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2025 Draft & College Hoops

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Re: 2025 Draft & College Hoops 

Post#41 » by Ghost of Kleine » Fri Feb 21, 2025 7:51 pm

This is the intruiging kid that I want the Suns to sign from the undrafted ranges to eventually replace Devin Booker.

Jon Tonje (Wisconsin- Senior) 2025 draft (range- undrafted???)
6'6 222 lbs 24 yrs old but with an incredibly efficient game, a high basketball IQ, great strength, and a leadership mentality as the Badgers team captain and big game shot maker!
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/john-tonje-1.html

19.6 points/ 4.8 rebounds/ 1.2 assists.
58.6% EFG/ 66.8 TS%/ .223 WS/40/ 10.3 BPM/ 24.8 PER.




Watch this footage and his style of play, and then look at his efficiency, and tell me that he doesn't remind people of Booker before he became soft and "unbothered" :banghead:
I'd look at him as a Booker 2.0 reset before Booker stopped caring at all!
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Re: 2025 Draft & College Hoops 

Post#42 » by SunsRback4Good » Fri Feb 21, 2025 8:32 pm

BW, I’m concerned with the wildcats. They play hard and get to the foul line, but the biggest concern with them is their lack of three point makes. They rank (304th) in 3PT fg & (323rd) in 3PT fg % those numbers are mind boggling for a team who will likely be 4-5 seed in March madness tournament. We might be a first round exit. :(
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Re: 2025 Draft & College Hoops 

Post#43 » by Ghost of Kleine » Sat Feb 22, 2025 2:10 am

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John Tonje ( Wisconsin) mentioned above as an undrafted steal value option at SG along with Kobe Brea too in the upcoming 25' draft.
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Re: 2025 Draft & College Hoops 

Post#44 » by bwgood77 » Sun Feb 23, 2025 7:59 pm

SunsRback4Good wrote:BW, I’m concerned with the wildcats. They play hard and get to the foul line, but the biggest concern with them is their lack of three point makes. They rank (304th) in 3PT fg & (323rd) in 3PT fg % those numbers are mind boggling for a team who will likely be 4-5 seed in March madness tournament. We might be a first round exit. :(


Yeah, the 3 pt shooting is a concern. They still need to have Carter Bryant shoot more. He's over 35% but seems pretty clutch when it matters. And Del Orso is over 42%. If Caleb is hot he can shoot them, but get these guys more shots from the perimeter.

That being said, last night they got absolutely screwed on that last foul call. The refs changed the outcome of the game. I don't really remember that happening so much on an end of game play, but it absolutely was the difference. There was no foul and we had the ball and the lead with just over 3 seconds left. It sucks they don't have reviews, because that would have been overturned.
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Re: 2025 Draft & College Hoops 

Post#45 » by Ghost of Kleine » Mon Feb 24, 2025 11:40 pm

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I'm looking at this draft in an unconventional manner by looking at KD trades to get us a higher 1st in the late teens- early 20s ( if not better) so we could hopefully draft Fleming at 19-24 range. And then Carter Bryant with our CLE 25' 1st ( 29th -30th pick).

Bryant is often compared to a bigger PJ Washington/ Andre Robertson w/ 3 PT shooting. So he'd be perfect at our backup SF spot next to Fleming at 6'9 240 lbs at the backup 4. Fleming is physical, athletic and is hitting 42% from three. That'd give us two long, versatile, athletic, physical lockdown defensive wing/ forward shotblockers at the SF/ PF spots.

Now we can look at a backup center option that is more versatile with playmaking, ballhandling and shooting like Raynaud, Ivisic or Hansen Yang from the undrafted pool!
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Re: 2025 Draft & College Hoops 

Post#46 » by Ghost of Kleine » Tue Feb 25, 2025 3:04 am

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Re: 2025 Draft & College Hoops 

Post#47 » by Ghost of Kleine » Sat Mar 1, 2025 5:19 am

https://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=collin-murray-boyles--jimmy-butler

Anyone else find this as an interesting comparison?
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Could CMBs' ceiling actually be somewhere between Draymond Green and Jimmy Butler? Currently he's in the 18-20 range because he's not a great shooter. But if we did a KD trade and landed in the 15-18 range, should we consider him for a power/ wing 3 & D utility 3/4? Then we could take Beringer at 29 who projects very similarly to Jarrett Allen/ Nik Claxton.
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Re: 2025 Draft & College Hoops 

Post#48 » by Ghost of Kleine » Sun Mar 2, 2025 4:43 am

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6'6 mini Mikal Bridges............NO CAP!

He'd actually go greatnext to Dunn and would look like his twin brother Lol # New Twins! :wink:
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Re: 2025 Draft & College Hoops 

Post#49 » by Ghost of Kleine » Sun Mar 2, 2025 5:11 pm

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This is actually a great quick reference for pretty much all the potential prospects in this draft! Great detailed scouting bullet points and floor/ceiling realistic comparisons. Much better and more professional and concise than what I share. Very easy and quick reads.
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Re: 2025 Draft & College Hoops 

Post#50 » by Ghost of Kleine » Tue Mar 4, 2025 5:11 am

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Franchise cornerstone center potential in the 2nd round! Has absurd versatility! Will be Pau Gasol 2.0. We should be aggressively targeting this center and a strong defensive 3/4 or 4/5 to complement his game.
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Re: 2025 Draft & College Hoops 

Post#51 » by Slim Charless » Tue Mar 4, 2025 9:57 pm

Ghost of Kleine wrote:
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Franchise cornerstone center potential in the 2nd round! Has absurd versatility! Will be Pau Gasol 2.0. We should be aggressively targeting this center and a strong defensive 3/4 or 4/5 to complement his game.


Who do you think are some guys we should grab in slots 5-10 if we can get that Philly or Dallas pick for Durant?
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Re: 2025 Draft & College Hoops 

Post#52 » by Ghost of Kleine » Wed Mar 5, 2025 8:24 am

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https://www.blazersedge.com/rip-city-remix/2025/3/3/24377045/portland-trail-blazers-rip-city-remix-isaac-nogues-gonzalez-2025-nba-draft-news-spain


Another very solid undrafted consideration along with Joun Tonje. Could this kid be a young 6'5 Derrick White ( ceiling) outcome?
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Re: 2025 Draft & College Hoops 

Post#53 » by Ghost of Kleine » Wed Mar 5, 2025 10:27 am

Slim Charless wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
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Franchise cornerstone center potential in the 2nd round! Has absurd versatility! Will be Pau Gasol 2.0. We should be aggressively targeting this center and a strong defensive 3/4 or 4/5 to complement his game.


Who do you think are some guys we should grab in slots 5-10 if we can get that Philly or Dallas pick for Durant?


Depending upon who might be there, I'd first hope for one of Bailey, Esgecombe or Harper to fall a couple of spots to there if we trade up into that 5-10 range. Otherwise, I'd really prefer to trade back down into the first with either Brooklyn or Orlando and pick up some additional picks/ assets.

However, IF we were to stay and not trade back, I'd target these 5 players hard:

1- Kaman Maluach.
2- Xavier Booker ( IF he declares).
3- Isiah Evans ( if he declares).
4- Colin Murray Boyle's.
5- Noah Essengue.
** I didn't mention names like Kneuppel, Mcneely, Newell, Demin, etc because I can honestly offer better value/ impact alternatives to each of those throughout the draft into the 2nd and even undrafted ranges. :wink:

But I'd really hope for 1 of these 3 outcomes man:

1- One of those top 3 options would fall to us.
2- Either or both of Xavier Booker ( A Davis) or Isiah Evans ( BI / Bridges) declare and I'd take both if somehow possible?
3- We trade back with Brooklyn or Orlando and add multiple athletic, long, physical young two way or high end defensive talents!! ( to make up for all the drafts we'll be missing out on thanks to Ishbia and Jones). :banghead:
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Re: 2025 Draft & College Hoops 

Post#54 » by Slim Charless » Wed Mar 5, 2025 2:59 pm

Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
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Franchise cornerstone center potential in the 2nd round! Has absurd versatility! Will be Pau Gasol 2.0. We should be aggressively targeting this center and a strong defensive 3/4 or 4/5 to complement his game.


Who do you think are some guys we should grab in slots 5-10 if we can get that Philly or Dallas pick for Durant?


Depending upon who might be there, I'd first hope for one of Bailey, Esgecombe or Harper to fall a couple of spots to there if we trade up into that 5-10 range. Otherwise, I'd really prefer to trade back down into the first with either Brooklyn or Orlando and pick up some additional picks/ assets.

However, IF we were to stay and not trade back, I'd target these 5 players hard:

1- Kaman Maluach.
2- Xavier Booker ( IF he declares).
3- Isiah Evans ( if he declares).
4- Colin Murray Boyle's.
5- Noah Essengue.
** I didn't mention names like Kneuppel, Mcneely, Newell, Demin, etc because I can honestly offer better value/ impact alternatives to each of those throughout the draft into the 2nd and even undrafted ranges. :wink:

But I'd really hope for 1 of these 3 outcomes man:

1- One of those top 3 options would fall to us.
2- Either or both of Xavier Booker ( A Davis) or Isiah Evans ( BI / Bridges) declare and I'd take both if somehow possible?
3- We trade back with Brooklyn or Orlando and add multiple athletic, long, physical young two way or high end defensive talents!! ( to make up for all the drafts we'll be missing out on thanks to Ishbia and Jones). :banghead:


What's your opinion on the 3 Euro PGs? Traore, Demin and Jakucionis. Having someone to set up other guys would be nice if we're "stuck" with Booker
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Re: 2025 Draft & College Hoops 

Post#55 » by Ghost of Kleine » Wed Mar 5, 2025 11:58 pm

Slim Charless wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
Who do you think are some guys we should grab in slots 5-10 if we can get that Philly or Dallas pick for Durant?


Depending upon who might be there, I'd first hope for one of Bailey, Esgecombe or Harper to fall a couple of spots to there if we trade up into that 5-10 range. Otherwise, I'd really prefer to trade back down into the first with either Brooklyn or Orlando and pick up some additional picks/ assets.

However, IF we were to stay and not trade back, I'd target these 5 players hard:

1- Kaman Maluach.
2- Xavier Booker ( IF he declares).
3- Isiah Evans ( if he declares).
4- Colin Murray Boyle's.
5- Noah Essengue.
** I didn't mention names like Kneuppel, Mcneely, Newell, Demin, etc because I can honestly offer better value/ impact alternatives to each of those throughout the draft into the 2nd and even undrafted ranges. :wink:

But I'd really hope for 1 of these 3 outcomes man:

1- One of those top 3 options would fall to us.
2- Either or both of Xavier Booker ( A Davis) or Isiah Evans ( BI / Bridges) declare and I'd take both if somehow possible?
3- We trade back with Brooklyn or Orlando and add multiple athletic, long, physical young two-way or high-end defensive talents!! ( to make up for all the drafts we'll be missing out on thanks to Ishbia and Jones). :banghead:


What's your opinion on the 3 Euro PGs? Traore, Demin and Jakucionis. Having someone to set up other guys would be nice if we're "stuck" with Booker


- Traore is very solid lead guard type! Not very athletic or flashy, but solid. Not yet a great or efficient shooter and can be a bit reckless and turnover prone. he's more or less a mix of George Hill/ Devin Harris. Solid, but I'd definitely choose a few other options before taking him.

- Demin is intriguing for his size, and ballhandling, but he's currently kind of basic to me. His ballhandling is decent but not elite, his passing is very solid but not flashy or high level, his athleticism is solid but he's not quick or explosive, just average. He does have great height, and a very high IQ, I wouldn't hate him, but I honestly would choose Larrea (1s) and him maybe (2nd) on my list because overall even though Sergio d Larrea is only 6'7, and Demin has 2 inches on him, Larrea is quicker, has more lateral and vertical burst (more athletic) has more flash to his passing, and is a better overall shooter between the two.
https://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=sergio-de-larrea--egor-demin

I have Demin more as a Thomas Santoransky (currently) and Larrea as a bigger, better shooting Rubio (currently), hence the trade back preference to try and glean a bit more assets to add other high-end positional talent as well.

- Jakucionis is pretty nice! I haven't really focused much on him as I have on defensive wings and two-way 3&D forwards. But I do really like his smooth European style crafty play and advanced passing. And even though I don't really see him ever being a star or superstar player due to his lack of speed or high-end athleticism, and his shooting is a concern. I actually would absolutely take him in the 6-10 range for his ballhandling, high level passing, and his high end shotmaking ability. ** He's more of a "big shot" maker and a very clever creator than he is a consistent good shooter. I have him as a starting level guard in the Podzieemski/ Drgic archetype
with all star ceiling potential if he can develop and increase his strength, speed, athleticism, and decision making a bit more.

In sequence, my guard list would probably be:
1- Harper.
2- Jakucionis.
3- Larrea.
4- Demin.
5- Tyrese Proctor or Garway Dual.
*** traore. :nod:
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Re: 2025 Draft & College Hoops 

Post#56 » by Slim Charless » Thu Mar 6, 2025 12:18 am

Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Depending upon who might be there, I'd first hope for one of Bailey, Esgecombe or Harper to fall a couple of spots to there if we trade up into that 5-10 range. Otherwise, I'd really prefer to trade back down into the first with either Brooklyn or Orlando and pick up some additional picks/ assets.

However, IF we were to stay and not trade back, I'd target these 5 players hard:

1- Kaman Maluach.
2- Xavier Booker ( IF he declares).
3- Isiah Evans ( if he declares).
4- Colin Murray Boyle's.
5- Noah Essengue.
** I didn't mention names like Kneuppel, Mcneely, Newell, Demin, etc because I can honestly offer better value/ impact alternatives to each of those throughout the draft into the 2nd and even undrafted ranges. :wink:

But I'd really hope for 1 of these 3 outcomes man:

1- One of those top 3 options would fall to us.
2- Either or both of Xavier Booker ( A Davis) or Isiah Evans ( BI / Bridges) declare and I'd take both if somehow possible?
3- We trade back with Brooklyn or Orlando and add multiple athletic, long, physical young two-way or high-end defensive talents!! ( to make up for all the drafts we'll be missing out on thanks to Ishbia and Jones). :banghead:


What's your opinion on the 3 Euro PGs? Traore, Demin and Jakucionis. Having someone to set up other guys would be nice if we're "stuck" with Booker


- Traore is very solid lead guard type! Not very athletic or flashy, but solid. Not yet a great or efficient shooter and can be a bit reckless and turnover prone. he's more or less a mix of George Hill/ Devin Harris. Solid, but I'd definitely choose a few other options before taking him.

- Demin is intriguing for his size, and ballhandling, but he's currently kind of basic to me. His ballhandling is decent but not elite, his passing is very solid but not flashy or high level, his athleticism is solid but he's not quick or explosive, just average. He does have great height, and a very high IQ, I wouldn't hate him, but I honestly would choose Larrea (1s) and him maybe (2nd) on my list because overall even though Sergio d Larrea is only 6'7, and Demin has 2 inches on him, Larrea is quicker, has more lateral and vertical burst (more athletic) has more flash to his passing, and is a better overall shooter between the two.
https://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=sergio-de-larrea--egor-demin

I have Demin more as a Thomas Santoransky (currently) and Larrea as a bigger, better shooting Rubio (currently), hence the trade back preference to try and glean a bit more assets to add other high-end positional talent as well.

- Jakucionis is pretty nice! I haven't really focused much on him as I have on defensive wings and two-way 3&D forwards. But I do really like his smooth European style crafty play and advanced passing. And even though I don't really see him ever being a star or superstar player due to his lack of speed or high-end athleticism, and his shooting is a concern. I actually would absolutely take him in the 6-10 range for his ballhandling, high level passing, and his high end shotmaking ability. ** He's more of a "big shot" maker and a very clever creator than he is a consistent good shooter. I have him as a starting level guard in the Podzieemski/ Drgic archetype
with all star ceiling potential if he can develop and increase his strength, speed, athleticism, and decision making a bit more.

In sequence, my guard list would probably be:
1- Harper.
2- Jakucionis.
3- Larrea.
4- Demin.
5- Tyrese Proctor or Garway Dual.
*** traore. :nod:


Great write-up.

I would like Jak as I'm worried about Demin's shooting. If we do a theoretical trade of KD to Dallas and get Gafford/PJ/filler and their pick this year (maybe 6) that can give us a lineup of:

Jak
Booker
Dunn
PJ
Gafford

Beal off the bench. Hopefully we could get Kody for a 3 point specialist and/or a young, raw big with our later picks at 32 and in the second. We can compete with that I guess. That's not terrible as none of those dudes have long deals and we at least we would have a PG to build around if we DO need to trade Book later on next summer. Obviously you need to see what OKC/Miami/HOU would offer up as well of course but this seems to be the floor for a KD deal. I can live with that if we HAVE to keep Booker.
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Re: 2025 Draft & College Hoops 

Post#57 » by Ghost of Kleine » Thu Mar 6, 2025 3:57 pm

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BWGood first mentioned Fleming awhile back as a great prospect for us to consider. And he was very right about that if we ended up securing a draft range to pick him.

He'd be a perfect fit for our needs if we'd secured a lottery pick in a KD trade! But even if he ranges into the lottery, and we couldn't get in range for him, the interesting thing about this draft is the distinctly very similar archetype alternatives to those players at different ranges.

If we couldn't somehow land Fleming, this would emphatically be my alternative PF option:
Yaxel Lendeborg. Just review this comparison for my reasoning in this.
https://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=rasheer-fleming--yaxel-lendeborg
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Re: 2025 Draft & College Hoops 

Post#58 » by Ghost of Kleine » Sat Mar 8, 2025 8:35 pm

The two super efficient, incredibly smooth shooters, scorers, I'd prefer for our post Booker backcourt of the future is:

Chance McMillian (Texas Tech)
6'2 170 lb scoring guard with an incredibly smooth efficient game and silky smooth shooting!
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/chance-mcmillian-1.html
14 points/ 4 rebounds/ 1.7 assists on 53% FG/ 44% 3PT/ 88% FT/ 66% EFG/ 69% TS/ .201 WS/40/ 10.0 BPM.

A slightly bigger, more athletic Steph Curry/ C J McCollum.

John Tonje ( Wisconsin)
6'5 222 lb more physical/ athletic version of Booker/ D Mitchell.
19 points/ 5 rebounds/ 1.7 assists on 47% FG/ 38% 3PT/ 91% FT/ 56% EFG/ 64% TS/ .211 WS/40/ 9.6 BPM.

A 6'5 physical, slightly more athletic version of Booker with a nearly identical style of play and mentality.
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Re: 2025 Draft & College Hoops 

Post#59 » by Ghost of Kleine » Thu Mar 13, 2025 9:26 pm

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This guy reminds me of a slightly better version of Drew Eubanks. Having said that, his size and versatility wouldn't be bad for us if we were to pick up a mid 2nd in a trade. But I wouldn't have him before any of Fleming, Carter Bryant, Maxime Raynaud, or Yaxel Lendeborg (maybe). All in all, for a power Forward consideration, I might have him at:

Power Forwards
1- Rasheer Fleming.
2- Maxime Raynaud.
3- Carter Bryant.
4- Johan Grunloh.
5- Alex Condon
5- Yaxel Lendeborg.
6- Johni Broome.
7- Trevon Brazile.
8- Brandon Garrison.
9- Grant Nelson.
10- Ousmane N'diaye.
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Re: 2025 Draft & College Hoops 

Post#60 » by SunsRback4Good » Thu Mar 13, 2025 10:23 pm

UOfA plays Kansas tonight @ 6:30pm. Need to win this game badly. We’ve been sliding the past 8 games winning just 3 of them. BEAR DOWN!!!

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