Masai Approval Rating Post-Deadline

[GreatWhiteStiff]

Oh I just remembered.

I was told showcasing Boucher, Bruce Brown, Kelly Olynyk by going 7-1 would pump their value and fetch us more return in a trade

Now crickets....

First we had fake wins, now we have vet wins.

[TheRaptor!]

Within a season he turned Siakam and OG (both expiring contracts).... into.... Ingram, Quickley, Barrett, Ochai, Walter, Mogbo

That's insanely impressive. Let's not forget that he also turned Jalen McDaniels (who is no longer in the league) into 3 second round picks, including Jamal Shead.

I hate to be that guy, but that's decent and not "insanely impressive". Siakam is a lot more consistent than Ingram, why shouldn't the expected return be something like that?

If you have space under the apron and a willingness to take salary, getting picks is not rocket science. Hell, even the Wizards got a FRP for eating Smart's contract.

disagree

Ingram healthy is a much better scorer and thus fits us way better than siakam

[Badonkadonk]

Within a season he turned Siakam and OG (both expiring contracts).... into.... Ingram, Quickley, Barrett, Ochai, Walter, Mogbo

That's insanely impressive. Let's not forget that he also turned Jalen McDaniels (who is no longer in the league) into 3 second round picks, including Jamal Shead.

I hate to be that guy, but that's decent and not "insanely impressive". Siakam is a lot more consistent than Ingram, why shouldn't the expected return be something like that?

If you have space under the apron and a willingness to take salary, getting picks is not rocket science. Hell, even the Wizards got a FRP for eating Smart's contract.

disagree

Ingram healthy is a much better scorer and thus fits us way better than siakam

I mean, he's also 3 years younger so his pending contract will cover his prime years. Siakam turns 31 this year and just signed his. That's as big a factor as any in all of this: the FO has aligned to Scottie's timeline more tightly.

[Scase]

I hate to be that guy, but that's decent and not "insanely impressive". Siakam is a lot more consistent than Ingram, why shouldn't the expected return be something like that?

If you have space under the apron and a willingness to take salary, getting picks is not rocket science. Hell, even the Wizards got a FRP for eating Smart's contract.

disagree

Ingram healthy is a much better scorer and thus fits us way better than siakam

I mean, he's also 3 years younger so his pending contract will cover his prime years. Siakam turns 31 this year and just signed his. That's as big a factor as any in all of this: the FO has aligned to Scottie's timeline more tightly.

Siakam will play more games in his post prime years, than BI in his prime, lets not ignore that. I guarantee Siakam plays more games for the pacers in his contract than BI does when adjusted for contract length.

Teacher : What's the best ability class?
Class : Availability!

[sidsid]

I'd be interested to see people's perspective if Masai was fired in 2023 and the entire moves since (siakam, OG etc) were done by a new FO.

They'd be given leniency on the siakam trade since they were painted into a corner by the old guard. But I feel like this pivot and the team we currently have would be viewed as more favourably than it is.

Absolutely, because cleaning up someone elses mess is not expected to be a simple process, however you should never get a pat on the back for cleaning up a mess you made.

You cannot be held responsible for actions that took place before you were with the org. They could still screw things up for sure, and there'd probably be some backlash, but they get leniency coming into a messy situation by no fault of their own. It's why I think the criticism of Weltman in ORL not perfectly turning it around year one is just stupid.

And I know you didn't say it, so this is directed at djsunyc's comment, but no, you don't get to hand wave away screw ups because they "changed direction", they still did it, they are still held responsible. If they made poor decisions trying to build off a flawed core, that speaks to their team building and judgment, and that doesn't go away just cause they decided to finally rip off the bandaid.

This is like giving a criminal a clean slate, because they moved towns to get away from other criminals. No, you're a big boy, you still made your choices, live with them and take responsibility.

Sure and agreed. But moving to the moves in isolation is still an interesting exercise to held hold back previous bias over the past moves.

If we're counting on a takeover timeline post-Jak trade lottery pick loss, I don't see how the new FO is provided with a mandate to retool over rebuild. Why would you get rid of Masai if you're just going to do the same thing?

The OG trade for a bad contract former lotto pick and a promising 6 man guard on an expiring contract is not the move that would happen. We're getting those 3 1st round picks (Knicks/Pels/Griz, whatever) from some team instead.

Landing in the lottery again and then expending more draft capital probably puts the heat on the new FO immediately. The general vibe around the league/press right now is that Masai does not have a plan and that team construct is bad/puzzling. A rookie FO would be questioned even more harshly.

[brownbobcat]

disagree

Ingram healthy is a much better scorer and thus fits us way better than siakam

And when has Ingram ever been healthy?

[Scase]

disagree

Ingram healthy is a much better scorer and thus fits us way better than siakam

And when has Ingram ever been healthy?

9 years ago by my count

[brownbobcat]

disagree

Ingram healthy is a much better scorer and thus fits us way better than siakam

And when has Ingram ever been healthy?

9 years ago by my count

Also BI is not a much better scorer than Siakam. He is a better shooter, but efficiency and output are very close.

Better fit beside Barnes? Absolutely.

Should FO be focusing on fitting pieces around Barnes instead of potential? Debatable, but that's the route they've chosen.

[TheRaptor!]

disagree

Ingram healthy is a much better scorer and thus fits us way better than siakam

And when has Ingram ever been healthy?

9 years ago by my count

Doesnt matter, he played for the cursed Pelicans, just ask Dyson Daniels

He can average 70 games next contract and I wouldnt be surprised

[TheRaptor!]

And when has Ingram ever been healthy?

9 years ago by my count

Also BI is not a much better scorer than Siakam. He is a better shooter, but efficiency and output are very close.

Better fit beside Barnes? Absolutely.

Should FO be focusing on fitting pieces around Barnes instead of potential? Debatable, but that's the route they've chosen.

If you consider roles and difficulty of shots rather than just numbers and percentages, you would be agreeing with me

[raincityraptors]

Because this is a post deadline grade, it's A+ to me.

Over time he's turned an expiring Siakam and OG into:
BI
IQ
RJ (my fave player)
Mogbo
Ochai
Ja'kobe (my fave rookie)

We lucked into BI narrowing down his team list to Atlanta and us. That is why we were able to get him for such low value.

Why aren't more people pumped about this? A great player picked us y'all!!

It takes some luck to make such a one sided trade at the deadline.

I don't care what the media is saying, this was a home run deadline for the Raptors.

We got a former All Star entering his prime for a non-lotto first, an easily replaceable second, a large expiring and a bad short term contract (sorry Kelly but that is why we needed to add another pick).

That is an A++ deadline deal.

We back up (next year)!!!

I want to see a .500 team next season. I believe in this staff and roster to get there.

Until then, let's tank for Cooper!

What a great plan for the rest of this year and for next season!

[Scase]

And when has Ingram ever been healthy?

9 years ago by my count

Doesnt matter, he played for the cursed Pelicans, just ask Dyson Daniels

He can average 70 games next contract and I wouldnt be surprised

Go buy some lotto tickets while youre at it.

[Quattro]

Oh I just remembered.

I was told showcasing Boucher, Bruce Brown, Kelly Olynyk by going 7-1 would pump their value and fetch us more return in a trade

Now crickets....

Didn't we move two of those guys and a middling 1st for Ingram? Do you even know what your whining about at this point?

[dTox]

https://open.spotify.com/episode/7xnSVQG1UjyFYdcGdDLvE7?si=FE3DBGPCSeqhgmmF-_eXCg

Simmons pod, Toronto part starts at 45:08

Sent from my Pixel 9 Pro using RealGM mobile app

[DelAbbot]

Oh I just remembered.

I was told showcasing Boucher, Bruce Brown, Kelly Olynyk by going 7-1 would pump their value and fetch us more return in a trade

Now crickets....

Didn't we move two of those guys and a middling 1st for Ingram? Do you even know what your whining about at this point?

yes I do.

Bruce Brown ended up with near 0 value; he was simply salary balast for facilitating the BI trade. Watch Pelicans buy him out, which confirms he's trade value is 0, but salary matching. The only way one can argue Bruce Brown had value is if we sent him to a team that will actually give him minutes.
Kelly O's 2 year deal ended up negative value as we paid a SRP to unload it.
Boucher is untraded.

really telling that I have to explain these to you

[Quattro]

Oh I just remembered.

I was told showcasing Boucher, Bruce Brown, Kelly Olynyk by going 7-1 would pump their value and fetch us more return in a trade

Now crickets....

Didn't we move two of those guys and a middling 1st for Ingram? Do you even know what your whining about at this point?

yes I do.

Bruce Brown ended up with near 0 value; he was simply salary balast for facilitating the BI trade. Watch Pelicans buy him out, which confirms he's trade value is 0, but salary matching. The only way one can argue Bruce Brown had value is if we sent him to a team that will actually give him minutes.
Kelly O's 2 year deal ended up negative value as we paid a SRP to unload it.
Boucher is untraded.

really telling that I have to explain these to you

Cool. So we basically traded a mid round 1st and nothing else for a former all star in his prime....and you're still crying.

[NinjaBro]

Because this is a post deadline grade, it's A+ to me.

Over time he's turned an expiring Siakam and OG into:
BI
IQ
RJ (my fave player)
Mogbo
Ochai
Ja'kobe (my fave rookie)

We lucked into BI narrowing down his team list to Atlanta and us. That is why we were able to get him for such low value.

Why aren't more people pumped about this? A great player picked us y'all!!

It takes some luck to make such a one sided trade at the deadline.

I don't care what the media is saying, this was a home run deadline for the Raptors.

We got a former All Star entering his prime for a non-lotto first, an easily replaceable second, a large expiring and a bad short term contract (sorry Kelly but that is why we needed to add another pick).

That is an A++ deadline deal.

We back up (next year)!!!

I want to see a .500 team next season. I believe in this staff and roster to get there.

Until then, let's tank for Cooper!

What a great plan for the rest of this year and for next season!

Masai gets an A+ from me too. He absolutely nailed this year's draft and now signed undrafted Battle to a 3 yr too. Adding Ingram to our core for just peanuts is unbelievable. And now that Bobby has made it known that we're taking the rest of the way for lottery luck , I couldn't have asked for a more perfect season.

The rest of the games will be fun to watch too with all our rookies playing. Easy A++

[DelAbbot]

Didn't we move two of those guys and a middling 1st for Ingram? Do you even know what your whining about at this point?

yes I do.

Bruce Brown ended up with near 0 value; he was simply salary balast for facilitating the BI trade. Watch Pelicans buy him out, which confirms he's trade value is 0, but salary matching. The only way one can argue Bruce Brown had value is if we sent him to a team that will actually give him minutes.
Kelly O's 2 year deal ended up negative value as we paid a SRP to unload it.
Boucher is untraded.

really telling that I have to explain these to you

Cool. So we basically traded a mid round 1st and nothing else for a former all star in his prime....and you're still crying.

We traded a mid FRP and nothing else for a expiring 1-time all star with poor defense, who is consistently injury prone, and will be demanding $40M+ AAV. It's not some heist.

you are still crying about my crying

[Quattro]

yes I do.

Bruce Brown ended up with near 0 value; he was simply salary balast for facilitating the BI trade. Watch Pelicans buy him out, which confirms he's trade value is 0, but salary matching. The only way one can argue Bruce Brown had value is if we sent him to a team that will actually give him minutes.
Kelly O's 2 year deal ended up negative value as we paid a SRP to unload it.
Boucher is untraded.

really telling that I have to explain these to you

Cool. So we basically traded a mid round 1st and nothing else for a former all star in his prime....and you're still crying.

We traded a mid FRP and nothing else for a expiring 1-time all star with poor defense, who is consistently injury prone, and will be demanding $40M+ AAV. It's not some heist.

you are still crying about my crying

Ya I'm pretty upset we didn't turn Olynyk and Brown into Kawhi part 2 myself. I think I'll rant about it like a baby for 3 days

[DelAbbot]

Cool. So we basically traded a mid round 1st and nothing else for a former all star in his prime....and you're still crying.

We traded a mid FRP and nothing else for a expiring 1-time all star with poor defense, who is consistently injury prone, and will be demanding $40M+ AAV. It's not some heist.

you are still crying about my crying

Ya I'm pretty upset we didn't turn Olynyk and Brown into Kawhi part 2 myself. I think I'll rant about it like a baby for 3 days

I have been ranting here for more than 3 years. I'm sure you are used to it.