2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part IV

[lilfishi22]

All Star game and weekend is a joke. And that is not a hyperbole.

It is an absolute mockery of the game, with hack celebrities, hack influencers (society is really bad when you have influencers) playing like hacks to entertain a bunch of hacks (with money or those skipping rent to attend this hack fest).

The players union should be made to force their members to accept that All Star attendees must play to their expected performance both ends or they simply forfeit their spots and let someone else play who will.

And no, USA vs The World won't save it nor would it be suitable since we have Fiba and Olympics for that, where players play for their countries and not force rivals (France, Spain, Serbia etc) to play with each other against the All mighty USA team... which degrades the other nations.

I have league pass and skipped the entire weekend. And I am ashamed to admit I only kept my league pass accidentally as I forgot to cancel it at the start of the season and realised it 2 months in... so might as well have my dad use it since he's bored. But last time I pay NBA games. Free streams here I come for good.

The only thing that saves NBA all-star weekend is east vs west game for home court advantage in the NBA finals.

I'd like to see that but I doubt any one move is enough to get them to play it like a real game. Aside from say...they lose money if they lose

[thamadkant]

All Star game and weekend is a joke. And that is not a hyperbole.

It is an absolute mockery of the game, with hack celebrities, hack influencers (society is really bad when you have influencers) playing like hacks to entertain a bunch of hacks (with money or those skipping rent to attend this hack fest).

The players union should be made to force their members to accept that All Star attendees must play to their expected performance both ends or they simply forfeit their spots and let someone else play who will.

And no, USA vs The World won't save it nor would it be suitable since we have Fiba and Olympics for that, where players play for their countries and not force rivals (France, Spain, Serbia etc) to play with each other against the All mighty USA team... which degrades the other nations.

I have league pass and skipped the entire weekend. And I am ashamed to admit I only kept my league pass accidentally as I forgot to cancel it at the start of the season and realised it 2 months in... so might as well have my dad use it since he's bored. But last time I pay NBA games. Free streams here I come for good.

The only thing that saves NBA all-star weekend is east vs west game for home court advantage in the NBA finals.

No it would not.

Because half of the players from each team arent from championship contenders.

Ultimately these players are greedy.

$1 Million dollar entry fee for each All-Star, money is pooled together. The winning team gets all and splits it among themselves. Entry money has to come from players pockets.

[thamadkant]

All Star game and weekend is a joke. And that is not a hyperbole.

It is an absolute mockery of the game, with hack celebrities, hack influencers (society is really bad when you have influencers) playing like hacks to entertain a bunch of hacks (with money or those skipping rent to attend this hack fest).

The players union should be made to force their members to accept that All Star attendees must play to their expected performance both ends or they simply forfeit their spots and let someone else play who will.

And no, USA vs The World won't save it nor would it be suitable since we have Fiba and Olympics for that, where players play for their countries and not force rivals (France, Spain, Serbia etc) to play with each other against the All mighty USA team... which degrades the other nations.

I have league pass and skipped the entire weekend. And I am ashamed to admit I only kept my league pass accidentally as I forgot to cancel it at the start of the season and realised it 2 months in... so might as well have my dad use it since he's bored. But last time I pay NBA games. Free streams here I come for good.

The only thing that saves NBA all-star weekend is east vs west game for home court advantage in the NBA finals.

I'd like to see that but I doubt any one move is enough to get them to play it like a real game. Aside from say...they lose money if they lose

This.

Money pool that came from players pockets, winner takes all and splits it.

[garrick]

The all-star game is pointless at this point. The players have disrespected the game and the fans far too long. These players have no pride or competitive fire anymore.

The dunk contest was suppose to be seeing the top stars going against each other. Now it’s a bunch of people who can barely make an NBA roster. Same goes with the 3pt contest.

The players basically spit on the fans during their “all-star BREAK”.

The new generation NBA star is now entitled and lazy. The game has been dumbed down because these current generation players only know 3 point shots and layups.

The game from 20-30 years ago was a chess match. Now the NBA is speed checkers seeing who can eat the checkers faster. Players don’t fight though injuries, take rest days off, and think they control the rosters.

Yeah I still watch the game today but it’s definitely less skilled and less exciting to watch then years past. Viewership has been trending down for nearly two decades and the NBA cant figure out why or how to get these players to care. And the answer to the problem is never going to be fixed at this point unfortunately.

It all started when players started getting these fat checks and stopped trying to prove themselves at all star games.

I hate to say it but maybe the only way to make it competitive is to pay the all stars MORE so the squad that wins gets significantly more than the losing team but I doubt the players will want to go along with something like this

[Djedefre]

What Lloyd? Lloyd Pierce? Tommy Lloyd? Lloyd Dobler? Some other Lloyd?

Tommy, ofc. He is a great bball mind and still pretty young. I'm convinced he could be a long term solution, provided our clown of an owner let's everyone do their friggin job, steps back and hires a proper GM to build a team.

Yeah, the way he has AZ playing stifling defense and hustling for 50/50 balls is nice. A lot of offensive rebounds too. Not sure I want him to leave AZ though.

It's offense also. The guy has a signature. Not many coaches even in NCAA who are not just recycling the same things and cruising on autopilot but trying to innovate. I'm aware he'd have a rocky start transferring to NBA ball, but we need to find our coach of the future and build basketball identity around him. Few coaches can do that for us. Hurley certainly is one of them, but he is untouchable. Don't particularly care for AU, so i have no dilemma. I mean, i may be completely wrong with this choice, but that is the blueprint we should use - find a relatively young, competent, creative and passionate guy with philosophy, who can develop young core and grow along with them. If we pick well and are lucky enough, maybe we could be a real organically built contender in like 5 years or so.

[Slim Charless]

I'd actually like the New York premise with getting Mikal Bridges back in the deal. but looking at their contract/ salary situation for this summer, it just doesn't seem possible to match with both teams in the 2nd apron UNLESS it's Anunoby and Hart with some form of picks. Miami would be solid too IF and only if Ware was the centerpiece value inclusion, But if Miami was unwilling to include Ware, then the value would need to be made up by including Jovic/ Jacquez/ and their GS 25' 1st and their MIA 29' 1st.
Maybe something like Wiggins/Robinson/ Jovic/ Jacquez/ GS 25' 1st (14th pick)/ MIA 29' 1st. ** Then I'd look to flip Wiggins elsewhere for players/ picks if at all possible. And of course Houston and OKC would bee great as long as they're willing to meet our value demands and not operate from a delusional mentality like some fans we've seen on the trade board claiming to have us over some metaphorical barrel...LOL!

I am one of those people who think Durant will get less value this summer than some are saying

To me, the time to trade him a 10 days ago but the team was too focused on a stupid short-sighted fantasy Jimmy Butler trade and not Durant. If they would have spent like 30-40% of the time on Durant and only 60-70% of the time on Butler, might have got a pretty stout deal for Durant.

I am going to be cautiously optimistic the Suns get a good solid deal for Durant.

I disagree. We weren't even really considering moving KD this season before teams started to really put the pressure on us to move him. With no prep or strategy, I think moving him for that offer would've been a mistake. You are right that we were far too narrow-focused on getting Jimmy that we didn't plan for anything else but moving KD because Miami and GS pushed for it rather than spending the time to survey the market and modelling out post-KD trade moves, would've been a short sighted move.

While the GS deal wasn’t necessarily a bad one, and we can’t say for certain we’ll land more or less in the offseason, the fact that we likely hadn’t fully explored a KD trade at that point suggests that moving him then and there would've had a significant impact on future planning exercises that we're honestly not prepared for.

Have you guys seen this? It's a cap breakdown for NEXT season. That way you can see what the cap situation and salaries are for potential KD and Booker trades this summer:

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/tax/_/year/2025/sort/tax_total/dir/desc

Brooklyn is a hilarious amount under the table. Like that has to be a record lol. There's a number of teams over so now that we can aggregate, I wonder how this will change trade strategies this summer?

[Frank Lee]

Blowing it up Just doesn’t fit Wishbia’s MO, nor these recent moves and comments. He doesn’t have the patience to build something. And we aren’t set up for it without another gutting.

There is absolutely nothing in his short past actions or comments to think otherwise.

And It’s horse**** to believe they were shopping KD. They made some calls trying to get Butler and a KD deal was proposed… they asked KD and he said nah. That’s it. Wishbia is extending him… period. It will be up to KD to ask out. The story starved media can try to whip up interest all they want. It’s f-n clickbaiting at its finest.

The acquisitions of Micic and Martin are pure salary dump team option trade chips. MadMatter did the 3/1 pick deal to get some extra grease for these upcoming trades. The draft is 6/25. Their deals can be nixed till 6/29. This is no coincidence. They will not be bought out. They were acquired to trade, similar to signing over paying Okogie. Edit…whoops, looks like Martin has a yr more.

They are playing both TyTy and Gillespie to see what they have. One or both will be kept on. TJones and Morris can go on to a bench somewhere else.

Book will badger D’Lo to sign on for the minimum.

Not sure what we do about the C spot but there are options. Will need to get creative. Not exactly Jones’ forte, but somebody in the front office is thinking about trade pieces. I’m getting the feeling that Wishbia is a delegator with input and of course, the final say. Hiring Tellem might be the sneaky best move he’s made.


Gawd… that almost seems positive wtf But positive that Wishbia is not blowing it up tho. It’s too soon to tuck tail and admit defeat. Hey, ‘it’s F-n Kevin Durant’ right?

[bwgood77]

Tommy, ofc. He is a great bball mind and still pretty young. I'm convinced he could be a long term solution, provided our clown of an owner let's everyone do their friggin job, steps back and hires a proper GM to build a team.

Yeah, the way he has AZ playing stifling defense and hustling for 50/50 balls is nice. A lot of offensive rebounds too. Not sure I want him to leave AZ though.

It's offense also. The guy has a signature. Not many coaches even in NCAA who are not just recycling the same things and cruising on autopilot but trying to innovate. I'm aware he'd have a rocky start transferring to NBA ball, but we need to find our coach of the future and build basketball identity around him. Few coaches can do that for us. Hurley certainly is one of them, but he is untouchable. Don't particularly care for AU, so i have no dilemma. I mean, i may be completely wrong with this choice, but that is the blueprint we should use - find a relatively young, competent, creative and passionate guy with philosophy, who can develop young core and grow along with them. If we pick well and are lucky enough, maybe we could be a real organically built contender in like 5 years or so.

I think he's also very good at identifying untapped talent, especially oversees. He could probably help some in that respect too. The only reason I wouldn't want him is that I want him at AZ. And in that case I'd look at assistants for the Thunder, Rockets, etc. Their head coaches are great. Maybe even an assistant for Lue who always seems to have the Clippers playing tough even when they are missing stars.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Read on Twitter

[thamadkant]

If i had the choice between Booker or KD... I'd keep KD purely because he is better and Suns can get a haul for Booker which would fix Suns immediate future but also allow Suns key players to help chemistry and fit.


Go to Rockets and fleece them. Booker for Van Vleet, Amen, Suns picks 27 and 29.

Beal, KD, Van Vleet, A.Thompson, Dunn, O'Neal, Allen, Bol and future secured to tank post 2027.... is a decent path considering KD and Beal and that cast would still be good for 50 wins... if not higher if Amen and Dunn improve.

[King4Day]

If i had the choice between Booker or KD... I'd keep KD purely because he is better and Suns can get a haul for Booker which would fix Suns immediate future but also allow Suns key players to help chemistry and fit.


Go to Rockets and fleece them. Booker for Van Vleet, Amen, Suns picks 27 and 29.

Beal, KD, Van Vleet, A.Thompson, Dunn, O'Neal, Allen, Bol and future secured to tank post 2027.... is a decent path considering KD and Beal and that cast would still be good for 50 wins... if not higher if Amen and Dunn improve.

I thought about something like this. Where we actually keep KD and deal Book. Your trade idea would be perfect, assuming the Rockets would be on board. Spin Van Vleet elsewhere so we get some cap relief too.

[Saberestar]

Gambo

The Suns arena will be called PHX arena on an interim basis as the naming rights go to market. The arena will host the 2027 NBA All-Star game.

So, in a nutshell Footprint stays on with the Suns just changes their assets. The Suns have the opportunity to bring someone else in as they can take the naming rights to market with the 2027 NBA All Star Game and a Women's Final Four on the horizon.

[Saberestar]

If i had the choice between Booker or KD... I'd keep KD purely because he is better and Suns can get a haul for Booker which would fix Suns immediate future but also allow Suns key players to help chemistry and fit.


Go to Rockets and fleece them. Booker for Van Vleet, Amen, Suns picks 27 and 29.

Beal, KD, Van Vleet, A.Thompson, Dunn, O'Neal, Allen, Bol and future secured to tank post 2027.... is a decent path considering KD and Beal and that cast would still be good for 50 wins... if not higher if Amen and Dunn improve.

Amen Thompson has to be one of the most untouchable players in the entire league. I doubt he is available for Book, but I know everything is possible after watching the Doncic trade.

[Slim Charless]

If i had the choice between Booker or KD... I'd keep KD purely because he is better and Suns can get a haul for Booker which would fix Suns immediate future but also allow Suns key players to help chemistry and fit.


Go to Rockets and fleece them. Booker for Van Vleet, Amen, Suns picks 27 and 29.

Beal, KD, Van Vleet, A.Thompson, Dunn, O'Neal, Allen, Bol and future secured to tank post 2027.... is a decent path considering KD and Beal and that cast would still be good for 50 wins... if not higher if Amen and Dunn improve.

I thought about something like this. Where we actually keep KD and deal Book. Your trade idea would be perfect, assuming the Rockets would be on board. Spin Van Vleet elsewhere so we get some cap relief too.

I'd keep FVV. We need a PG and badly. If we're under the KD timeline even moreso. I wonder if they'd do those 2 guys, plus Jabari?

FVV
Amen
Dunn
KD
Jabari

Bench: Beal/Dunn/Greyson


That's a good team and we get our later picks back.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Read on Twitter

[Ghost of Kleine]

Read on Twitter

[mkot]

More salt to our wound

Watch on YouTube

[lilfishi22]

The only thing that saves NBA all-star weekend is east vs west game for home court advantage in the NBA finals.

I'd like to see that but I doubt any one move is enough to get them to play it like a real game. Aside from say...they lose money if they lose

This.

Money pool that came from players pockets, winner takes all and splits it.

I doubt the player's union would be down for that. There already is money to play for in the ASG but it's not a lot to play for ($125k to win) to these all-star level guys who are on $30-50m+ per year deals. If I was on the median American salary of $40k a year, winning the ASG would be like getting a $100 bonus. It's not nothing but it's not really worth injuring myself and risk potentially far larger bonuses or kickers in my contract like Trae's contract which if he had missed a ton of games due to an injury at the ASG and not be eligible for an all-NBA team, he would stand to lose the supermax trigger which works out to be about $7m extra on average per year.

Not every player is doing that kind of calculus to work out if it's worth going all out or not but I do think $125k is just far too low for these highest paid NBA players.

Now maybe they could build a standard all-star bonus clause in all contract such that if they make an all-star they get a 1% bonus and if they win, it's an extra 2%. On a $40m contract, that's a $1.2m bonus which is in line with other bonuses . $400k to make all-star and $800k to win it. Certainly could play with the numbers and % more but that's not too dissimilar to other incentive structures. For example, Kyrie has in his contract if Dallas won 50 games and he plays at least 58 games, he has a $1m bonus. Certainly gotta play around with the numbers/%'s but that's a high level of what could be done to make it more "enthusiastic"

[thamadkant]

With KD coming out with that comment about not wanting to be traded mid season has definitely lowered his value considering teams now know Suns are entertaining this coming off season...

Hence I still think Ishiba needs to pull the trigger on Booker instead. Unlikely, but only way to help the team in the immediate and medium length future. Booker amd KD together is no good, KD would benefit with a super athletic and long team to compliment his mid range and isolation game... he needs slashers, runners and finishers... while also having quick athletic and long defenders.

Unlikely but it would be a quick reload for Suns while saving their next 5 years

[They_Them_Hatin]

Everything comes back to trading for Beal then doing the dumpster fire that was the Ayton trade. Now everyone is preparing to low ball the Suns for KD in the off season. Way to go Suns.