Bears 10.0: GM and coach watch before the draft

[dice]

Biggs floating Dalman.

https://www.bleachernation.com/bears/2025/02/17/bears-center-options/

only 3 centers on PFF's top 100 FA list:

22 dalman
81 kelly - coming off knee surgery, mulling retirement w/ 32nd birthday approaching
100 shelton

on dalman:

"There aren’t many long-term answers in free agency at center, which will make Dalman the primary beneficiary if he reaches the open market. Any team that deploys an outside-zone rushing scheme will be all over the former fourth-round pick. Dalman has room to grow as a pass protector but is one of the best run-blocking centers in the NFL and will advance the continued growth of the interior offensive line market after Kansas City Chiefs center Creed Humphrey finally reset the center market."

lots of teams gonna go after this guy. can't expect that the bears are gonna be seated when the game of musical chairs is over. and if they are, they'll probably be out a lot of cap space w/o having helped the perceived biggest issue on the team (protecting caleb)

[moorhosj]

i assume it's like PER in basketball except there has been no attempt to market or explain it.

Not sure where you got that idea, it is thoroughly explained: https://www.pro-football-reference.com/about/approximate_value.htm

anyway, you are the first person i have ever seen cite AV (which values mayfield and wirfs over burrow...and gibbs over henry) to argue one player over another

You asked for a source, I provided one. Then you predictably came up with an entirely new reason to dismiss it.

Mayfield and Burrow had pretty similar seasons. Mayfield had a higher completion percentage, more yards per attempt, and better rushing stats across the board. Burrow had the counting stats of yards, attempts, and one more TD (Baker had 3 rushing, Burrow had 2). The biggest complaint is Mayfield's turnovers and that is a very reasonable criticism.

Gibbs led the NFL in touchdowns. He had 180 fewer scrimmage yards than Henry, but more yards per touch and 2 fewer fumbles. Not a stretch to say he had a better year.

that would be true if it were a description of an actual player

I have no idea what this means. It is literally the description of Jenkins as shown by his snap % vs. starts, watching him get injured, and Biggs' comments.

can you even name who the bears backup LG was w/o looking it up? you want a teven jenkins who feels good enough to practice to give up reps to his backup in case he has to play on sunday? THAT screws up continuity as much as jenkins pulling himself out of a game does!

I think Matt Prior was the primary backup at both Guard spots. Unfortunately, he couldn't cover both guard spots because Bates and Miller got hurt while Nate Davis quit trying, so he ended up starting primarily at RG. I want a Teven Jenkins who doesn't continually remove himself from games with injury and negatively impact the rest of the offensive line.

[Peelboy]

wasn't one of the worst O-lines. caleb holds the ball too long. agree on jenkins, though, and i think re-signing him is very unlikely

PFN o-line rankings:

17) Chicago Bears
Regular-Season Grade: 76.7 (C)

It has been exceptionally unfair that the Chicago Bears’ offensive woes were largely blamed on the offensive line. Sure, a 17th-placed ranking isn’t good, but it’s not horrendous. They had some bad outings, as did most offensive lines, but that doesn’t mean they are the main reason for Caleb Williams’ struggles as a rookie.

The Bears’ OL was asked to block for the fourth-longest time of any unit this season (3.09 seconds). That contributes heavily to a 10.7% sack rate (last in the NFL) because their 35.4% pressure rate is up to 18th. We see that replicated whether it’s against the blitz or not, suggesting it might be a general problem in Williams’ game.

Chicago also ranks 15th in PBWR, which is respectable. Similarly, the run-blocking numbers are fairly solid (0.91 RBYBC/rush, 15th), so it’s ambitious to blame the offensive line for this season’s collapse.

8) Washington Commanders
Regular-Season Grade: 83.5 (B)
Regular Season + Postseason Grade: 81.1 (B-; 7th)

On the season as a whole, the Commanders’ offensive line did a good job in pass protection, given just how long Jayden Daniels holds the ball (3.01 seconds; seventh). Whether it’s in the face of the blitz or not, he’s in the top 10 for both in time to throw (or be sacked).

Therefore, while the pressure numbers don’t look elite (34.4%), in the context of the time they are blocking, they’re respectable. That is reflected in a top-10 ranking in PBWR entering Week 18.

In the run game, the Commanders’ RBs only averaged 0.89 YBC/rush, but ESPN ranks Washington’s line as the second-best in RBWR.

The Commanders’ offensive line did not perform well in the NFC Championship Game (D+). They finished with two of the worst four performances in run blocking, with 0.53 RBYBC/rush against the Eagles’ front four. We feared this might be the case after Washington struggled in the Wild Card round, but their bounce back against Detroit offered some hope.

The pass-blocking numbers look fine on the surface, with a 34.5% pressure rate and a 5.8% sack rate. However, Daniels consistently got the ball in under three seconds, suggesting their quarterback helped salvage those numbers with his play.

The main concern came against the blitz, where they allowed a 57.1% pressure rate. Daniels did well in escaping pressure and getting the ball out, which means Washington’s line didn’t give up a sack against the blitz.

The Bears rank 24th in the PFF offensive line rankings.

"While Chicago’s offensive line failed to reach the potential many saw in it in the preseason, the unit was better than many people gave it credit for. Four of the Bears’ five projected starters earned PFF overall grades above 70.0, and all five topped 65.0. However, injuries and Caleb Williams’ pocket movement and awareness did the group no favors, resulting in the line allowing the most sacks in the NFL (37).

The Bears may have surrendered the most sacks in the league, but they were “only” the 12th-worst offensive line in PFF pass-blocking efficiency rating (84.1). The unit allowed 180 total pressures on 682 pass plays."

I agree Caleb holds the ball, although from watching, that really became more of an issue later in the year, and based on my armchair coach read, was substantially due to dropping eyes at the snap to watch for the rush up the middle. Which was a massive issue for most of the season.

I don't quibble too much with the PFF ranking of 24th, I'd have assumed somewhere near the bottom and in the bottom quarter of OLs would qualify. No clue how PFN is getting 17, that's inconsistent with what I saw (and apparently what PFF saw). I do note that PFN says "Intriguingly, this unit posted four games with a grade of B- or above, and three of its five wins came in those games. All three came before their bye week, though, and they only posted one game above a C+ after Week 7, when their schedule got significantly harder." So seems consistent with looking good when playing weak competition but bad against better teams.

All of which to me still says by far the priority for the offseason is a significant retool of the O Line. It's been a particular area of deficit under Poles (although he tried with Nate Davis it was a massive fail). And while it's armchair again, I could distinctly notice that as the season went one, Caleb regressed in keeping his head up, and it happened as the interior of the O Line got repeatedly bulldozed.

Happy to agree to disagree, but I would target 1-2 starter caliber OL in FA and 1-2 in the draft. I would similarly target the DL and don't disagree with your choices there. But if I had to choose, I'd 1000% pick OL over DL to give Caleb his best shot (and Johnson).

[Dresden]

wasn't one of the worst O-lines. caleb holds the ball too long. agree on jenkins, though, and i think re-signing him is very unlikely

PFN o-line rankings:

17) Chicago Bears
Regular-Season Grade: 76.7 (C)

It has been exceptionally unfair that the Chicago Bears’ offensive woes were largely blamed on the offensive line. Sure, a 17th-placed ranking isn’t good, but it’s not horrendous. They had some bad outings, as did most offensive lines, but that doesn’t mean they are the main reason for Caleb Williams’ struggles as a rookie.

The Bears’ OL was asked to block for the fourth-longest time of any unit this season (3.09 seconds). That contributes heavily to a 10.7% sack rate (last in the NFL) because their 35.4% pressure rate is up to 18th. We see that replicated whether it’s against the blitz or not, suggesting it might be a general problem in Williams’ game.

Chicago also ranks 15th in PBWR, which is respectable. Similarly, the run-blocking numbers are fairly solid (0.91 RBYBC/rush, 15th), so it’s ambitious to blame the offensive line for this season’s collapse.

8) Washington Commanders
Regular-Season Grade: 83.5 (B)
Regular Season + Postseason Grade: 81.1 (B-; 7th)

On the season as a whole, the Commanders’ offensive line did a good job in pass protection, given just how long Jayden Daniels holds the ball (3.01 seconds; seventh). Whether it’s in the face of the blitz or not, he’s in the top 10 for both in time to throw (or be sacked).

Therefore, while the pressure numbers don’t look elite (34.4%), in the context of the time they are blocking, they’re respectable. That is reflected in a top-10 ranking in PBWR entering Week 18.

In the run game, the Commanders’ RBs only averaged 0.89 YBC/rush, but ESPN ranks Washington’s line as the second-best in RBWR.

The Commanders’ offensive line did not perform well in the NFC Championship Game (D+). They finished with two of the worst four performances in run blocking, with 0.53 RBYBC/rush against the Eagles’ front four. We feared this might be the case after Washington struggled in the Wild Card round, but their bounce back against Detroit offered some hope.

The pass-blocking numbers look fine on the surface, with a 34.5% pressure rate and a 5.8% sack rate. However, Daniels consistently got the ball in under three seconds, suggesting their quarterback helped salvage those numbers with his play.

The main concern came against the blitz, where they allowed a 57.1% pressure rate. Daniels did well in escaping pressure and getting the ball out, which means Washington’s line didn’t give up a sack against the blitz.

The Bears rank 24th in the PFF offensive line rankings.

"While Chicago’s offensive line failed to reach the potential many saw in it in the preseason, the unit was better than many people gave it credit for. Four of the Bears’ five projected starters earned PFF overall grades above 70.0, and all five topped 65.0. However, injuries and Caleb Williams’ pocket movement and awareness did the group no favors, resulting in the line allowing the most sacks in the NFL (37).

The Bears may have surrendered the most sacks in the league, but they were “only” the 12th-worst offensive line in PFF pass-blocking efficiency rating (84.1). The unit allowed 180 total pressures on 682 pass plays."

I agree Caleb holds the ball, although from watching, that really became more of an issue later in the year, and based on my armchair coach read, was substantially due to dropping eyes at the snap to watch for the rush up the middle. Which was a massive issue for most of the season.

I don't quibble too much with the PFF ranking of 24th, I'd have assumed somewhere near the bottom and in the bottom quarter of OLs would qualify. No clue how PFN is getting 17, that's inconsistent with what I saw (and apparently what PFF saw). I do note that PFN says "Intriguingly, this unit posted four games with a grade of B- or above, and three of its five wins came in those games. All three came before their bye week, though, and they only posted one game above a C+ after Week 7, when their schedule got significantly harder." So seems consistent with looking good when playing weak competition but bad against better teams.

All of which to me still says by far the priority for the offseason is a significant retool of the O Line. It's been a particular area of deficit under Poles (although he tried with Nate Davis it was a massive fail). And while it's armchair again, I could distinctly notice that as the season went one, Caleb regressed in keeping his head up, and it happened as the interior of the O Line got repeatedly bulldozed.

Happy to agree to disagree, but I would target 1-2 starter caliber OL in FA and 1-2 in the draft. I would similarly target the DL and don't disagree with your choices there. But if I had to choose, I'd 1000% pick OL over DL to give Caleb his best shot (and Johnson).

I agree as well that the OL is a bigger need than the DL. I hope they can get at least one above average starter in FA on the O line, and at least one guy who is going to be at least decent, in FA. I feel confident we can get two starters with our 2nd round picks, leaving our FRP free to go after an EDGE or to trade down (still the best scenario, IMO).

That will give us at least 3 new starters for the O line, and one quality backup.

I would not discount bringing back Shelton. He graded out pretty well, and although he did have a few noticeably bad plays, overall, he seemed to do ok. I'd hope for an upgrade there, but if we had two quality guards next to him, and possibly a new LT as well, we could likely get by with him at center.

[dice]

i assume it's like PER in basketball except there has been no attempt to market or explain it.

Not sure where you got that idea, it is thoroughly explained: https://www.pro-football-reference.com/about/approximate_value.htm

my bad, thanks. it told me to click on the glossary for an explanation, and when i did it told me the same thing

anyway, as i expected, it's pretty much football PER. the creator himself says in the explanation that it is not a credible comparative tool for single seasons: "If one player is a 16 and another is a 14, we can't be very confident that the 16AV player actually had a better season than the 14AV player."

even the weighted career leaderboard produces interesting results, very skewed toward modern day players:

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/career_av_career.htm

phil rivers the 6th best QB career of all time?

anyway, you are the first person i have ever seen cite AV (which values mayfield and wirfs over burrow...and gibbs over henry) to argue one player over another

You asked for a source, I provided one. Then you predictably came up with an entirely new reason to dismiss it.

huh? was i supposed to come up with an old way to dismiss a measure that i've never seen cited?

and i didn't ask a source. that opens up anything you can find on god's green earth. i asked for EVIDENCE. does single season AV qualify as evidence? an argument that you would bother to introduce in court? i don't think its creator would even say yes

you said outright that becton is the better player. using a single season of AV hardly shows that. career AV per season (a use more in line with the creator's intent) shows the opposite: 16 over 5 seasons for becton, 16 over 4 for jenkins

who is the more valued free agent guard?

PFF: jenkins 3rd, becton 6th
SB nation (cumulative staff ranking): jenkins 2nd, becton not in top 7
33rd team: becton 5th, jenkins 7th
NFLtraderumors: jenkins 2nd, becton 4th
underdognetwork: jenkins 5th, becton 6th
foxsports: becton 2nd, jenkins 5th
sportskeeda: becton 4th, jenkins 7th
sportingnews: becton 5th, jenkins 6th
walterfootball: jenkins 3rd, becton 8th

the only one we know is doing deep analysis is PFF, but anyway...to sum up:

jenkins 2nd 2nd 3rd 3rd 5th 5th 6th 7th 7th
becton 2nd ...........4 4 5th 5th 6 6........8th, 8+

slight edge to jenkins on overall value, which obviously includes injury risk. taking out injury risk, i'm confident that jenkins is considered the better player by online pundits. we'll see what GMs think soon though!

Mayfield and Burrow had pretty similar seasons. Mayfield had a higher completion percentage, more yards per attempt, and better rushing stats across the board. Burrow had the counting stats of yards, attempts, and one more TD (Baker had 3 rushing, Burrow had 2). The biggest complaint is Mayfield's turnovers and that is a very reasonable criticism.

scant few think that mayfield had a better season

QBR, which solely measures QB contribution to maximizing a team's chances of scoring points, had 74.7 burrow, 61.6 mayfield

offensive player of the year voting: burrow 5th overall (1-5-8-7-5), mayfield others receiving votes (0-0-0-0-2)
MVP voting: burrow 4th (0-1-15-10-12), mayfield 11th (0-0-0-0-2)

Gibbs led the NFL in touchdowns. He had 180 fewer scrimmage yards than Henry, but more yards per touch and 2 fewer fumbles. Not a stretch to say he had a better year.

yards per touch is heavily weighted toward backs more involved in the passing game. it's a stat that suggests that any volume receiver was automatically more valuable than saquon because they dwarf him in yards per touch

that would be true if it were a description of an actual player

I have no idea what this means. It is literally the description of Jenkins as shown by his snap % vs. starts, watching him get injured, and Biggs' comments.

that's not what literally means, first of all. secondly, snap % vs. starts tells us nothing about whether a guy takes HIMSELF out, or whether he is forced to come out due to halting play due to injury. this is not a discussion about whether jenkins gets injured a lot. he does. "taking himself out a lot" suggests some sort of decision making or toughness deficiency. not sure about his decision making, but jenkins seems like a pretty tough SOB to me

and why the hell you put so much weight on what this biggs guy says is beyond me

can you even name who the bears backup LG was w/o looking it up? you want a teven jenkins who feels good enough to practice to give up reps to his backup in case he has to play on sunday? THAT screws up continuity as much as jenkins pulling himself out of a game does!

I think Matt Prior was the primary backup at both Guard spots. Unfortunately, he couldn't cover both guard spots because Bates and Miller got hurt while Nate Davis quit trying, so he ended up starting primarily at RG. I want a Teven Jenkins who doesn't continually remove himself from games with injury and negatively impact the rest of the offensive line.

teven jenkins playing as much as he reasonably can when his backup sucks is the correct strategy. he knows that, the coaches (who decide whether he plays) know that, even you know that

[dice]

wasn't one of the worst O-lines. caleb holds the ball too long. agree on jenkins, though, and i think re-signing him is very unlikely

PFN o-line rankings:

17) Chicago Bears
Regular-Season Grade: 76.7 (C)

It has been exceptionally unfair that the Chicago Bears’ offensive woes were largely blamed on the offensive line. Sure, a 17th-placed ranking isn’t good, but it’s not horrendous. They had some bad outings, as did most offensive lines, but that doesn’t mean they are the main reason for Caleb Williams’ struggles as a rookie.

The Bears’ OL was asked to block for the fourth-longest time of any unit this season (3.09 seconds). That contributes heavily to a 10.7% sack rate (last in the NFL) because their 35.4% pressure rate is up to 18th. We see that replicated whether it’s against the blitz or not, suggesting it might be a general problem in Williams’ game.

Chicago also ranks 15th in PBWR, which is respectable. Similarly, the run-blocking numbers are fairly solid (0.91 RBYBC/rush, 15th), so it’s ambitious to blame the offensive line for this season’s collapse.

8) Washington Commanders
Regular-Season Grade: 83.5 (B)
Regular Season + Postseason Grade: 81.1 (B-; 7th)

On the season as a whole, the Commanders’ offensive line did a good job in pass protection, given just how long Jayden Daniels holds the ball (3.01 seconds; seventh). Whether it’s in the face of the blitz or not, he’s in the top 10 for both in time to throw (or be sacked).

Therefore, while the pressure numbers don’t look elite (34.4%), in the context of the time they are blocking, they’re respectable. That is reflected in a top-10 ranking in PBWR entering Week 18.

In the run game, the Commanders’ RBs only averaged 0.89 YBC/rush, but ESPN ranks Washington’s line as the second-best in RBWR.

The Commanders’ offensive line did not perform well in the NFC Championship Game (D+). They finished with two of the worst four performances in run blocking, with 0.53 RBYBC/rush against the Eagles’ front four. We feared this might be the case after Washington struggled in the Wild Card round, but their bounce back against Detroit offered some hope.

The pass-blocking numbers look fine on the surface, with a 34.5% pressure rate and a 5.8% sack rate. However, Daniels consistently got the ball in under three seconds, suggesting their quarterback helped salvage those numbers with his play.

The main concern came against the blitz, where they allowed a 57.1% pressure rate. Daniels did well in escaping pressure and getting the ball out, which means Washington’s line didn’t give up a sack against the blitz.

The Bears rank 24th in the PFF offensive line rankings.

"While Chicago’s offensive line failed to reach the potential many saw in it in the preseason, the unit was better than many people gave it credit for. Four of the Bears’ five projected starters earned PFF overall grades above 70.0, and all five topped 65.0. However, injuries and Caleb Williams’ pocket movement and awareness did the group no favors, resulting in the line allowing the most sacks in the NFL (37).

The Bears may have surrendered the most sacks in the league, but they were “only” the 12th-worst offensive line in PFF pass-blocking efficiency rating (84.1). The unit allowed 180 total pressures on 682 pass plays."

I agree Caleb holds the ball, although from watching, that really became more of an issue later in the year, and based on my armchair coach read, was substantially due to dropping eyes at the snap to watch for the rush up the middle. Which was a massive issue for most of the season.

I don't quibble too much with the PFF ranking of 24th, I'd have assumed somewhere near the bottom and in the bottom quarter of OLs would qualify. No clue how PFN is getting 17, that's inconsistent with what I saw (and apparently what PFF saw). I do note that PFN says "Intriguingly, this unit posted four games with a grade of B- or above, and three of its five wins came in those games. All three came before their bye week, though, and they only posted one game above a C+ after Week 7, when their schedule got significantly harder." So seems consistent with looking good when playing weak competition but bad against better teams.

All of which to me still says by far the priority for the offseason is a significant retool of the O Line. It's been a particular area of deficit under Poles (although he tried with Nate Davis it was a massive fail). And while it's armchair again, I could distinctly notice that as the season went one, Caleb regressed in keeping his head up, and it happened as the interior of the O Line got repeatedly bulldozed.

Happy to agree to disagree, but I would target 1-2 starter caliber OL in FA and 1-2 in the draft. I would similarly target the DL and don't disagree with your choices there. But if I had to choose, I'd 1000% pick OL over DL to give Caleb his best shot (and Johnson).

agree w/ a lot of that. to be clear, i did a simulation of an offseason using perceived probabilities and a random number generator.
i was not providing my preferred acquisitions. just a weirdly fun intellectual exercise that takes a few hours. if the final results stimulate a little discussion, great. anyway...i've done several of them last year and this, and i've never looked at the final results and said "man, i'd like that to happen." odds are, most everybody's gonna be less than thrilled at what actually goes down

for example, jenkins re-signing for over 15 mil a year (1 yr. fully guaranteed) was a distinct outlier scenario. he is expected to get 10-15 mil a year. and it's very unlikely to be in chicago. i personally wouldn't mind keeping him, but not at 17 mil

[Almost Retired]

Biggs floating Dalman.

https://www.bleachernation.com/bears/2025/02/17/bears-center-options/

only 3 centers on PFF's top 100 FA list:

22 dalman
81 kelly - coming off knee surgery, mulling retirement w/ 32nd birthday approaching
100 shelton

on dalman:

"There aren’t many long-term answers in free agency at center, which will make Dalman the primary beneficiary if he reaches the open market. Any team that deploys an outside-zone rushing scheme will be all over the former fourth-round pick. Dalman has room to grow as a pass protector but is one of the best run-blocking centers in the NFL and will advance the continued growth of the interior offensive line market after Kansas City Chiefs center Creed Humphrey finally reset the center market."

lots of teams gonna go after this guy. can't expect that the bears are gonna be seated when the game of musical chairs is over. and if they are, they'll probably be out a lot of cap space w/o having helped the perceived biggest issue on the team (protecting caleb)

I think getting Dalman should be a bigger priority for Poles than trying to add Trey Smith. Smith is a great player but the price is too steep in my opinion. I'd try to get Dalman and Will Fries. Then add Kelvin Banks at #10 and Grey Zabel at #39 in the draft. They are both positionally flexible. If Banks doesn't work out at LT he can be moved inside to LG. And Zabel can play anywhere in the interior. Use the cash saved by not pursuing Trey Smith on an EDGE rusher, someone like Josh Sweat. Then we have a lot more options on how to use the 41st pick in the 2nd round. My preference would be to add another defensive tackle, someone like Deone Walker or Alfred Collins. They wouldn't be immediate starters but would be good depth players to have and develop.

[moorhosj]

teven jenkins playing as much as he reasonably can when his backup sucks is the correct strategy. he knows that, the coaches (who decide whether he plays) know that, even you know that

I could go point-by-point to rebut your contradictory arguments, like consistent relying on PFF which graded Teven Jenkins higher than Trey Smith, while criticizing AV. Or how you simply ignore information that goes against your stance, like how Philip Rivers has the 6th most QB starts in NFL history which heavily impacts a counting stat like Career AV. Or completely ignoring that Jahmyr Gibbs led the entire NFL in TDs.

Instead, I'll just highlight this comment and use it to remember why I stopped posting here in the first place. Enjoy being right about everything and never questioning yourself. I'm going to stop wasting my time.

[MalagaBulls]

Biggs: season ticket prices are about to get even more expensive:

Read on Twitter

[CROBulls]

I hope nobody watches damn team. You increasing season ticket prices after having 12 loss season?

[Betta Bulleavit]

I hope nobody watches damn team. You increasing season ticket prices after having 12 loss season?

On a the surface, that makes perfect sense. But that’s not really how pricing generally works. It tends to be more cost driven….unfortunately.

[biggestbullsfan]

Read on Twitter

[IliketheBullsNBearstoo]

I hope nobody watches damn team. You increasing season ticket prices after having 12 loss season?

I think what they're saying is, we plan on being 10% better this coming season.

[jnrjr79]

I hope nobody watches damn team. You increasing season ticket prices after having 12 loss season?

Is there any request more hopeless than asking Chicagoans not to watch the Bears?

[Dresden]

I hope nobody watches damn team. You increasing season ticket prices after having 12 loss season?

On a the surface, that makes perfect sense. But that’s not really how pricing generally works. It tends to be more cost driven….unfortunately.

I wonder what % of the team's revenue comes from gate attendance? 30% ?

[Dresden]

I hope nobody watches damn team. You increasing season ticket prices after having 12 loss season?

I think what they're saying is, we plan on being 10% better this coming season.

They ought to refund some of last year's ticket prices, given how lousy they were.

[NecessaryEvil]

Read on Twitter

[dice]

teven jenkins playing as much as he reasonably can when his backup sucks is the correct strategy. he knows that, the coaches (who decide whether he plays) know that, even you know that

I could go point-by-point to rebut your contradictory arguments, like consistent relying on PFF which graded Teven Jenkins higher than Trey Smith, while criticizing AV.

first of all, PFF did NOT grade jenkins higher...even though trey was highly ineffective in the playoffs

78.8 smith
75.4 jenkins

now...how is consistently relying on the ONLY SOURCE THAT WATCHES AND GRADES EVERY PLAY (and whose services every NFL team purchases) contradictory? i am contradicting myself by consistently using the vastly superior stat? that makes no damn sense. the difference between you and me is that i do not use a single season of results to make absolute statements like "player A is better than player B." it would be one thing to do it using a quality source like PFF. but you are doing it using a garbage stat (at least as a single season sample). as evidenced in small measure by its valuation of baker mayfield over the substantially better joe burrow this past season. AV is the NFL's version of PER

i did not say that teven jenkins is better than trey smith. you DID say that becton is better than jenkins based on...2024 AV. a minority opinion requires a much better argument to convince

you simply cannot grade an NFL lineman effectively w/o watching him work. a lot

Or how you simply ignore information that goes against your stance, like how Philip Rivers has the 6th most QB starts in NFL history which heavily impacts a counting stat like Career AV

i ignored that? why would you think i ignored that? such an assumption is...ignorant. the intellectual dishonesty here is you stating blind assumptions (which you may or may not even believe) to discredit me rather than making an argument to defend the ranking i am questioning!

Or completely ignoring that Jahmyr Gibbs led the entire NFL in TDs.

didn't ignore that either. you obviously value TDs more than i do

but you apparently ARE ignoring what i pointed out to you about the CREATOR of the stat warning against misusing it in the way that you continue to

btw, that gibbs led the league in TDs doesn't matter when making a direct comparison to another player. gibbs had 2 more TDs than henry. that's what's important to the argument

Instead, I'll just highlight this comment and use it to remember why I stopped posting here in the first place. Enjoy being right about everything and never questioning yourself. I'm going to stop wasting my time.

good riddance. i don't have to be right about everything. but you clearly do when you desperately cling to a terrible argument and a terrible (single season, anyway) stat while resorting to falsely denigrating me when the argument doesn't go your way

AV

[dice]

I hope nobody watches damn team. You increasing season ticket prices after having 12 loss season?

On a the surface, that makes perfect sense. But that’s not really how pricing generally works. It tends to be more cost driven….unfortunately.

inflation is 3%. are the costs of putting on a game really anticipated to be up anywhere close to 10%?

[Almost Retired]

I hope nobody watches damn team. You increasing season ticket prices after having 12 loss season?

On a the surface, that makes perfect sense. But that’s not really how pricing generally works. It tends to be more cost driven….unfortunately.

inflation is 3%. are the costs of putting on a game really anticipated to be up anywhere close to 10%?

Inflation is at 3%? According to who? The government? Which has lied about everything for over 50 years. The CPI is worthless. It has been manipulated beyond recognition. For more accurate data try "Shadow Stats". Real inflation, measuring the things you actually have to buy, like food, insurance, health care, etc. is at least 10%. Our auto insurance rose 17% last year and we haven't had an accident in 20 years. We just renewed our home owners insurance. Up just under 24% year over year. We're running $2 Trillion Dollar deficits. That's what is causing inflation. And it's far higher than 3%.