Tune In: The Nick Smith Jr Thread

[SWedd523]

Agreed. Nick is looking like an 8th-10th man on a roster. Ready for this experiment to be over.

33/24 splits over his last 10. Abused defensively. Doesn't really bring anything at all if he's not hitting shots.

[JMAC3]

NSJ would probably be the 2nd biggest win on Charles Lee exit interview agenda, doesn't say much that people are ready to move on from him when he might be seen as a small bright spot from the season in terms of development.

Not that he has even been good numbers wise, but he has held off pretty much this entire list of players below from taking his minutes and he is the youngest on the list. He is clearly better than the loose change floating around in Wong, Baugh, Rhoden, WM types that Peterson has tried to strike oil with.

NSJ - 20 yrs old
Simpson - 22 yrs old
Mann - 23 yrs old
Wong - 23 yrs old
Wendell Moore - 23 yrs old
Baugh -24 yrs old
Rhoden - 25 yrs old
Malachi Flynn - 26 yrs old
Jeffries - 27 yrs old
Payton - 30 yrs old
Curry- 34 yrs old

NSJ is being miscast right now, his best role would be a Julian Strawther type where he is your 8th/9th man and some nights he is going to score 15+ and you likely win when he is "found money" other nights he is going to not do much and shoot 1/5 and be a complete non-factor. Guys like him in the league are taking up a lot of roster spots, no reason to move one when we have a bunch of dudes worse than him hanging around.

His February of 12 games averaging 14.7 ppg, 3 apg while shooting 34.5% from three and 53% TS if he played on another team would be a guy people would be wanting to trade assets for as a "buy low" guy. He has a lot of Tre Mann in him, who struggled to be a consistent player in this league. NSJ is 3 yrs younger, I would rather not have an OKC Tre Mann situation where we let him go to keep Damion Baugh and Malachi Flynn around instead.

Seth Curry didn't break into the NBA as a real player until he was 25 yrs old.

[fatlever]

Not sure I'm following your logic on that previous post jmac

I don't think Smith has shown an ounce of improvement this season under Lee, in fact his percentages have regressed across the board

Also I'm not sure from that list the point you're trying to make. He and KJ Simpson don't play the same position. And I would take kj going forward over Nick and a heartbeat. Mann has been injured all season so Nick Smith absolutely did not hold him off from taking his spot. Had mann been healthy all year Nick would still be in Greensboro Or at best holding mann's towel at the end of the bench. Seth Curry has easily been the better of the two players this season and the only reason Nick Smith junior is playing over him is simply because we're not trying to win. No coach in the right mind would play Nick Over Curry if they were actually trying to win basketball games.
The rest of the guys are all dudes on 10 day contracts Or G League fodder. The main reason Nick is playing is because we invested a first round pick and he's under contract for another season. They have to see what they have in him and give him every chance of development before making a decision. If he breaks out by the time he's 25 then fantastic. But there will be 30 other vague impressions of him rotated in the league by then.

[JDR720]

He's the youngest of our collection of guards, but he's a free agent after next season. Which means we have to re-sign him. Which probably means we'll have to pay him more.

And for what?

His ideal role is a 3pt specialist bench scorer. But we already have Mann for that job, and NSJ can't really play with Mann because of size/defense. So he's still capped at being the 9th/10th player on the rotation, if not lower.

He won't be replaced by the random G-League guys we have, he'll be replaced by our own draft picks, the Heat and Mavs picks, and our collection of 2nd round picks.

[JMAC3]

He's the youngest of our collection of guards, but he's a free agent after next season. Which means we have to re-sign him. Which probably means we'll have to pay him more.

And for what?

His ideal role is a 3pt specialist bench scorer. But we already have Mann for that job, and NSJ can't really play with Mann because of size/defense. So he's still capped at being the 9th/10th player on the rotation, if not lower.

He won't be replaced by the random G-League guys we have, he'll be replaced by our own draft picks, the Heat and Mavs picks, and our collection of 2nd round picks.

He is in year 2 of his rookie deal, Hornets can pick up his 4th year option and he is cheap for 2 more years. They are not close to having to decide whether to extend him or not.
His 4th year option is for 5 million, I think it would be pretty easy to pick that up right now given he is 20 yrs old and flashed some potential.

[JMAC3]

Not sure I'm following your logic on that previous post jmac

I don't think Smith has shown an ounce of improvement this season under Lee, in fact his percentages have regressed across the board

Also I'm not sure from that list the point you're trying to make. He and KJ Simpson don't play the same position. And I would take kj going forward over Nick and a heartbeat. Mann has been injured all season so Nick Smith absolutely did not hold him off from taking his spot. Had mann been healthy all year Nick would still be in Greensboro Or at best holding mann's towel at the end of the bench. Seth Curry has easily been the better of the two players this season and the only reason Nick Smith junior is playing over him is simply because we're not trying to win. No coach in the right mind would play Nick Over Curry if they were actually trying to win basketball games.
The rest of the guys are all dudes on 10 day contracts Or G League fodder. The main reason Nick is playing is because we invested a first round pick and he's under contract for another season. They have to see what they have in him and give him every chance of development before making a decision. If he breaks out by the time he's 25 then fantastic. But there will be 30 other vague impressions of him rotated in the league by then.

He is the 27th overall pick. Already appeared in 93 NBA games, with 23 starts. He ranks 23rd in pts, 22nd in minutes played from his draft class. As a guy that was one of the youngest players in his class- I guess the bar for keeping him around and what is successful is not the same for us.

I listed guys like Mann, Simpson and Curry because at age 20 they were all worse players than NSJ. NSJ is better player right now at age 20 then Simpson at age 22. Which is why he is playing more, even though this front office selected KJ and didn't have any ties to NSJ.

I don't really care about shooting percentages for him, because we are asking too much of him. The team around him sucks so it is more about the flashes for me.

His 6 best games this year, idk how you see a 20 yr old that was barely a first rounder in year 2 do this and only be focused on how fast you can move on from him.
24 pts on 9/16 shooting
23 pts on 9/15 shooting
19 pts on 7/13 shooting
19 pts on 7/12 shooting
19 pts on 8/13 shooting
18 pts on 7/12 shooting

but at the same time be in the corner of a 22 yr old who is shooting 33% from the field and 21% from 3 with pretty much zero full game flashes.

If you guys really want to chase him out of town so we can get the 48th pick in the draft they I guess go for it, but I am somewhat intrigued by what he has shown at times this year.

[yosemiteben]

He's dirt cheap and worth a roster spot IMO. We aren't exactly committing a lot by keeping him around.

[KembaWalker]

Yeah I mean, our entire roster at this point is "guys that would/could look a lot better around a bunch of talent" so obviously a lot them need the axe to make room for that talent if it ever actually arrives but half the roster is literal G-League replacement trash. perhaps including NSJ but i mean, at least replace the literal g league slop and Taj before axing first round draft picks for less than we paid

[fatlever]

He's dirt cheap and worth a roster spot IMO. We aren't exactly committing a lot by keeping him around.

When I say I'm kind of giving up on Nick, I'm not necessarily suggesting we cut him and throw him to the wolves, But I'm also not opposed to the organization deciding to not pick up the next team option that comes up.. I can't imagine he has much trade value but I am not opposed to moving him for a future second round pick or something. I don't think he should be in the rotation next year if we're trying to win. And I think we all agree that this summer the front office needs to either go all in to surround lamelo with some actual winning talent or move on from him. So assuming we tried it add some actual veteran legit basketball hoopers this summer through whatever means, then for me that means Nick goes back to where he started the season as the 12th man. There's just a limit to how many young players you can try to develop at the same time, If you're actually trying to field a competitive basketball team. If Nick is in our rotation next year, when everyone is healthy, then it's a signal that we're not a serious basketball team yet. Next year we're still going to be trying to develop salaun, a first round pick, probably a second round pick, and maybe kj/nick. That's four to five projects. Not to mention still trying to rehab Miller Grant and possibly mann Returning from serious injuries.

At some point the front office will have to prioritize developing other players over Nick. I'm just not sure he's shown enough this year to really justify sinking another year of gifting him minutes. At some point he has to earn those minutes to keep playing on a team that's hopefully going to be trying to win next year.

[luciano-davidwesley]

I'm sorry but with all due respect we would be so **** stupid if we didn't pick up his fourth year option for $4.89 million barring some crazy regression between October and now. That's basically vet min for the next 2 years for a 20 year old propsect who will in a worst case scenario project to be a Seth Curry level player.

Like what are we even doing here?

In a world where we can get off of Jeffries, Taj, Baugh, Moore Jr, Flynn etc etc why are we going after Nick as the guy we want to cut?

[JMAC3]

Feels like NSJ might be on the way out, previous regime pick. Roster crunch going on and we just traded for Sexton who pretty much is a better version of him. Along with maybe resigning Tre Mann.

I would probably be fine moving him for a future 2nd at this point and taking the roster spot.

[Bassman]

Feels like NSJ might be on the way out, previous regime pick. Roster crunch going on and we just traded for Sexton who pretty much is a better version of him. Along with maybe resigning Tre Mann.

I would probably be fine moving him for a future 2nd at this point and taking the roster spot.

I really hoped NSJ would develop. He was given lots of opportunities. He got a little better, but never gained consistency nor a quality tier we should continue investing in. Hopefully he’s part of the player group going out in a trade for a much needed center.

[Diop]

hopefully his shooting has made him intriguing as a trade chip. front office is still working.

[EmpireFalls]

Read on Twitter

?s=46

Farewell, sweet prince.

Not at all a fan of cutting him.

[fatlever]

nick getting waived

Read on Twitter

Fitting end to one of the dumbest trades in NBA history.
Wish Nick the best. He had a good attitude. But he simply had no role I could keep him on the court. Undersized microwave iso scorers who bring literally nothing else to the table generally don't pan out.

[yosemiteben]

Don't love this, but not sure what else to do with the current roster situation. He's still only 21.

[HornetJail]

nick getting waived

Read on Twitter

Fitting end to one of the dumbest trades in NBA history.
Wish Nick the best. He had a good attitude. But he simply had no role I could keep him on the court. Undersized microwave iso scorers who bring literally nothing else to the table generally don't pan out.

the final tally for Jalen Duren is:

2023 1st -> NSJ - waived
2023 2nd -> Amari Bailey - waived
2023 2nd and 2024 2nd -> traded move up for Bryce McGowens - waived
2023 2nd -> traded with another 2nd to move up for James Nnaji - never signed. traded rights in the Knicks salary dump

the James Nnaji return, which is more for the salary dump than his value, but screw it, since I'm already doing this trade tree:
DaQuan Jeffries - waived
Charlie Brown Jr - waived
Duane Washington Jr - tanked a preseason game seemingly on purpose - waived
2025 2nd - traded as part of the Richards/Okogie swap
2026 2nd - appears to have been swapped in that same trade?
2031 2nd

--

well done Mitch you **** hack

[Hornet Mania]

I get it, but I'd have rather kept him and cut one of the older guys.

It seems like we always 'develop' a guy for 2-3 years and then cut him before he ever manages to be halfway decent. NSJ looks less likely to pan out than someone like Monk but it's still a bad pattern.

[luciano-davidwesley]

Read on Twitter

?s=46

Farewell, sweet prince.

Not at all a fan of cutting him.

He's going to go somewhere and kill it as a sniper off the bench. Hornets fail

[luciano-davidwesley]

I get it, but I'd have rather kept him and cut one of the older guys.

It seems like we always 'develop' a guy for 2-3 years and then cut him before he ever manages to be halfway decent. NSJ looks less likely to pan out than someone like Monk but it's still a bad pattern.

We've developed him almost to the equivalent of a college junior or senior and taken the lumps of that development. Now watch him blossom elsewhere.