PG: Pelicans waive the white Flagg

[YogurtProducer]

Didn’t posters say magic was the blueprint on how to tank last week?

I've never been once super impressed with them. They are way ahead of where we are because then I'd at least be content to keep building bit by bit but at the same time, they aren't going very far if whatever they got right now is the core.

Yeah I give it two seasons max before we're better than Orlando. Could be as soon as next season. Masai knows how to build a team that has depth and it looks like we're on our way to that again.

Depth is so underrated.

You get depth and you are a playoff lock. You get a few higher end pieces and you’re a HCA lock (like we were 2014 to 2020).

Then, you consolidate. The margin for error is way bigger because “screwing up” means 2nd round appearances instead of lottery appearances. I know which ones more enjoyable to follow.

[tsherkin]

Depth is so underrated.

You get depth and you are a playoff lock. You get a few higher end pieces and you’re a HCA lock (like we were 2014 to 2020).

Then, you consolidate. The margin for error is way bigger because “screwing up” means 2nd round appearances instead of lottery appearances. I know which ones more enjoyable to follow.

This is the move outside of a year where it makes sense to tank for a single season, for sure. And if you can keep acquiring assets and bundle them for something, you can stay pretty good for a long time. You need to get supremely lucky and land a legit franchise centerpiece if you want to win a title, but you can pull some long stretches of quality play and playoff appearances with some series victories along the way.

[Tha Cynic]

I've never been once super impressed with them. They are way ahead of where we are because then I'd at least be content to keep building bit by bit but at the same time, they aren't going very far if whatever they got right now is the core.

Yeah I give it two seasons max before we're better than Orlando. Could be as soon as next season. Masai knows how to build a team that has depth and it looks like we're on our way to that again.

Depth is so underrated.

You get depth and you are a playoff lock. You get a few higher end pieces and you’re a HCA lock (like we were 2014 to 2020).

Then, you consolidate. The margin for error is way bigger because “screwing up” means 2nd round appearances instead of lottery appearances. I know which ones more enjoyable to follow.

Sure we don't have a superstar, but this team has so many players that can play that we had to send some to the G League. A lot of those guys will improve and have a chance to repeat what our bench mod did back when Siakam, FVV and Powell came up. The consolidation will be there in a couple of seasons but even today this team has cap flexibility that teams would find big.

If they really wanted they could probablytrade for Jimmy Butler or Zach Lavine while keeping Barnes, Quickley, Poeltl and some bench depth, but obviously they're not at a stage where that makes sense.

This team has a lot of assets now that people aren't realizing when the season first started. Imagine adding a top pick to that.

[Clay Davis]

I think the most meaningful data points are those 2018, since they changed the rules for lottery picks. So the rizz is with us, in a sense, even if we're North of 20 wins.

We'll see. If we're bottom-4, we're in good shape. Less so thereafter. But again, that comes down to things happening after the deadline, so we'll have to see what management does.

Thank u brother god bless u and ur rizz

[tsherkin]

Thank u brother god bless u and ur rizz

I'm too old to know what that means xD

[Tha Cynic]

Hate to be the grammar guy but the thread title should read wave not waive.

Pelicans wave the white Flagg
Raptors waive the white Flagg

Both of those work

[DelAbbot]

Didn’t posters say magic was the blueprint on how to tank last week?

I've never been once super impressed with them. They are way ahead of where we are because then I'd at least be content to keep building bit by bit but at the same time, they aren't going very far if whatever they got right now is the core.

Yeah I give it two seasons max before we're better than Orlando. Could be as soon as next season. Masai knows how to build a team that has depth and it looks like we're on our way to that again.

Did you just say Masai knows how to build a team that has depth? How can you forget the last 4 years this quickly, where we lost many games when starters rested

[pingpongrac]

For the people complaining about the young guys not getting as much opportunity lately, we still have four rookies in the top 30 in total minutes and Gradey is 7th for sophomores while Scottie, RJ and Ochai are all averaging 28+ MPG for the season too. Even more recently in this 6-1 stretch, Scottie and RJ are leading the way while Shead has been great off the bench. It’s not like we’re only winning because of Poeltl/Brown/Boucher.

[DelAbbot]

For the people complaining about the young guys not getting as much opportunity lately, we still have four rookies in the top 30 in total minutes and Gradey is 7th for sophomores while Scottie, RJ and Ochai are all averaging 28+ MPG for the season too. Even more recently in this 6-1 stretch, Scottie and RJ are leading the way while Shead has been great off the bench. It’s not like we’re only winning because of Poeltl/Brown/Boucher.

Claims " it's not like we're only winning THE LAST 2 WEEKS because of Poeltl/Brown/Boucher"

While quoting rookies mins from the entire season

[pingpongrac]

For the people complaining about the young guys not getting as much opportunity lately, we still have four rookies in the top 30 in total minutes and Gradey is 7th for sophomores while Scottie, RJ and Ochai are all averaging 28+ MPG for the season too. Even more recently in this 6-1 stretch, Scottie and RJ are leading the way while Shead has been great off the bench. It’s not like we’re only winning because of Poeltl/Brown/Boucher.

Claims " it's not like we're only winning THE LAST 2 WEEKS because of Poeltl/Brown/Boucher"

While quoting rookies mins from the entire season

Maybe read the whole post. Scottie just won POTW and has clearly been our best player over this stretch due to his two-way play while RJ (19/7/5 on 60 TS%) has also been a major driving force. Shead is playing the most he has all season (19.5 MPG is the most he has played over a 7-game stretch of our season) and Gradey is still getting 24 MPG despite some struggles while Mogbo and Battle are getting big minutes and more opportunity with the 905. Really the only complaint is JKW not getting much of an opportunity lately as he has contributed when given minutes, but we’re still typically putting out 2-3 young players on the floor at any given moment.

[Tripod]

I think the most meaningful data points are those 2018, since they changed the rules for lottery picks. So the rizz is with us, in a sense, even if we're North of 20 wins.

We'll see. If we're bottom-4, we're in good shape. Less so thereafter. But again, that comes down to things happening after the deadline, so we'll have to see what management does.

Honest question...because you are level headed...

Most things I have seen has Flagg 1, Harper 2...then it seems like it's all over the place after that. Some think Ace, others don't want to touch Ace. Everyone seems to see things differently.

Is there more of a flat "next tier" with a bunch of guys and if so, how many. It just seems like there are 4-6 names always bandied around on who is next best.

[Tripod]

For the people complaining about the young guys not getting as much opportunity lately, we still have four rookies in the top 30 in total minutes and Gradey is 7th for sophomores while Scottie, RJ and Ochai are all averaging 28+ MPG for the season too. Even more recently in this 6-1 stretch, Scottie and RJ are leading the way while Shead has been great off the bench. It’s not like we’re only winning because of Poeltl/Brown/Boucher.

Claims " it's not like we're only winning THE LAST 2 WEEKS because of Poeltl/Brown/Boucher"

While quoting rookies mins from the entire season

Maybe read the whole post. Scottie just won POTW and has clearly been our best player over this stretch due to his two-way play while RJ (19/7/5 on 60 TS%) has also been a major driving force. Shead is playing the most he has all season (19.5 MPG is the most he has played over a 7-game stretch of our season) and Gradey is still getting 24 MPG despite some struggles while Mogbo and Battle are getting big minutes and more opportunity with the 905. Really the only complaint is JKW not getting much of an opportunity lately as he has contributed when given minutes, but we’re still typically putting out 2-3 young players on the floor at any given moment.

We also played a 10 day guy 32 minutes the last 2 games.

Some people would rather we never play any vets any minutes regardless if we are trying to trade them or not.

We literally played 3 guys older than 26 years old last game out of 10 guys

[tsherkin]

Is there more of a flat "next tier" with a bunch of guys and if so, how many. It just seems like there are 4-6 names always bandied around on who is next best.

I honestly don't know the draft this year well enough to comment. I know Flagg, and that's about it. I don't have the patience or interest to keep up with college ball anymore, haven't for a long time. I'll follow a prospect up at the top, but I have too much other stuff going on to give it bandwidth like I used to in my teens and 20s, especially because of how bleh the games are.

[YogurtProducer]

For the people complaining about the young guys not getting as much opportunity lately, we still have four rookies in the top 30 in total minutes and Gradey is 7th for sophomores while Scottie, RJ and Ochai are all averaging 28+ MPG for the season too. Even more recently in this 6-1 stretch, Scottie and RJ are leading the way while Shead has been great off the bench. It’s not like we’re only winning because of Poeltl/Brown/Boucher.

Claims " it's not like we're only winning THE LAST 2 WEEKS because of Poeltl/Brown/Boucher"

While quoting rookies mins from the entire season

Maybe read the whole post. Scottie just won POTW and has clearly been our best player over this stretch due to his two-way play while RJ (19/7/5 on 60 TS%) has also been a major driving force. Shead is playing the most he has all season (19.5 MPG is the most he has played over a 7-game stretch of our season) and Gradey is still getting 24 MPG despite some struggles while Mogbo and Battle are getting big minutes and more opportunity with the 905. Really the only complaint is JKW not getting much of an opportunity lately as he has contributed when given minutes, but we’re still typically putting out 2-3 young players on the floor at any given moment.

Plus - there is nothing that says you gotta play NBA minutes to develop.

Siakam started a lot as a rookie, then went to the GLeague. FVV barely plays as a rook. Dick was down and up last year. Delon Wright played a lot of G.

You can develop without playing minutes with the big club

[Tha Cynic]

The problem is that it's all on paper right now. He hasn't played.

It's interesting to see whether IQs offense will make up for the loss of Davion's defense on ball, on guys like Trae.

Yeah. You either have to play Mitchell at the 1 & IQ at the 2 or you have to start Ochai at the 2.

It is a luxury having Mitchell & Ochai because it can be matchup dependent. Against Atlanta, you start Mitchell & move IQ to the 2. Against teams with a star wing, you start Ochai.

Gradey has to go though. They need to develop him as a microwave type player off the bench.

The answer is Mitchell. I don't think Agbaji has been that great sefensively. To me it's wild that Darko refuses to play IQ and Mitchell together. IQ has been a very good team defender historically and you would see that more if we had Mitchell on the lead guards.

[Tha Cynic]

I've never been once super impressed with them. They are way ahead of where we are because then I'd at least be content to keep building bit by bit but at the same time, they aren't going very far if whatever they got right now is the core.

Yeah I give it two seasons max before we're better than Orlando. Could be as soon as next season. Masai knows how to build a team that has depth and it looks like we're on our way to that again.

Did you just say Masai knows how to build a team that has depth? How can you forget the last 4 years this quickly, where we lost many games when starters rested

Our depth players became our core and we didn't have the picks to replace them. Our coach was also playing to win over developing because our organization thought that core was one to build around. Individually those were all good players. It was an anomaly and that's why coach was fired and the Raptors have pivoted to how they originally won that championship, which was by building depth and then consolidating. Masai also realized his mistake and pivoted.

[Duffman100]

I've never been once super impressed with them. They are way ahead of where we are because then I'd at least be content to keep building bit by bit but at the same time, they aren't going very far if whatever they got right now is the core.

Yeah I give it two seasons max before we're better than Orlando. Could be as soon as next season. Masai knows how to build a team that has depth and it looks like we're on our way to that again.

Did you just say Masai knows how to build a team that has depth? How can you forget the last 4 years this quickly, where we lost many games when starters rested

Yes. Remember how he drafted, traded for and signed the bench mob?

The post championship team was bereft of depth and picks. He tried to patch as he went (which you could say was wrong and a fair criticism) to give the main core a shot.

But we once he rebuilt, we now have depth again.

[MEDIC]

Masai also realized his mistake and pivoted.

When it comes to team building/ direction, I don't think he looks at it as making mistakes. I kind of view it is creating sample sizes & doing evidence based studies to decide the direction of the team.

Let's see if we can win with Pascal, Fred & OG. Not workin great. OK, can we add another ingredient to make this work. Ok....a bit better, but not as good as we need it to be.

After 6 months of taking data & tinkering, he decides to either stay the course on this experiement because he thinks it still has legs. Or he views it as as not effective, blows it up & starts from scratch.

He may even be looking at it the same way with this current group. It's obvious that he is not going all in tank mode. Some teams have committed & there is no plan B. I think with Masai, there is always a plan B.