RS 24/25 - Mavs @ Hornets (Jan 20, 12PM EST)

[arkuo]

I vote to trade for Herb Jones, and punt the season. Who knows maybe get a good draft pick too.

[Mavrelous]

I don't care if they punt the season or not, but bad organizarions lack accountability, after 22/23 no one answered for what happened, year after same medical stuff continued, same coaching absurdities, until after the deadline they went on a run, and now, same medical.and coaching stuff return.
It's 2.5 years, the coach can't manage the roster and loses to the worst teams and the medical staff allow for insane amount of injuries, if these things aren't answered it means the FO is OK with what's happening.

[Bob8]

I don't care if they punt the season or not, but bad organizarions lack accountability, after 22/23 no one answered for what happened, year after same medical stuff continued, same coaching absurdities, until after the deadline they went on a run, and now, same medical.and coaching stuff return.
It's 2.5 years, the coach can't manage the roster and loses to the worst teams and the medical staff allow for insane amount of injuries, if these things aren't answered it means the FO is OK with what's happening.

Medical staff allow? You might a little bit overestimate what medical staff can do.

Mavs had just 2 long term injuries this year. I don't know what medical staff could have done about broken hand and calf injury. The same goes for bulging disc. Then you had Naji's super illness which was my guess difficult to prevent too. All others are typical basketball injuries as rolling ankles and happens to all teams all the time.

Number of injuries isn't a problem, problem is who's long term out. Not being able to play anything without that player is 100% on coach. They are playing the same game with a big difference, Kyrie is only iso scorer not a Pg. He gets his points but do very little to help others to score. You would imagine, that playing without Luka would mean that his assists would go up, but they're down. Pg out and Kidd believes they will win with Iso.

[41Dirk41]

I don't think so...even if the Mavs don't get in the playoffs he stays...because of last year and all the injuries(as an excuse) this season...end of game strugles to secure a rebound have started to haunt them yet again

2 PO miss in 4 years for a Doncic team is a huge shame. I don't think Kidd has more jolly cards left.
He used one 2 years ago.

****trigger alert, questioning luka conditoning/injury history and leadership and saying the blame should start with him****

That falls on Luka mostly...remember they missed the playoffs when Kyrie got here and Luka was hurt as well. Luka is hurt again. Luka was hurt when Brunson was here as well in the playoffs. We just can't put this on Kidd. Starts with Luka imo. His conditioning and his leadership has always been in questioned.

Luka injury can't justify the Ls against 2 of the worst team in the league.

But i'm happy too see that your self-defined expert view of basketball about "we play better without Luka" is ended and now his injury is the problem of this ****.

Teams have injuries, short or long but good ones win games anyway.
No one here expect to be a top4 seed without Luka but not even a worst 3 record in last 15 games.
And over the record the eye test is brutal, we play horrible basketball.

[41Dirk41]

4-10 in last 14 games after Luka injury.

If this Luka less roster worths that record i'm ok, Kidd is not a problem.
But then trade half of the roster at the TDL because they are trash.

[Mavrelous]

I don't care if they punt the season or not, but bad organizarions lack accountability, after 22/23 no one answered for what happened, year after same medical stuff continued, same coaching absurdities, until after the deadline they went on a run, and now, same medical.and coaching stuff return.
It's 2.5 years, the coach can't manage the roster and loses to the worst teams and the medical staff allow for insane amount of injuries, if these things aren't answered it means the FO is OK with what's happening.

Medical staff allow? You might a little bit overestimate what medical staff can do.

Mavs had just 2 long term injuries this year. I don't know what medical staff could have done about broken hand and calf injury. The same goes for bulging disc. Then you had Naji's super illness which was my guess difficult to prevent too. All others are typical basketball injuries as rolling ankles and happens to all teams all the time.

I stated clearly I am talking about all 2.5 years, and there were a lot of injuries in these 2.5 years, absurd injuries that took months to resolve, for example:
Luka injury against the Pelicans in 23 that Slobenian medical team found it wasn't resolved
Josh Green injury against the Bucks
Maxi injury last.year
All of these were open ended injuries that mo timetable for was given.

Exum will not be back before ASB.
Countless small injuries, that result in a constantly changing lineups, 3rd season in a row.

Even older injuries, KP meninsus injury wasn't treated properly and it took him all of 20/21 to recover, KAT had it last year and was back before the PO.

Injury management on this team is one huge mystery.

[Bob8]

I don't care if they punt the season or not, but bad organizarions lack accountability, after 22/23 no one answered for what happened, year after same medical stuff continued, same coaching absurdities, until after the deadline they went on a run, and now, same medical.and coaching stuff return.
It's 2.5 years, the coach can't manage the roster and loses to the worst teams and the medical staff allow for insane amount of injuries, if these things aren't answered it means the FO is OK with what's happening.

Medical staff allow? You might a little bit overestimate what medical staff can do.

Mavs had just 2 long term injuries this year. I don't know what medical staff could have done about broken hand and calf injury. The same goes for bulging disc. Then you had Naji's super illness which was my guess difficult to prevent too. All others are typical basketball injuries as rolling ankles and happens to all teams all the time.

I stated clearly I am talking about all 2.5 years, and there were a lot of injuries in these 2.5 years, absurd injuries that took months to resolve, for example:
Luka injury against the Pelicans in 23 that Slobenian medical team found it wasn't resolved
Josh Green injury against the Bucks
Maxi injury last.year
All of these were open ended injuries that mo timetable for was given.

Exum will not be back before ASB.
Countless small injuries, that result in a constantly changing lineups, 3rd season in a row.

Even older injuries, KP meninsus injury wasn't treated properly and it took him all of 20/21 to recover, KAT had it last year and was back before the PO.

Injury management on this team is one huge mystery.

Yes you're talking about 2.5 years, but you're talking about this problem now, so you for sure find something problematic about this season too.

Problem with injuries is they are all individual cases, you can have similar injuries with very different timetables.

If you're right and Mavs medical staff is bad, then I can't understand why they don't do something about it. I would imagine someone in Mavs management or owners should raise that question. Normally insiders have much more information than us.

[41Dirk41]

Injuries are a fake problem, Luka injury is THE problem...so draw your own conclusions.

Trade half of the roster or fire Kidd.
I'm ok with one of both. No problem. But do something.

[Bob8]

I don't think so...even if the Mavs don't get in the playoffs he stays...because of last year and all the injuries(as an excuse) this season...end of game strugles to secure a rebound have started to haunt them yet again

2 PO miss in 4 years for a Doncic team is a huge shame. I don't think Kidd has more jolly cards left.
He used one 2 years ago.

****trigger alert, questioning luka conditoning/injury history and leadership and saying the blame should start with him****

That falls on Luka mostly...remember they missed the playoffs when Kyrie got here and Luka was hurt as well. Luka is hurt again. Luka was hurt when Brunson was here as well in the playoffs. We just can't put this on Kidd. Starts with Luka imo. His conditioning and his leadership has always been in questioned.

I totally agree with you, it's all Luka's fault. Mavs are title contenders with him and lottery team without him. It's what it is. Unfortunately Kyrie can play only Iso.

[Mavrelous]

Yes you're talking about 2.5 years, but you're talking about this problem now, so you for sure find something problematic about this season too.

Problem with injuries is they are all individual cases, you can have similar injuries with very different timetables.

If you're right and Mavs medical staff is bad, then I can't understand why they don't do something about it. I would imagine someone in Mavs management or owners should raise that question. Normally insiders have much more information than us.

Mavs missed the PO with 23 y/o top 3 player and insiders didn't voice a single word, Kacey Smith was fired and no explanation given, all signaling was that everything is going well.
I din't need or have to speculate, and I follow the league closely, not just the Mavs, teams with the amount of missed time Mavs have are tanking teams, who sit their players for every little excuse, this isn't normal, and the result is a crappy product and improbable results, making the PO is no longer a given and there is real risk to miss it.

[41Dirk41]

Just don't forget those moments when Luka come back and we will make a run (because it will happens for sure) like last year.

...making mistakes is human, persevering is diabolical...

[Bob8]

Yes you're talking about 2.5 years, but you're talking about this problem now, so you for sure find something problematic about this season too.

Problem with injuries is they are all individual cases, you can have similar injuries with very different timetables.

If you're right and Mavs medical staff is bad, then I can't understand why they don't do something about it. I would imagine someone in Mavs management or owners should raise that question. Normally insiders have much more information than us.

Mavs missed the PO with 23 y/o top 3 player and insiders didn't voice a single word, Kacey Smith was fired and no explanation given, all signaling was that everything is going well.
I din't need or have to speculate, and I follow the league closely, not just the Mavs, teams with the amount of missed time Mavs have are tanking teams, who sit their players for every little excuse, this isn't normal, and the result is a crappy product and improbable results, making the PO is no longer a given and there is real risk to miss it.

Let's assume that something is wrong with medical staff and management and owners are for some reason ok with that. The only injury that really matters is Luka's, because Mavs are winning only 42% games without him in his career. It's not given but Mavs should be good enough to make playoffs, when he returns, if he stays healthy of course.

[Mavrelous]

Yes you're talking about 2.5 years, but you're talking about this problem now, so you for sure find something problematic about this season too.

Problem with injuries is they are all individual cases, you can have similar injuries with very different timetables.

If you're right and Mavs medical staff is bad, then I can't understand why they don't do something about it. I would imagine someone in Mavs management or owners should raise that question. Normally insiders have much more information than us.

Mavs missed the PO with 23 y/o top 3 player and insiders didn't voice a single word, Kacey Smith was fired and no explanation given, all signaling was that everything is going well.
I din't need or have to speculate, and I follow the league closely, not just the Mavs, teams with the amount of missed time Mavs have are tanking teams, who sit their players for every little excuse, this isn't normal, and the result is a crappy product and improbable results, making the PO is no longer a given and there is real risk to miss it.

Let's assume that something is wrong with medical staff and management and owners are for some reason ok with that. The only injury that really matters is Luka's, because Mavs are winning only 42% games without him in his career. It's not given but Mavs should be good enough to make playoffs, when he returns, if he stays healthy of course.

Healthey roster w/o Luka is a winning team, but when 3rd string PG needs 4.5 months to recover from injury and you have to rely on Dinwiddie it becomes much harder battle.
The team can withstand Luka injury, the team can't withstand 4-6 players missing each game.

[Bob8]

Mavs missed the PO with 23 y/o top 3 player and insiders didn't voice a single word, Kacey Smith was fired and no explanation given, all signaling was that everything is going well.
I din't need or have to speculate, and I follow the league closely, not just the Mavs, teams with the amount of missed time Mavs have are tanking teams, who sit their players for every little excuse, this isn't normal, and the result is a crappy product and improbable results, making the PO is no longer a given and there is real risk to miss it.

Let's assume that something is wrong with medical staff and management and owners are for some reason ok with that. The only injury that really matters is Luka's, because Mavs are winning only 42% games without him in his career. It's not given but Mavs should be good enough to make playoffs, when he returns, if he stays healthy of course.

Healthey roster w/o Luka is a winning team, but when 3rd string PG needs 4.5 months to recover from injury and you have to rely on Dinwiddie it becomes much harder battle.
The team can withstand Luka injury, the team can't withstand 4-6 players missing each game.

I don't believe Mavs had winning record in any RS without Luka.

The problem is not players, who are missing, but the system or better to say lack of system they play without Luka. Kyrie is playing more or less only Iso and others try to do the same, I doubt very much that Exum would change much. Last year Exum was the best playing besides Luka. Exum is far from classical Pg, he's more like secondary ball handler, he wouldn't change much. Having Brunson instead of Kyrie would be different story of course, but they **** up that.

[Mavrelous]

Let's assume that something is wrong with medical staff and management and owners are for some reason ok with that. The only injury that really matters is Luka's, because Mavs are winning only 42% games without him in his career. It's not given but Mavs should be good enough to make playoffs, when he returns, if he stays healthy of course.

Healthey roster w/o Luka is a winning team, but when 3rd string PG needs 4.5 months to recover from injury and you have to rely on Dinwiddie it becomes much harder battle.
The team can withstand Luka injury, the team can't withstand 4-6 players missing each game.

I don't believe Mavs had winning record in any RS without Luka.

The problem is not players, who are missing, but the system or better to say lack of system they play without Luka. Kyrie is playing more or less only Iso and others try to do the same, I doubt very much that Exum would change much. Last year Exum was the best playing besides Luka. Exum is far from classical Pg, he's more like secondary ball handler, he wouldn't change much. Having Brunson instead of Kyrie would be different story of course, but they **** up that.

A fully healthy roster, w/o Luka and Exum went 5-1 with OT loss in Miami.
The team isn't missing just Luka, Lively is in and out, PJ missed time, Naji missed time, Hardy missed time, Kidd yesterday had 8 regular roster players, 6 were out and Markief doesn't count, he had 0 gaurd depth.

[41Dirk41]

That 5-1 stint is killing us... Is it more likely that one was fool's gold or all the other (lost) games without Luka were?

[41Dirk41]

...and talking about Lively absence after a 31-15 game by Gafford looks strange... But every excuse is allowed when it's on Kidd favor. Ok.

[Bob8]

Healthey roster w/o Luka is a winning team, but when 3rd string PG needs 4.5 months to recover from injury and you have to rely on Dinwiddie it becomes much harder battle.
The team can withstand Luka injury, the team can't withstand 4-6 players missing each game.

I don't believe Mavs had winning record in any RS without Luka.

The problem is not players, who are missing, but the system or better to say lack of system they play without Luka. Kyrie is playing more or less only Iso and others try to do the same, I doubt very much that Exum would change much. Last year Exum was the best playing besides Luka. Exum is far from classical Pg, he's more like secondary ball handler, he wouldn't change much. Having Brunson instead of Kyrie would be different story of course, but they **** up that.

A fully healthy roster, w/o Luka and Exum went 5-1 with OT loss in Miami.
The team isn't missing just Luka, Lively is in and out, PJ missed time, Naji missed time, Hardy missed time, Kidd yesterday had 8 regular roster players, 6 were out and Markief doesn't count, he had 0 gaurd depth.

That good stretch is keeping Mavs alive, but unfortunately that's just small sample size. You must not forget that other teams have injuries too. It goes both ways. Would we win against OKC, if they didn't miss all 3 Cs? Injuries suck, but one thing is losing some winnable games and other winning only 4 of last 14, one of them just because OKC's load management and 1 with lucky escape against Portland.

You might not agree, but the main problem is how they play not who plays. They play disastrous basketball on both sides of the court and they play exactly the same no matter how healthy they're. That system can work only with Luka, because he's the system. With Luka long term out, coaches should find some other solutions. Dinwiddie is doing too much, but is there any other alternatives? There're no set plays, no system. Kyrie with his iso not capable of winning games alone.

[BliscoSantos]

Enough with the injury excuse...every team in the league deals with injuries yet the Mavs seem to be the only ones that can't win games they should be winning...this team doesn't only have an injury problem,they also have a coaching problem and an attitude problem....they are way too relaxed.. there's no sense of urgency, no taking the blame,trying to get better.... it's Just excuse after excuse ...oh ,we're missing Players or the refs made some bad calls or we couldn't make the shots.... honestly i'm sick and tired of it...yes, you're gonna struggle without your Best Player on O but that doesn't explain the awfull D...what the hell are they doing on that end? They never could guard the 3 Point line, that's why every team seems to be shooting lights out against them...at some point the coach needs to take the blame for his awfull game decisions...the problem with Luka being the system is that when he misses games these guys still try to Play the same way....and they can't, they are role Players....they need structure, plays ,a real gameplan...not Just iso after iso

[41Dirk41]

4-10 is the pace for a 24Ws season.

If this roster without Luka is a 24Ws team it's ok, trade everybody.