PG Denver - Great Win!

[Ron Swanson]

Anyone have the Bucks D rating since the trade deadline?

109.4 (5th best)

The asterisk being that it's come mostly against trash and mediocre offenses (CHA, MIA, ATL, HOU, WAS, LAC) up until last night.

[ShootingtheJ]

The early returns have Kuzma's on/off at -3.3, so he's really just getting credit for the work other players are doing. He's defending, but negating that with terribly inefficient shooting on high volume.

It flipped to +2.9 last night, which shows it's silly to read into on/off #'s that aren't extreme in either direction over a small sample.

Thanks, just trying to hold him to the same standard Bobby Portis is held to.

[DingleJerry]

I happened to look up Team D ratings the other day and saw we're #10 for the whole year. So I'd presume if you take out the first 10ish games when they were a mess that they've been top 7ish since then. Huh, who would've thought that can be done even with a bad D PG

[Turk Nowitzki]

EDIT: Never mind, I don't want to get into it

[BigO]

The two big problems going forward:

1) Creating offense. With KM, we had an elite shot maker and faciltator. Take that away and replace it with an inefficient offensive player and Bucks aren't left with enough offense.

2) Still worried about point of attack defense. The Bucks guards can't stay with good guards. Dame is bad at it and Prince isn't much better. Herro embarrassed him. Who is guarding Cleveland's guards?

[Dick Tate]

Those comments from Doc yesterday (?) made it sound like he’s pretty focused on getting Prince as much experience guarding SGs as possible before the playoffs. I think the starting 5 is going to stay as is from this point forward.

[Siefer]

You can see the bones of this thing. They need to be healthy going into the post season or the rest doesn't matter, but I'm slowly losing my mind with the Prince burn. If Horst cut him today it would noticeably improve the product on the floor and that's not a happy place to be in.

Prince is actually a great fit right now for this team as a bench small ball 4, especially with Bobby out. The issue is Doc starting him at SG over Green, who is not only more gravitational and a better guard defender, but also showing up in the best net rating lineups across the board with Dame/GA.

He's not even a good smallball 4! He can't rebound worth a lick, and he doesn't do the thing you need a smallball 4 to do on defense, which is play up.

[Mags FTW]

you guys the whole point of kuzma was to sacrifice khris' efficent scoring for a forward who could do all the other things like be athletic rebound and guard scoring wings without getting torched.

This, plus Kuzma will actually play 65+ games a year.

[Bernman]

The early returns have Kuzma's on/off at -3.3, so he's really just getting credit for the work other players are doing. He's defending, but negating that with terribly inefficient shooting on high volume.

It flipped to +2.9 last night, which shows it's silly to read into on/off #'s that aren't extreme in either direction over a small sample.

Thanks, just trying to hold him to the same standard Bobby Portis is held to.

When he had 2 and a half seasons of on/offs of -5+? Na, those 2 things were nothing alike.

[BigO]

you guys the whole point of kuzma was to sacrifice khris' efficent scoring for a forward who could do all the other things like be athletic rebound and guard scoring wings without getting torched.

This, plus Kuzma will actually play 65+ games a year.

To say KM was just an efficient scorer minimizes his ability to pass and rebound.

Kuzma is a better rebounder , but not by much. And don't downplay efficient scoring in the playoffs. It could be the Bucks downfall.

If Kuzma minimizes his shooting volume and sticks to his most efficient shots, he can be a good addition. It still leaves a void. But BP will help on the offensive end when he returns.

[jimmybones]

Prince was too big and slow to play at the 3. Starting him at the 2 is pure insanity to comical levels. Especially when Green and Trent as such obviously better fit options exist. It would improve the starting unit and the balance of the bench, multiple players would be moved into more coherent roles with the one move.

It's not Prince's fault, nothing against him and think he's totally fine and useful as a backup combo forward. Starting him, at SG, is genuinely frustrating me

[Wonka]

Prince was too big and slow to play at the 3. Starting him at the 2 is pure insanity to comical levels. Especially when Green and Trent as such obviously better fit options exist. It would improve the starting unit and the balance of the bench, multiple players would be moved into more coherent roles with the one move.

It's not Prince's fault, nothing against him and think he's totally fine and useful as a backup combo forward. Starting him, at SG, is genuinely frustrating me

I'm there too. It's more coaching malpractice from the king of that. AJ or Gary just make more sense, and to me, both of them are infinitely more important to the future of this team. We could pick up a version of Taurean Prince every year until Giannis retires. We need to find an actual starting 2-guard for the conceivable future, and give that player some confidence by starting and playing them consistently instead of forcing an injured TP to try to adapt. Doc is a joke. The results post deadline have been encouraging, but that guy is a disaster waiting to happen. His stubbornness is and has been an issue for a long, long time now.

[tydett]

Kuzgod

Is Kuz a new fan favorite? Would love to know the list of Bucks who can go 5-15 and get a positive nickname around here

Diary Bird
Dairy Trent Jr
Dairy Sanders
Nate The South Dakota Gentleman Wolters
"Brad" Jennings possibly neutral but definately not negative
Jon "I Got My Nine and My" McGlocklin
Dairy Trent Jr Sr (retro active)
Joe "Ghostface" Prezbilla (sp)

Somehow this post just kept getting better. True artistry.

[Wonka]

Is Kuz a new fan favorite? Would love to know the list of Bucks who can go 5-15 and get a positive nickname around here

Diary Bird
Dairy Trent Jr
Dairy Sanders
Nate The South Dakota Gentleman Wolters
"Brad" Jennings possibly neutral but definately not negative
Jon "I Got My Nine and My" McGlocklin
Dairy Trent Jr Sr (retro active)
Joe "Ghostface" Prezbilla (sp)

Somehow this post just kept getting better. True artistry.

Need a "Nine and my McGlocklin" shirt YESTERDAY

[tydett]

Prince was too big and slow to play at the 3. Starting him at the 2 is pure insanity to comical levels. Especially when Green and Trent as such obviously better fit options exist. It would improve the starting unit and the balance of the bench, multiple players would be moved into more coherent roles with the one move.

It's not Prince's fault, nothing against him and think he's totally fine and useful as a backup combo forward. Starting him, at SG, is genuinely frustrating me

I'm there too. It's more coaching malpractice from the king of that. AJ or Gary just make more sense, and to me, both of them are infinitely more important to the future of this team. We could pick up a version of Taurean Prince every year until Giannis retires. We need to find an actual starting 2-guard for the conceivable future, and give that player some confidence by starting and playing them consistently instead of forcing an injured TP to try to adapt. Doc is a joke. The results post deadline have been encouraging, but that guy is a disaster waiting to happen. His stubbornness is and has been an issue for a long, long time now.

Plus, there's an argument to be made that with both AJ and GTJ staggered, you can always have a dude who can just go unconscious from 3 on the floor - instead, they occupy the same spaces and their effectiveness is redundant playing in a lineup without great playmaking.

[-Jragon-]

you guys the whole point of kuzma was to sacrifice khris' efficent scoring for a forward who could do all the other things like be athletic rebound and guard scoring wings without getting torched.

This, plus Kuzma will actually play 65+ games a year.

To say KM was just an efficient scorer minimizes his ability to pass and rebound.

Kuzma is a better rebounder , but not by much. And don't downplay efficient scoring in the playoffs. It could be the Bucks downfall.

If Kuzma minimizes his shooting volume and sticks to his most efficient shots, he can be a good addition. It still leaves a void. But BP will help on the offensive end when he returns.

Giannis and Dame seeing their 3rd banana hustling to cover up for them and help them get extra buckets is priceless on this team

Having a 3rd guy that will humble himself and stand in the corner not calling for the ball is priceless on this team

Kuz can playmake and pass similar to KM so far..

I think Kuz gets to the ft line more than KM which is how you close playoff games

I dont mind the few 3s he tries since when he's off he attacks.. he's not a 1-6 or 1-7 from 3 kind of guy (we've had plenty of those)... I do expect him to figure out how to finish when guys try to rim check him and he can't use his bully move.. I suspect Giannis and Dame will give him some ideas to try because he'll have space to drive all game off superstar gravity.

[chonestown]

Diary Bird
Dairy Trent Jr
Dairy Sanders
Nate The South Dakota Gentleman Wolters
"Brad" Jennings possibly neutral but definately not negative
Jon "I Got My Nine and My" McGlocklin
Dairy Trent Jr Sr (retro active)
Joe "Ghostface" Prezbilla (sp)

Somehow this post just kept getting better. True artistry.

Need a "Nine and my McGlocklin" shirt YESTERDAY

<rocks a customized Mitchell & Ness with jersey number 9 and McGlocklin nameplate>
<throws down on a muenster and cheddar grilled cheese>
<hurls headset>

[Wonka]

This, plus Kuzma will actually play 65+ games a year.

To say KM was just an efficient scorer minimizes his ability to pass and rebound.

Kuzma is a better rebounder , but not by much. And don't downplay efficient scoring in the playoffs. It could be the Bucks downfall.

If Kuzma minimizes his shooting volume and sticks to his most efficient shots, he can be a good addition. It still leaves a void. But BP will help on the offensive end when he returns.

Giannis and Dame seeing their 3rd banana hustling to cover up for them and help them get extra buckets is priceless on this team

Having a 3rd guy that will humble himself and stand in the corner not calling for the ball is priceless on this team

Kuz can playmake and pass similar to KM so far..

I think Kuz gets to the ft line more than KM which is how you close playoff games

I dont mind the few 3s he tries since when he's off he attacks.. he's not a 1-6 or 1-7 from 3 kind of guy (we've had plenty of those)... I do expect him to figure out how to finish when guys try to rim check him and he can't use his bully move.. I suspect Giannis and Dame will give him some ideas to try because he'll have space to drive all game off superstar gravity.

It's great to be on board with any trade and support the team, which you are very clearly doing. But it's another thing entirely to continue to state things as objective truth regarding Kuzma when they just aren't true. Kuzma has shown to be most effective leading bench units. He struggles playing off of our stars so far since he's been used to iso ball in Washington for a while. He is nowhere near the playmaker Khris is, and he has most definitely been a 1-6 type of shooter from three since coming here. Both numbers and an eye test back these up.

Again, he's been great on defense, and his impact on some of our recent wins can't be ignored. Genuinely, he's been awesome on that end. But to continue to assert that he's been some sort of offensive wizard because he hit a couple of floaters last night is just untrue. He's been pretty underwhelming on that end, and that's fine for now, he has time. It's a lie to constantly assert the opposite.

[Shaffty]

you guys the whole point of kuzma was to sacrifice khris' efficent scoring for a forward who could do all the other things like be athletic rebound and guard scoring wings without getting torched.

Yeah, adjusting your expectations is necessary with Kuzma's role here. Thought we all agreed that the chances that he was ever going to replace Khris' offense was near zero. I never thought that he had this kind of defensive potential buried in him though, which is why I think most people hated the deal. But we aren't a Top-5 defense in basketball the last 9-games without Kuz and his consistent 35-minutes a night. This was always gonna be the trade-off we had to live with.

its like complaining about having to let the dog out every day.

If you are posting on this board watching every bucks game and you cant see the clear difference having altheticism even in bad players over khris has changed, idk what to tell you

[Prez]

Since the 2-8 start we’re tied with Minnesota for 6th in DRTG. 48 game sample size, with room to improve if Doc started Green instead of Prince.