Dane Moore reporting indications are that Taylor lost arbitration

[winforlose]

Wolves fans don't need to be apologetic on Taylor's behalf to have serious concerns about the funding, integrity and competence of a Lore/ARod ownership group.

Dallas Maverick fans would like a word with you about Miriam Adelson...

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Exactly. I hate Glen, but I fear Arod/Lore. Both sides have huge potential for negative and it feels far more likely they will destroy the team than improve it.

Maybe I’m missing it, but the only thing Taylor was doing before was hiring GM’s (poorly), and now he isn’t even doing that. Now he just ponies up the money when the GM wants something (or ARod and Lore want him to buy them a lavish owner’s suite). Where is the “huge potential for danger” from Glen anymore?

I read through your posts and I understand your position. I look back on years of poor coaching and failed drafts and the debacles with Smith, Butler, and now KAT and I wonder how ownership allowed this to happen. Then I look at the Mavs and the Suns and how their FOs and ownership have run those teams into the ground (Beal and Davis trades,) I look at the Nets trading Harden for Simmons and remember how badly we wanted him. I have seen the ugly side of asset management, drafting, and FOs in the NBA. Lore and Arod hired TC who in my opinion is performing inexcusably poorly, and I fear more of that plus budget constraints. But, I also fear Glen keeping TC and giving him a blank check to go make a KD trade or some other disasters mistake. The answer isn’t hands totally on or off, it is in the middle. So far everyone involved track record sucks.

[Worm Guts]

I think Glen did actually take the blame for the Joe Smith deal, saying he was concerned with his health at the time and wanted to make sure his commitments were honored.

My take is that the GM should know what is legal and illegal in the CBA, and that was McHale’s job. But Glen ultimately gets blame for hiring McHale.

They both knew it was illegal. If Taylor was the boss and pushed for the illegal deal, it’s more on him, but they both put their names on it.

[shrink]

We KNOW long term it's going to be more of the same with Taylor. So what if AROD/Lore fail and end up worse? Our "status" as a franchise will go from being the biggest pro sports embarrassment to...continuing to be the biggest pro sports embarrassment.

I just wanted to mention that I don’t think this is true anymore. Our status since Taylor stopped picking GMs has definitely improved, and we’re not an embarrassment anymore.

The drafting under Rosas and Connelly, and the expensive Connelly trades have led to winning, and the greatest benefit is that we are not seen as a laughingstock any more? Evidence? Before now, there hasn’t been any time in MIN history, even the KG era, when we didn’t have to overpay players to come here. Now, the whole team wants to be here. Naz avoids free agency to stay. Multiple Wolves sign discount deals. Rudy renegotiates. Ant and Jaden don’t take the customary player option on the end of their new contracts. And Kevin freakin’ Durant turns down GSW and is open to MIN?

MIN’s image has changed.

[shrink]

Exactly. I hate Glen, but I fear Arod/Lore. Both sides have huge potential for negative and it feels far more likely they will destroy the team than improve it.

Maybe I’m missing it, but the only thing Taylor was doing before was hiring GM’s (poorly), and now he isn’t even doing that. Now he just ponies up the money when the GM wants something (or ARod and Lore want him to buy them a lavish owner’s suite). Where is the “huge potential for danger” from Glen anymore?

I read through your posts and I understand your position. I look back on years of poor coaching and failed drafts and the debacles with Smith, Butler, and now KAT and I wonder how ownership allowed this to happen. Then I look at the Mavs and the Suns and how their FOs and ownership have run those teams into the ground (Beal and Davis trades,) I look at the Nets trading Harden for Simmons and remember how badly we wanted him. I have seen the ugly side of asset management, drafting, and FOs in the NBA. Lore and Arod hired TC who in my opinion is performing inexcusably poorly, and I fear more of that plus budget constraints. But, I also fear Glen keeping TC and giving him a blank check to go make a KD trade or some other disasters mistake. The answer isn’t hands totally on or off, it is in the middle. So far everyone involved track record sucks.

I don’t agree with your position, but I applaud you for having one that fits the evidence. While others fear Glen for somehow doing things in the future (they never say what) to make the team bad, since you don’t like TC, you fear Glen for not meddling enough. This is consistent, because Glen not meddling with previous (bad) GMs probably made the team worse.

This is also consistent with last week’s events. Everyone is saying DAL wouldn’t have traded Doncic is Mark Cuban was still owner, because then you would have an owner telling a GM “no.”

[winforlose]

Maybe I’m missing it, but the only thing Taylor was doing before was hiring GM’s (poorly), and now he isn’t even doing that. Now he just ponies up the money when the GM wants something (or ARod and Lore want him to buy them a lavish owner’s suite). Where is the “huge potential for danger” from Glen anymore?

I read through your posts and I understand your position. I look back on years of poor coaching and failed drafts and the debacles with Smith, Butler, and now KAT and I wonder how ownership allowed this to happen. Then I look at the Mavs and the Suns and how their FOs and ownership have run those teams into the ground (Beal and Davis trades,) I look at the Nets trading Harden for Simmons and remember how badly we wanted him. I have seen the ugly side of asset management, drafting, and FOs in the NBA. Lore and Arod hired TC who in my opinion is performing inexcusably poorly, and I fear more of that plus budget constraints. But, I also fear Glen keeping TC and giving him a blank check to go make a KD trade or some other disasters mistake. The answer isn’t hands totally on or off, it is in the middle. So far everyone involved track record sucks.

I don’t agree with your position, but I applaud you for having one that fits the evidence. While others fear Glen for somehow doing things in the future (they never say what) to make the team bad, since you don’t like TC, you fear Glen for not meddling enough. This is consistent, because Glen not meddling with previous (bad) GMs probably made the team worse.

This is also consistent with last week’s events. Everyone is saying DAL wouldn’t have traded Doncic is Mark Cuban was still owner, because then you would have an owner telling a GM “no.”

I still wonder about the new Mavs ownership. Either way I don’t have the right answer. Some moves are good other are bad. Knowing which is often a judgment call, and I just don’t like TC’s judgement. Each move looks fine by itself, (Dlo for Mike, NAW, and picks looks great,) but then you see we don’t have a PG for after Mike. We also lose the salary slot (which is less relevant once you add Rudy and now you are trying to cut spending, which is itself counter intuitive with being a super tax team, until you figure in the 2nd apron.) The level of complexity and variables is immense, and short term plans without long term plans are often VERY DANGEROUS! I have not heard specifics on who will do what, so how can I possibly say whose vision is better?

[minimus]

I don't understand much about this, but for me all the information that is given by the parties to the conflict is just advertising. And I don't like to buy goods from an advertising brochure. So I'm not deceived.

[Baseline81]

Well, instead of your imagination and conspiracy theories, let’s use actual, public evidence.

Do you remember that Taylor specifically said he didn’t like the Gobert trade and thought we paid too much? Even on a trade he didn’t like, did he over-ride Connelly? I bet Connelly remembers.

I can only think of one instance in his entire time as an owner where we have evidence that he put his finger on the scale. That’s when he said to keep Naz. Can you bring yourself to thank Glen for that, whenever Naz makes a big play?

Direct quote last year:

“I think we’ll have the challenge of keeping this team together, because we have a lot of really good, high-paid players, and that’s going to be a challenge,” Taylor said. “I think the arena is a long-term, big plan, and you’d have to get people on it. So I still have all the same … opportunities you look at either way in the future, and I’ve always been willing to take on the opportunities.”

Fast-forward a few months, Towns is traded. If that's the not the definition of foreshadowing, I don't know what is.

[shrink]

Well, instead of your imagination and conspiracy theories, let’s use actual, public evidence.

Do you remember that Taylor specifically said he didn’t like the Gobert trade and thought we paid too much? Even on a trade he didn’t like, did he over-ride Connelly? I bet Connelly remembers.

I can only think of one instance in his entire time as an owner where we have evidence that he put his finger on the scale. That’s when he said to keep Naz. Can you bring yourself to thank Glen for that, whenever Naz makes a big play?

Direct quote last year:

“I think we’ll have the challenge of keeping this team together, because we have a lot of really good, high-paid players, and that’s going to be a challenge,” Taylor said. “I think the arena is a long-term, big plan, and you’d have to get people on it. So I still have all the same … opportunities you look at either way in the future, and I’ve always been willing to take on the opportunities.”

Fast-forward a few months, Towns is traded. If that's the not the definition of foreshadowing, I don't know what is.

How about actual direct quotes specifically about the Towns trade, rather than vague conspiracy theorist foreshadowing?

All summer long, after the Wolves advanced out of the first round for just the second time in franchise history, Taylor insisted to Connelly and the front office staff that he was comfortable paying a hefty luxury tax bill, team sources told The Athletic. In addition, those sources said Taylor preferred to retain Towns rather than make a trade that made his team demonstrably worse. He did not want to take a step back this season.

The Athletic

Taylor always loved Towns, and he’s loyal to his guys. But again, my point is that Taylor lets the basketball people make the basketball decisions.

[Klomp]

We KNOW long term it's going to be more of the same with Taylor. So what if AROD/Lore fail and end up worse? Our "status" as a franchise will go from being the biggest pro sports embarrassment to...continuing to be the biggest pro sports embarrassment.

I just wanted to mention that I don’t think this is true anymore. Our status since Taylor stopped picking GMs has definitely improved, and we’re not an embarrassment anymore.

A great endorsement of keeping someone in charge of a company, where they have to sign off on personnel changes all of the time.

[shrink]

Btw, if you are looking for someone to blame for the Towns trade, here’s an article for you titled:

Timberwolves: Was Alex Rodriguez behind the Karl-Anthony Towns trade?

https://nbarealities.com/2024/09/29/alex-rodriguez-karl-anthony-towns/

[shrink]

I didn’t want to mention this during our hiatus, but when Jim Souhan talked with Timberwolves employees (from janitors to marketing to front office) last month, he said they were feeling nervous about their future with the ownership battle, and most were trying to keep their heads down. However, off the record, he said they unanimously hoped Taylor would win the arbitration.

[shrink]

Glen Taylor’s concern about payroll

If this is true, why would Taylor refuse to give them [ARod and Lore] an extension? Well, the answer is that they were planning to cut payroll. ESPN reported on April 10th that the ownership wanted to lower payroll to $171 million for the 2024-25 season.

In documents shared with Taylor, the NBA and The Carlyle Group, a private equity firm, Lore and Rodriguez rendered a budget projection as potential majority owners that would’ve lowered the Timberwolves’ payroll to $171 million beginning next season — below the projected $172 million luxury tax threshold, sources told ESPN. The Timberwolves would’ve gone from approximately a $25 million-plus tax payment to a team receiving a tax distribution of approximately $6.5 million.

Consequently, the team would have reduced payroll by 27.3 million, as the salary cap was $198.4 million during the 2023-24 season. Before this report, Taylor alluded to his displeasure with the new ownership group’s plans on March 28th.

“We went through the process, and I spent a lot of time. We’ve got a really good team, we’ve got a lot of good things going for us, I enjoy it and I’m healthy enough to do this,” Taylor said in an interview with The Associated Press after the announcement. “I don’t need the money, so I think I’ll just keep running it and enjoy it. I like my coach. I like my staff. This way everybody gets to keep their jobs, and I’ll be happy.”

[Baseline81]

I didn’t want to mention this during our hiatus, but when Jim Souhan talked with Timberwolves employees (from janitors to marketing to front office) last month, he said they were feeling nervous about their future with the ownership battle, and most were trying to keep their heads down. However, off the record, he said they unanimously hoped Taylor would win the arbitration.

Of course employees of a company would rather the current regime stays. Shocking. New owners likely result in upheaval.

[shrink]

I didn’t want to mention this during our hiatus, but when Jim Souhan talked with Timberwolves employees (from janitors to marketing to front office) last month, he said they were feeling nervous about their future with the ownership battle, and most were trying to keep their heads down. However, off the record, he said they unanimously hoped Taylor would win the arbitration.

Of course employees of a company would rather the current regime stays. Shocking. New owners likely result in upheaval.

Yes, janitors part of the “Taylor regime.”

[Baseline81]

Glen Taylor’s concern about payroll

If this is true, why would Taylor refuse to give them [ARod and Lore] an extension? Well, the answer is that they were planning to cut payroll. ESPN reported on April 10th that the ownership wanted to lower payroll to $171 million for the 2024-25 season.

In documents shared with Taylor, the NBA and The Carlyle Group, a private equity firm, Lore and Rodriguez rendered a budget projection as potential majority owners that would’ve lowered the Timberwolves’ payroll to $171 million beginning next season — below the projected $172 million luxury tax threshold, sources told ESPN. The Timberwolves would’ve gone from approximately a $25 million-plus tax payment to a team receiving a tax distribution of approximately $6.5 million.

Consequently, the team would have reduced payroll by 27.3 million, as the salary cap was $198.4 million during the 2023-24 season. Before this report, Taylor alluded to his displeasure with the new ownership group’s plans on March 28th.

“We went through the process, and I spent a lot of time. We’ve got a really good team, we’ve got a lot of good things going for us, I enjoy it and I’m healthy enough to do this,” Taylor said in an interview with The Associated Press after the announcement. “I don’t need the money, so I think I’ll just keep running it and enjoy it. I like my coach. I like my staff. This way everybody gets to keep their jobs, and I’ll be happy.”

Really shrink? You know darn well what posting this is going to bring. Do you not recall the amount of back and forth that took place when the article appeared the first time?

[Baseline81]

Yes, janitors part of the “Taylor regime.”

What?

The point of my post was to show how idiotic it was to even bring that up. Employees, from simple peons to executives, will always side with current ownership because, get this, they already have a job there.

What does that have to do with whether Lore or Rodriguez will be better owners at producing results on the court?

[shrink]

Glen Taylor’s concern about payroll

If this is true, why would Taylor refuse to give them [ARod and Lore] an extension? Well, the answer is that they were planning to cut payroll. ESPN reported on April 10th that the ownership wanted to lower payroll to $171 million for the 2024-25 season.

In documents shared with Taylor, the NBA and The Carlyle Group, a private equity firm, Lore and Rodriguez rendered a budget projection as potential majority owners that would’ve lowered the Timberwolves’ payroll to $171 million beginning next season — below the projected $172 million luxury tax threshold, sources told ESPN. The Timberwolves would’ve gone from approximately a $25 million-plus tax payment to a team receiving a tax distribution of approximately $6.5 million.

Consequently, the team would have reduced payroll by 27.3 million, as the salary cap was $198.4 million during the 2023-24 season. Before this report, Taylor alluded to his displeasure with the new ownership group’s plans on March 28th.

“We went through the process, and I spent a lot of time. We’ve got a really good team, we’ve got a lot of good things going for us, I enjoy it and I’m healthy enough to do this,” Taylor said in an interview with The Associated Press after the announcement. “I don’t need the money, so I think I’ll just keep running it and enjoy it. I like my coach. I like my staff. This way everybody gets to keep their jobs, and I’ll be happy.”

Really shrink? You know darn well what posting this is going to bring. Do you not recall the amount of back and forth that took place when the article appeared the first time?

This specifically refutes your conspiracy theory that “we don’t know Taylor didn’t force Connelly to make the KAT trade.” In fact, my quote was part of the “Was Alex Rodriguez Behind the Karl Anthony Towns?” article.

If you are afraid of the results of being refuted with facts, maybe don’t post your conspiracy theory crap that needs to be refuted?

[thinktank]

Exactly. I hate Glen, but I fear Arod/Lore. Both sides have huge potential for negative and it feels far more likely they will destroy the team than improve it. I cannot tell you how disgusted I felt when I heard we tried to trade for KD. That is the worst possible mistake, and we almost made it. Give TC time he will destroy the core and burn the ashes to dust.

You two should both be thanking Lore and ARod for convincing Taylor to bring Connelly onboard.

I hope that is a joke. If I could rewind and undo that hire I would. The Gobert trade me so happy, but only when paired with KAT. I am a huge fan of big ball and twin towers. When we dumped KAT for scraps that was a massive blow to this franchise. All the player talent currently leading us was acquired by Rosas. The Conley trade backed us into a corner that forced the Dilly trade, and he is years away from being viable. NAW looks like he might be on the way out, and TC bringing in Randle could very well cost us Naz. Every move that TC has made has brought with it a hint of calamity. Including the signings of Garza, Jingles, and PJ. The final straw is trying to dump MCD and more for KD. We could have just traded Karl for him and tossed in the pick package we gave up for Dilly. But no, TC has to sabotage us just a little bit more deeply before he realizes he has been an abject failure in his time here. One good season is nice, we had Karl, Ant, Naz, Jaden, and a full boat of our own picks. We could be in the same place now that we were last year without our future gutted and KAT in NYK.

Taylor is the guy who ordered KAT traded, my friend.

When the ownership changes, this news will come out. Just watch.

I’ve been 100% correct about all this crap so far.

The folks with their heads in the sand on this aren’t going to change their thinking, including you.

[thinktank]

Really shrink? You know darn well what posting this is going to bring. Do you not recall the amount of back and forth that took place when the article appeared the first time?

This specifically refutes your conspiracy theory that “we don’t know Taylor didn’t force Connelly to make the KAT trade.” In fact, my quote was part of the “Was Alex Rodriguez Behind the Karl Anthony Towns?” article.

If you are afraid of the results of being refuted with facts, maybe don’t post your conspiracy theory crap that needs to be refuted?

You’ll die on this hill of KAT being traded by Lore / ARod even though Taylor owned the team.

So be it.

That would suck—you’re a huge KAT backer and the guy you admire so much (Taylor) sold you (and us) out.

[Klomp]

I don't think "Taylor ordered Connelly to trade KAT"
I do think Taylor advised Connelly to have a path out of the second apron. A Towns trade was the most feasible way to accomplish this without completely gutting the team.

That doesn't mean we'll never pay the second apron again. It's not saying that Lore and Rodriguez wouldn't have done the same thing either.