Varsho/Moreno Discussion Thread

Randle McMurphy · Post #1661 » by **Randle McMurphy** » Fri Feb 28, 2025 6:45 pm

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Extend him.

s e n s i · Post #1662 » by **s e n s i** » Sun Mar 2, 2025 7:32 pm

another majestic blast by the best player in this trade. wow.

bartron_44 · Post #1663 » by **bartron_44** » Sun Mar 2, 2025 10:29 pm

if shoulder surgery is what it takes for his bat to finally arrive from Arizona, so be it.

He may have a top 50 average bat speed type of swing, but Im still waiting for him to post an OBP north of .300, steal more than 16 bases, or hit more than 23 doubles. If he isnt going to hit 30-40 HRs to be a viable 5 thru 7 type of hitter, he needs get on base a lot more, hit 30+ doubles and steal 30+ bases to try and become a 1/2 type of hitter.

Id say the best possible comparison for Varsho is his mentor…. Kevin Kiermier. If he wants 20+ million per, not sure they should do that. That would be a lot
Of money on the 8 and 9 hitters. Even it they are great defenders.

If Vladdy was a nightmare to come to agreement on value with, Varsho could be even worse. His bat doesnt play anywhere so far but in the 8/9 hole as a defensive specialist. He doesn't get on base any where near enough to hit in the top 3, and he doesn’t get enough extra base hits (or hits in general) to hit in the middle of the order. Not on a team that wants to contend anyway.

Not only was Moreno a 3 hitter on a team that made it to the World Series, he was already a #3 hitter in the World Series. .. on a team with some good veteran hitters

s e n s i · Post #1664 » by **s e n s i** » Thu Mar 6, 2025 2:06 am

alejandro kirk, while not involved in the actual transaction itself, is the classic example of the player you keep being a great move for franchise. stud catcher on both sides of the ball this season, as expected.

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Mehar · Post #1665 » by **Mehar** » Fri Mar 7, 2025 1:33 am

Let's see how Kirk and Varsho play when the games matter in the regular season, before singing their praises in meaningless Spring Training games. If I recall correctly, both Varsho and Kirk had solid Spring Training games in 2023 and 2024 according to the Jays beat writers.

Then they were both disappointments with the bat in both years, with Varsho hitting below .200 for nearly 5 months of the MLB season in 2024, which is atrocious. If this team is out of it by the deadline, hopefully this organization has the sense to trade both Varsho and Kirk at the deadline with both their contracts expiring after 2026.

Varsho would be an asset to a legitimate contender where he can hit 9th and worry just about playing defense. Kirk can be a really good backup on a contender as well. Makes no sense to pay these guys big dollars if this team is out of it by the deadline, which I suspect they will most likely be due to the tough division they play in called the AL East.

Post #1666 » by **JaysRule15** » Mon Apr 28, 2025 3:56 pm

Well, Moreno and Gurriel have both been god awful to start this season. Moreno with the .224/.316/.254 (lol at the slugging) slashline with 0 homers and -0.2 WAR. Gurriel hitting .175/.200/.340 and -0.7 WAR. I don't think keeping them here would've helped our trash offensive start this season. That makes me feel a little better at least lol.

Hopefully Varsho can return to the lineup and bring a little power along with his excellent defence. Even if he hits .200, at this point I just want some homeruns and extra base hits. We have enough singles hitters on this team.

Randle McMurphy · Post #1667 » by **Randle McMurphy** » Tue Apr 29, 2025 3:44 am

JaysRule15 wrote:Well, Moreno and Gurriel have both been god awful to start this season. Moreno with the .224/.316/.254 (lol at the slugging) slashline with 0 homers and -0.2 WAR. Gurriel hitting .175/.200/.340 and -0.7 WAR. I don't think keeping them here would've helped our trash offensive start this season. That makes me feel a little better at least lol.

Hopefully Varsho can return to the lineup and bring a little power along with his excellent defence. Even if he hits .200, at this point I just want some homeruns and extra base hits. We have enough singles hitters on this team.

Lourdes will go on his usual hot streak to get his numbers passable soon enough I'm sure (unless he's truly washed this time).

Moreno just simply isn't a good hitter at all. Guy can't really get the ball out of the infield.

The Jays chose well.

Post #1668 » by **JaysRule15** » Tue Apr 29, 2025 4:00 pm

It's so weird about Moreno. I followed him all throughout the minors and he always had decent power potential. So much so that one point, the club was toying with the idea of making him a 1B just because how special his bat was. Then all of a sudden he just couldn't hit for power any more. Maybe those hand injuries he had took their toll or something.

bartron_44 · Post #1669 » by **bartron_44** » Tue Apr 29, 2025 8:05 pm

Im gonna blame his swing path for the lack of HRs..and he had 2 good weeks followed by 2 bad ones. I still like his chances of hitting better than Kirk this year.

However, regarding Kirk…if he doesnt figure it out at the plate, his new found arm strength isnt gonna matter very much from the bench. Tyler Heineman is coming for his job! I can admit I waz dead wrong before the season saying it was awful to even keep him on the team. All he has done is rake, and also perform well defensively. His OPS is literally over twice as high as Kirks so far. Its a SSS, hit sooner than later that drastic difference in production is going to start costing him playing time again. He couldnt beat out Jano the last couple years to be “the guy”, and now he cant beat out Tyler Heineman. ( Who to be fair is on an all time heater for him right now, but still.)

If TH suddenly turns into a good player, is that also going to mean trading Moreno was a good thing back then?

Randle McMurphy · Post #1670 » by **Randle McMurphy** » Thu May 1, 2025 2:10 am

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The kind of power Moreno can only dream of. What a trade.

Randle McMurphy · Post #1671 » by **Randle McMurphy** » Fri May 2, 2025 12:55 am

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Extend him.

Randle McMurphy · Post #1672 » by **Randle McMurphy** » Fri May 9, 2025 3:51 pm

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1st on the team in wRC+ and 4th among position players on our team in WAR (through only 7 games played).

brwnman · Post #1673 » by **brwnman** » Fri May 9, 2025 4:24 pm

Players ahead of Varsho in OPS+ since he joined the Jays (2023 + 2024 season)

Vlad
Bo
Springer
Davis Schneider
Kirk
Ernie Clement
Nathan Lukes
Will Wagner
Spencer Horowitz
Justin Turner
IKF
Danny Jansen
Leo Jimenez
Orelvis Martinez
Jonatan Clase
Whit Merrifield
Matt Chapman
Brandon Belt
Cavan Biggio (tied)

Trade him.

Randle McMurphy · Post #1674 » by **Randle McMurphy** » Fri May 9, 2025 4:33 pm

Players ahead of Daulton Varsho in WAR on the Jays since the start of 2023:

Vladimir Guerrero Jr.

Extend him.

Fairview4Life · Post #1675 » by **Fairview4Life** » Fri May 9, 2025 6:02 pm

Varsho is one of the few reasons to watch this team.

Randle McMurphy · Post #1676 » by **Randle McMurphy** » Sat May 10, 2025 3:14 am

Fairview4Life wrote:Varsho is one of the few reasons to watch this team.

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The main reason. Extend him.

Randle McMurphy · Post #1677 » by **Randle McMurphy** » Sat May 10, 2025 6:28 pm

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s e n s i · Post #1678 » by **s e n s i** » Sat May 10, 2025 6:36 pm

“the next pudge rodriguez”

bartron_44 · Post #1679 » by **bartron_44** » Sat May 10, 2025 9:54 pm

Randle McMurphy wrote:

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Gurriels 9 games in May:
.306/.342/.639. With 3 HRs, 3 2Bs and 10 RBIs and 7 SOs

Varsho’s first/last 8 games-
.231/.290/.615 with 3 HRs, 1 2B and 7 RBIs and 14 SOs.

Moreno’s 7 games in May:
.273/.304/.455 with 1 HR, 1 2B and 5 RBIs

Everyone can have a good week at the dish… and Varsho’s wasnt as good as Gurriels.

Randle McMurphy · Post #1680 » by **Randle McMurphy** » Sat May 10, 2025 10:41 pm

bartron_44 wrote:
Randle McMurphy wrote:

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Gurriels 9 games in May:
.306/.342/.639. With 3 HRs, 3 2Bs and 10 RBIs and 7 SOs

Varsho’s first/last 8 games-
.231/.290/.615 with 3 HRs, 1 2B and 7 RBIs and 14 SOs.

Moreno’s 7 games in May:
.273/.304/.455 with 1 HR, 1 2B and 5 RBIs

Everyone can have a good week at the dish… and Varsho’s wasnt as good as Gurriels.

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