2024-25 NBA Season Discussion

[eminence]

Lol, Dallas what the ****.

Edit: Feeling more conspiratorial about the NBA than I have in a minute. An unconscionable deal from the Mavs.

[MartinToVaught]

Feeling more conspiratorial about the NBA than I have in a minute. An unconscionable deal from the Mavs.

I'm with you on that one. This feels like Silver's solution to the ratings problem, setting up a few years of Lakers/Celtics Finals matchups to cram down our throats. What a corrupt farce of a trade.

[Mos_Heat]

What conspiracy are you talking about? I legit don't understand

[Doctor MJ]

If this is real, the behind-the-scenes has to be documentary-worthy. Why would DAL do this?!

So, I’m with everyone that this is the most shocking trade I’ve ever seen. Certainly don’t see it coming and would not have expected, based on my limited information, to have said yes to this deal myself.

I think we can say though:

1. This was about Luka’s fitness and attitude, and these were issues we were well aware of. If those issues are bad enough, it makes sense to get out of the Luka business before the rest of the NBA realizes how bad these issues are.

Everyone is pointing out how young Luka is and therefore he’s pre-prime. The Mavs have now essentially stated that they don’t actually agree with that typical timeline. They are betting he’s going to age poorly - and - they DO know more than us about that.

Of course it’s entirely possible that this slap in the face is what wakes Luka up and he starts taking his fitness seriously enough to give a long career arc, in which case this has a good chance to look like the stupidest trade of all time.

2. This was about the Mavs deciding AD was the best player available to pair with Kyrie, and they wanted him more than they wanted draft picks. They are going to be trying to compete and we’ll see what happens.

Hard to swallow though because I don’t see them winning a title like this and Luka got them to the Finals. If you want to win in the next few years, it doesn’t seem like an actual improvement.

Additionally, this core probably won’t be in prime for that much longer so it seems they were far more concerned having obese Luka on a super-max down the road than doing a more typical rebuild.

3, For the Lakers, while they did just get a new best player and that doesn’t cry out for explanation, the fit on the team just doesn’t make sense and this is them basically saying to LeBron “We’re moving on from your demands. This isn’t your team any more and you can either adjust to that, or expect to be moved on from.”

This is pretty amazing in its own right after LeBron bullying every franchise he’s ever played for (other than the Heat where his attempted bullying went nowhere).

Will be fascinating to see how it all plays out from here.


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[Doctor MJ]

What conspiracy are you talking about? I legit don't understand

A conspiracy of calories.


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[Mos_Heat]

What conspiracy are you talking about? I legit don't understand

A conspiracy of calories.


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Just stay at the maintenance level bro

[tsherkin]

This is pretty amazing in its own right after LeBron bullying every franchise he’s ever played for (other than the Heat where his attempted bullying went nowhere).

He's 40, it was inevitable, right? We here even 5 years younger, he'd still be in full control, I imagine.

[eminence]

What conspiracy are you talking about? I legit don't understand

A conspiracy of calories.


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Thinking too small, Trump obviously called in a favor to Adelson to absorb some news space.

Or maybe the liberal (derogatory) NBA is punishing Texas and forcing them to trade the next face of the league to LA? Wemby to GS inbound.

Who knows, the possibilities are endless.

On the serious side - Mavs just made a terrible move (has a shot at worst ever). The Kyrie/AD duo isn't going anywhere and will be rebuilding in 2-3 seasons at most.

Pelinka got given an absolute gift though not really for this season, were I him I'd at least talk with LeBron about moving teams to get some pieces to accelerate the rebuild around Luka. Can't see the squad gelling fast enough this season, and continuing to count on LeBron to be a 1B/2 guy going forward is unwise.

[AEnigma]

Cavaliers would be such a storybook ending (I think that hypothetical move puts them above Boston for me and at least above the Chet-less Thunder). Unfortunate that it almost certainly will not happen.

[OhayoKD]

This is pretty amazing in its own right after LeBron bullying every franchise he’s ever played for (other than the Heat where his attempted bullying went nowhere).

Will be fascinating to see how it all plays out from here.

Lebron has played for 3 franchises. There's no real way for you to argue he's bullied the Lakers at this point, you've already crossed off the heat, and there certainly wasn't any bullying when he first left Cleveland. That leaves less than half his tenure with one franchise for LeBully to be a real talking point.

[MartinToVaught]

This was about Luka’s fitness and attitude, and these were issues we were well aware of.

"Fitness and attitude" was merely one of the post-trade rationalizations thrown out by the Mavs to try and spin this garbage trade. There are already other narratives being put out there and there will be more in the days and weeks to come. Sure, we all know Luka's fat, but that still doesn't justify trading him for way below market value without any advance warning or even shopping him around to the rest of the league first.

From a conspiratorial perspective, it also seems very convenient that Luka is being gifted the juiciest possible bulletin-board material to motivate him now that he's on the Lakers. Even if it's true that Luka isn't taking his fitness seriously enough, it's still utterly moronic to say that in public after you've traded him to a conference rival who you're going to have to play against on a regular basis for the next 20 years. Especially when it's a player as hyper-competitive as Luka is. It just adds to the shadiness around this trade that the Mavs would come out and say that anyway when they have to know how likely it is to backfire on them.

This is pretty amazing in its own right after LeBron bullying every franchise he’s ever played for (other than the Heat where his attempted bullying went nowhere).

How has LeBron "bullied" the Lakers? They've consistently ignored his opinions on everything, even to the team's detriment (such as letting Caruso walk). The only bone they've thrown him over the years was drafting Bronny, but handing out roster spots to your franchise player's relatives is nothing new. See: Giannis' brother, Lillard's cousin... the Knicks even did it for JR freaking Smith.

[jalengreen]

Between the Cavs’ successful rebuild and the Lakers getting Luka, might be time to turn things around and launch a take about LeBron’s aura leaving his teams in *better* shape than average when he leaves

[sp6r=underrated]

How this will impact the business of Mavericks basketball?

The media and fans incorrectly evaluate trades in a zero-sum manner. Trade isn't zero sum even in the world of sports. Usually teams have differing agendas and the trade helps both teams accomplish their agenda As an example, the famous Lions-Rams trade was positive sum for both teams. The Rams were in win-now mode and needed a better QB. The Lions couldn't build a good team and wanted capital along with a respectable QB. The trade helped both teams.

But here how the lakers probably matters for the business of Mavericks basketball as much as how the Mavericks do given that the teams don't seem to have differing agenda/timelines.

If high-end customer sentiment mirrors online sentiment they are going to be getting a lot of angry calls from corporate/individual season ticket holders.Teams care a lot about what individual and corporate season ticket holders think. If the Mavericks bomb right out of the gate, you could lose a lot of ticket sales. And if the Lakers play picks up you may have risked your fanbase for years over this trade. And frankly, I'm amazed they do this.

If they had traded him for 2 good random 22 year olds not pegged for stardom it would make more sense to me. I'd assume Dallas management was unusually high on one of those players and convinced ownership.

Here you're buying a known good. Davis is old, somewhat injury-prone and had a bad attitude in New Orleans. He is also a big and bigs are the least marketable players. I'd probably consider keeping Luka and treating him as a rental over this trade package.

But companies make stupid decisions all the time. And I think that is what this is. Ownership ordered the basketball people to trade him by date X and they did it. I doubt the GM really believes his talking points.

Aside, conspiracy theorists combine low social trust with being overly credulousness for select sources. It is why they are so often marks for grifters.

[eminence]

Sidenote - AD needs to come out on fire in his first game against LA or this dude is the biggest bus rider to ever ride.

He's getting trashed right now, I hate the direction/decision/final value from Dallas, but AD was probably the best player they could get back (okay, Philly probably deals Embiid).

[MartinToVaught]

How this will impact the business of Mavericks basketball?

The business of Mavericks basketball will probably be conducted in Vegas instead of Dallas by the end of the decade, to be honest. The only way it makes sense for the Adelsons to sign on for this trade is as a "Major League" scenario to justify moving the team.

If high-end customer sentiment mirrors online sentiment they are going to be getting a lot of angry calls from corporate/individual season ticket holders.Teams care a lot about what individual and corporate season ticket holders think. If the Mavericks bomb right out of the gate, you could lose a lot of ticket sales. And if the Lakers play picks up you may have risked your fanbase for years over this trade. And frankly, I'm amazed they do this.

They've already lost 700,000+ followers on Instagram since the trade. Again, it makes no sense from the owners' perspective unless alienating the current fanbase is their goal.

But companies make stupid decisions all the time. And I think that is what this is. Ownership ordered the basketball people to trade him by date X and they did it. I doubt the GM really believes his talking points.

I suspect there were multiple agendas at play. The league office getting desperate to boost ratings at all costs, the Adelsons wanting to move the team, Harrison wanting to do a favor for his buddy Pelinka. It's all corrupt no matter how you look at it.

[sp6r=underrated]

How this will impact the business of Mavericks basketball?

The business of Mavericks basketball will probably be conducted in Vegas instead of Dallas by the end of the decade, to be honest. The only way it makes sense for the Adelsons to sign on for this trade is as a "Major League" scenario to justify moving the team.

If Adelson wanted to own an NBA team in Vegas, he wouldn't have bought the Mavericks. He would have bought one of the many teams in smaller markets.

Metro Dallas's GDP is 4x that of Vegas. Metro Vegas has 2 fortune 500 companies. Dallas has 22.

Moving to Dallas for Vegas would cause the value to decline, alot.

If they had a master plan to move to Vegas, they would have bought a Charlotte/Memphis/Cleveland level franchise.

[eminence]

How this will impact the business of Mavericks basketball?

The business of Mavericks basketball will probably be conducted in Vegas instead of Dallas by the end of the decade, to be honest. The only way it makes sense for the Adelsons to sign on for this trade is as a "Major League" scenario to justify moving the team.

If Adelson wanted to own an NBA team in Vegas, he wouldn't have bought the Mavericks. He would have bought one of the many teams in smaller markets.

Metro Dallas's GDP is 4x that of Vegas. Metro Vegas has 2 fortune 500 companies. Dallas has 22.

Moving to Dallas for Vegas would cause the value to decline, alot.

If they had a master plan to move to Vegas, they would have bought a Charlotte/Memphis/Cleveland level franchise.

Just a note, because it's unclear here - Miriam Adelson is the remaining Adelson, her husband is dead.

[Special_Puppy]

How this will impact the business of Mavericks basketball?

The media and fans incorrectly evaluate trades in a zero-sum manner. Trade isn't zero sum even in the world of sports. Usually teams have differing agendas and the trade helps both teams accomplish their agenda As an example, the famous Lions-Rams trade was positive sum for both teams. The Rams were in win-now mode and needed a better QB. The Lions couldn't build a good team and wanted capital along with a respectable QB. The trade helped both teams.

But here how the lakers probably matters for the business of Mavericks basketball as much as how the Mavericks do given that the teams don't seem to have differing agenda/timelines.

If high-end customer sentiment mirrors online sentiment they are going to be getting a lot of angry calls from corporate/individual season ticket holders.Teams care a lot about what individual and corporate season ticket holders think. If the Mavericks bomb right out of the gate, you could lose a lot of ticket sales. And if the Lakers play picks up you may have risked your fanbase for years over this trade. And frankly, I'm amazed they do this.

If they had traded him for 2 good random 22 year olds not pegged for stardom it would make more sense to me. I'd assume Dallas management was unusually high on one of those players and convinced ownership.

Here you're buying a known good. Davis is old, somewhat injury-prone and had a bad attitude in New Orleans. He is also a big and bigs are the least marketable players. I'd probably consider keeping Luka and treating him as a rental over this trade package.

But companies make stupid decisions all the time. And I think that is what this is. Ownership ordered the basketball people to trade him by date X and they did it. I doubt the GM really believes his talking points.

Aside, conspiracy theorists combine low social trust with being overly credulousness for select sources. It is why they are so often marks for grifters.

I guess that goes into why ownership wanted to trade Luka or why they wanted him gone so quickly? Luka's medicals and health being substantially worse than is publicly known is more plausible although not super likely

[MartinToVaught]

How this will impact the business of Mavericks basketball?

The business of Mavericks basketball will probably be conducted in Vegas instead of Dallas by the end of the decade, to be honest. The only way it makes sense for the Adelsons to sign on for this trade is as a "Major League" scenario to justify moving the team.

If Adelson wanted to own an NBA team in Vegas, he wouldn't have bought the Mavericks. He would have bought one of the many teams in smaller markets.

Metro Dallas's GDP is 4x that of Vegas. Metro Vegas has 2 fortune 500 companies. Dallas has 22.

Moving to Dallas for Vegas would cause the value to decline, alot.

If they had a master plan to move to Vegas, they would have bought a Charlotte/Memphis/Cleveland level franchise.

Ordinarily, you'd be right, but Vegas is asserting itself as a pro sports town. They've already taken the Raiders and the A's away from a top-10 media market. The Raiders' valuation has increased substantially since moving to Vegas. The Golden Knights have been a huge success story for the NHL. Dallas also isn't a glamor market in basketball like it is in football.

I'm not saying I want them to move, I don't think any team should move. It's just difficult to think of any other reason the owners would not only sign off on this ridiculous trade but handle it in the most enraging possible way.

[sp6r=underrated]

Sidenote - AD needs to come out on fire in his first game against LA or this dude is the biggest bus rider to ever ride.

He's getting trashed right now, I hate the direction/decision/final value from Dallas, but AD was probably the best player they could get back (okay, Philly probably deals Embiid).

He wasn't a bus rider but I hope he comes out of the gate fired up. If he approaches this like he did in New Orleans it will be awful for Dallas basketball.

One other note, the Mavs are gambling on Kyrie which historically is an awful bet.