2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part IV

[ChuckS]

Looking for the next Booker if we happen to eventually trade him or if he opts to leave soon anyways, Upon looking through this coming draft, I ve come across Kobe Brea and did a comparison between him and Booker and found this very interesting!!

https://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=koby-brea--devin-booker

Kobe Brea ( currently flying way under the radar at 57th pick I believe, due to athletic limitations ( same as Booker had coming into the league). But very similar projections between the two. So what I'm getting at here is I believe that I might have ow key found the next Devin Booker?

I don’t want the next Booker. I want the next Nash, Barkley, KJ, Marion, Kidd, Ceballos, Googs, Uncle Cliff, Amare, Walter Davis, Chambers, McDyess all of whom I would take before Booker.

I certainly cannot fault you for your excellent choice of favorites. To this day my starters and sixth man have been Robertson, West, Baylor, Pettit, Kareem, and Havlicek. And it isn't because I haven't been even more in awe of Magic, Michael, KD/Bird, Duncan, and equally impressed with Wilt, Russ, Hakeem, and Shaq. I attribute it to the enthusiasm of youth and some dispassion with age.

My confusion lies with the few, but prominent, seemingly knowledgeable, and prolific posters, herein, who express such disdain for those whom (I think) most observers would believe are far and away the two best and valuable players on this team, Durant and Booker. Perhaps some could even believe that a few on your list were better than Devin. For example, maybe Kidd and Barkley because of their careers. And only Kidd and Marion (together at ages 33 and 38, I think) have won one championship -- albeit with a "little" help from Nowitzki.

In summary, I believe that Durant and Booker, are least responsible for the record of this team. They seem to be paying for the unpopular decisions of management, on which I, maybe stupidly, haven't yet given up hope. We rave about the OKC model. But forget that their journey started in 2012 (edited) when they foolishly traded Harden. I need more than two years to so panic.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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LOL! Why not at this point?

[Ghost of Kleine]

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That'd honestly be stupid to give up that much value for an unproven prospect. Although I suppose that at some point it might just make sense as opposed to just pushing picks farther out! On the other end of the spectrum, I don't know that whichever team gets Flag with the first pick would trade him for OKCs' late 1sts as the majority of them will likely be fairly mediocre with maybe the 28' Dallas 1st being the only premium pick they could offer.

[Saberestar]

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LOL! Why not at this point?

How absurd are those bets? Have they been right about it at least once? James Harden, Jimmy Butler, PJ Tucker... so many times I see you posting things like that but it’s not like they have any good information about it. They just want people to waste their money in bets.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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[Ghost of Kleine]

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Simple Answer here:

[Fo-Real]

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LOL! Why not at this point?

Win HUH?!?!

[Ghost of Kleine]

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Minnesota desperately needs to make a big move! And it just so happens that their franchisee star player Ant adores KD! We can add Minnesota to the KD list this summer, And the Wolves can give us one of two possible packages:

1- KD for Randle/ Reid/ Dillingham/ DET 25' 1st (17th pick) / MIN 32' 1st.
2- KD for Mcdaniels/ Reid/ DiVencenzo/ Shannon Jr/ Minott/ MIN 32' 1st.

Although it likely won't matter now as come summertime, Minnesota as a 2nd apron team won't be able to aggregate salaries in a trade, just like us! So there likely won't be a mechanism for us to get those player packages.

[Slim Charless]

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Minnesota desperately needs to make a big move! And it just so happens that their franchisee star player Ant adores KD! We can add Minnesota to the KD list this summer, And the Wolves can give us one of two possible packages:

1- KD for Randle/ Reid/ Dillingham/ DET 25' 1st (17th pick) / MIN 32' 1st.
2- KD for Mcdaniels/ Reid/ DiVencenzo/ Shannon Jr/ Minott/ MIN 32' 1st.

Although it likely won't matter now as come summertime, Minnesota as a 2nd apron team won't be able to aggregate salaries in a trade, just like us! So there likely won't be a mechanism for us to get those player packages.

Booker for Anthony Edwards. Straight up.

[MrMiyagi]

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LOL! Why not at this point?

Kill me now

[Ghost of Kleine]

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LOL! Why not at this point?

Win HUH?!?!

Might be the only time in the next 8-10 yrs that we " win" anything.

But adding Beverly to this team in our current condition would be like adding a molotov cocktail to a dumpster fire! Burn.....baby ......burn!

[bwgood77]

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Minnesota desperately needs to make a big move! And it just so happens that their franchisee star player Ant adores KD! We can add Minnesota to the KD list this summer, And the Wolves can give us one of two possible packages:

1- KD for Randle/ Reid/ Dillingham/ DET 25' 1st (17th pick) / MIN 32' 1st.
2- KD for Mcdaniels/ Reid/ DiVencenzo/ Shannon Jr/ Minott/ MIN 32' 1st.

Although it likely won't matter now as come summertime, Minnesota as a 2nd apron team won't be able to aggregate salaries in a trade, just like us! So there likely won't be a mechanism for us to get those player packages.

They may be close if the second apron level goes up. They currently have about $190 million committed in salary in 25-23 and the second apron is $189 million.

But if not, and they are close, they could just not pick up Josh Minott's team option and maybe dump Terrence Shannon. Leonard Miller isn't guaranteed. I am not sure if they will have minimum cap holds and a draft one.

The other option could be stretching Conley or dumping him to a team with cap space

[bwgood77]

Watching the Rising Stars now, Leonard MIller is pretty good for the G league team. Hanging with the top rookies.

[BobbieL]

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This is the last piece of evidence anyone needs to trade Booker at the first opportunity. A “franchise” player especially in the NBA doesn’t miss the playoffs. Franchise players carry their team to the playoffs.

Booker is NOT a franchise player. He’s an NBA player that’s really good at shooting mid range shots that’s not particularly good at anything else.

Blows my mind when people say “anyone not named Booker” needs to be traded. WHEN Booker is one of the MAIN problems! He needs to go. His game is limited, he has no leadership ability, he’s not an ambassador of Phoenix. His name doesn’t hold much weight around the league. The times he does make the all-star game it’s by a thread. He’s not a world wide star. Take away his mid range game and he’s barely a G-League player.

I don't get why Booker is untradable or this nonsense that they should keep him unless he asks for a trade.

I think you are undervaluing him a bit but I also don't think he is untouchable. The way for the Suns to improve and start the path to winning a title and not just make the play in game is to trade Booker and Durant.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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Minnesota desperately needs to make a big move! And it just so happens that their franchisee star player Ant adores KD! We can add Minnesota to the KD list this summer, And the Wolves can give us one of two possible packages:

1- KD for Randle/ Reid/ Dillingham/ DET 25' 1st (17th pick) / MIN 32' 1st.
2- KD for Mcdaniels/ Reid/ DiVencenzo/ Shannon Jr/ Minott/ MIN 32' 1st.

Although it likely won't matter now as come summertime, Minnesota as a 2nd apron team won't be able to aggregate salaries in a trade, just like us! So there likely won't be a mechanism for us to get those player packages.

They may be close if the second apron level goes up. They currently have about $190 million committed in salary in 25-23 and the second apron is $189 million.

But if not, and they are close, they could just not pick up Josh Minott's team option and maybe dump Terrence Shannon. Leonard Miller isn't guaranteed. I am not sure if they will have minimum cap holds and a draft one.

The other option could be stretching Conley or dumping him to a team with cap space

Very true. But they'd likely have to waive/ stretch or salary dump ( not sure they could/ would do this with their lack of available picks) the players that you mentioned. And any further information on whether or not we could even trade for either Randle or Reid if in a McDaniels/ Reid/ Divencenzo/ fillers alternative package to Randle / Reid/ Dillingham with BOTH Randle and Reid having player options coming up this summer?

IF we could do the trade this summer and get that Detroit pick on top of the Wolves 32' 1st, that'd be great value. And much better overall than some of the pizz poor value returns that some fans are deluding themselves into around KD based upon age/ contract situation. Claiming that KD might at best return something like a matching contract and maybe a 1st. But nothing really good.

And their Booker trade suggestions for the rockets are downright laughable if not so sad! For my part though, if not prioritizing picks in a KD trade, I'm still going to push my top 3 Durant destinations as:

1- Denver.
2- Minnesota.
3- New York.
4- San Antonio.
5- Miami.

And even though I truly hate the lakers with the fire of a thousand suns, I wouldn't say no to a package of:

KD for Reeves/ Hachimura/ Finney Smith/ Knecht/ Reddish/ LAL 31 1st.

Because Reeves, Knecht and Reddish would be great young pieces. And taking Hachimura, Finney Smith and Reeves along with Knecht and Reddish would gut their depth significantly whilst taking the 31 1st would also hamstring them under the Stepien rules.

And I'd think that Knecht could kind of become our version of Thunder Dan Majerle for us. And Reeves could be our Hornacek? Reddish our Tim Thomas perhaps.....lol. But all in all, I'd save that trade as a last resort, and wouldn't accept it under any conditions without BOTH of Reeves and Knecht included.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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This is the last piece of evidence anyone needs to trade Booker at the first opportunity. A “franchise” player especially in the NBA doesn’t miss the playoffs. Franchise players carry their team to the playoffs.

Booker is NOT a franchise player. He’s an NBA player that’s really good at shooting mid range shots that’s not particularly good at anything else.

Blows my mind when people say “anyone not named Booker” needs to be traded. WHEN Booker is one of the MAIN problems! He needs to go. His game is limited, he has no leadership ability, he’s not an ambassador of Phoenix. His name doesn’t hold much weight around the league. The times he does make the all-star game it’s by a thread. He’s not a world wide star. Take away his mid range game and he’s barely a G-League player.

I don't get why Booker is untradable or this nonsense that they should keep him unless he asks for a trade.

I think you are undervaluing him a bit but I also don't think he is untouchable. The way for the Suns to improve and start the path to winning a title and not just make the play in game is to trade Booker and Durant.

There's really only two reasons why Ishbia would have Booker as "UNTRADABLE" and is against moving him. And neither reason really has anything to do with actually caring about the fanbase.

The first is a simple business decision in that Ishbia doesn't want to be completely uncompetitive since this is still a recent investment that hasn't yet bore him significant profits. So keeping Booker in his mind would help float higher profit margins more than logically bottoming out completely. The whole big names superteam premise is just a larger example of this thought process. At some point, money does factor in to the big picture.

The second reason is actually quite simple and the underlying reason why he not only keeps Isiah Thomas as the little parrot on his shoulder, but the reason why he pursued getting back Draymond Green from the Warriors in that KD trade before Curry nixed it quickly. And that is his infatuation with Michigan and creating a Michigan " boys Club" here in Phoenix!

The only real solution to that would be for him to alternatively trade Booker to Detroit and build his club there where they both call home, and then bring in Green there possibly too. It's also this premise why I personally don't see Booker asking out anytime soon with Ishbia as the owner!

Personally, I wouldn't mind at all trading Booker to Detroit as an alternative option to Houston if our package thresholds are not met! A Booker to Detroit package could ideally return something like:

Stewart/ Ivey/ Holland or Thompson/ Reed/ Klintman/ DET 27' 1st/ DET 29' 1st/ DET 31' 1st/ TOR 25' 2nd/ 28' 2nd ( via Miami).

[bwgood77]

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Minnesota desperately needs to make a big move! And it just so happens that their franchisee star player Ant adores KD! We can add Minnesota to the KD list this summer, And the Wolves can give us one of two possible packages:

1- KD for Randle/ Reid/ Dillingham/ DET 25' 1st (17th pick) / MIN 32' 1st.
2- KD for Mcdaniels/ Reid/ DiVencenzo/ Shannon Jr/ Minott/ MIN 32' 1st.

Although it likely won't matter now as come summertime, Minnesota as a 2nd apron team won't be able to aggregate salaries in a trade, just like us! So there likely won't be a mechanism for us to get those player packages.

They may be close if the second apron level goes up. They currently have about $190 million committed in salary in 25-23 and the second apron is $189 million.

But if not, and they are close, they could just not pick up Josh Minott's team option and maybe dump Terrence Shannon. Leonard Miller isn't guaranteed. I am not sure if they will have minimum cap holds and a draft one.

The other option could be stretching Conley or dumping him to a team with cap space

Very true. But they'd likely have to waive/ stretch or salary dump ( not sure they could/ would do this with their lack of available picks) the players that you mentioned. And any further information on whether or not we could even trade for either Randle or Reid if in a McDaniels/ Reid/ Divencenzo/ fillers alternative package to Randle / Reid/ Dillingham with BOTH Randle and Reid having player options coming up this summer?

IF we could do the trade this summer and get that Detroit pick on top of the Wolves 32' 1st, that'd be great value. And much better overall than some of the pizz poor value returns that some fans are deluding themselves into around KD based upon age/ contract situation. Claiming that KD might at best return something like a matching contract and maybe a 1st. But nothing really good.

And their Booker trade suggestions for the rockets are downright laughable if not so sad! For my part though, if not prioritizing picks in a KD trade, I'm still going to push my top 3 Durant destinations as:

1- Denver.
2- Minnesota.
3- New York.
4- San Antonio.
5- Miami.

And even though I truly hate the lakers with the fire of a thousand suns, I wouldn't say no to a package of:

KD for Reeves/ Hachimura/ Finney Smith/ Knecht/ Reddish/ LAL 31 1st.

Because Reeves, Knecht and Reddish would be great young pieces. And taking Hachimura, Finney Smith and Reeves along with Knecht and Reddish would gut their depth significantly whilst taking the 31 1st would also hamstring them under the Stepien rules.

And I'd think that Knecht could kind of become our version of Thunder Dan Majerle for us. And Reeves could be our Hornacek? Reddish our Tim Thomas perhaps.....lol. But all in all, I'd save that trade as a last resort, and wouldn't accept it under any conditions without BOTH of Reeves and Knecht included.

Well if those guys don't pick up their options, then no, we couldn't trade for them. Reid is more likely not to, and then he would be a FA. Randle probably will. But to me, Reid would have to be a key piece. I wouldn't want it done without him (if we had other offers on the table).

Player options last year had to be made by June 29th. Typically they would be picked up or declined before the deadline. Hopefully before the draft.

[bwgood77]

This is the last piece of evidence anyone needs to trade Booker at the first opportunity. A “franchise” player especially in the NBA doesn’t miss the playoffs. Franchise players carry their team to the playoffs.

Booker is NOT a franchise player. He’s an NBA player that’s really good at shooting mid range shots that’s not particularly good at anything else.

Blows my mind when people say “anyone not named Booker” needs to be traded. WHEN Booker is one of the MAIN problems! He needs to go. His game is limited, he has no leadership ability, he’s not an ambassador of Phoenix. His name doesn’t hold much weight around the league. The times he does make the all-star game it’s by a thread. He’s not a world wide star. Take away his mid range game and he’s barely a G-League player.

I don't get why Booker is untradable or this nonsense that they should keep him unless he asks for a trade.

I think you are undervaluing him a bit but I also don't think he is untouchable. The way for the Suns to improve and start the path to winning a title and not just make the play in game is to trade Booker and Durant.

There's really only two reasons why Ishbia would have Booker as "UNTRADABLE" and is against moving him. And neither reason really has anything to do with actually caring about the fanbase.

The first is a simple business decision in that Ishbia doesn't want to be completely uncompetitive since this is still a recent investment that hasn't yet bore him significant profits. So keeping Booker in his mind would help float higher profit margins more than logically bottoming out completely. The whole big names superteam premise is just a larger example of this thought process. At some point, money does factor in to the big picture.

The second reason is actually quite simple and the underlying reason why he not only keeps Isiah Thomas as the little parrot on his shoulder, but the reason why he pursued getting back Draymond Green from the Warriors in that KD trade before Curry nixed it quickly. And that is his infatuation with Michigan and creating a Michigan " boys Club" here in Phoenix!

The only real solution to that would be for him to alternatively trade Booker to Detroit and build his club there where they both call home, and then bring in Green there possibly too. It's also this premise why I personally don't see Booker asking out anytime soon with Ishbia as the owner!

Personally, I wouldn't mind at all trading Booker to Detroit as an alternative option to Houston if our package thresholds are not met! A Booker to Detroit package could ideally return something like:

Stewart/ Ivey/ Holland or Thompson/ Reed/ Klintman/ DET 27' 1st/ DET 29' 1st/ DET 31' 1st/ TOR 25' 2nd/ 28' 2nd ( via Miami).

Booker will likely be deemed as untradable for many of the same reasons Luka was. The fanbase would be livid if we traded him. Or 80% of it. However, I do remember how livid many were when we traded Marbury, which was partially because the return was very weak. I remember watching interviews with fans on tv saying things like "what were they thinking? He was our best player!"

Booker will have to ask out.

Anyone know if Book has a relationship with Udoka? Or anyone on the Rockets? It really would be the perfect landing spot for him because they desperately need a go to scorer, but I could see him not being excited because he doesn't know any of those guys. Most of them are very young. I'm sure he'd love playing with guys like Sengun and Thompson though.

[sunsbum]

Booker is fine, we can do a mini rebuild with KD and see where we’re at in 3 years. Everyone is just down on book because they are down on everything suns.

[bullsaficianado]

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LOL! Why not at this point?

Win HUH?!?!

The way this season has been going why the hell not. Hopefully he chews every Suns players ass off.