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Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Giannis Thoughts on Middleton Trade Page 90

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Re: Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Trade Deadline 2/6/25 - 2 p.m. CDT 

Post#361 » by Badgerlander » Thu Jan 30, 2025 11:24 am

ReasonablySober wrote:
Badgerlander wrote:
MickeyDavis wrote:Why are we talking about something said in June 2024?


Because 42 games ago they couldn’t give Lavine away WITH a First round pick. Now we want that albatross?

Read on Twitter


You're following that up with a tweet from 2023?


And from a fan account no less, sigh. My apologies everyone. I was looking thru articles from last summer talking about the challenge of having to start the season with him still on the roster after how bad he was last year and the previous ones and I was distracted by the crash and looked for something on twitter to wrap things up. Basically we shouldn’t look at 42 games in his career and think he will suddenly be our number 3 guy that's going to bring us a championship. Alas I will go back to coloring with crayons. Again sorry everybody.
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Re: Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Trade Deadline 2/6/25 - 2 p.m. CDT 

Post#362 » by pifhluk23 » Thu Jan 30, 2025 11:42 am

Ron Swanson wrote:Being scared to move on from complimentary guys like Bobby is one of the biggest reasons why we're in this mess in the first place, i.e. an aging roster with mis-matched pieces and poor fits around the two stars we've now invested in building the team around. All I know is that preaching the status quo just isn't an option anymore.


29 year old Role Player and most role players decline after 30. Will be opting out this Summer for a 3-4 year deal. It's such an obvious move we need to make. Horst sucks if he's still on the team after the deadline.
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Re: Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Trade Deadline 2/6/25 - 2 p.m. CDT 

Post#363 » by JayMKE » Thu Jan 30, 2025 12:07 pm

It’s crazy to expect LaVine to become a different player 10+ years into his career, he is who he is and it would be stupid to expect different. He isn’t even a young or healthy guy on top of it all. You’ve been warned.
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Re: Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Trade Deadline 2/6/25 - 2 p.m. CDT 

Post#364 » by ShootingtheJ » Thu Jan 30, 2025 12:26 pm

tedbrogen wrote:
raferfenix wrote:LaVine + Jalen Smith works in a direct deal for Khris + Bobby + Pat + MarJon (or AJ Johnson) contractually.

On the face of it seems like Jalen would be a great fit as well -- and he's only 24 making ~ $9M per through 2027:

"Loved him," Carlisle said when asked by a Chicago reporter about his experience coaching Smith. "He's one of the most wonderful young men I've ever been around. Always in a great mood, high level of skill. He's a great rebounder and he can really shoot the ball and he can block shots. He knows how to play. He's a great teammate. I was really disappointed that we lost him, but I could really see that it was gonna happen. He's just too good."

Smith now finds himself in a similar position on a Bulls team that wants to play the way the Pacers did last year. The Bulls rank fifth in the league in scoring and first in pace and it helps when a team is playing that fast to have a center who can run like Smith can. He's averaging 8.0 points and 5.1 rebounds in 14.8 minutes per game as the backup for starter Nikola Vucevic [as of Dec. 10].


https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nba/pacers/2024/12/10/jalen-smith-pacers-bulls-good-terms/76867970007/


Someone correct me if I am wrong but the Bucks have to get under the second apron BEFORE they make a trade that combines salaries. The Bulls are over the cap so they can’t take one of the Bucks players for nothing in an initial separate trade. Which is why you first need to unload Pat for nothing on a team with cap space like the Pistons and likely toss them a pick or young player as compensation.

Once Pat is gone, the Bucks still can’t take back too much more than they send out so you need Brook’s salary in the deal (or a third team taking Brook and sending the Bulls someone on a similar contract) to send out enough salary with Midds to take back both Lavine and Jalen Smith.

If the Bulls want Marjon or AJ Johnson as sweetener, they can take have either because the real target here is Smith who seems like a great fit next to Giannis.

The bonus is Bobby has enough trade value and with Jalen Johnson out, I’d assume the Hawks would easily do Portis for Nance straight up.


We do not need to be under the 2nd apron before the trade. The trade just needs to take us under the 2nd apron.

Portis has more trade value than Nance, we'd get draft compensation in that deal. I definitely think the Hawks would have real interest in this.
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Re: Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Trade Deadline 2/6/25 - 2 p.m. CDT 

Post#365 » by GHOSTofSIKMA » Thu Jan 30, 2025 12:27 pm

drew881 wrote:This isn’t the number one goal, but getting LaVine also allows you to move Dame in the offseason if you want to for depth/athletic slasher guys. LaVine can play the Jayson Tatum chucker role and a Dame trade can bring in a Jaylen Brown type guy. You have Celtics Midwest.

With Butler you are basically getting a rental and hoping it puts you over the top this year. Then who knows what.


the deal for lavine if thats the target absolutely should be for dame. cheaper, younger, more efficient, etc etc etc. all for the low low price of super duper clutch. we have to give up dame time to avoid father time
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Re: Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Trade Deadline 2/6/25 - 2 p.m. CDT 

Post#366 » by Baddy Chuck » Thu Jan 30, 2025 12:47 pm

Trading Dame so Zach LaVine can be our Jayson Tatum. Just when you thought you heard it all.
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Re: Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Trade Deadline 2/6/25 - 2 p.m. CDT 

Post#367 » by JayMKE » Thu Jan 30, 2025 1:09 pm

LaVine isn’t that young & isn’t a paradigm of health, his contract is obscene. His numbers this year are an outlier and 100% will return to the norm.

Adding anybody else that doesn’t play defense to this team would be a disaster, AJ/Trent are a better option at the 2 and taking away PT from our only worthwhile bench players will be a L. LaVine and
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Re: Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Trade Deadline 2/6/25 - 2 p.m. CDT 

Post#368 » by soxperry » Thu Jan 30, 2025 1:22 pm

Heres what's interesting

You look at the wiretap and its:

Bucks have interest in Lavine
Warriors prefer Lavine over Butler

But if you look at betting props, Bucks aren't even listed under Lavine and Warriors are the runaway favorite for Butler.

Smells like Lavine camp trying to create a market
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Re: Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Trade Deadline 2/6/25 - 2 p.m. CDT 

Post#369 » by RogerMurdock » Thu Jan 30, 2025 1:43 pm

BroncoBuck wrote:Khris has quit on this team.


ok
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Re: Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Trade Deadline 2/6/25 - 2 p.m. CDT 

Post#370 » by Frank Nova » Thu Jan 30, 2025 2:01 pm

ReasonablySober wrote:Lavine wouldn't be my first choice, but he's probably the best option of players that are getable for the Bucks trash package. I'd rebuild, but if that's not an option, Lavine is fine.


What’s your idea of rebuilding in this current state? I don’t see that as a realistic possibility. I only say that because a rebuild at the trade deadline seems completely out of the question. We don’t have the depth to pull that off. I’m assuming you mean trading Khris Bobby and Brook to retool around Dame and Giannis, is that what you mean by rebuild? I don’t hate that idea at all but how would you expect to gel in 30 some games before the playoffs? I don’t advocate for sitting still this deadline, I think change is necessary but I’m also a huge believer in continuity and chemistry and you just can’t build that in such a short period of time. Plus I feel like you’re on polar opposite sides of the spectrum here. Trading for Lavine is about as anti rebuild as you can get, being stuck with his contract and paying Lavine, Dame and Giannis the next 2/3 seasons really hinders what else we could possibly do in the meantime. We’d be inevitably pushing back a potential rebuild by multiple years. Pick your poison I guess right?
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Re: Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Trade Deadline 2/6/25 - 2 p.m. CDT 

Post#371 » by German Athens » Thu Jan 30, 2025 2:09 pm

There shouldn’t be any talk of Celtics Midwest. That’s crazy.

We have Giannis and he’s a completely singular talent, because of that we aren’t, and can’t be, a derivative of anyone else.


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Re: Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Trade Deadline 2/6/25 - 2 p.m. CDT 

Post#372 » by Ron Swanson » Thu Jan 30, 2025 2:19 pm

The thought of giving up an asset for LaVine makes me gag, but the "not a winning player" thing is a dumb moniker that's unfairly applied to every guy who's ever been stuck on lottery teams his entire career. If I squint hard enough, sure, I see the logic behind making a play for him when you look at the catch and shoot stuff:

2024-25: 43%
2023-24: 33%
2022-23: 41%
2021-22: 46%

Theoretically, if he buys into the MPJ role, you've got a lethal floor-spacer that can play well off of Dame/Giannis while also being a guy that can get you 30 on any given night where those guys sit or just don't have it. My guess is that considering how fine the defense has largely been even with the subpar perimeter defenders we've thrown out there, that they're willing to gamble on the idea that trotting out three nuclear scorers is just too much for any defense to handle. It's definitely a zig-when-they-zag type move when you look at what teams like Boston and the Knicks have done.
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Re: Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Trade Deadline 2/6/25 - 2 p.m. CDT 

Post#373 » by MickeyDavis » Thu Jan 30, 2025 2:23 pm

It's frustrating. You see Khris against Utah and think, "hell yeah, we can win a title with that Khris Middleton". But you see Khris against the Clippers (an actual playoff team, which Utah is not) and think "hell no, we can't win a title with that Khris Middleton".
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Re: Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Trade Deadline 2/6/25 - 2 p.m. CDT 

Post#374 » by MikeIsGood » Thu Jan 30, 2025 2:44 pm

Ron Swanson wrote:The thought of giving up an asset for LaVine makes me gag, but the "not a winning player" thing is a dumb moniker that's unfairly applied to every guy who's ever been stuck on lottery teams his entire career.


This is always the case. We've learned he's not a #1 option and is outrageously overpaid, yes. But that's it. What the hell was anyone outside of like LeBron, Giannis, Jokic, or Shai going to do with the Bulls the past decade? They're an absolute mess.
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Re: Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Trade Deadline 2/6/25 - 2 p.m. CDT 

Post#375 » by SirChurros » Thu Jan 30, 2025 2:56 pm

I can’t imagine that Lavine has rehabbed his image enough to have to attach a first to GET him.
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Re: Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Trade Deadline 2/6/25 - 2 p.m. CDT 

Post#376 » by ABucksFan » Thu Jan 30, 2025 3:07 pm

MickeyDavis wrote:It's frustrating. You see Khris against Utah and think, "hell yeah, we can win a title with that Khris Middleton". But you see Khris against the Clippers (an actual playoff team, which Utah is not) and think "hell no, we can't win a title with that Khris Middleton".


This right here. I know people have been bringing up recent DEF/OFF ratings, record etc etc, but you take a closer look and we've been doing it against cake teams (yes we should). Play any playoff contender and you can see we've struggled.
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Re: Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Trade Deadline 2/6/25 - 2 p.m. CDT 

Post#377 » by crowhead76 » Thu Jan 30, 2025 3:14 pm

Bucks in: Hunter, Bogdanovic, Nance Jr
Hawks in: Khris, Pat, Bobby
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Re: Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Trade Deadline 2/6/25 - 2 p.m. CDT 

Post#378 » by ShootingtheJ » Thu Jan 30, 2025 3:24 pm

ABucksFan wrote:
MickeyDavis wrote:It's frustrating. You see Khris against Utah and think, "hell yeah, we can win a title with that Khris Middleton". But you see Khris against the Clippers (an actual playoff team, which Utah is not) and think "hell no, we can't win a title with that Khris Middleton".


This right here. I know people have been bringing up recent DEF/OFF ratings, record etc etc, but you take a closer look and we've been doing it against cake teams (yes we should). Play any playoff contender and you can see we've struggled.


The Bucks have been just as good against legit teams as everyone else after the first 10 games. Bucks struggled against all teams to open the season, and that investment in learning a new play style is paying off now.

Also, those numbers don't include the Cup championship, a game were we slapped OKC, a contender, in a playoff environment.
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Re: Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Trade Deadline 2/6/25 - 2 p.m. CDT 

Post#379 » by ShootingtheJ » Thu Jan 30, 2025 3:29 pm

RogerMurdock wrote:
BroncoBuck wrote:Khris has quit on this team.


ok


To say Khris quit simply because he didn't listen to our clueless medical staff is a joke. He didn't listen to the same people who thought is was a good idea to let Giannis and Dame play through calf injuries just before the playoffs.

The fact that Brian Flanigan and staff didn't get pink slips after last season shows were still not a serious franchise.
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Re: Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Trade Deadline 2/6/25 - 2 p.m. CDT 

Post#380 » by buckboy » Thu Jan 30, 2025 3:32 pm

German Athens wrote:
emunney wrote:
German Athens wrote:I’m perfectly fine sending that 2031 pick out - I just want to get something worth a damn in the trade.

Reminder that if we gave up an unprotected pick and it went worst case scenario and actually became the #1 pick, the median #1 guy is something like Andrew Wiggins.

Do what you gotta do to put us over the top.


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I feel like if you can get first round value out of a first rounder 6+ years from now, I don't think that's ever a bad idea. I will say again, also, that the Suns robbed Ainge through a hole in the sheet.

Yeah, I hope the Ainge thing set the market on our pick and there are other suitors offering us a similar deal.

It being unprecedented may bode well for us. I have to imagine there’s a lot of people around the league who think Ainge is shrewd.

Maybe the copy-cat league will do its thing.


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I sure as hell hope not.
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