Return to Sender: The Mark Williams Thread

[yosemiteben]

I am choosing to believe we gave them a copy of his chart / medical records, which almost certainly are in electronic form. I can't believe that they messed with his records and then sent them, I'm going to need the league to weigh in before I believe that.

[EmpireFalls]

I am choosing to believe we gave them a copy of his chart / medical records, which almost certainly are in electronic form. I can't believe that they messed with his records and then sent them, I'm going to need the league to weigh in before I believe that.

There would be significant penalties and/or firings if it turns out we doctored his medical records or withheld them.

[MPM]

Did you really post this BEFORE the trade was rescinded due to failed Mark physical?

Ha. Yep. Day or so before - some weird voodoo going on in the ole noggin.

love me some Cooper.

[yosemiteben]

I am choosing to believe we gave them a copy of his chart / medical records, which almost certainly are in electronic form. I can't believe that they messed with his records and then sent them, I'm going to need the league to weigh in before I believe that.

There would be significant penalties and/or firings if it turns out we doctored his medical records or withheld them.

Right, and I think that would be appropriate

[Rich4114]

Had a dream last night that Mark failed his Lakers physical.

Did you really post this BEFORE the trade was rescinded due to failed Mark physical?

He did!

Petition to change MPM's name to MPModomous moving forward

[yosemiteben]

https://ak-static.cms.nba.com/referee/injury/Injury-Report_2025-02-10_01PM.pdf

[Rich4114]

https://ak-static.cms.nba.com/referee/injury/Injury-Report_2025-02-10_01PM.pdf

Guess LeMelo's back again lol

[_tijo_]

Hornets could have disclosed everything that they know about Mark.

Lakers could have reviewed it, and then made the trade.

Then the Lakers docs can still fail someone on a physical, for whatever reason they want. If they aren't comfortable with potential for future health, or whatever nebulous thing they have concerns about... including if the front office gets remorseful about all the haul they gave up for someone whose health may project to not have as long a career as they would like.

All can be true.

NBA has to fix this in the next CBA. If this were a Charlotte/Memphis deal, then no chance of any change. But because it's LA, it probably will.

And give us the #1 pick because we don't necessarily make the Nurkic deal without this deal, and we got royally screwed. But with this and Lamelo not getting even an injury alternate for allstar when he was leading vote getter, the league has made it pretty clear that they don't care about us at all, and treat us like it's favor to the Carolinas that we have a team. Even though we have supported their trash for now 20+ years (and I'm just talking Bobcats/new Hornets era).

[JMAC3]

This is a weird one. My initial thoughts are:
-Lakers backing out hurts them in the short term more than it hurts us.
-Never seen a physical failed for a player who is actively playing 30+ mins.
-I was never a fan of the trade, so it getting rescinded is fine by me.

Where do we go from here? I think this does potentially lower Mark value league wide which could be seen as a negative, but it also could help the Hornets sign him to a team friendly extension. I saw a few bring up that investing in Mark could be scary due to injury concerns, but if he is going to cost .50 on the dollar now then maybe that is best for both parties.

Also, yes this should motivate Mark. I am not in the group that we should send Mark home for the rest of the year, that seems like an odd reaction to this type of transaction. Mark did nothing wrong, Charlotte did nothing wrong. Are we really supposed to not be able to trade a 23 yr old center averaging 17/10 as a starter who's played 28+ mins in 12/14 games?

Lots of fishy things going on... How would the Lakers have taken this if Mavs saw the backlash of Luka trade and recinded due to AD not passing physical. A guy that was actively hurt, then got immediately hurt in his first game?

If guys like Blake Griffin, T-Mac, Penny Hardaway, Grant Hill etc all were passed on physicals despite being constantly banged up this doesn't add up.

[yosemiteben]

Read on Twitter

[Rich4114]

This is a weird one. My initial thoughts are:
-Lakers backing out hurts them in the short term more than it hurts us.
-Never seen a physical failed for a player who is actively playing 30+ mins.
-I was never a fan of the trade, so it getting rescinded is fine by me.

Where do we go from here? I think this does potentially lower Mark value league wide which could be seen as a negative, but it also could help the Hornets sign him to a team friendly extension. I saw a few bring up that investing in Mark could be scary due to injury concerns, but if he is going to cost .50 on the dollar now then maybe that is best for both parties.

Also, yes this should motivate Mark. I am not in the group that we should send Mark home for the rest of the year, that seems like an odd reaction to this type of transaction. Mark did nothing wrong, Charlotte did nothing wrong. Are we really supposed to not be able to trade a 23 yr old center averaging 17/10 as a starter who's played 28+ mins in 12/14 games?

Lots of fishy things going on... How would the Lakers have taken this if Mavs saw the backlash of Luka trade and recinded due to AD not passing physical. A guy that was actively hurt, then got immediately hurt in his first game?

If guys like Blake Griffin, T-Mac, Penny Hardaway, Grant Hill etc all were passed on physicals despite being constantly banged up this doesn't add up.

It's difficult to speculate given the lack of actual detail from anyone (shoutout to Rod for being silent this entire time other than to re-type/post Hornets PR tweets) but reading between the lines of what we do have and the vagueness of the initial report by Shams - my gut is telling me that the Lakers had buyers remorse because they gave up so much for a player with health questions. I think once that Green report came out on the TNT broadcast (which was later, very suspiciously rescinded) that it set all of this in motion.

We may never know what really went down, but I hope someone gives us better insight into what actually is going on with Mark because bro's medicals have been a mystery for like 18 months now.

Anyway, I was upset when we traded him (despite the haul) because of how much easier it is to find Dalton Knecht's than it is 7 footers with good hands and instincts. He has been getting absolutely cooked defensively, but I mean not playing basketball for a year, not lifting weights, not really practicing and then all of the sudden facing Anthony Davis, Jokic, etc.... is it really the best move to determine he's done for good and move on? I get why they did it, it was an offer that they saw improved their team for the long-haul and gave them even more assets to deal with for a future star. But Mark could develop into one of the premier bigs in the NBA and I think as long as he can regain his rookie year defensive form, add strength and reps he will develop.

I'm happy he's back. But obviously, if there is some really bad issue lurking with his foot or something new then it's a giant concern.

[Walt Cronkite]

FWIW, Hollinger has a piece (https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/6125067/2025/02/10/nba-trades-undo-lakers-spurs/) saying teams can fail a player's physical for any reason.

"So what do we mean by “pass,” exactly? Well, we’re getting into murky territory. This is an important and underrated point: Technically, a team can fail a player’s physical for any reason at all. A hangnail. A droopy eyelid. Halitosis. Anything."

Maybe he's speaking generally or maybe we should be nervous about Mark's knee:
"That policy is one of the hidden risks of last-minute shopping: The Lakers’ only option was to either complete the trade as agreed, or blow it up. As I noted above, whether they unwound the trade because they didn’t like the imaging on Williams’ knee or just didn’t like the defensive clips that people were posting on social media, is almost irrelevant. The end-game is the same: An incredible sliding-doors moment."

Article seems to imply the Lakers are in the wrong here:
"Theoretically, they could even trade for Williams again this summer on different terms, although I’m not sure the Hornets will be returning their calls. (One of the ancillary costs of nuking a trade is that other teams become less willing to do business with you, especially the one you just burned.)"

[Chapelchilla]

I think there is also the possibility that we just don't know (or even should be told) what the actual health issue is, it may be mental, sickle cell, diabetes. Hopefully, it is not something like that and he will be fine going forward. The whole thing dating to last season is weird.

[luciano-davidwesley]

The best part of all of this is the Lakers now have no meaningful way of strengthening their Center rotation until the offseason.

As long as Mark doesn't break down imminently I much prefer him to the poo poo platter of meh we were set to receive for him.

[fatlever]

source here is unknown, so take away what you want

Read on Twitter

Here is the translation to English:

It's a pity that the deal between the Lakers and the Hornets was canceled. Mark Williams' physical exam not only revealed back issues but also showed that his cartilage wear has reached level 2, which is normal at 0 to 1. There's also a case of incomplete healing from a hard zone fracture in his right foot. Medical experts have assessed that this could shorten his career by 3 to 5 years.

He's somewhat similar to Ibaka from the Thunder.

This similarity means that an unsigned medical team gives a risk of over 40% for the next 5 years, directly triggering the trade protection clause. So, what about this trade?

It reminds us once again how crucial the physical exam process is in the NBA.

The player's health status directly affects the success or failure of a trade.

Although the Lakers are very eager for internal support, the health risks forced them to give up on this performance. Now that the trade has been canceled, the Lakers can only turn to the free agent market or the buyout market to find other center options.

[fatlever]

Read on Twitter

Just a very weird situation all around between LA and Charlotte.

The Lakers claimed it was the Hornets who failed to provide all information on Williams and that came to them about the trade.

The Hornets say it is the other way around on both issues.

Very weird...

[Braggins]

source here is unknown, so take away what you want

Here is the translation to English:

It's a pity that the deal between the Lakers and the Hornets was canceled. Mark Williams' physical exam not only revealed back issues but also showed that his cartilage wear has reached level 2, which is normal at 0 to 1. There's also a case of incomplete healing from a hard zone fracture in his right foot. Medical experts have assessed that this could shorten his career by 3 to 5 years.

He's somewhat similar to Ibaka from the Thunder.

This similarity means that an unsigned medical team gives a risk of over 40% for the next 5 years, directly triggering the trade protection clause. So, what about this trade?

It reminds us once again how crucial the physical exam process is in the NBA.

The player's health status directly affects the success or failure of a trade.

Although the Lakers are very eager for internal support, the health risks forced them to give up on this performance. Now that the trade has been canceled, the Lakers can only turn to the free agent market or the buyout market to find other center options.

If this is legit and that issue with his foot is something that could benefit from sitting out for further treatment then he probably shouldn't be playing the rest of the year. I really hope this wasn't something missed by the Hornets medical staff.

[yosemiteben]

I am hugely skeptical that this random dude has that degree of knowledge of Mark's medical records. That doesn't make any sense.

[HornetJail]

I am hugely skeptical that this random dude has that degree of knowledge of Mark's medical records. That doesn't make any sense.

the most detailed report I've ever seen on an injury in my entire life of watching sports is coming from a chinese fan site. skeptical is an understatement

[Rays Pompadour]

I don't believe there's any reason to overthink this. The Lakers had buyer's remorse. It's that simple. Pelinka tried to assuage Doncic's desires and made a deal he probably didn't want to make. And I don't believe for one second that the Hornets called the Lakers first. GM's talk all the time, coming back to things that were casual at one moment but acute the next. Spin all you want, LA. The truth of causation is evident.

Mark's medical condition isn't a state secret. His foot injury and back issues are well known. He just wasn't super healthy right now, which is why LA nixed the trade after doing what they had to do - something that Luka wanted - then taking the coward's way out by claiming medical issues that were known. There's just zero possibility that the Lakers discovered something the Hornets didn't already know. And I think the huge risks in faking a med report make it very likely the reports sent to LA were comprehensive and not redacted.

Mark Williams was Rob Pelinka's prom dress.