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Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season

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Re: Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season 

Post#81 » by Muzbar » Tue Mar 11, 2025 5:49 am

Man, why didn't the Bulls pick Deni Avdija instead of Pat...

Big game from him today. 34 points, 16 rebounds and 6 assists. He's been great for Portland.
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Re: Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season 

Post#82 » by MrSparkle » Tue Mar 11, 2025 6:09 am

Muzbar wrote:Man, why didn't the Bulls pick Deni Avdija instead of Pat...

Big game from him today. 34 points, 16 rebounds and 6 assists. He's been great for Portland.


Probably could’ve traded a bag of Dorito's for him!
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Re: Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season 

Post#83 » by Ice Man » Tue Mar 11, 2025 11:52 am

Apropos of nothing, I found this cool reddit post, about a study showing that calling a timeout to stop an opposing team's hot streak has no effect. The author was surprised by his finding, so he hedges and waffles at the end. I don't think he should have, as from a data analyst's perspective (data analysis being my paid job), the null hypothesis is the logical starting point. That is what I would expect the case to be, barring convincing counterevidence.

https://www.reddit.com/r/nbadiscussion/comments/15xgmrb/why_nba_timeouts_are_way_less_important_than_they/?rdt=60039
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Re: Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season 

Post#84 » by cocktailswith_2short » Tue Mar 11, 2025 6:29 pm

Ice Man wrote:Apropos of nothing, I found this cool reddit post, about a study showing that calling a timeout to stop an opposing team's hot streak has no effect. The author was surprised by his finding, so he hedges and waffles at the end. I don't think he should have, as from a data analyst's perspective (data analysis being my paid job), the null hypothesis is the logical starting point. That is what I would expect the case to be, barring convincing counterevidence.

https://www.reddit.com/r/nbadiscussion/comments/15xgmrb/why_nba_timeouts_are_way_less_important_than_they/?rdt=60039
it's an outdated coaching tactic .
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Re: Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season 

Post#85 » by Ice Man » Tue Mar 11, 2025 9:32 pm

cocktailswith_2short wrote:it's an outdated coaching tactic .


Well, you know that I agree. I don't believe that most fans share our view, though.
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Re: Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season 

Post#86 » by Gant » Tue Mar 11, 2025 9:44 pm

cocktailswith_2short wrote:
Ice Man wrote:Apropos of nothing, I found this cool reddit post, about a study showing that calling a timeout to stop an opposing team's hot streak has no effect. The author was surprised by his finding, so he hedges and waffles at the end. I don't think he should have, as from a data analyst's perspective (data analysis being my paid job), the null hypothesis is the logical starting point. That is what I would expect the case to be, barring convincing counterevidence.

https://www.reddit.com/r/nbadiscussion/comments/15xgmrb/why_nba_timeouts_are_way_less_important_than_they/?rdt=60039
it's an outdated coaching tactic .


A few years ago Joe Mazzulla took a lot of of heat for not calling timeouts to stop runs by the other team. He often does call timeouts in this situation now.

There's a video interview in the article below from 2022. There were a lot more articles about this, as it was the subject of much discussion that season.

"I don't think there's actual real evidence that (calling timeouts during runs) works," Mazzulla said. "I think there's feel. And I think this is what people are used to seeing and how people have done it along the way. We were down 92-88 and I called one, we scored to go 92-90, and they went on another 6-0 run. So what did that timeout do besides get us down more than we were when I called it?


"But I'm not quite sure there's any real evidence that one way works and one way doesn't. I think it's more about what your team's comfortable with, and what you can get your guys to buy into and how well they respond."


https://www.nbcsportsboston.com/nba/boston-celtics/joe-mazzulla-explains-his-unique-timeout-strategy/279025/
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Re: Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season 

Post#87 » by kodo » Tue Mar 11, 2025 10:44 pm

Ice Man wrote:Apropos of nothing, I found this cool reddit post, about a study showing that calling a timeout to stop an opposing team's hot streak has no effect. The author was surprised by his finding, so he hedges and waffles at the end. I don't think he should have, as from a data analyst's perspective (data analysis being my paid job), the null hypothesis is the logical starting point. That is what I would expect the case to be, barring convincing counterevidence.

https://www.reddit.com/r/nbadiscussion/comments/15xgmrb/why_nba_timeouts_are_way_less_important_than_they/?rdt=60039


I assume the actual data was removed from the archived post, hard to comment without looking at what the post is talking about.

But I remember Phil Jackson also had the same philosophy and it was also puzzling most of the NBA back then. PJ didn't call timeouts to stop runs... and it's hard to argue all his rings.
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Re: Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season 

Post#88 » by kodo » Tue Mar 11, 2025 11:45 pm

Muzbar wrote:Man, why didn't the Bulls pick Deni Avdija instead of Pat...

Big game from him today. 34 points, 16 rebounds and 6 assists. He's been great for Portland.


It was almost a consensus that #4 should be either Haliburton or Avdija.
Somehow we managed to pick Patrick Williams from the 12 to 18 range.
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Re: Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season 

Post#89 » by ImSlower » Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:32 am

While we're on that - Tyrese Haliburton hit a crazy tough shot over Giannis, got fouled, and iced the game winner. Holy crap did I want the Bulls to reach and pick him. We stood Pat.
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Re: Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season 

Post#90 » by Dan Z » Wed Mar 12, 2025 9:21 am

ImSlower wrote:While we're on that - Tyrese Haliburton hit a crazy tough shot over Giannis, got fouled, and iced the game winner. Holy crap did I want the Bulls to reach and pick him. We stood Pat.


If AK picked Haliburton then that would've caused a domino effect. Would Haliburton help unlock Markkanen's potential? If so, does that mean no Vucevic trade? No Vucevic trade...do they keep Gafford?

With a different style of play do they decide not to pursue DDR? Or still try to get him?
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Re: Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season 

Post#91 » by Ice Man » Wed Mar 12, 2025 11:29 am

Gant wrote:A few years ago Joe Mazzulla took a lot of of heat for not calling timeouts to stop runs by the other team. He often does call timeouts in this situation now.


It takes stones for a new coach to buck the convention. Not only the fans, but also the players themselves will question him. So, I can see why Mazzulla has somewhat relented.

Phil Jackson, on the other hand, could give his team weed before a game and people would say, "Well, it's Phil, he has 11 rings. He knows what he's doing."
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Re: Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season 

Post#92 » by Ice Man » Wed Mar 12, 2025 11:34 am

kodo wrote:It was almost a consensus that #4 should be either Haliburton or Avdija.
Somehow we managed to pick Patrick Williams from the 12 to 18 range.


The mock draft consensus was Deni at #4, then Toppin, Hali, Killian Hayes, Okungwu, and Okoro at #10. Pat came in at #11.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2917825-bleacher-reports-final-2020-nba-mock-draft
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Re: Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season 

Post#93 » by MrSparkle » Wed Mar 12, 2025 1:45 pm

Ice Man wrote:
kodo wrote:It was almost a consensus that #4 should be either Haliburton or Avdija.
Somehow we managed to pick Patrick Williams from the 12 to 18 range.


The mock draft consensus was Deni at #4, then Toppin, Hali, Killian Hayes, Okungwu, and Okoro at #10. Pat came in at #11.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2917825-bleacher-reports-final-2020-nba-mock-draft


Ironically, drafting Hayes and releasing him after 3y would’ve been better than paying Pat $90m.

Then again, maybe AK would’ve paid Hayes $90m.
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Re: Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season 

Post#94 » by Ice Man » Wed Mar 12, 2025 2:11 pm

MrSparkle wrote:Ironically, drafting Hayes and releasing him after 3y would’ve been better than paying Pat $90m.


High draft picks can be dangerous, if they don't pan out, due to the sunk-cost fallacy. AK is hardly the only GM to struggle with that issue. The Wolves screwed themselves for years by overvaluing Andrew Wiggins. Not only was he their #1 pick, but they gave up Kevin Love to get him. So by God the Wolves were going to take care of Andrew. He would have year after year after year, at high pay, to show that he could get better.

A fat lot of good that did the Wolves!
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Re: Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season 

Post#95 » by Chi town » Wed Mar 12, 2025 2:29 pm

Ice Man wrote:
kodo wrote:It was almost a consensus that #4 should be either Haliburton or Avdija.
Somehow we managed to pick Patrick Williams from the 12 to 18 range.


The mock draft consensus was Deni at #4, then Toppin, Hali, Killian Hayes, Okungwu, and Okoro at #10. Pat came in at #11.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2917825-bleacher-reports-final-2020-nba-mock-draft


Deni is who I wanted before I put my blind trust in AK and his Pat experiment.
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Re: Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season 

Post#96 » by DASMACKDOWN » Wed Mar 12, 2025 2:30 pm

MrSparkle wrote:
Ice Man wrote:
kodo wrote:It was almost a consensus that #4 should be either Haliburton or Avdija.
Somehow we managed to pick Patrick Williams from the 12 to 18 range.


The mock draft consensus was Deni at #4, then Toppin, Hali, Killian Hayes, Okungwu, and Okoro at #10. Pat came in at #11.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2917825-bleacher-reports-final-2020-nba-mock-draft


Ironically, drafting Hayes and releasing him after 3y would’ve been better than paying Pat $90m.

Then again, maybe AK would’ve paid Hayes $90m.


The thing is Cleveland was in the same boat as us by picking Okoro.

But at least Cleveland self corrected by only bringing him back after the market dried and got him back at a reasonable rate.
Pat at 10 mil sounds alot better.
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Re: Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season 

Post#97 » by MrSparkle » Wed Mar 12, 2025 2:51 pm

Gant wrote:
cocktailswith_2short wrote:
Ice Man wrote:Apropos of nothing, I found this cool reddit post, about a study showing that calling a timeout to stop an opposing team's hot streak has no effect. The author was surprised by his finding, so he hedges and waffles at the end. I don't think he should have, as from a data analyst's perspective (data analysis being my paid job), the null hypothesis is the logical starting point. That is what I would expect the case to be, barring convincing counterevidence.

https://www.reddit.com/r/nbadiscussion/comments/15xgmrb/why_nba_timeouts_are_way_less_important_than_they/?rdt=60039
it's an outdated coaching tactic .


A few years ago Joe Mazzulla took a lot of of heat for not calling timeouts to stop runs by the other team. He often does call timeouts in this situation now.

There's a video interview in the article below from 2022. There were a lot more articles about this, as it was the subject of much discussion that season.

"I don't think there's actual real evidence that (calling timeouts during runs) works," Mazzulla said. "I think there's feel. And I think this is what people are used to seeing and how people have done it along the way. We were down 92-88 and I called one, we scored to go 92-90, and they went on another 6-0 run. So what did that timeout do besides get us down more than we were when I called it?


"But I'm not quite sure there's any real evidence that one way works and one way doesn't. I think it's more about what your team's comfortable with, and what you can get your guys to buy into and how well they respond."


https://www.nbcsportsboston.com/nba/boston-celtics/joe-mazzulla-explains-his-unique-timeout-strategy/279025/


I kind of want to interject and say that when Billy wouldn’t call TOs… there was obvious dysfunction as the other team found an easy way to exploit Vuc/Demar/Zach/Coby, and they kept hammering easy buckets while Bulls offense fell apart (i.e. mid and long range shots stop falling). It was worsened by Billy not breaking up the trio of doom.

Generally speaking, I agree that a lot of basketball coaching cliches are nonsensical and circumstantial (TOs to stop momentum, taking it to the rim and not settling, big minutes fatigue or injure players). Like, if your team can’t regularly take it to the rim, it means your offense sucks- it’s fairly easy for competent playmakers to get an easy PnR basket against any NBA defense these days, and players have a green light to shoot 3Ps like never before. So if the bad spacing and iso sets are incapable of creating baskets in the half-court, maybe don’t triple-down on your “all stars.”

And yeah, most good teams can stop a big run without huddling and reading their coach’s clipboard.
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Re: Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season 

Post#98 » by pipfan » Wed Mar 12, 2025 4:58 pm

DASMACKDOWN wrote:
MrSparkle wrote:
Ice Man wrote:
The mock draft consensus was Deni at #4, then Toppin, Hali, Killian Hayes, Okungwu, and Okoro at #10. Pat came in at #11.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2917825-bleacher-reports-final-2020-nba-mock-draft


Ironically, drafting Hayes and releasing him after 3y would’ve been better than paying Pat $90m.

Then again, maybe AK would’ve paid Hayes $90m.


The thing is Cleveland was in the same boat as us by picking Okoro.

But at least Cleveland self corrected by only bringing him back after the market dried and got him back at a reasonable rate.
Pat at 10 mil sounds alot better.

I'll admit, I liked PWill at the draft, and I like Deni too. Even Wiseman turned into a better pick, since GS dumped him.

PWill's deal is SOOOOO bad
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Re: Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season 

Post#99 » by Dan Z » Wed Mar 12, 2025 11:25 pm

"Jazz Fined $100,000 For Violating NBA's Player Participation Policy With Lauri Markkanen":

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/279623/Jazz-Fined-$100000-For-Violating-NBAs-Player-Participation-Policy-With-Lauri-Markkanen

The NBA has announced that the Utah Jazz organization has been fined $100,000 for violating the league’s Player Participation Policy. The violation occurred when the Jazz failed to make Lauri Markkanen, a star player under the Policy, available for the team’s game against the Washington Wizards on March 5 at Capital One Arena, as well as other recent games.
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Re: Around The NBA : 2024-25 Season 

Post#100 » by Muzbar » Wed Mar 12, 2025 11:54 pm

Dan Z wrote:"Jazz Fined $100,000 For Violating NBA's Player Participation Policy With Lauri Markkanen":

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/279623/Jazz-Fined-$100000-For-Violating-NBAs-Player-Participation-Policy-With-Lauri-Markkanen

The NBA has announced that the Utah Jazz organization has been fined $100,000 for violating the league’s Player Participation Policy. The violation occurred when the Jazz failed to make Lauri Markkanen, a star player under the Policy, available for the team’s game against the Washington Wizards on March 5 at Capital One Arena, as well as other recent games.

Fine isn't big enough, IMO.
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