Magic and Kings off-sason deal

[The Beam King]

Kings deal Zack LaVine
Magic deal Jonathan Isaac, WCJ, Black

Magic add a dynamic perimeter scorer without sacrificing anyone from their core.

Kings balance out their roster.

Magic SL

C Wagner
PF Banchero
SF Wagner
SG LaVine
PG Suggs

Kings
Sabonis
PF Isaac
SF Murray
SG DeRozan
PG Monk

[BoogieTime]

Why are you guys moving LaVine.

efficient all around player. Move him to SF, let DeRozan come off the bench

Isaac isn’t someone to bet on and hasn’t been good offensively at all

[daoneandonly]

No chance Orl is trading Black, a solid center, and Issac for Lavine

[Magic_Johnny12]

So Orlando purposely didn’t trade for Lavine when he could be had for peanuts and now because Sacramento regrets the acquisition they can get significant more value for him? Make it make sense.

[BoogieTime]

So Orlando purposely didn’t trade for Lavine when he could be had for peanuts and now because Sacramento regrets the acquisition they can get significant more value for him? Make it make sense.

Nobody regrets anything, just because there are a few fans doing this?

The guy has been putting up ~24/5/5 on Steph efficiency for the year in Chicago..

The guys who are being traded for aren't significant value.. they are sketchy contracts that may or may not ever contribute. Isaac is closest, but he is bad offensively and may never be counted on

[The Beam King]

So Orlando purposely didn’t trade for Lavine when he could be had for peanuts and now because Sacramento regrets the acquisition they can get significant more value for him? Make it make sense.

Easy. Lavine is rhe best player in the deal. Fills a distinct role for the Magic that they currently have little of in perimeter scoring. LaVine is one of the better perimeter scorers in thr entire league.

Had the magic gotten in on The deal at the trade deadline what would you imagine they would have given up for him to match salaries and make a deal work?

Isaac is a shell of his former self but gets you half way there. Black is the incentive to make the deal and WCJ is the remaining salary and a solid reserve or a pinch starter.

You're getting near all-star offensive production at a position of need.

Make sense. I swear you're being obtuse on purpose.

[Scoot McGroot]

I’m sure Sacramento would love to flip Lavine within months for 3-4x what they just paid for him.

I don’t see anyone else paying so much for Lavine this offseason.

[OrlandoDream]

ORL doesnt have an interest in Levine. He has been on the market for almost 3 years. His was traded for half that and his price keeps decreasing. Its a small sample size but already looks like he isn't a good fit in SAC with all those guards.

Now if Sac decides to blow it up? ORL would def call on Monk and Keon Ellis.

[OxAndFox]

ORL doesnt have an interest in Levine. He has been on the market for almost 3 years. His was traded for half that and his price keeps decreasing. Its a small sample size but already looks like he isn't a good fit in SAC with all those guards.

Now if Sac decides to blow it up? ORL would def call on Monk and Keon Ellis.

Agreed. I don't think the Kings can get the value in the OP for Lavine. He is definitely the best player in the deal when he is playing like he has earlier this season. BUT that contract for Orlando isn't really what they require at this time. Monk's deal and game are a lot better.
Keon Ellis hopefully gets into position as the starting 2 for the Kings next season. It likely won't happen though unless the Kings hire a veteran coach that is huge on defense.
I would love nothing more though that to see Keon on a team like Orlando with the defensive scheme/assets the Magic has. Would pay good money to watch that alone.

[The Beam King]

I’m sure Sacramento would love to flip Lavine within months for 3-4x what they just paid for him.

I don’t see anyone else paying so much for Lavine this offseason.

How is going from DeAaron Fox to Isaac, enjoy and blacks 3 to 4xs what we paid for? This is an insane argument.

[ReggiesKnicks]

I’m sure Sacramento would love to flip Lavine within months for 3-4x what they just paid for him.

I don’t see anyone else paying so much for Lavine this offseason.

How is going from DeAaron Fox to Isaac, enjoy and blacks 3 to 4xs what we paid for? This is an insane argument.

Scoot said what LaVine's value was, not Fox.

[Scoot McGroot]

I’m sure Sacramento would love to flip Lavine within months for 3-4x what they just paid for him.

I don’t see anyone else paying so much for Lavine this offseason.

How is going from DeAaron Fox to Isaac, enjoy and blacks 3 to 4xs what we paid for? This is an insane argument.

DeAaron Fox plays for Chicago now? Or did Sacramento trade Fox for a bunch if value, and then send their “bad contracts and a single protected first” to Chicago for Lavine?

Ultimately, Sacramento traded Huerter, Zach Collins, Tre Jones and the Chicago protected first for Lavine and a 2nd. Feels like here they’re trading Lavine for good players, no bad contracts, and a still valuable rookie contract player. That’s a huge return on investment, no?

[BoogieTime]

I’m sure Sacramento would love to flip Lavine within months for 3-4x what they just paid for him.

I don’t see anyone else paying so much for Lavine this offseason.

How is going from DeAaron Fox to Isaac, enjoy and blacks 3 to 4xs what we paid for? This is an insane argument.

DeAaron Fox plays for Chicago now? Or did Sacramento trade Fox for a bunch if value, and then send their “bad contracts and a single protected first” to Chicago for Lavine?

Ultimately, Sacramento traded Huerter, Zach Collins, Tre Jones and the Chicago protected first for Lavine and a 2nd. Feels like here they’re trading Lavine for good players, no bad contracts, and a still valuable rookie contract player. That’s a huge return on investment, no?

I think we have different opinions on Isaac and WCJ.....

From where I sit, they aren't positive collectively.....

WCJ's offense has cratered this season.. Isaac is still a profound defensive player, but his offense is so bad you couldn't start him with Domas or anything, or start him in too many places IMO. And then an organization couldn't build around his health anyhoo. WCJ wouldnt play with Domas/Val

And the way Magic fans are reacting to the trade I will assume Black holds more value to them and their eye tests than his numbers..

So, the value, seems about even to what the Kings gave up IMO but direction is off though the Magic players may have more market value....

But directionally it doesn't work for the kings certainly (so no they wouldn't love anything in your words). Again, despite Lavine's reputation, he's been thoroughly a solid player for a couple years and is the best player here. And the Kings are winning now, and have been after Lavine, and aren't gambling on Black at this juncture. And Lavine can move to SF in the future (he played SF/PF in Chicago)

[meatwad4343]

Lavine doesn't gave anywhere near that amount of value, and I'm not even a huge fan of wcj or Issac

[The Beam King]

Lavine doesn't gave anywhere near that amount of value, and I'm not even a huge fan of wcj or Issac

So are you asserting Blacks value as grwater thant tha of a player near all star level offensive production?

If that's the case then sure. I just haven't seen that type of valiation of black.

WCJ and Isaac are mainly salary fillers that can play rotational minutes on a decent team imo.

I'm not over here saying LaVine has this amazing type of value. He doesn't. But I don't see this amazing return coming back either. I'd put Isaac and WCJ on neutral value at best and black with positive value due to his contract and potential, but not much is actualized as of yet either.

Bird in the hand...

[Scoot McGroot]

How is going from DeAaron Fox to Isaac, enjoy and blacks 3 to 4xs what we paid for? This is an insane argument.

DeAaron Fox plays for Chicago now? Or did Sacramento trade Fox for a bunch if value, and then send their “bad contracts and a single protected first” to Chicago for Lavine?

Ultimately, Sacramento traded Huerter, Zach Collins, Tre Jones and the Chicago protected first for Lavine and a 2nd. Feels like here they’re trading Lavine for good players, no bad contracts, and a still valuable rookie contract player. That’s a huge return on investment, no?

I think we have different opinions on Isaac and WCJ.....

I agree this is clearly where we differ.

From where I sit, they aren't positive collectively.....

WCJ's offense has cratered this season.. Isaac is still a profound defensive player, but his offense is so bad you couldn't start him with Domas or anything, or start him in too many places IMO. And then an organization couldn't build around his health anyhoo. WCJ wouldnt play with Domas/Val

I agree on WCJ's offense this season. But I think that guy that's been there the last 3 or so seasons is likely to return? And, I think you could play WCJ with either of Domas or Val in limited minutes. He offers enough stretch and movement to easily play with Sabonis, even if it's not perfect.

As for Isaac, I think that he'd have to play somewhat limited minutes...maybe he and WCJ platoon at the 4? But with Sabonis as the 5, I think Isaac is kind of the perfect impactful defender next to Sabonis. And with how Sabonis can pass people open for easy shots, I think Isaac would excel there. When Sabonis was in Indy, we always pictured Isaac (albeit, pre multiple injuries) as the PERFECT prototype PF fit next to Sabonis. And, I think WCJ and Isaac are on great team controlled contracts to protect from any major downsides going forward. As we saw this year with team's struggling to staff the C spot, I think WCJ is a great low end starter, top tier backup C that will maintain value in trade.

And the way Magic fans are reacting to the trade I will assume Black holds more value to them and their eye tests than his numbers..

Again, he's a really good defender at multiple guard spots, while his offensive game is struggling to come along. Luckily, his secondary distributing ability helps a ton there, and seems to have some promise in growth. And, he just turned 21. There's definitely a lot of promise there.

So, the value, seems about even to what the Kings gave up IMO but direction is off though the Magic players may have more market value....

I would agree direction is different, and the Magic players have more market value. I just think that Sacramento, if they're to build around Sabonis/Murray, should put as many solid defenders around them as possible. This kind of move does that.

But directionally it doesn't work for the kings certainly (so no they wouldn't love anything in your words). Again, despite Lavine's reputation, he's been thoroughly a solid player for a couple years and is the best player here. And the Kings are winning now, and have been after Lavine, and aren't gambling on Black at this juncture.

I'm sure Ranadive would hate to move Lavine. He has lusted after him for awhile. I just think that if they had an offer of so much value, they'd have to take it and flip a bit in terms of direction.

And Lavine can move to SF in the future (he played SF/PF in Chicago)

Oh! I think WCJ could equally move to SF in the future to accommodate Sabonis/Val

[OxAndFox]

Lavine doesn't gave anywhere near that amount of value, and I'm not even a huge fan of wcj or Issac

So are you asserting Blacks value as grwater thant tha of a player near all star level offensive production?

If that's the case then sure. I just haven't seen that type of valiation of black.

WCJ and Isaac are mainly salary fillers that can play rotational minutes on a decent team imo.

I'm not over here saying LaVine has this amazing type of value. He doesn't. But I don't see this amazing return coming back either. I'd put Isaac and WCJ on neutral value at best and black with positive value due to his contract and potential, but not much is actualized as of yet either.

Bird in the hand...

The thing is when you lay it out you have health concerns on Lavine, Isaac, WCJ. The thing you don't have a concern with the Magic guys is contract.
The contract situation you are getting back from the Magic is something Monte would be jumping up and down over. Isaac's contract isn't fully GTD. Think its called the Exhibition 3 clause. Scoot would be able to correct this maybe.
I understand everyone is hesitant on Isaac, I am too, but let's not pretend the Kings are a perfect team and Lavine is this stud the Kings just gave Fox up for. Lavine came with negative value even while having this "all star" type season with the Bulls.

Black comes in as more than an icing on the cake type that has the potential to be the best young player the Kings currently have and is still 21. The last time the Kings had a 1st round pick that was 21 or younger was Tyrese Haliburton in 2020.
You have all 3 of these guys locked up for long term. The only 1 that you may not be able to get out from under is WCJ if things turn south drastically. Even then, due to this being an off season trade you have WCJ at 3/$48.5m, which is not much more than the MLE and if it does work out with him then you take up the last year of just $20m which will be an insanely small amount for a player like he is getting to near the end of his prime.

This is a no brainer for the Kings, but in reality no one is offering anything close to positive value for Lavine, even after this "AS worthy" season. This would fundamentally change the ceiling for Sacramento for the better immediately, and not only that it balances the roster with guys in the window of Domas while getting a high potential guy in Black who could realistically be the point of the future and potentially form a great wing trio of Black/Keon/Keegan.

[BoogieTime]

Lavine doesn't gave anywhere near that amount of value, and I'm not even a huge fan of wcj or Issac

So are you asserting Blacks value as grwater thant tha of a player near all star level offensive production?

If that's the case then sure. I just haven't seen that type of valiation of black.

WCJ and Isaac are mainly salary fillers that can play rotational minutes on a decent team imo.

I'm not over here saying LaVine has this amazing type of value. He doesn't. But I don't see this amazing return coming back either. I'd put Isaac and WCJ on neutral value at best and black with positive value due to his contract and potential, but not much is actualized as of yet either.

Bird in the hand...

The thing is when you lay it out you have health concerns on Lavine, Isaac, WCJ. The thing you don't have a concern with the Magic guys is contract.
The contract situation you are getting back from the Magic is something Monte would be jumping up and down over. Isaac's contract isn't fully GTD. Think its called the Exhibition 3 clause. Scoot would be able to correct this maybe.
I understand everyone is hesitant on Isaac, I am too, but let's not pretend the Kings are a perfect team and Lavine is this stud the Kings just gave Fox up for. Lavine came with negative value even while having this "all star" type season with the Bulls.

Black comes in as more than an icing on the cake type that has the potential to be the best young player the Kings currently have and is still 21. The last time the Kings had a 1st round pick that was 21 or younger was Tyrese Haliburton in 2020.
You have all 3 of these guys locked up for long term. The only 1 that you may not be able to get out from under is WCJ if things turn south drastically. Even then, due to this being an off season trade you have WCJ at 3/$48.5m, which is not much more than the MLE and if it does work out with him then you take up the last year of just $20m which will be an insanely small amount for a player like he is getting to near the end of his prime.

This is a no brainer for the Kings, but in reality no one is offering anything close to positive value for Lavine, even after this "AS worthy" season. This would fundamentally change the ceiling for Sacramento for the better immediately, and not only that it balances the roster with guys in the window of Domas while getting a high potential guy in Black who could realistically be the point of the future and potentially form a great wing trio of Black/Keon/Keegan.

What are you talking about. I should expect you here because your literally in my hair everywhere and flattering other teams on this board constantly, lol

Lavine was moved for positive value, or your Fox was just moved for nothing, lol. To Chicago, they were getting a possible lottery pick with their own pick.

And the Kings were after LaVine for awhile, last summer, during this season, just constant rumors of the Kings interest - and thats because he's actually good and better than Fox as a player IMO. No they wouldn't move Lavine for this, its not the win now direction and there is no rumored interest in Black

No one wants WCJ and Isaac under contract. its not injury concerns its play concerns.

[Braggins]

If I was Orlando I would be going after Malik Monk.

[BoogieTime]

If I was Sacramento I would be going after Malik Monk.

Monk/Keon/Zach should be starting with DeMar cooking off the bench IMO. At least until the Monk - PG experiment definitively fails