Official Brandon Ingram Thread

[Drakeem]

Probably because we're about to overpay him

But on a serious note, likely to start the relationship off on a good note, doesn't benefit him to bitch and moan about 2mil if he's getting a 3-5 year extension.

I share the hope of him being healthy next year, but there is nothing to indicate it'll happen. He's missed over 30% of his eligible games since his rookie year where he actually played 79 games. Not a good sign.

I like BI as a player, but the best ability is availability, and that is one he's never had.

On the open market he's likely going to play for a crap team. Raptors will give him a 4 year extension at the max, which is less than the FA max, but he's guaranteed it.

To me he's analogous to Pete Alonso of the Mets. Pete turned down a large extension offer then free agency hit and it dragged on and he eventually re-signed with the Mets but on a short 2 year deal.

I think it will happen once he starts playing in games and shows at least that he's currently healthy.

My only concern is that they called the BI trade as a "long term" plan, but I guess that really depends on what long term means to them.

I'm not super....low? I guess, on this trade, but I am low on where we're at with it so far. I was hoping we'd move RJ and get some stuff back on top of Ingram, because I absolutely do not see the fit with this SL, and really with RJ in general. If that had happened, I'd actually be fairly positive on the whole trade and probably give it a B. If things change in the offseason I will reassess my opinion on it when we see the details of the new deal, and if we end up moving a starter to have a more cohesive SL.

But for now, it's extremely underwhelming, even more so if we don't end up with a top 5 pick. Even if he doesn't play a single minute this year, if we don't get a high pick, that weighs on the value of the trade as well. That's probably the best way to describe my issues with the trade, there are just way too many things up in the air, too many things that really have to go just right, for the trade to make real sense. And I'm not a big fan of having so many uncontrollable variables.

...Huh?

So you're saying, if he doesn't play a single minute (meaning we gave up winning vets to hopefully tank more this year for a guy who won't play), it impacts the grade for this trade?

Now we're just reaching.

[ItsDanger]

Read on Twitter

Original injury.

[tsherkin]

But for now, it's extremely underwhelming, even more so if we don't end up with a top 5 pick. Even if he doesn't play a single minute this year, if we don't get a high pick, that weighs on the value of the trade as well. That's probably the best way to describe my issues with the trade, there are just way too many things up in the air, too many things that really have to go just right, for the trade to make real sense. And I'm not a big fan of having so many uncontrollable variables.

To be fair, if he doesn't play another minute, we're probably going to end up with a top-5 pick. We have moved a bunch of our defensive pieces and bench depth, which is a large part of how we were beating bad teams (besides some remarkable shooting).

We'll have to see how it all plays out. We have what, 31 games remaining? We're still pretty bad, but our remaining schedule is pretty soft, which isn't awesome for draft slot jockeying. So we do have to manage our expectations.

[Duffman100]

But for now, it's extremely underwhelming, even more so if we don't end up with a top 5 pick. Even if he doesn't play a single minute this year, if we don't get a high pick, that weighs on the value of the trade as well. That's probably the best way to describe my issues with the trade, there are just way too many things up in the air, too many things that really have to go just right, for the trade to make real sense. And I'm not a big fan of having so many uncontrollable variables.

To be fair, if he doesn't play another minute, we're probably going to end up with a top-5 pick. We have moved a bunch of our defensive pieces and bench depth, which is a large part of how we were beating bad teams (besides some remarkable shooting).

We'll have to see how it all plays out. We have what, 31 games remaining? We're still pretty bad, but our remaining schedule is pretty soft, which isn't awesome for draft slot jockeying. So we do have to manage our expectations.

The writing is on the wall, I'll be shocked if we don't have the 5th or 6th worst record. Which considering the teams below us, is really always been the realistic place we'd be.

[StopitLeo]

He needs to follow the Steph Curry ankle stabilization plan.

Steph had some seriously messed up ankles where he was getting self-inflicted sprains doing normal movements. Ingram’s sprains have occurred after landing on someone’s foot. I’d be surprised if they needed to scope him but maybe it’s worth a look since he has done that left ankle a few times. I think it’s more about proper/thorough rehabilitation.

[earthtone]

Calling it now, by this time next year this will be the Official Brandon Ingram All-Star thread

[Duffman100]

On the open market he's likely going to play for a crap team. Raptors will give him a 4 year extension at the max, which is less than the FA max, but he's guaranteed it.

To me he's analogous to Pete Alonso of the Mets. Pete turned down a large extension offer then free agency hit and it dragged on and he eventually re-signed with the Mets but on a short 2 year deal.

I think it will happen once he starts playing in games and shows at least that he's currently healthy.

My only concern is that they called the BI trade as a "long term" plan, but I guess that really depends on what long term means to them.

I'm not super....low? I guess, on this trade, but I am low on where we're at with it so far. I was hoping we'd move RJ and get some stuff back on top of Ingram, because I absolutely do not see the fit with this SL, and really with RJ in general. If that had happened, I'd actually be fairly positive on the whole trade and probably give it a B. If things change in the offseason I will reassess my opinion on it when we see the details of the new deal, and if we end up moving a starter to have a more cohesive SL.

But for now, it's extremely underwhelming, even more so if we don't end up with a top 5 pick. Even if he doesn't play a single minute this year, if we don't get a high pick, that weighs on the value of the trade as well. That's probably the best way to describe my issues with the trade, there are just way too many things up in the air, too many things that really have to go just right, for the trade to make real sense. And I'm not a big fan of having so many uncontrollable variables.

...Huh?

So you're saying, if he doesn't play a single minute (meaning we gave up winning vets to hopefully tank more this year for a guy who won't play), it impacts the grade for this trade?

Now we're just reaching.

Yeah I'm a bit confused by that as well. What's the rationale?

[douggood]

But for now, it's extremely underwhelming, even more so if we don't end up with a top 5 pick. Even if he doesn't play a single minute this year, if we don't get a high pick, that weighs on the value of the trade as well. That's probably the best way to describe my issues with the trade, there are just way too many things up in the air, too many things that really have to go just right, for the trade to make real sense. And I'm not a big fan of having so many uncontrollable variables.

To be fair, if he doesn't play another minute, we're probably going to end up with a top-5 pick. We have moved a bunch of our defensive pieces and bench depth, which is a large part of how we were beating bad teams (besides some remarkable shooting).

We'll have to see how it all plays out. We have what, 31 games remaining? We're still pretty bad, but our remaining schedule is pretty soft, which isn't awesome for draft slot jockeying. So we do have to manage our expectations.

The writing is on the wall, I'll be shocked if we don't have the 5th or 6th worst record. Which considering the teams below us, is really always been the realistic place we'd be.

was 9 wins
pels 12 wins
jazz 12 wins
hornets 12 wins
------------------
raptors 16 wins
bkn 17 wins
bulls 22 wins
--------------
sixers 20 wins (embidd is back)
blazers 23 wins (on a heater right now and seem to found a groove)
hawks 23 wins (dont own pick, no incentive to tank)
spurs 22 wins (just got fox)
------------
pistons/magic/kings warriors etc at 25

we will finish in the 2nd tier, probably 6-7 range. i expect bkn to out tank us, smaller chance bulls do.

[Duffman100]

To be fair, if he doesn't play another minute, we're probably going to end up with a top-5 pick. We have moved a bunch of our defensive pieces and bench depth, which is a large part of how we were beating bad teams (besides some remarkable shooting).

We'll have to see how it all plays out. We have what, 31 games remaining? We're still pretty bad, but our remaining schedule is pretty soft, which isn't awesome for draft slot jockeying. So we do have to manage our expectations.

The writing is on the wall, I'll be shocked if we don't have the 5th or 6th worst record. Which considering the teams below us, is really always been the realistic place we'd be.

was 9 wins
pels 12 wins
jazz 12 wins
hornets 12 wins
------------------
raptors 16 wins
bkn 17 wins
bulls 22 wins
--------------
sixers 20 wins (embidd is back)
blazers 23 wins (on a heater right now and seem to found a groove)
hawks 23 wins (dont own pick, no incentive to tank)
spurs 22 wins (just got fox)
------------
pistons/magic/kings warriors etc at 25

we will finish in the 2nd tier, probably 6-7 range. i expect bkn to out tank us, smaller chance bulls do.

If Ingram doesn't play or very limited and we're playing the rookies heavy minutes, I don't see it likely the Bulls catch us.

But yeah, 5-7 range is where we'll land 99%.

[WuTang_OG]

But for now, it's extremely underwhelming, even more so if we don't end up with a top 5 pick. Even if he doesn't play a single minute this year, if we don't get a high pick, that weighs on the value of the trade as well. That's probably the best way to describe my issues with the trade, there are just way too many things up in the air, too many things that really have to go just right, for the trade to make real sense. And I'm not a big fan of having so many uncontrollable variables.

To be fair, if he doesn't play another minute, we're probably going to end up with a top-5 pick. We have moved a bunch of our defensive pieces and bench depth, which is a large part of how we were beating bad teams (besides some remarkable shooting).

We'll have to see how it all plays out. We have what, 31 games remaining? We're still pretty bad, but our remaining schedule is pretty soft, which isn't awesome for draft slot jockeying. So we do have to manage our expectations.

Even if he plays we will be 6-7 pre lotto. Philly trying to win and Chicago will still grind some wins plus they got 5 games ahead of us. He won't be back before the all star break so another 27 games post all star

With vets out and young guys in, losses will still pile up

[bcv]

They didn’t have a Physical Therapist on staff until last season! I trust the Raptor’s medical staff to get him in the best shape possible for next season.

Say what now? That can’t be true. An NBA team didn’t have a PT before last season?! Amateur hour.

[kwajo]

It's a nice clip. I think Scase had it when he said "the best ability is availability," though. It'd be faintly miraculous if we were able to reverse a decade-long trend of weak durability, but if we could... well. If we can find ways to help RJ look a little better, score more efficiently, maybe we'll be able to do the same with Ingram.

It’s very beneficial that there isn’t any pressure for him to get back on the court. His low ankle injury is reported as high-grade, which is pretty serious but not something you can’t recover from with sufficient time. Fortunately, the team’s current situation is ideal for allowing him to fully rehabilitate the ankle and strengthen the associated muscles.

I suspect Ingram had sub-optimal care in New Orleans. They didn’t have a Physical Therapist on staff until last season! I trust the Raptor’s medical staff to get him in the best shape possible for next season.

That's wild. I know you can easily contract an outside provider, but to not have at least one in-house physiotherapist when you're committing hundreds of millions to player contracts is some terrible risk management.

[Scase]

On the open market he's likely going to play for a crap team. Raptors will give him a 4 year extension at the max, which is less than the FA max, but he's guaranteed it.

To me he's analogous to Pete Alonso of the Mets. Pete turned down a large extension offer then free agency hit and it dragged on and he eventually re-signed with the Mets but on a short 2 year deal.

I think it will happen once he starts playing in games and shows at least that he's currently healthy.

My only concern is that they called the BI trade as a "long term" plan, but I guess that really depends on what long term means to them.

I'm not super....low? I guess, on this trade, but I am low on where we're at with it so far. I was hoping we'd move RJ and get some stuff back on top of Ingram, because I absolutely do not see the fit with this SL, and really with RJ in general. If that had happened, I'd actually be fairly positive on the whole trade and probably give it a B. If things change in the offseason I will reassess my opinion on it when we see the details of the new deal, and if we end up moving a starter to have a more cohesive SL.

But for now, it's extremely underwhelming, even more so if we don't end up with a top 5 pick. Even if he doesn't play a single minute this year, if we don't get a high pick, that weighs on the value of the trade as well. That's probably the best way to describe my issues with the trade, there are just way too many things up in the air, too many things that really have to go just right, for the trade to make real sense. And I'm not a big fan of having so many uncontrollable variables.

...Huh?

So you're saying, if he doesn't play a single minute (meaning we gave up winning vets to hopefully tank more this year for a guy who won't play), it impacts the grade for this trade?

Now we're just reaching.

Yes, I am very clearly saying that depending on the outcome of the remainder of the season, it would impact the grade of the trade. If BI came back, and we won like 15-18 of our remaining 31 games because they are all dumpster level teams, and we ended up getting the 11th pick, that would absolutely make this trade a disaster.

Same way if he didn't play a single minute and didn't impact our draft chances, it would be better than the above. How is that confusing?

But for now, it's extremely underwhelming, even more so if we don't end up with a top 5 pick. Even if he doesn't play a single minute this year, if we don't get a high pick, that weighs on the value of the trade as well. That's probably the best way to describe my issues with the trade, there are just way too many things up in the air, too many things that really have to go just right, for the trade to make real sense. And I'm not a big fan of having so many uncontrollable variables.

To be fair, if he doesn't play another minute, we're probably going to end up with a top-5 pick. We have moved a bunch of our defensive pieces and bench depth, which is a large part of how we were beating bad teams (besides some remarkable shooting).

We'll have to see how it all plays out. We have what, 31 games remaining? We're still pretty bad, but our remaining schedule is pretty soft, which isn't awesome for draft slot jockeying. So we do have to manage our expectations.

Yes but, also no. We will likely be positioned for a top 5 pick, but whether or not we get one is a different story. BI trade with a top 5 pick, not bad. BI with the 7/8th pick and beyond, much worse. And that's my main concern, the trade to me is heavily dependent on our draft slot. If we can get a high end scorer, that means that even if BI flops, we still have a solid backup plan. If we get a guy who is another RJ/Scottie level player, then we are further behind than when we started, cause now we are just kicking the can down the road again.

We're 1 game out from 6th, and 4 games out from 7th, I am not celebrating a 50% chance at a 7/8 pick, or a 57% chance at an 8/9th pick. And with how soft our schedule is, it's a genuine concern.

[WuTang_OG]

Read on Twitter

[Drakeem]

My only concern is that they called the BI trade as a "long term" plan, but I guess that really depends on what long term means to them.

I'm not super....low? I guess, on this trade, but I am low on where we're at with it so far. I was hoping we'd move RJ and get some stuff back on top of Ingram, because I absolutely do not see the fit with this SL, and really with RJ in general. If that had happened, I'd actually be fairly positive on the whole trade and probably give it a B. If things change in the offseason I will reassess my opinion on it when we see the details of the new deal, and if we end up moving a starter to have a more cohesive SL.

But for now, it's extremely underwhelming, even more so if we don't end up with a top 5 pick. Even if he doesn't play a single minute this year, if we don't get a high pick, that weighs on the value of the trade as well. That's probably the best way to describe my issues with the trade, there are just way too many things up in the air, too many things that really have to go just right, for the trade to make real sense. And I'm not a big fan of having so many uncontrollable variables.

...Huh?

So you're saying, if he doesn't play a single minute (meaning we gave up winning vets to hopefully tank more this year for a guy who won't play), it impacts the grade for this trade?

Now we're just reaching.

Yes, I am very clearly saying that depending on the outcome of the remainder of the season, it would impact the grade of the trade. If BI came back, and we won like 15-18 of our remaining 31 games because they are all dumpster level teams, and we ended up getting the 11th pick, that would absolutely make this trade a disaster.

Same way if he didn't play a single minute and didn't impact our draft chances, it would be better than the above. How is that confusing?

But for now, it's extremely underwhelming, even more so if we don't end up with a top 5 pick. Even if he doesn't play a single minute this year, if we don't get a high pick, that weighs on the value of the trade as well. That's probably the best way to describe my issues with the trade, there are just way too many things up in the air, too many things that really have to go just right, for the trade to make real sense. And I'm not a big fan of having so many uncontrollable variables.

To be fair, if he doesn't play another minute, we're probably going to end up with a top-5 pick. We have moved a bunch of our defensive pieces and bench depth, which is a large part of how we were beating bad teams (besides some remarkable shooting).

We'll have to see how it all plays out. We have what, 31 games remaining? We're still pretty bad, but our remaining schedule is pretty soft, which isn't awesome for draft slot jockeying. So we do have to manage our expectations.

Yes but, also no. We will likely be positioned for a top 5 pick, but whether or not we get one is a different story. BI trade with a top 5 pick, not bad. BI with the 7/8th pick and beyond, much worse. And that's my main concern, the trade to me is heavily dependent on our draft slot. If we can get a high end scorer, that means that even if BI flops, we still have a solid backup plan. If we get a guy who is another RJ/Scottie level player, then we are further behind than when we started, cause now we are just kicking the can down the road again.

We're 1 game out from 6th, and 4 games out from 7th, I am not celebrating a 50% chance at a 7/8 pick, or a 57% chance at an 8/9th pick. And with how soft our schedule is, it's a genuine concern.

I'm confused bc your initial post said, even if he doesn't play a single minute, you're hinging the grade of the trade on our draft pick... but if he doesn't play a minute we're objectively a worse team without Brown/Mitchell/Olynyk, so we would have had an even WORSE pick if we don't make the trade.

[tsherkin]

The writing is on the wall, I'll be shocked if we don't have the 5th or 6th worst record. Which considering the teams below us, is really always been the realistic place we'd be.

Keep in mind that of the 31 remaining games, 24 of them are against teams which are .500 or worse. 9 of them are against teams with less than 20 wins. We have a pretty good chance against most of the teams we have left, which concerns me.

We have 16 wins ourselves. If we go 12-19 and end with 28 wins, will we be bottom 6?

[Thaddy]

5-7 range is pretty good compared to where we've landed in the past. It could net us an all star player. The difference between Bailey and Maluach isn't huge, I'd argue the latter will produce more wins in his prime.

Ingram will be on a minutes restriction similar to IQ. We'll probably see an extension announcement by the end of next week. I see these moves making Barrett expendable, I could see him being dumped for Collins, Huerter and a distant first rounder.

Poeltl / Collins / Maluach
Barnes / Mogbo / Chomche
Ingram / Agbaji / Battle
Huerter / Dick / Walter
Quickely / Shead / Walter

We have a competitive group of players and valuable assets. We'll have to shift around some pieces in a trade to keep flexibility. It's becoming clear there isn't enough money laying around in the NBA for all the talent that's available. The aprons really screwed the players over. I'd want to keep flexibility in case big names become available.

[tsherkin]

Yes but, also no. We will likely be positioned for a top 5 pick, but whether or not we get one is a different story.

Fair point. But I guess my point was, if BI isn't playing, then he isn't impacting our ability to win, so it isn't really a reflection on the trade.

[Duffman100]

The writing is on the wall, I'll be shocked if we don't have the 5th or 6th worst record. Which considering the teams below us, is really always been the realistic place we'd be.

Keep in mind that of the 31 remaining games, 24 of them are against teams which are .500 or worse. 9 of them are against teams with less than 20 wins. We have a pretty good chance against most of the teams we have left, which concerns me.

We have 16 wins ourselves. If we go 12-19 and end with 28 wins, will we be bottom 6?

We are also a terrible team, I guess it depends on who we play and sit and compare to our competitors.

The Bulls are really the only risk of catching us.

Nobody is catching the Wizards, Pelicans, Hornets, Jazz. Net, Raptors and Bulls are the next 3 and we have a good lead on the Bulls right now.

[tsherkin]

We are also a terrible team, I guess it depends on who we play and sit and compare to our competitors.

Agreed, yes.

Nobody is catching the Wizards, Pelicans, Hornets, Jazz.

Yep.

Net, Raptors and Bulls are the next 3 and we have a good lead on the Bulls right now.

We'll see how it goes. All depends on how well we do against the soft teams. We do have an extremely gentle schedule. If Scottie comes to life at the end of the season, that'd be a little bittersweet, lol.