NY Knicks

[cgf]

Sure, but how are you improving this roster?

The Knicks have 1 draft pick - the better for Bos/Mem which is currently #55.

In terms of room below the 2nd apron, NY has about 11.5MM of space with 10 players on the roster. Assuming they sign their 2nd rd pick to a minimum contract, they can offer 5.6mm out of the 5.65mm taxpayer MLE, then round the roster out with 2 vet minimums, and basically be sitting at the 2nd apron. I’d love Malcom Brogdon or Clint Capela for the taxpayer MLE - just not sure if that’s realistic.

If your not trading one of the starters, there is very little moveable salary, no real tradable 1’s (the WAS pick is almost guaranteed to be 2 2nds) and most of the 6 future 2nds they own are “least favorable of” picks. So the cupboard is close to bare.

That’s the problem with this team, they don’t have the ways to improve the roster - either by trading for a superstar or adding necessary depth - and they are not a contender as currently constructed. They also don’t have an opportunity to hit the reset button for anther 6 seasons.

It’s as bad a future outlook as their is in the league, even if they are currently a solid 50 win team that should make the 2nd round of the playoffs for the third straight year

Just going to quote myself from another thread where this same question came up:

Is spotrac lying to me or wouldn't we need to bring in someone more expensive than Achiuwa to hit the 2nd apron? Unless I'm reading it wrong we could bring Precious back for 6M and still have the 1st-apron MLE for another fringe rotation guy to upgrade on Shamet, or replace Precious with someone making almost double what he currently is.

So far this season Deuce McBride has been our only starting caliber bench player. Once Robinson is back in action that'll bump that up to two whether he or Hart is starting. So a precious upgrade would make that 3 guys that could give us a good 24mpg or more even if we didn't get any progress from our kids, find any new bargains, or do anything with our SRPs / Dadiet.

And with 8 guys who can give us 24+ minutes a game, or 7 + Precious and another Precious caliber pure bench guy, we should stay a lot fresher...which should help us maintain the kind of defensive intensity we had while storming back, even if going big with both Robinson & Towns doesn't level us up.

Plus I think Kolek will be able to upgrade upon Payne by next postseason, if not the start of the regular season, because the kid is really crafty...and if Dadiet doesn't take a big step, I suspect he'll be paired with some of our SRPs for another bench upgrade, whether that's upgrading on Shamet's role or Hukporti's.

So there's the potential for 3-4 upgrades to our current bench...Hart/Robinson, Kolek, Achiuwa-upgrade or Apron MLE, and Dadiet+picks trade...even without our FO snagging whoever turns out to be this summer's best vet min bargain, or taking advantage of their better understanding of the CBA to find more wiggle room than everyone thought they had, like they did last summer.

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/new-york-knicks/overview/_/year/2025/sort/cap_total

Whether bolstering our bench and getting Mitch back will be enough to move us from the top of tier 2 into tier 1, we won't know until we see, but the FO has avenues to improve the bench even without any cap-shenanigans that we lack the CBA-knowledge to predict or landing someone like Yabusele with a vet min, like Philly did.

According to Spotrac the Knicks are about 11.5mm below the 2nd apron next year with 10 guys on the roster. Need to get to 14. The way to do it is signing our 2nd rd pick to a minimum deal - 1.3mm and 2 vet min slots - 2.3mm each. NY can then use up to 5.6mm of the taxpayer MLE, but would be up against the apron with no room for a buyout guy. So it’s Precious or taxpayer MLE

Also important to note - this will be the last time the Knicks have access to the taxpayer MLE for a while.

That 11.5M under the 2nd apron figure includes a 2.5M incomplete roster charge, so we've got around 14M to fill those 4 spots.

That would be enough to use the MLE and bring Precious back for a bit less than he's getting this year...but we overpaid him this year, so a slight paycut could still be the best deal he has on the table, especially one that leaves us with his bird rights.

How are Hukporti and Shamet paid less than that? Is it because Huk is a converted two-way and Shamet's cap hit is only for the pro-rated portion of the season? If so, couldn't we fill the final 2-3 spots with contracts like Huk's? 3 Huk's and suddenly we've got almost 11M to pay our 8th man...almost 13M if we traded Dadiet for that 8th man too.

[cgf]

Just going to quote myself from another thread where this same question came up:



Whether bolstering our bench and getting Mitch back will be enough to move us from the top of tier 2 into tier 1, we won't know until we see, but the FO has avenues to improve the bench even without any cap-shenanigans that we lack the CBA-knowledge to predict or landing someone like Yabusele with a vet min, like Philly did.

According to Spotrac the Knicks are about 11.5mm below the 2nd apron next year with 10 guys on the roster. Need to get to 14. The way to do it is signing our 2nd rd pick to a minimum deal - 1.3mm and 2 vet min slots - 2.3mm each. NY can then use up to 5.6mm of the taxpayer MLE, but would be up against the apron with no room for a buyout guy. So it’s Precious or taxpayer MLE

Also important to note - this will be the last time the Knicks have access to the taxpayer MLE for a while.

That 11.5M under the 2nd apron figure includes a 2.5M incomplete roster charge, so we've got around 14M to fill those 4 spots.

That would be enough to use the MLE and bring Precious back for a bit less than he's getting this year...but we overpaid him this year, so a slight paycut could still be the best deal he has on the table, especially one that leaves us with his bird rights.

How are Hukporti and Shamet paid less than that? Is it because Huk is a converted two-way and Shamet's cap hit is only for the pro-rated portion of the season? If so, couldn't we fill the final 2-3 spots with contracts like Huk's? 3 Huk's and suddenly we've got almost 11M to pay our 8th man...almost 13M if we traded Dadiet for that 8th man too.

To add to this. There are some cap shenanigans that can be played with 10-days & non-guaranteed deals not counting until January + cap hits being prorated, to fill that last roster spot or two on the cheap if we need an extra million or two.

[NYG]

Honestly with some minor tweaks and full health, why can't the 2025-26 Knicks take a leap similar to the 2024-25 Cavs? This team isn't old or anything, I think we have to give it one more go and possibly change the coach after 2025-26 if it's still not working rather than changing the roster. If the above is correct, you bring back Achiuwa, you sign the best center or wing possible with the Tax MLE and trade Dadiet and that conditional Wizards 1st for whichever you didn't get with the Tax MLE.

Healthy Mitchell Robinson, C via Tax MLE or Dadiet deal, Achiuwa, Deuce, Kolek, Wing via Tax MLE or Dadiet deal... suddenly you have a nice second unit that can leave the starters fresher.

[cgf]

Honestly with some minor tweaks and full health, why can't the 2025-26 Knicks take a leap similar to the 2024-25 Cavs? This team isn't old or anything, I think we have to give it one more go and possibly change the coach after 2025-26 if it's still not working rather than changing the roster. If the above is correct, you bring back Achiuwa, you sign the best center or wing possible with the Tax MLE and trade Dadiet and that conditional Wizards 1st for whichever you didn't get with the Tax MLE.

Healthy Mitchell Robinson, C via Tax MLE or Dadiet deal, Achiuwa, Deuce, Kolek, Wing via Tax MLE or Dadiet deal... suddenly you have a nice second unit that can leave the starters fresher.

Ainge will finally relent and give us Kessler for Dadiet + WSH FRP + Hukporti!

Starters:
Brunson - Bridges - Anunoby - Towns - Robinson
Bench:
Kolek (1) - McBride (1-2) - Hart (2-4) - LaRavia (3-4) - Achiuwa (4-5) - Kessler (5)

[NYG]

Free agency is very slim pickings...

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/free-agents/_/year/2025

Salaries lower than Dadiet are rough too...

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/rankings/player/_/year/2025/sort/cap_total

[WargamesX]

I think a lot of this summer depends on if another team that wants to get under a Apron or the tax and see's an opptunity to waive Precious for an asset after a trade instead of another player already on their roster for nothing as a preferable move. They might move Mitch, but lowkey I think this season has shown the value of mitch to this team winning.

[NYG]

Free agency is very slim pickings...

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/free-agents/_/year/2025

Salaries lower than Dadiet are rough too...

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/rankings/player/_/year/2025/sort/cap_total

Given Nick Richards value... Dadiet and 2-3 2nds for Duop Reath?

Which wing free agents are valued at the Tax MLE though? Would getting Quentin Grimes back make sense? Gary Trent Jr.? NAW? Can LaRavia play SF at all or is he more of a PF? Are Ingles or Tate anything more than league minimum guys now?

Karl-Anthony Towns
Mitchell Robinson
Duop Reath
OG Anunoby
Precious Achiuwa
Mikal Bridges
Free Agent via Tax MLE
Josh Hart
Deuce McBride
Jalen Brunson
Tyler Kolek

[R-DAWG]

According to Spotrac the Knicks are about 11.5mm below the 2nd apron next year with 10 guys on the roster. Need to get to 14. The way to do it is signing our 2nd rd pick to a minimum deal - 1.3mm and 2 vet min slots - 2.3mm each. NY can then use up to 5.6mm of the taxpayer MLE, but would be up against the apron with no room for a buyout guy. So it’s Precious or taxpayer MLE

Also important to note - this will be the last time the Knicks have access to the taxpayer MLE for a while.

That 11.5M under the 2nd apron figure includes a 2.5M incomplete roster charge, so we've got around 14M to fill those 4 spots.

That would be enough to use the MLE and bring Precious back for a bit less than he's getting this year...but we overpaid him this year, so a slight paycut could still be the best deal he has on the table, especially one that leaves us with his bird rights.

How are Hukporti and Shamet paid less than that? Is it because Huk is a converted two-way and Shamet's cap hit is only for the pro-rated portion of the season? If so, couldn't we fill the final 2-3 spots with contracts like Huk's? 3 Huk's and suddenly we've got almost 11M to pay our 8th man...almost 13M if we traded Dadiet for that 8th man too.

To add to this. There are some cap shenanigans that can be played with 10-days & non-guaranteed deals not counting until January + cap hits being prorated, to fill that last roster spot or two on the cheap if we need an extra million or two.

The 11,514,776 below the 2nd apron does not include minimum cap holds.

Fill out the roster with a 2nd rd pick (1,272,870) and 2 vet mins (2,378,870 each) and your left with 5,484,776. The full tax MLE is 5,650,000.

The Precious/Bird rights thing is a great point, but signing him to a contract that saves his bird rights would cost 2,850,000 - about 475k above a minimum slot. I would think keeping his bird rights for a human TPE type of contract for the years we are in the 2nd apron and can’t combine salaries for a trade.

So realistically, we can use 5mm of the tax mle, keep Precious with bird rights, have one minimum slot and a 2nd rd pick. Maybe some shenanigans can create 500k or so of wiggle room below the 2nd apron

It wouldn’t surprise me if they tried to move Pacome for a pick in the 30’s, which would save about 800k below the apron and possibly get a piece that is more ready to help now.

[cgf]

That 11.5M under the 2nd apron figure includes a 2.5M incomplete roster charge, so we've got around 14M to fill those 4 spots.

That would be enough to use the MLE and bring Precious back for a bit less than he's getting this year...but we overpaid him this year, so a slight paycut could still be the best deal he has on the table, especially one that leaves us with his bird rights.

How are Hukporti and Shamet paid less than that? Is it because Huk is a converted two-way and Shamet's cap hit is only for the pro-rated portion of the season? If so, couldn't we fill the final 2-3 spots with contracts like Huk's? 3 Huk's and suddenly we've got almost 11M to pay our 8th man...almost 13M if we traded Dadiet for that 8th man too.

To add to this. There are some cap shenanigans that can be played with 10-days & non-guaranteed deals not counting until January + cap hits being prorated, to fill that last roster spot or two on the cheap if we need an extra million or two.

The 11,514,776 below the 2nd apron does not include minimum cap holds.

Fill out the roster with a 2nd rd pick (1,272,870) and 2 vet mins (2,378,870 each) and your left with 5,484,776. The full tax MLE is 5,650,000.

The Precious/Bird rights thing is a great point, but signing him to a contract that saves his bird rights would cost 2,850,000 - about 475k above a minimum slot. I would think keeping his bird rights for a human TPE type of contract for the years we are in the 2nd apron and can’t combine salaries for a trade.

So realistically, we can use 5mm of the tax mle, keep Precious with bird rights, have one minimum slot and a 2nd rd pick. Maybe some shenanigans can create 500k or so of wiggle room below the 2nd apron

It wouldn’t surprise me if they tried to move Pacome for a pick in the 30’s, which would save about 800k below the apron and possibly get a piece that is more ready to help now.

Spotrac lists a ~2.5M incomplete roster charge, is that not included in their apron calculations?

[R-DAWG]

To add to this. There are some cap shenanigans that can be played with 10-days & non-guaranteed deals not counting until January + cap hits being prorated, to fill that last roster spot or two on the cheap if we need an extra million or two.

The 11,514,776 below the 2nd apron does not include minimum cap holds.

Fill out the roster with a 2nd rd pick (1,272,870) and 2 vet mins (2,378,870 each) and your left with 5,484,776. The full tax MLE is 5,650,000.

The Precious/Bird rights thing is a great point, but signing him to a contract that saves his bird rights would cost 2,850,000 - about 475k above a minimum slot. I would think keeping his bird rights for a human TPE type of contract for the years we are in the 2nd apron and can’t combine salaries for a trade.

So realistically, we can use 5mm of the tax mle, keep Precious with bird rights, have one minimum slot and a 2nd rd pick. Maybe some shenanigans can create 500k or so of wiggle room below the 2nd apron

It wouldn’t surprise me if they tried to move Pacome for a pick in the 30’s, which would save about 800k below the apron and possibly get a piece that is more ready to help now.

Spotrac lists a ~2.5M incomplete roster charge, is that not included in their apron calculations?

It is not. I manually added up the contracts to confirm the same

[cgf]

The 11,514,776 below the 2nd apron does not include minimum cap holds.

Fill out the roster with a 2nd rd pick (1,272,870) and 2 vet mins (2,378,870 each) and your left with 5,484,776. The full tax MLE is 5,650,000.

The Precious/Bird rights thing is a great point, but signing him to a contract that saves his bird rights would cost 2,850,000 - about 475k above a minimum slot. I would think keeping his bird rights for a human TPE type of contract for the years we are in the 2nd apron and can’t combine salaries for a trade.

So realistically, we can use 5mm of the tax mle, keep Precious with bird rights, have one minimum slot and a 2nd rd pick. Maybe some shenanigans can create 500k or so of wiggle room below the 2nd apron

It wouldn’t surprise me if they tried to move Pacome for a pick in the 30’s, which would save about 800k below the apron and possibly get a piece that is more ready to help now.

Spotrac lists a ~2.5M incomplete roster charge, is that not included in their apron calculations?

It is not. I manually added up the contracts to confirm the same

Ah well that does make it trickier, but we can still open more room if there aren’t vet min guys who would actually play for us and we just need to comply with the roster rules.

You bring in kids that are only eligible for the rookie min. Sign them to unguaranteed deals to keep their money from effecting our cap until the January deadline. Then you cut them & sign them back to prorated rookie min deals, which should carry a cap hit of around 800K each.

[R-DAWG]

Spotrac lists a ~2.5M incomplete roster charge, is that not included in their apron calculations?

It is not. I manually added up the contracts to confirm the same

Ah well that does make it trickier, but we can still open more room if there aren’t vet min guys who would actually play for us and we just need to comply with the roster rules.

You bring in kids that are only eligible for the rookie min. Sign them to unguaranteed deals to keep their money from effecting our cap until the January deadline. Then you cut them & sign them back to prorated rookie min deals, which should carry a cap hit of around 800K each.

If we use any of the taxpayer MLE it triggers a hard cap at the 2nd apron.

If we don't we can exceed the 2nd apron, but it starts the 2nd apron clock, which you really want to limit to 2 years. We will be a 2nd apron team in 26/27 and 27/28 once the Mikal extension kicks in (and expect it to be a HUGE number since he has the team by the balls)

[Astaluego]

I understand the value of having a guy like Robinson, but in my opinion the need for another level generator is even more important... especially if they can replace much of what Robinson brings in free agency with guys like Adams for a lower salary (and retain Achiuwa+Hukporti development)... Who could they get with Robinson (maybe a 3rd team that brings value? +Dadiet+SRP....Clarksson/White(Bulls)Sexton come to mind...could be good fits

[R-DAWG]

I understand the value of having a guy like Robinson, but in my opinion the need for another level generator is even more important... especially if they can replace much of what Robinson brings in free agency with guys like Adams for a lower salary (and retain Achiuwa+Hukporti development)... Who could they get with Robinson (maybe a 3rd team that brings value? +Dadiet+SRP....Clarksson/White(Bulls)Sexton come to mind...could be good fits

I think you need to focus on moving one of Bridges/Anunoby to get that kind of short creator.

[NYG]

I understand the value of having a guy like Robinson, but in my opinion the need for another level generator is even more important... especially if they can replace much of what Robinson brings in free agency with guys like Adams for a lower salary (and retain Achiuwa+Hukporti development)... Who could they get with Robinson (maybe a 3rd team that brings value? +Dadiet+SRP....Clarksson/White(Bulls)Sexton come to mind...could be good fits

I think you need to focus on moving one of Bridges/Anunoby to get that kind of short creator.

I wish Bridges/Mitch was enough salary for Collins/Sexton... I kind of like that deal

[Celts17Pride]

Honestly with some minor tweaks and full health, why can't the 2025-26 Knicks take a leap similar to the 2024-25 Cavs?

Because the Knicks don’t defend and they have two of the worst defenders at their position in Brunson and Towns

[NYG]

Lu Dort + ?? = Mikal?

[WargamesX]

Honestly with some minor tweaks and full health, why can't the 2025-26 Knicks take a leap similar to the 2024-25 Cavs?

Because the Knicks don’t defend and they have two of the worst defenders at their position in Brunson and Towns

I think a coaching change is in the cards and could see them moving KAT to the 4 and Mitch to the 5. Assuming they can’t improve over the offseason is an over reaction. The roster isn’t perfect but a lot of the issues with this team comes down to coaching.

[TheZachAttack]

Honestly with some minor tweaks and full health, why can't the 2025-26 Knicks take a leap similar to the 2024-25 Cavs?

Because the Knicks don’t defend and they have two of the worst defenders at their position in Brunson and Towns

I think a coaching change is in the cards and could see them moving KAT to the 4 and Mitch to the 5. Assuming they can’t improve over the offseason is an over reaction. The roster isn’t perfect but a lot of the issues with this team comes down to coaching.

Towns can definitely work defensively as a 4 so he doesn't have to play drop and he doesn't have to make as many decisions on offense and can just focus on moving his feet. The challenge will be on offense, if there's another true 5 on the floor he becomes more of a spot up shooter and then pump and go player -- and a lot of the stray voltage as we would call it happens when Towns is trying to drive against a smaller player with a rim protector still in at the rim. He also is not that great at posting up these types of players because they all flop when he tries to be physical so he ends up not really getting great position and more stray voltage happens.

He was still good offensively, but he becomes more of a piece that's closer to the Bridges role versus the role has right now as the center of the 2-man engine. The challenge with Towns is that he's a great finisher and can even drive from the perimeter against 5's but really he needs a player to set up in spots, so he's somewhat easily taken out of games when he's the focal point of the defense and when the offense isn't really focusing on making sure he gets open.

[NYG]

Honestly with some minor tweaks and full health, why can't the 2025-26 Knicks take a leap similar to the 2024-25 Cavs?

Because the Knicks don’t defend and they have two of the worst defenders at their position in Brunson and Towns

I think a coaching change is in the cards and could see them moving KAT to the 4 and Mitch to the 5. Assuming they can’t improve over the offseason is an over reaction. The roster isn’t perfect but a lot of the issues with this team comes down to coaching.

Who would you hire though? Jay Wright maybe?