaging 40mpg.

Interesting. The hot topic is KAT and Mikal. I think Josh Hart's comments were about OG...he's not buying into his defensive role. He hasn't been good in a minute.

I don't know if its the wear and tear. He's on pace to obliterate his minutes played (never plays this many games and minutes). I know he thinks more highly of himself offensively (even though his offensive game is pretty sus) he has zero handle and ability to create. He's basically a spot of 3 pt shooter (and his shot has gone to ****) and can exploit hard close outs and finish.

I really think Josh Hart's comments about people not buying in was directed at OG. He's the 2nd highest paid player on the team and currently isn't holding up is end.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

D rating with KAT on is 111.1

When he's off it's 112.2

KAT also leads the team in Net rating at +9.7.

Best DRTG among starters since Dec 1st too, 107.1 and highest NET rating on the team of 12.7. Quite literally the best player on the team.


Oh, and Mikal has a better DRTG than OG over that time period, imagine what he'd be like if he wasn't averaging 40mpg.

Interesting. The hot topic is KAT and Mikal. I think Josh Hart's comments were about OG...he's not buying into his defensive role. He hasn't been good in a minute.

I don't know if its the wear and tear. He's on pace to obliterate his minutes played (never plays this many games and minutes). I know he thinks more highly of himself offensively (even though his offensive game is pretty sus) he has zero handle and ability to create. He's basically a spot of 3 pt shooter (and his shot has gone to ****) and can exploit hard close outs and finish.

I really think Josh Hart's comments about people not buying in was directed at OG. He's the 2nd highest paid player on the team and currently isn't holding up is end.

Maybe it's about him wanting more touches, they've gone away from him when earlier in the season he was the 3rd option. His defensive slip is minutes, scheme and effort, it cannot be said enough that no other coach is asking all-defense caliber guys to play this many minutes, you have to go down to 41st in MPG to find a all-defense specialist playing 33.6mph - Dyson Daniels who is 21 years old. When you filter for age of guys 26 or older, the next closest is Herb Jones at 64th at 32.4 mpg



Acting like minutes aren't impacting these guys is just denying reality.

[mpharris36]

Best DRTG among starters since Dec 1st too, 107.1 and highest NET rating on the team of 12.7. Quite literally the best player on the team.


Oh, and Mikal has a better DRTG than OG over that time period, imagine what he'd be like if he wasn't averaging 40mpg.

Interesting. The hot topic is KAT and Mikal. I think Josh Hart's comments were about OG...he's not buying into his defensive role. He hasn't been good in a minute.

I don't know if its the wear and tear. He's on pace to obliterate his minutes played (never plays this many games and minutes). I know he thinks more highly of himself offensively (even though his offensive game is pretty sus) he has zero handle and ability to create. He's basically a spot of 3 pt shooter (and his shot has gone to ****) and can exploit hard close outs and finish.

I really think Josh Hart's comments about people not buying in was directed at OG. He's the 2nd highest paid player on the team and currently isn't holding up is end.

oh you know I agree. Asking guys to make 3-4 different rotations especially in the 4th qtr when they are playing 40 mins a night. Its basically unheard of.

If we were playing more zone or more switch based defense you could probably get away with some higher minutes and not impact as much of the defense because its less exertion fighting through screen after screen.

OG's stocks have plummeted this month.


Maybe it's about him wanting more touches, they've gone away from him when earlier in the season he was the 3rd option. His defensive slip is minutes, scheme and effort, it cannot be said enough that no other coach is asking all-defense caliber guys to play this many minutes, you have to go down to 41st in MPG to find a all-defense specialist playing 33.6mph - Dyson Daniels who is 21 years old. When you filter for age of guys 26 or older, the next closest is Herb Jones at 64th at 32.4 mpg



Acting like minutes aren't impacting these guys is just denying reality.

[spree2kawhi]

D rating with KAT on is 111.1

When he's off it's 112.2

KAT also leads the team in Net rating at +9.7.

Best DRTG among starters since Dec 1st too, 107.1 and highest NET rating on the team of 12.7. Quite literally the best player on the team.


Oh, and Mikal has a better DRTG than OG over that time period, imagine what he'd be like if he wasn't averaging 40mpg.

I agree. Still claiming that KAT is a problem of this team in 2025 is just so insane. I wish it would just stop. We’ve been through this idiotic debate of Randle vs Towns. That same poster brought up net rtg months ago before KAT buried every sane person’s painful memory of Randle’s spin-moves into triple teams. Now he has by far the best net rating on the team while in snowy Minnesota they’ll trade Randle’s bum ass as soon as someone will take him. Turns out Jordan vs Steakhouse was closer sometimes. Now this type of BS goes on. I don’t want to read this stupidity again. It has to stop. It isn’t sane. It isn’t fun. It’s just so f***ing stupid.

This team is pretty good. The record is good. Like all teams, it has flaws. Bucks looked bad. Boston has looked mid lately. Why does Tatum get a pass by that same poster? Hypocrite. The Cavs were blown out so badly and looked like the mid team they may actually be… why can’t this board and certain posters in particular just wait and see (as in stfu) instead of trashing this team all the time? Bridges has shown flashes of all star caliber play. OG has been very good, despite a cold stretch. Towns has not only been better than this clown Randle, he’s been a top-5 player in the league and top-5 in nba.com’s very own MVP-race. You don’t like that? Basketball-reference has him at #3. Still I have to read posts about us trading him for Giannis. Didn’t we just blow that MFer out? Meanwhile, the Knicks that everybody is oh-so concerned about have top-5 odds to win the NBA title wherever you look.

Why not simply wait and see the result? The team has been awesome in December 2024, but some idiot keeps bringing up January 2024 - why?! This is the best team in 25 years.

[Clyde_Style]

I agree. Still claiming that KAT is a problem of this team in 2025 is just so insane. I wish it would just stop. We’ve been through this idiotic debate of Randle vs Towns. That same poster brought up net rtg months ago before KAT buried every sane person’s painful memory of Randle’s spin-moves into triple teams. Turns out Jordan vs Steakhouse was closer sometimes. Now this type of BS goes on. I don’t want to read this stupidity again. It has to stop. It isn’t sane. It isn’t fun. It’s just so f***ing stupid.

This team is pretty good. The record is good. Like all teams, it has flaws. Bucks looked bad. Boston has looked mid lately. Why does Tatum get a pass by that same poster? Hypocrite. The Cavs were blown out so badly and looked like the mid team they may actually be… why can’t this board and certain posters in particular just wait and see (as in stfu) instead of trashing this team all the time? Bridges has shown flashes of all star caliber play. OG has been very good, despite a cold stretch. Towns has not only been better than this clown Randle, he’s been a top-5 player in the league and top-5 in nba.com’s very own MVP-race. You don’t like that? Basketball-reference has him at #3. Still I have to read posts about us trading him for Giannis. Didn’t we just blow that MFer out? Meanwhile, the Knicks that everybody is oh-so concerned about have top-5 odds to win the NBA title wherever you look.

Why not simply wait and see the result? The team has been awesome in December 2024, but some idiot keeps bringing up January 2024 - why?! This is the best team in 25 years.

I agree with you about the roster. I think we have the talent to compete and contend. I agree that when Bridges plays well he looks terrific. OG can be a difference maker though he's struggling now. KAT is an amazing addition to the team.

My issue is with Thibs. The guy will not be able to maximize our roster. It is not impatience. In the past, I was often someone who felt exactly like you do now, especially during any rough games last season.

But I strongly feel this time is different and we won't go very far any longer under Thibs. Not going to litigate here and now as you know the arguments against Thibs already, but this is all about him, not our roster.

Any questions about how our roster fits together, chemistry, defensive or offensive schemes that play to their strengths, their gas tanks, etc., none of that will get resolved under Thibs. He needs what he needs and is rigid AF in how he implements players and manages his rotations and Mitch coming back is not going to save him.

[spree2kawhi]

I agree. Still claiming that KAT is a problem of this team in 2025 is just so insane. I wish it would just stop. We’ve been through this idiotic debate of Randle vs Towns. That same poster brought up net rtg months ago before KAT buried every sane person’s painful memory of Randle’s spin-moves into triple teams. Turns out Jordan vs Steakhouse was closer sometimes. Now this type of BS goes on. I don’t want to read this stupidity again. It has to stop. It isn’t sane. It isn’t fun. It’s just so f***ing stupid.

This team is pretty good. The record is good. Like all teams, it has flaws. Bucks looked bad. Boston has looked mid lately. Why does Tatum get a pass by that same poster? Hypocrite. The Cavs were blown out so badly and looked like the mid team they may actually be… why can’t this board and certain posters in particular just wait and see (as in stfu) instead of trashing this team all the time? Bridges has shown flashes of all star caliber play. OG has been very good, despite a cold stretch. Towns has not only been better than this clown Randle, he’s been a top-5 player in the league and top-5 in nba.com’s very own MVP-race. You don’t like that? Basketball-reference has him at #3. Still I have to read posts about us trading him for Giannis. Didn’t we just blow that MFer out? Meanwhile, the Knicks that everybody is oh-so concerned about have top-5 odds to win the NBA title wherever you look.

Why not simply wait and see the result? The team has been awesome in December 2024, but some idiot keeps bringing up January 2024 - why?! This is the best team in 25 years.

I agree with you about the roster. I think we have the talent to compete and contend. I agree that when Bridges plays well he looks terrific. OG can be a difference maker though he's struggling now. KAT is an amazing addition to the team.

My issue is with Thibs. The guy will not be able to maximize our roster. It is not impatience. In the past, I was often someone who felt exactly like you do now, especially during any rough games last season.

But I strongly feel this time is different and we won't go very far any longer under Thibs. Not going to litigate here and now as you know the arguments against Thibs already, but this is all about him, not our roster.

Any questions about how our roster fits together, chemistry, defensive or offensive schemes that play to their strengths, their gas tanks, etc., none of that will get resolved under Thibs. He needs what he needs and is rigid AF in how he implements players and manages his rotations and Mitch coming back is not going to save him.

I don’t like the amount of minutes they’re playing either. But I won’t sht on the players because of that.

You know I never meant you. You’re a quality poster in my view. I’ll enjoy these Knicks even if they lose to the hawks again. Trae young is very good and you can lose games in the NBA. It’s normal. But we’d never lose a series against them.

Now I need to go back to talking the Kessler+Sexton trade into existence.

[Clyde_Style]

I agree. Still claiming that KAT is a problem of this team in 2025 is just so insane. I wish it would just stop. We’ve been through this idiotic debate of Randle vs Towns. That same poster brought up net rtg months ago before KAT buried every sane person’s painful memory of Randle’s spin-moves into triple teams. Turns out Jordan vs Steakhouse was closer sometimes. Now this type of BS goes on. I don’t want to read this stupidity again. It has to stop. It isn’t sane. It isn’t fun. It’s just so f***ing stupid.

This team is pretty good. The record is good. Like all teams, it has flaws. Bucks looked bad. Boston has looked mid lately. Why does Tatum get a pass by that same poster? Hypocrite. The Cavs were blown out so badly and looked like the mid team they may actually be… why can’t this board and certain posters in particular just wait and see (as in stfu) instead of trashing this team all the time? Bridges has shown flashes of all star caliber play. OG has been very good, despite a cold stretch. Towns has not only been better than this clown Randle, he’s been a top-5 player in the league and top-5 in nba.com’s very own MVP-race. You don’t like that? Basketball-reference has him at #3. Still I have to read posts about us trading him for Giannis. Didn’t we just blow that MFer out? Meanwhile, the Knicks that everybody is oh-so concerned about have top-5 odds to win the NBA title wherever you look.

Why not simply wait and see the result? The team has been awesome in December 2024, but some idiot keeps bringing up January 2024 - why?! This is the best team in 25 years.

I agree with you about the roster. I think we have the talent to compete and contend. I agree that when Bridges plays well he looks terrific. OG can be a difference maker though he's struggling now. KAT is an amazing addition to the team.

My issue is with Thibs. The guy will not be able to maximize our roster. It is not impatience. In the past, I was often someone who felt exactly like you do now, especially during any rough games last season.

But I strongly feel this time is different and we won't go very far any longer under Thibs. Not going to litigate here and now as you know the arguments against Thibs already, but this is all about him, not our roster.

Any questions about how our roster fits together, chemistry, defensive or offensive schemes that play to their strengths, their gas tanks, etc., none of that will get resolved under Thibs. He needs what he needs and is rigid AF in how he implements players and manages his rotations and Mitch coming back is not going to save him.

I don’t like the amount of minutes they’re playing either. But I won’t sht on the players because of that.

You know I never meant you. You’re a quality poster in my view. I’ll enjoy these Knicks even if they lose to the hawks again. Trae young is very good and you can lose games in the NBA. It’s normal. But we’d never lose a series against them.

Now I need to go back to talking the Kessler+Sexton trade into reality.

Thanks. I know that. I like reading your posts too. I was just supporting you in posting that, because I'm relatively optimistic about the roster's longer term prospects if we can solve the coaching issue. I don't want to crap on the players for something they have no control over either.

[Guano]

the sanctity of this place is being ruined by mins discussions and nerd stats.

this is a sht post thread have some fcking respect ffs

[NoDopeOnSundays]

the sanctity of this place is being ruined by mins discussions and nerd stats.

this is a sht post thread have some fcking respect ffs

[Chanel Bomber]

D rating with KAT on is 111.1

When he's off it's 112.2

KAT also leads the team in Net rating at +9.7.

Best DRTG among starters since Dec 1st too, 107.1 and highest NET rating on the team of 12.7. Quite literally the best player on the team.


Oh, and Mikal has a better DRTG than OG over that time period, imagine what he'd be like if he wasn't averaging 40mpg.

Interesting. The hot topic is KAT and Mikal. I think Josh Hart's comments were about OG...he's not buying into his defensive role. He hasn't been good in a minute.

I don't know if its the wear and tear. He's on pace to obliterate his minutes played (never plays this many games and minutes). I know he thinks more highly of himself offensively (even though his offensive game is pretty sus) he has zero handle and ability to create. He's basically a spot of 3 pt shooter (and his shot has gone to ****) and can exploit hard close outs and finish.

I really think Josh Hart's comments about people not buying in was directed at OG. He's the 2nd highest paid player on the team and currently isn't holding up is end.

That was my interpretation as well.

OG hasn't provided elite defense in recent weeks. He's well below the standard he set last year.

And he did once complain about his role in Toronto.

His level play has dipped after a very solid first month, and it hasn't lived up to his contract.

Brunson and KAT are carrying the team's offense but it was always expected of OG and Mikal to offset their frailties with elite defense. They've only provided it in spurts. It's disappointing but let's see, it's a long season.

[nykballa2k4]

So his own stats as in Jerry Stackhouse, Ricky Davis, Bradley Beal… I’m sure Beal is very, very good around the right players, too. Maybe trade Bridges and OG for him?

I mean your logic is broken. Stackhouse was a very good player and was the lead star on a playoff team for quite a while. MJ basically hand picked him to be is running mate in DC.

Beal is a good player, and when he was Randles age, yeah he would be a good get. You put him next to a force multiplier (like when John Wall was with him) and he looks elite. Randle is a good player regardless, but can be great in some situations.

The comp for him has always been Zach Randolph. Zbo on a team of chuckers was another black hole on offense.
On a great team like Memphis, he was very much a winning player next to Gasol and Conley.

You’re dreaming. Wake up.

You're on drugs. Sober up.

Rewriting history to suit your narrative. Randle was an all-star on our playoff teams. He is good next to a point guard. Wolves just had to bench/semi retire Mike Conley. They need a point guard.