Ayton, Grant, and Simons for anything?

[DusterBuster]

Well, maybe with how bad Orlando is playing offensively right now, they can maybe squeeze 2 FRPs out of Simons yet?

[Butter]

It doesn't sound like Randle is working out very well in Minnesota. What about swapping Grant for him? Need to add another player to make salaries work. I was trying to figure out a way to send Thybulle with Grant in return for Leonard Miller and someone else. I've not watched Minny play so I don't know how any of the other players are (not their main players). Any thoughts? Randle has a player option next year so at worst, he exercises his option, then is done. I'm just trying to find ways to move some of these guys, particularly Grant.

Not advocating for this - but a Grant/Randle straight up is legal. It also keeps Portland out of the Tax (barely - by like $200k).

I like the less years on the contract. Ironically, the Wolves would probably ask for draft assets, and it probably hurts the Blazers lottery pick.

[DaVoiceMaster]

What about Simons, Thybulle, Williams for KCP, Anthony, Da Silva, Howard, Wagner (the bad, injured one), and the better pick of Orlando/Denver.

[DaVoiceMaster]

It doesn't sound like Randle is working out very well in Minnesota. What about swapping Grant for him? Need to add another player to make salaries work. I was trying to figure out a way to send Thybulle with Grant in return for Leonard Miller and someone else. I've not watched Minny play so I don't know how any of the other players are (not their main players). Any thoughts? Randle has a player option next year so at worst, he exercises his option, then is done. I'm just trying to find ways to move some of these guys, particularly Grant.

Not advocating for this - but a Grant/Randle straight up is legal. It also keeps Portland out of the Tax (barely - by like $200k).

I like the less years on the contract. Ironically, the Wolves would probably ask for draft assets, and it probably hurts the Blazers lottery pick.

I wouldn't play him much. Would be fantastic if he did not pick up his option next year.

[DusterBuster]

What about Simons, Thybulle, Williams for KCP, Anthony, Da Silva, Howard, Wagner (the bad, injured one), and the better pick of Orlando/Denver.

I had thoughts of a bigger ORL deal too...

Simons
Thybulle
Williams

for

Isaac
Anthony
Harris
Howard
2 FRPs (can be heavily protected)

Orlando fans think they're sitting on a gold mine with Isaac's contract, I guess there's a lot of team outs with the deal because of his injury history... I still don't see it as THAT valuable of an asset imo, but w/e.

Essentially ends up a salary dump for Portland to get some draft capital. Orlando gets two starting quality players plus Murray who can replace Jett Howard. Maybe Portland throws in some seconds for **** and giggles. It's the kind of deal that could save the the Magic's season.

I'm not giving Orlando both Simons and Williams for only a single FRP tho. Simons alone is worth that. Williams is proving he might be able to return a FRP as well from a contender, so if Orlando wants both, they need to pay the freight otherwise it would be better to shop Williams elsewhere.

[Wizenheimer]

Jake Fischer talks a bit about Portland here:

https://nateduncannba.com/podcast-episodes/jake-fischer-assesses-the-2025-deadline/

most of the discussion starts at the 32:20 mark

earlier in the podcast they talked about Grant, basically saying the the Blazers blew their opportunity to get decent value for him by keeping him past last year's trade deadline. Neither guy believed the Blazers had a prayer of getting two 1st's for Grant, and were skeptical any teams would send a single first unless it was heavily protected

Fischer seemed to think there would be interest in Simons if the Blazers shopped him, but didn't sound like he expected any interest strong enough to garner major value

Ayton and his contract = negative value. They implied trading for him was a mistake

[PDXKnight]

^
Sounds like we are stuck here. Really irritated we didn't come down on our jerami price tag

[DaVoiceMaster]

What about Simons, Thybulle, Williams for KCP, Anthony, Da Silva, Howard, Wagner (the bad, injured one), and the better pick of Orlando/Denver.

I had thoughts of a bigger ORL deal too...

Simons
Thybulle
Williams

for

Isaac
Anthony
Harris
Howard
2 FRPs (can be heavily protected)

Orlando fans think they're sitting on a gold mine with Isaac's contract, I guess there's a lot of team outs with the deal because of his injury history... I still don't see it as THAT valuable of an asset imo, but w/e.

Essentially ends up a salary dump for Portland to get some draft capital. Orlando gets two starting quality players plus Murray who can replace Jett Howard. Maybe Portland throws in some seconds for **** and giggles. It's the kind of deal that could save the the Magic's season.

I'm not giving Orlando both Simons and Williams for only a single FRP tho. Simons alone is worth that. Williams is proving he might be able to return a FRP as well from a contender, so if Orlando wants both, they need to pay the freight otherwise it would be better to shop Williams elsewhere.

I initially considered both picks, but figured that wouldn't flow with Portland getting young talent. I liked Da Silva at draft time but don't know what he's done since then. I went with KCP instead of Isaac because his contract is shorter.

[DusterBuster]

What about Simons, Thybulle, Williams for KCP, Anthony, Da Silva, Howard, Wagner (the bad, injured one), and the better pick of Orlando/Denver.

I had thoughts of a bigger ORL deal too...

Simons
Thybulle
Williams

for

Isaac
Anthony
Harris
Howard
2 FRPs (can be heavily protected)

Orlando fans think they're sitting on a gold mine with Isaac's contract, I guess there's a lot of team outs with the deal because of his injury history... I still don't see it as THAT valuable of an asset imo, but w/e.

Essentially ends up a salary dump for Portland to get some draft capital. Orlando gets two starting quality players plus Murray who can replace Jett Howard. Maybe Portland throws in some seconds for **** and giggles. It's the kind of deal that could save the the Magic's season.

I'm not giving Orlando both Simons and Williams for only a single FRP tho. Simons alone is worth that. Williams is proving he might be able to return a FRP as well from a contender, so if Orlando wants both, they need to pay the freight otherwise it would be better to shop Williams elsewhere.

I initially considered both picks, but figured that wouldn't flow with Portland getting young talent. I liked Da Silva at draft time but don't know what he's done since then. I went with KCP instead of Isaac because his contract is shorter.

Yeah, Isaac's contract is apparently filled with non-guaranteed years that teams can exercise to drop him as needed. Next year only 8mil is guaranteed based on how many games he plays in, then the final years are all team options I believe. So technically his contract is shorter than Orlando fans view him as some incredibly valuable contract... I get it... to a point... but I also don't fully agree that he's some asset teams are going to lose their mind over, he's still just a throw-in piece to make salaries work.

[PDXKnight]

I had thoughts of a bigger ORL deal too...

Simons
Thybulle
Williams

for

Isaac
Anthony
Harris
Howard
2 FRPs (can be heavily protected)

Orlando fans think they're sitting on a gold mine with Isaac's contract, I guess there's a lot of team outs with the deal because of his injury history... I still don't see it as THAT valuable of an asset imo, but w/e.

Essentially ends up a salary dump for Portland to get some draft capital. Orlando gets two starting quality players plus Murray who can replace Jett Howard. Maybe Portland throws in some seconds for **** and giggles. It's the kind of deal that could save the the Magic's season.

I'm not giving Orlando both Simons and Williams for only a single FRP tho. Simons alone is worth that. Williams is proving he might be able to return a FRP as well from a contender, so if Orlando wants both, they need to pay the freight otherwise it would be better to shop Williams elsewhere.

I initially considered both picks, but figured that wouldn't flow with Portland getting young talent. I liked Da Silva at draft time but don't know what he's done since then. I went with KCP instead of Isaac because his contract is shorter.

Yeah, Isaac's contract is apparently filled with non-guaranteed years that teams can exercise to drop him as needed. Next year only 8mil is guaranteed based on how many games he plays in, then the final years are all team options I believe. So technically his contract is shorter than Orlando fans view him as some incredibly valuable contract... I get it... to a point... but I also don't fully agree that he's some asset teams are going to lose their mind over, he's still just a throw-in piece to make salaries work.

Pretty much. Depending on what's non guaranteed that's his worth more than any on the floor production

[Walton1one]

Sources tell Bontemps and Windhorst that the Lakers front office has been relatively unaggressive of late. L.A. has been reluctant to include any future first-round draft selections in a deal.

Multiple teams have checked in on the Bulls‘ asking price for Lonzo Ball, sources tell Jake Fischer of The Stein Line (Substack link). While it’s unclear if the Lakers are one of those teams, Jovan Buha of The Athletic believes they could make a run at the 27-year-old, whom the Lakers drafted No. 2 overall back in 2017.

Pretty much LAL is looking at minor deals (involving 2nd rounders\salaries) and not willing to use their future 1st'. Will be interesting to see how that plays out, given LeBron\AD's desires for the team to cash their chips in for a run now.

As Windhorst and Bontemps observe, the Bucks are currently over the second tax apron and would need shed about $6.5MM from their payroll in order to aggregate salaries. Connaughton, who earns $9.42MM in ’24/25, with an identical player option for ’25/26, has been viewed as the player most likely to be moved, but due to injuries and declining play, Milwaukee would have to attach sweeteners to trade him.

Middleton, meanwhile earns $31.67MM this season, with a $34MM player option for ’25/26. Portis makes $12.6MM in ’24/25, with a $13.45MM player option for next season.

All three played important roles during Milwaukee’s title run a handful of years ago, but so did Holiday, and that didn’t prevent the Bucks from trading him. Milwaukee has one future first-round pick (2031) it can dangle in trade talks, per Windhorst and Bontemps.

I wonder if they strike out big game hunting, would they pivot to Grant?

A Grant\Middleton exchange fits rather well. The problem is, I doubt MIL would throw a 1st back, and I doubt POR would just take a 31' 1st back, BUT.....

I wonder if they could do a separate deal for a young player from the Bucks, as a secondary part of this exchange?

So, Trade #1 - Middleton for Grant and MIL 31' 2nd

Trade #2 - You could have a secondary deal with POR sending 1 or 2 of Reath\Banton\Walker for a combination of MIL players

AJ Johnson (who has looked good in the G league but is a few years away) straight up for any(1) of Reath\Walker\Banton

OR

Johnson + Livingston for (2) of Reath\Walker\Banton

OR

Johnson\Livingston\Tyler Smith for all (3) of Reath\Walker\Banton

Beauchamp is another option for MIL to dangle instead of Johnson, but I don't think he has any value outside of a small salary dump, but if Johnson was off limits, Beauchamp + Livingston + Smith for Reath\Walker\banton is an option

Then, POR looks to offload Middleton to a 3rd team.

[DaVoiceMaster]

I had thoughts of a bigger ORL deal too...

Simons
Thybulle
Williams

for

Isaac
Anthony
Harris
Howard
2 FRPs (can be heavily protected)

Orlando fans think they're sitting on a gold mine with Isaac's contract, I guess there's a lot of team outs with the deal because of his injury history... I still don't see it as THAT valuable of an asset imo, but w/e.

Essentially ends up a salary dump for Portland to get some draft capital. Orlando gets two starting quality players plus Murray who can replace Jett Howard. Maybe Portland throws in some seconds for **** and giggles. It's the kind of deal that could save the the Magic's season.

I'm not giving Orlando both Simons and Williams for only a single FRP tho. Simons alone is worth that. Williams is proving he might be able to return a FRP as well from a contender, so if Orlando wants both, they need to pay the freight otherwise it would be better to shop Williams elsewhere.

I initially considered both picks, but figured that wouldn't flow with Portland getting young talent. I liked Da Silva at draft time but don't know what he's done since then. I went with KCP instead of Isaac because his contract is shorter.

Yeah, Isaac's contract is apparently filled with non-guaranteed years that teams can exercise to drop him as needed. Next year only 8mil is guaranteed based on how many games he plays in, then the final years are all team options I believe. So technically his contract is shorter than Orlando fans view him as some incredibly valuable contract... I get it... to a point... but I also don't fully agree that he's some asset teams are going to lose their mind over, he's still just a throw-in piece to make salaries work.

Oh, good call. I think Orlando may make the most sense as a trading partner. They have contracts, young players, and draft picks that fit. Let's look at:

Reath to whoever for a 2nd.

Magic / Blazers trade:
Isaac + 1st for Simons
KCP + Howard + Da Silva for Grant + 2nd
Anthony + 1st for Williams + Walker
Wagner for Thybulle

Lakers / Blazers trade:
Vincent + 2nd for Isaac

How close is that?

PG - Simons / Joseph
SG - Black / Suggs / Thybulle / Queen
SF - Banchero / Grant / Houstan
PF - Wagner / Walker
. C - WCJ / Williams

PG - Scoot / Anthony / Vincent
SG - Sharpe / KCP / Rupert
SF - Camara / Murray / Howard
PF - Avdija / Da Silva / Banton
.C - Ayton / Clingan / FA Big Man

Waive - Wagner

Thinking about Isaac's contract... perhaps we don't do the trade with the Lakers if Isaac's contract will be cheaper. They may be able to flip him this summer if another team wants to dump a contract.

[DaVoiceMaster]

Sources tell Bontemps and Windhorst that the Lakers front office has been relatively unaggressive of late. L.A. has been reluctant to include any future first-round draft selections in a deal.

Multiple teams have checked in on the Bulls‘ asking price for Lonzo Ball, sources tell Jake Fischer of The Stein Line (Substack link). While it’s unclear if the Lakers are one of those teams, Jovan Buha of The Athletic believes they could make a run at the 27-year-old, whom the Lakers drafted No. 2 overall back in 2017.

Pretty much LAL is looking at minor deals (involving 2nd rounders\salaries) and not willing to use their future 1st'. Will be interesting to see how that plays out, given LeBron\AD's desires for the team to cash their chips in for a run now.

As Windhorst and Bontemps observe, the Bucks are currently over the second tax apron and would need shed about $6.5MM from their payroll in order to aggregate salaries. Connaughton, who earns $9.42MM in ’24/25, with an identical player option for ’25/26, has been viewed as the player most likely to be moved, but due to injuries and declining play, Milwaukee would have to attach sweeteners to trade him.

Middleton, meanwhile earns $31.67MM this season, with a $34MM player option for ’25/26. Portis makes $12.6MM in ’24/25, with a $13.45MM player option for next season.

All three played important roles during Milwaukee’s title run a handful of years ago, but so did Holiday, and that didn’t prevent the Bucks from trading him. Milwaukee has one future first-round pick (2031) it can dangle in trade talks, per Windhorst and Bontemps.

I wonder if they strike out big game hunting, would they pivot to Grant?

A Grant\Middleton exchange fits rather well. The problem is, I doubt MIL would throw a 1st back, and I doubt POR would just take a 31' 1st back, BUT.....

I wonder if they could do a separate deal for a young player from the Bucks, as a secondary part of this exchange?

So, Trade #1 - Middleton for Grant and MIL 31' 2nd

Trade #2 - You could have a secondary deal with POR sending 1 or 2 of Reath\Banton\Walker for a combination of MIL players

AJ Johnson (who has looked good in the G league but is a few years away) straight up for any(1) of Reath\Walker\Banton

OR

Johnson + Livingston for (2) of Reath\Walker\Banton

OR

Johnson\Livingston\Tyler Smith for all (3) of Reath\Walker\Banton

Beauchamp is another option for MIL to dangle instead of Johnson, but I don't think he has any value outside of a small salary dump, but if Johnson was off limits, Beauchamp + Livingston + Smith for Reath\Walker\banton is an option

Then, POR looks to offload Middleton to a 3rd team.

Does anyone want or is anyone willing to trade for Middleton?

[BlazersBroncos]

I think there is no chance MIL adds a FRP to Middleton.

Market has changed - getting off 2 years of Grant is worth a straight up Middleton swap. I dont think MIL would even go for that straight swap though.

[PDXKnight]

I think there is no chance MIL adds a FRP to Middleton.

Market has changed - getting off 2 years of Grant is worth a straight up Middleton swap. I dont think MIL would even go for that straight swap though.

Yeah we'd probably need to add the first tbh. Not saying we should just that that's probably "fair market value." We waited for the market to come to us and it turned. Grant will be a blazer for 1-2 years at least it seems

[tester551]

Sources tell Bontemps and Windhorst that the Lakers front office has been relatively unaggressive of late. L.A. has been reluctant to include any future first-round draft selections in a deal.

Multiple teams have checked in on the Bulls‘ asking price for Lonzo Ball, sources tell Jake Fischer of The Stein Line (Substack link). While it’s unclear if the Lakers are one of those teams, Jovan Buha of The Athletic believes they could make a run at the 27-year-old, whom the Lakers drafted No. 2 overall back in 2017.

Pretty much LAL is looking at minor deals (involving 2nd rounders\salaries) and not willing to use their future 1st'. Will be interesting to see how that plays out, given LeBron\AD's desires for the team to cash their chips in for a run now.

As Windhorst and Bontemps observe, the Bucks are currently over the second tax apron and would need shed about $6.5MM from their payroll in order to aggregate salaries. Connaughton, who earns $9.42MM in ’24/25, with an identical player option for ’25/26, has been viewed as the player most likely to be moved, but due to injuries and declining play, Milwaukee would have to attach sweeteners to trade him.

Middleton, meanwhile earns $31.67MM this season, with a $34MM player option for ’25/26. Portis makes $12.6MM in ’24/25, with a $13.45MM player option for next season.

All three played important roles during Milwaukee’s title run a handful of years ago, but so did Holiday, and that didn’t prevent the Bucks from trading him. Milwaukee has one future first-round pick (2031) it can dangle in trade talks, per Windhorst and Bontemps.

I wonder if they strike out big game hunting, would they pivot to Grant?

A Grant\Middleton exchange fits rather well. The problem is, I doubt MIL would throw a 1st back, and I doubt POR would just take a 31' 1st back, BUT.....

I wonder if they could do a separate deal for a young player from the Bucks, as a secondary part of this exchange?

So, Trade #1 - Middleton for Grant and MIL 31' 2nd

Trade #2 - You could have a secondary deal with POR sending 1 or 2 of Reath\Banton\Walker for a combination of MIL players

AJ Johnson (who has looked good in the G league but is a few years away) straight up for any(1) of Reath\Walker\Banton

OR

Johnson + Livingston for (2) of Reath\Walker\Banton

OR

Johnson\Livingston\Tyler Smith for all (3) of Reath\Walker\Banton

Beauchamp is another option for MIL to dangle instead of Johnson, but I don't think he has any value outside of a small salary dump, but if Johnson was off limits, Beauchamp + Livingston + Smith for Reath\Walker\banton is an option

Then, POR looks to offload Middleton to a 3rd team.

Does anyone want or is anyone willing to trade for Middleton?

Even if Grant & Middleton had the exact same contract - I'd prefer to have Middleton over Grant. I think he's a better player all things considered.
This would be my ideal scenario.

Grant -> Middleton
Reath -> Smith
Banton -> Beauchamp

[BlazersBroncos]

Pretty much LAL is looking at minor deals (involving 2nd rounders\salaries) and not willing to use their future 1st'. Will be interesting to see how that plays out, given LeBron\AD's desires for the team to cash their chips in for a run now.



I wonder if they strike out big game hunting, would they pivot to Grant?

A Grant\Middleton exchange fits rather well. The problem is, I doubt MIL would throw a 1st back, and I doubt POR would just take a 31' 1st back, BUT.....

I wonder if they could do a separate deal for a young player from the Bucks, as a secondary part of this exchange?

So, Trade #1 - Middleton for Grant and MIL 31' 2nd

Trade #2 - You could have a secondary deal with POR sending 1 or 2 of Reath\Banton\Walker for a combination of MIL players

AJ Johnson (who has looked good in the G league but is a few years away) straight up for any(1) of Reath\Walker\Banton

OR

Johnson + Livingston for (2) of Reath\Walker\Banton

OR

Johnson\Livingston\Tyler Smith for all (3) of Reath\Walker\Banton

Beauchamp is another option for MIL to dangle instead of Johnson, but I don't think he has any value outside of a small salary dump, but if Johnson was off limits, Beauchamp + Livingston + Smith for Reath\Walker\banton is an option

Then, POR looks to offload Middleton to a 3rd team.

Does anyone want or is anyone willing to trade for Middleton?

Even if Grant & Middleton had the exact same contract - I'd prefer to have Middleton over Grant. I think he's a better player all things considered.
This would be my ideal scenario.

Grant -> Middleton
Reath -> Smith
Banton -> Beauchamp

Ya, I would be down for that 100%.

I just dont think MIL swaps Mids for Grant. Middleton is a better player, when healthy. But the divide in health between Grant and Mids isnt worth taking on the much longer deal of Jerami IMO.

[DaVoiceMaster]

Pretty much LAL is looking at minor deals (involving 2nd rounders\salaries) and not willing to use their future 1st'. Will be interesting to see how that plays out, given LeBron\AD's desires for the team to cash their chips in for a run now.



I wonder if they strike out big game hunting, would they pivot to Grant?

A Grant\Middleton exchange fits rather well. The problem is, I doubt MIL would throw a 1st back, and I doubt POR would just take a 31' 1st back, BUT.....

I wonder if they could do a separate deal for a young player from the Bucks, as a secondary part of this exchange?

So, Trade #1 - Middleton for Grant and MIL 31' 2nd

Trade #2 - You could have a secondary deal with POR sending 1 or 2 of Reath\Banton\Walker for a combination of MIL players

AJ Johnson (who has looked good in the G league but is a few years away) straight up for any(1) of Reath\Walker\Banton

OR

Johnson + Livingston for (2) of Reath\Walker\Banton

OR

Johnson\Livingston\Tyler Smith for all (3) of Reath\Walker\Banton

Beauchamp is another option for MIL to dangle instead of Johnson, but I don't think he has any value outside of a small salary dump, but if Johnson was off limits, Beauchamp + Livingston + Smith for Reath\Walker\banton is an option

Then, POR looks to offload Middleton to a 3rd team.

Does anyone want or is anyone willing to trade for Middleton?

Even if Grant & Middleton had the exact same contract - I'd prefer to have Middleton over Grant. I think he's a better player all things considered.
This would be my ideal scenario.

Grant -> Middleton
Reath -> Smith
Banton -> Beauchamp

I'm just greedy. I want a contract that's still a bit shorter.

[tester551]

Does anyone want or is anyone willing to trade for Middleton?

Even if Grant & Middleton had the exact same contract - I'd prefer to have Middleton over Grant. I think he's a better player all things considered.
This would be my ideal scenario.

Grant -> Middleton
Reath -> Smith
Banton -> Beauchamp

I'm just greedy. I want a contract that's still a bit shorter.

Middleton's contract expires in 15 months from now. That is ideal IMO.
It gives Portland a lot of flexibility if a trade opportunity materializes.... otherwise he can play the role of a sage vet for next season.

[DaVoiceMaster]

Even if Grant & Middleton had the exact same contract - I'd prefer to have Middleton over Grant. I think he's a better player all things considered.
This would be my ideal scenario.

Grant -> Middleton
Reath -> Smith
Banton -> Beauchamp

I'm just greedy. I want a contract that's still a bit shorter.

Middleton's contract expires in 15 months from now. That is ideal IMO.
It gives Portland a lot of flexibility if a trade opportunity materializes.... otherwise he can play the role of a sage vet for next season.

Oh, I was thinking he had just 1 year less than Grant.