Moderators: Def Swami, Howard Mass, ChosenSavior, UCF, Knightro, UCFJayBird
rcklsscognition wrote:They are getting Trae Young this summer I don’t care what it costs as long as it’s not Suggs P5 or Franz.
The Real Dalic wrote:Also, stop suggesting this FO trade for any sort of offensive players. They, literally, have not made ONE move towards that goal. They absolutely refuse to do it. It's not going to happen. We've seen this FO for almost a literal decade and they have not shown an inkling of it. It's getting irritating that people continue to wish for this. The only way you'll get offense on the Orlando Magic, is to fire the morons running the team.
drsd wrote:rcklsscognition wrote:They are getting Trae Young this summer I don’t care what it costs as long as it’s not Suggs P5 or Franz.
Orlando cannot financially have three max-players. The 2026.27 cap would destroy the Magic's ability to have anything more than LLE-vets. Even rookies would be too expensive.
drsd wrote:rcklsscognition wrote:They are getting Trae Young this summer I don’t care what it costs as long as it’s not Suggs P5 or Franz.
Orlando cannot financially have three max-players. The 2026.27 cap would destroy the Magic's ability to have anything more than LLE-vets. Even rookies would be too expensive.
eyriq wrote:I'm 100% on the trade Suggs train ASAP. Injury prone and not a good 3rd option with a low probability to develop into a good offensive player.
They are the same archetype but AB is taller, more durable, and on his rookie extension. Suggs is more valuable and is paid to be our third option. It just makes more sense to move him to spice up our core with more offense.The Real Dalic wrote:eyriq wrote:I'm 100% on the trade Suggs train ASAP. Injury prone and not a good 3rd option with a low probability to develop into a good offensive player.
You want to give up the guy who is far superior than AB on defense, offense, and shooting, but not AB himself who is the absolute worst fitting player on the team? Literally the worst possible fit around Paolo and Franz.
Trading Suggs would have to be for a star or borderline star. Look at how bad the energy and defense has been without him. Mo definitely would help with the energy as well btw. But Suggs is far too important to this team to just let go. But let's get AB the hell out of here.
toquito wrote:From what I understand, it's extremely hard to have 3 max players on a roster in this CBA. You have to fill out the rest of your roster on rookie contracts or vet min. So for the people wanting to trade for Trae or Booker, keep this in mind that this is a risky idea. You can probably only make this type of trade once, and after that you need picks and luck to have other decent rotation players.
The other option, which is more standard, is to avoid having 3 max players. I think this is what our front office is doing: to build around Franz and Paolo with two-way players (meaning players that are capable on the offensive and defensive end). The hope thus far has been to stack young talent that will develop into a strong supporting cast. After this season, depending on how we finish out, we will continue with this internal development or trade assets for better supporting players. But I think our trades will be limited to rotation players, not all-star level players that are being suggested.
eyriq wrote:They are the same archetype but AB is taller, more durable, and on his rookie extension. Suggs is more valuable and is paid to be our third option. It just makes more sense to move him to spice up our core with more offense.The Real Dalic wrote:eyriq wrote:I'm 100% on the trade Suggs train ASAP. Injury prone and not a good 3rd option with a low probability to develop into a good offensive player.
You want to give up the guy who is far superior than AB on defense, offense, and shooting, but not AB himself who is the absolute worst fitting player on the team? Literally the worst possible fit around Paolo and Franz.
Trading Suggs would have to be for a star or borderline star. Look at how bad the energy and defense has been without him. Mo definitely would help with the energy as well btw. But Suggs is far too important to this team to just let go. But let's get AB the hell out of here.
drsd wrote:rcklsscognition wrote:They are getting Trae Young this summer I don’t care what it costs as long as it’s not Suggs P5 or Franz.
Orlando cannot financially have three max-players. The 2026.27 cap would destroy the Magic's ability to have anything more than LLE-vets. Even rookies would be too expensive.
eyriq wrote:I'm 100% on the trade Suggs train ASAP. Injury prone and not a good 3rd option with a low probability to develop into a good offensive player.
eyriq wrote:They are the same archetype but AB is taller, more durable, and on his rookie extension. Suggs is more valuable and is paid to be our third option. It just makes more sense to move him to spice up our core with more offense.
Knightro wrote:
I know this is hard for you to hear, but Anthony Black - right now - is bad at basketball. He just doesn't impact winning much at all and as it presently stands, he doesn't bring much to the table offensively that fits with Franz and Paolo.
MAYBE both of those things will change in the future, but even if they do, I'm hard pressed to see him having a season anytime soon like the one Suggs just had last year which was 40% 3PT on 5+ attempts per game with all-NBA defense.
I like his potential, but I just don't think he's in a position right now to replace Suggs anytime soon.
eyriq wrote:Paolo projects to be an all-nba offensive talent, a Melo/Griffin/Webber hybrid player.
Franz projects to be an all-nba offensive talent, something like a Hill or Leonard.
Suggs projects to have what kind of upside at this point? Victor Oladipo? Latrell Sprewell? Stephen Jackson? What is his 3rd option upside, really?
We are paying Suggs 3rd option money. He's in his 4th year, improvement is going to start to level out. He's missed almost as many games this season as Franz, who had a major injury. I think its fair to consider Suggs injury prone. We probably need a better offensive player in Suggs' salary slot. His most adamant fans concede that he's better as a 3&D role-player. If that is true, he's already overpaid.
Suggs grades out as exactly the same archetype as Anthony Black. We can swap Suggs for an offensive minded 3rd option and still have AB as our key point of attack defender. AB is actually right on track developmentally to match Suggs current output, by my evaluation. It isn't AB replacing Suggs at his cap hit. It is a 3rd option replacing Suggs at his cap hit and AB replacing Suggs in the role Suggs is actually best suited for, at an appropriate market value.
Knightro wrote:eyriq wrote:Paolo projects to be an all-nba offensive talent, a Melo/Griffin/Webber hybrid player.
Franz projects to be an all-nba offensive talent, something like a Hill or Leonard.
Suggs projects to have what kind of upside at this point? Victor Oladipo? Latrell Sprewell? Stephen Jackson? What is his 3rd option upside, really?
We are paying Suggs 3rd option money. He's in his 4th year, improvement is going to start to level out. He's missed almost as many games this season as Franz, who had a major injury. I think its fair to consider Suggs injury prone. We probably need a better offensive player in Suggs' salary slot. His most adamant fans concede that he's better as a 3&D role-player. If that is true, he's already overpaid.
Suggs grades out as exactly the same archetype as Anthony Black. We can swap Suggs for an offensive minded 3rd option and still have AB as our key point of attack defender. AB is actually right on track developmentally to match Suggs current output, by my evaluation. It isn't AB replacing Suggs at his cap hit. It is a 3rd option replacing Suggs at his cap hit and AB replacing Suggs in the role Suggs is actually best suited for, at an appropriate market value.
Suggs is averaging 28.2 PTS/100. That's perfectly acceptable 3rd option production offensively.
You're going to die alone and miserable on this Anthony Black hill my friend. I feel sorry for you.
If anything, the issue overwhelmingly is that Paolo *might* not be an All-NBA offensive talent. And if the Magic want to go anywhere, Paolo really has to hit those heights offensively given how poor he currently is defensively and on the glass.
Knightro wrote:Suggs is averaging 28.2 PTS/100. That's perfectly acceptable 3rd option production offensively.
MartinsIzAfraud wrote: he's nowhere close to on-court capabilities.