2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V

[Ghost of Kleine]

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[Saberestar]

Mat Ishbia

"So what's the reason?" Ishbia said, rhetorically asking why the Suns have fallen so far short of expectations. "I don't have the answer. If I had the answer, I'd fix it right now.

"I still believe in our team. I still believe in Coach Budenholzer. I believe in the guys we have. And at the same time, at the end of the season, if we don't get to where we expect to get to, I'll have enough data and evidence that it didn't work or it did work. And then we'll make decisions based on that."

"It's been a really disappointing year. Very disappointed," Ishbia said. "There's not a person in the organization that doesn't feel that way. We had high expectations. We felt really good about where going into the season and we've not met any of those expectations. We've been well below what we all expected, and it's not anything close."

THERE IS ONE absolute certainty as the Suns approach what might be a summer of major change: Booker will not be traded.

"Never happen," Ishbia said, interrupting the question. "It's silly. So here's what I'll tell you: I have Devin Booker in the prime. In order to win an NBA championship, you got to have a superstar. You got to have a great player."

"It's surprising to me that other people, other fans, they actually like the rebuild process," Ishbia said, disdain dripping from his voice as the final word of that sentence comes out of his mouth. "Like, 'Oh, let's rebuild it.' Are you crazy?! You think I'm going to go for seven years and try to get there? You enjoy the 2030 draft picks that we have holding? I want to try to see the game today. I want us to win today, and we're going to try.

"Although let's say this doesn't work, guess what? Maybe next year we won't be as good, but we're going to try again. The next opportunity we have, we're going to try to win and compete. And it will work. We will win championships here in Phoenix. Might not be this year, but I promise you we are going to do it. And that's what we're focused on."

Barring a drastic late-season turnaround for the Suns, there is anticipation around the league that Phoenix will entertain trade offers for Durant again this summer.

"I'll just say that we're going to evaluate in the offseason," Ishbia said. "We're going to find a way to win, and it's probably a lot easier winning with Kevin Durant than without him. But at the same time, yes, if we're not good enough in this iteration of the Phoenix Suns, we're going to find a way to be better next year. "

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/44237621/next-kevin-durant-devin-booker-phoenix-suns

The article is much longer and I recommend to every fan to read it but I wanted to post some important excerpts.

[garrick]

Mat Ishbia

"So what's the reason?" Ishbia said, rhetorically asking why the Suns have fallen so far short of expectations. "I don't have the answer. If I had the answer, I'd fix it right now.

"I still believe in our team. I still believe in Coach Budenholzer. I believe in the guys we have. And at the same time, at the end of the season, if we don't get to where we expect to get to, I'll have enough data and evidence that it didn't work or it did work. And then we'll make decisions based on that."

"It's been a really disappointing year. Very disappointed," Ishbia said. "There's not a person in the organization that doesn't feel that way. We had high expectations. We felt really good about where going into the season and we've not met any of those expectations. We've been well below what we all expected, and it's not anything close."

THERE IS ONE absolute certainty as the Suns approach what might be a summer of major change: Booker will not be traded.

"Never happen," Ishbia said, interrupting the question. "It's silly. So here's what I'll tell you: I have Devin Booker in the prime. In order to win an NBA championship, you got to have a superstar. You got to have a great player."

"It's surprising to me that other people, other fans, they actually like the rebuild process," Ishbia said, disdain dripping from his voice as the final word of that sentence comes out of his mouth. "Like, 'Oh, let's rebuild it.' Are you crazy?! You think I'm going to go for seven years and try to get there? You enjoy the 2030 draft picks that we have holding? I want to try to see the game today. I want us to win today, and we're going to try.

"Although let's say this doesn't work, guess what? Maybe next year we won't be as good, but we're going to try again. The next opportunity we have, we're going to try to win and compete. And it will work. We will win championships here in Phoenix. Might not be this year, but I promise you we are going to do it. And that's what we're focused on."

Barring a drastic late-season turnaround for the Suns, there is anticipation around the league that Phoenix will entertain trade offers for Durant again this summer.

"I'll just say that we're going to evaluate in the offseason," Ishbia said. "We're going to find a way to win, and it's probably a lot easier winning with Kevin Durant than without him. But at the same time, yes, if we're not good enough in this iteration of the Phoenix Suns, we're going to find a way to be better next year. "

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/44237621/next-kevin-durant-devin-booker-phoenix-suns

The article is much longer and I recommend to every fan to read it but I wanted to post some important excerpts.

This part shows he's absolutely delusional and in a state of denial if he thinks we are anything more than an easy out in the first round like last season.

"If we get in the playoffs, I don't think that we're an easy out for anybody," Ishbia said.

Nothing this season has shown that we are capable of winning more than a single game in the playoffs if even that and we would be easily swept by any of the top 4 teams in the West.

Just spending an exorbitant amount of money has also never been a winning strategy in sports like the Cowboys and Knicks championship futility has shown us and Ishbia is on the cusp of being the joke of the league in the same manner that Jerry Jones and James Dolan have been for the past 3 decades. Until he realizes that some patience and smart player selection is key to winning we aren't winning a championship with him as owner.

[Saberestar]

The Timberwolves aggressively pursued Durant in trade talks before the deadline and are expected to circle the wagon again this summer, but were unwilling to part with star guard Anthony Edwards and versatile forward Jaden McDaniels in discussions, league sources told HoopsHype.

Instead, Timberwolves forward Julius Randle and guard Donte DiVincenzo were discussed as part of trade talks for Durant, league sources told HoopsHype.

Minnesota has now won 11 straight games Randle has played, and he has a $30.94 million player option for the 2025-26 season. DiVincenzo, meanwhile, is shooting 39.4 percent from three-point range this season and is averaging a career-high 3.7 assists.

It’s also worth noting that reigning Sixth Man of the Year Naz Reid drew interest from the Suns as part of the Durant trade talks, league sources told HoopsHype. Reid is expected to decline his $15 million player option for the 2025-26 season and enter unrestricted free agency this summer. Nonetheless, Minnesota hopes to re-sign Reid to a long-term contract, league sources told HoopsHype.

In the meantime, the playoffs will have massive implications for which direction the Suns, Timberwolves, and other teams will go this summer.

https://hoopshype.com/lists/nba-intel-kevin-durant-trade-talks-jimmy-butler-warriors-lakers-suns-timberwolves-nets/

Trash offer, obviously we said no lol.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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tweet]1900579349755224266[/tweet]

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[Ghost of Kleine]

Mat Ishbia

"So what's the reason?" Ishbia said, rhetorically asking why the Suns have fallen so far short of expectations. "I don't have the answer. If I had the answer, I'd fix it right now.

"I still believe in our team. I still believe in Coach Budenholzer. I believe in the guys we have. And at the same time, at the end of the season, if we don't get to where we expect to get to, I'll have enough data and evidence that it didn't work or it did work. And then we'll make decisions based on that."

"It's been a really disappointing year. Very disappointed," Ishbia said. "There's not a person in the organization that doesn't feel that way. We had high expectations. We felt really good about where going into the season and we've not met any of those expectations. We've been well below what we all expected, and it's not anything close."

THERE IS ONE absolute certainty as the Suns approach what might be a summer of major change: Booker will not be traded.

"Never happen," Ishbia said, interrupting the question. "It's silly. So here's what I'll tell you: I have Devin Booker in the prime. In order to win an NBA championship, you got to have a superstar. You got to have a great player."

"It's surprising to me that other people, other fans, they actually like the rebuild process," Ishbia said, disdain dripping from his voice as the final word of that sentence comes out of his mouth. "Like, 'Oh, let's rebuild it.' Are you crazy?! You think I'm going to go for seven years and try to get there? You enjoy the 2030 draft picks that we have holding? I want to try to see the game today. I want us to win today, and we're going to try.

"Although let's say this doesn't work, guess what? Maybe next year we won't be as good, but we're going to try again. The next opportunity we have, we're going to try to win and compete. And it will work. We will win championships here in Phoenix. Might not be this year, but I promise you we are going to do it. And that's what we're focused on."

Barring a drastic late-season turnaround for the Suns, there is anticipation around the league that Phoenix will entertain trade offers for Durant again this summer.

"I'll just say that we're going to evaluate in the offseason," Ishbia said. "We're going to find a way to win, and it's probably a lot easier winning with Kevin Durant than without him. But at the same time, yes, if we're not good enough in this iteration of the Phoenix Suns, we're going to find a way to be better next year. "

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/44237621/next-kevin-durant-devin-booker-phoenix-suns

The article is much longer and I recommend to every fan to read it but I wanted to post some important excerpts.

This part shows he's absolutely delusional and in a state of denial if he thinks we are anything more than an easy out in the first round like last season.

"If we get in the playoffs, I don't think that we're an easy out for anybody," Ishbia said.

Nothing this season has shown that we are capable of winning more than a single game in the playoffs if even that and we would be easily swept by any of the top 4 teams in the West.

Just spending an exorbitant amount of money has also never been a winning strategy in sports like the Cowboys and Knicks championship futility has shown us and Ishbia is on the cusp of being the joke of the league in the same manner that Jerry Jones and James Dolan have been for the past 3 decades. Until he realizes that some patience and smart player selection is key to winning we aren't winning a championship with him as owner.

Spot on assessment man! This delusional narcissistic idiot is pushing us into an unavoidable 20 year rebuild as he'll continue to moronically give away every draft asset we have while keeping us as a laughable punching bag for all of the rest of the league that aren't completely delusional!

This owner needs to be forcefully removed from his position and he and Isiah Thomas need to be permanently barred from the NBA and having any association with it indefinitely!!

This is a completely narcissistic and delusional mindset that will destroy our franchise for decades to come and the more he continues to compound these egregious decisions, the longer it'll take us to rise from the ashes of obscurity. Ishbia is truly much worse than even Sarver was. And will go down easily as the worst most incompetently delusional owner in Arizona and possibly NBA history too!

[Frank Lee]

Rah rah rah sis boom bah

The MadMatter speaks

[Ghost of Kleine]

Read on Twitter

[Calvin Klein]

It's sad that NBA teams all depend of the idiocy level of its owners. It's just that simple. And the Suns have one of the dumbest ones.

[Slim Charless]

I understand that you're trying to keep the duo of KD and Booker together because they've clearly been great together and Beal is where we really started messing up badly! But people need to get past the illusions that we'll somehow be able to trade Beal this summer. Beal has a "no trade clause that's iron clad and he has all the power in trades to approve or determine his outcome. Beal came here because he wanted to be here not only for the chance to contend, but also to be in an environment with warm sunny weather and close to California (where he's had houses and spends the summer with his family. He's already gone on record saying that he loves it here and wants to stay as does his family. So it's very very unlikely he'll approve any trades elsewhere. And especially not back to the last coast with their harsh winters and a depressing horrible rebuilding outcome with Philadelphia.

Now he might consider a Cali team due to spending his summers there and the nice warm weather, but even then, there'd still have to be mutual interest and I'm just not sure there's a team that has interest in Beeal for the money he's paid given his injury history, inconsistencies. No team is excited or intrigued by that contract or the idea of adding it. Also, Beal came here due to the connections with Bartelstein. So I don't see his agent helping convince him to leave either.

And I don't see any possibility of the Suns being interested in George for the money he's owed and how he's performed for Philly along with his injury concerns. They'd be trading an already horrible outcome scenario with Beal for an older, worse producing, appears to be completely washed player on a huge salary longer term deal than Beal has (if even only a year longer. Creative thinking to try and get off of Beals' contract, but I'd think the Suns would be prioritizing getting under the 2nd apron as a byproduct of any trade, and not being stuck in it longer until Booker's contract is up. Also again, I just don't see Bal approving any trades unless it's to one of the California teams or Miami. But not any others at all.

PG13 has an even longer contract than Beal...and is more injured. Philly needs to give us picks for him. Even for Beal

At least 1 really good one, if not two mid first value picks. I'd be looking at a fair value exchange of George/ Philly 26' 1st or LAC 28' 1st (no protections). Otherwise 26' 1st via OKC, HOU, or LAC/ PHI 28' 1st/ PHI 28' 2nd.

Would you do Jared McCain and PG13 for Beal? Gets us a PGOTF and with McCain and Maxey playing the same spot it's a little redundant for Philly.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

I agree this team can be better next season if we can turn Durant into pieces that fit. But contending? Seems like a pipe dream. If we get some picks and youth in the deal, I'll feel much better about it.

Bottom line is that if we don't offer Booker to HOU, we can't tank right now. So my wish list:

1. I will feel much better about this franchise's direction if we can get some quality youth in return, as well as pick or two. (After all, what player other than Booker on this roster will ever be worth a future pick?)
2. Please, do not trade any more unprotected future FRPs.
3. If we can save some money by trading Beal, fine. Otherwise, we will have to find a way for him and Booker to coexist on a functional roster.
4. Draft a point guard. I wanted Collier in last year's draft.

On that last point - GOK, are there any PG prospects with jets I might reasonably hope for? I really like CMB by the way. My comp is Paul Millsap based on the 4 minutes of highlights I watched.

A quiz for anyone still reading. Without looking it up, who do you think has the fourth-highest PPG for the Suns this season? The only hint I can give you is, it's a tight race!

[Saberestar]

Devin Booker

“I take pride in the community in Phoenix, the people that have supported me since I was 18 when things were ugly. And the people that are with us, we just fell short of accomplishing what we want. So I want to do it, and I want to do it here."

[Sunsdeuce]

Mat Ishbia

"So what's the reason?" Ishbia said, rhetorically asking why the Suns have fallen so far short of expectations. "I don't have the answer. If I had the answer, I'd fix it right now.

"I still believe in our team. I still believe in Coach Budenholzer. I believe in the guys we have. And at the same time, at the end of the season, if we don't get to where we expect to get to, I'll have enough data and evidence that it didn't work or it did work. And then we'll make decisions based on that."

"It's been a really disappointing year. Very disappointed," Ishbia said. "There's not a person in the organization that doesn't feel that way. We had high expectations. We felt really good about where going into the season and we've not met any of those expectations. We've been well below what we all expected, and it's not anything close."

THERE IS ONE absolute certainty as the Suns approach what might be a summer of major change: Booker will not be traded.

"Never happen," Ishbia said, interrupting the question. "It's silly. So here's what I'll tell you: I have Devin Booker in the prime. In order to win an NBA championship, you got to have a superstar. You got to have a great player."

"It's surprising to me that other people, other fans, they actually like the rebuild process," Ishbia said, disdain dripping from his voice as the final word of that sentence comes out of his mouth. "Like, 'Oh, let's rebuild it.' Are you crazy?! You think I'm going to go for seven years and try to get there? You enjoy the 2030 draft picks that we have holding? I want to try to see the game today. I want us to win today, and we're going to try.

"Although let's say this doesn't work, guess what? Maybe next year we won't be as good, but we're going to try again. The next opportunity we have, we're going to try to win and compete. And it will work. We will win championships here in Phoenix. Might not be this year, but I promise you we are going to do it. And that's what we're focused on."

Barring a drastic late-season turnaround for the Suns, there is anticipation around the league that Phoenix will entertain trade offers for Durant again this summer.

"I'll just say that we're going to evaluate in the offseason," Ishbia said. "We're going to find a way to win, and it's probably a lot easier winning with Kevin Durant than without him. But at the same time, yes, if we're not good enough in this iteration of the Phoenix Suns, we're going to find a way to be better next year. "

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/44237621/next-kevin-durant-devin-booker-phoenix-suns

The article is much longer and I recommend to every fan to read it but I wanted to post some important excerpts.

What a delusional s$&t show Ishbia is. He has no pieces to win with but thinks he’s going to fix the team next year by refusing to trade what he thinks is a superstar in Booker which by the way the rest of the league and nation wide fan base don’t think Booker is.

KD isn’t going to get Ishbia the same return that Ishbia gave up to get him. Beal will not wave his no trade and rightfully so. It’s not Beal’s fault Ishbia is a complete moron. No reason for Beal to up root his family to accommodate Ishbias ego and low IQ. Plus Beal has almost no market value.

Ishbia was suppose to be a gift to this organization, he just turned out to be Sarver dressed in sheep’s wool!

If you asked me what the worst possible scenario is for this organization is, my answer is this current roster, thr current assets in the cupboard and this owner is the worst possible scenario. Not good good enough to contend, not bad enough to get a great draft pick/traded away those picks anyways so not even possible to bottom out to improve by the draft, bad player contracts/overpaid, and a hard headed owner unwilling to admit problems! that’s the worst possible position any sport organization can possibly be in!!

[sunsbg]

Based on the expectations things are uglier in your prime, that's the problem, Book.

That's the future, float around play-in territory, with Booker as a leader and Ishbia as the owner.

[Saberestar]

What a delusional s$&t show Ishbia is. He has no pieces to win with but thinks he’s going to fix the team next year by refusing to trade what he thinks is a superstar in Booker which by the way the rest of the league and nation wide fan base don’t think Booker is.

KD isn’t going to get Ishbia the same return that Ishbia gave up to get him. Beal will not way his no trade and rightfully so. It’s not Beal’s fault Ishbia is a complete moron. No reason for Beal to up root his family to accommodate Ishbias ego and low IQ. Plus Beal has almost no market value.

Ishbia was suppose to be a gift to this organization, he just turned out to be Sarver dressed in sheep’s wool!

Regarding Beal, he said a few interesting things on that article that open the door to negotiate next to him on different trade options in the summer.

Like Durant, Beal had no interest in having his life uprooted with a midseason trade. But Beal, whose longtime agent, Mark Bartelstein, is the Suns CEO's father, is open to considering other possibilities this offseason.

"It is a different deal in the summer," Beal said. "Everything is kind of more laid out on the table. You got more options."

[Ghost of Kleine]

Read on Twitter

People out there thinking we'll be able to trade Beal or that he'll agree to be traded elsewhere.....lol

[Ghost of Kleine]

What a delusional s$&t show Ishbia is. He has no pieces to win with but thinks he’s going to fix the team next year by refusing to trade what he thinks is a superstar in Booker which by the way the rest of the league and nation wide fan base don’t think Booker is.

KD isn’t going to get Ishbia the same return that Ishbia gave up to get him. Beal will not way his no trade and rightfully so. It’s not Beal’s fault Ishbia is a complete moron. No reason for Beal to up root his family to accommodate Ishbias ego and low IQ. Plus Beal has almost no market value.

Ishbia was suppose to be a gift to this organization, he just turned out to be Sarver dressed in sheep’s wool!

Regarding Beal, he said a few interesting things on that article that open the door to negotiate next to him on different trade options in the summer.

Like Durant, Beal had no interest in having his life uprooted with a midseason trade. But Beal, whose longtime agent, Mark Bartelstein, is the Suns CEO's father, is open to considering other possibilities this offseason.

"It is a different deal in the summer," Beal said. "Everything is kind of more laid out on the table. You got more options."

That's just the typical agent speak/ lip service dude. Par for the course with no real change coming. It's to pacify certain groups frustrations nothing more. Come this summer everyone will see except of course Ishbia who's completely blind to the reality we're facing.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

Mat Ishbia

"So what's the reason?" Ishbia said, rhetorically asking why the Suns have fallen so far short of expectations. "I don't have the answer. If I had the answer, I'd fix it right now.

"I still believe in our team. I still believe in Coach Budenholzer. I believe in the guys we have. And at the same time, at the end of the season, if we don't get to where we expect to get to, I'll have enough data and evidence that it didn't work or it did work. And then we'll make decisions based on that."

"It's been a really disappointing year. Very disappointed," Ishbia said. "There's not a person in the organization that doesn't feel that way. We had high expectations. We felt really good about where going into the season and we've not met any of those expectations. We've been well below what we all expected, and it's not anything close."

THERE IS ONE absolute certainty as the Suns approach what might be a summer of major change: Booker will not be traded.

"Never happen," Ishbia said, interrupting the question. "It's silly. So here's what I'll tell you: I have Devin Booker in the prime. In order to win an NBA championship, you got to have a superstar. You got to have a great player."

"It's surprising to me that other people, other fans, they actually like the rebuild process," Ishbia said, disdain dripping from his voice as the final word of that sentence comes out of his mouth. "Like, 'Oh, let's rebuild it.' Are you crazy?! You think I'm going to go for seven years and try to get there? You enjoy the 2030 draft picks that we have holding? I want to try to see the game today. I want us to win today, and we're going to try.

"Although let's say this doesn't work, guess what? Maybe next year we won't be as good, but we're going to try again. The next opportunity we have, we're going to try to win and compete. And it will work. We will win championships here in Phoenix. Might not be this year, but I promise you we are going to do it. And that's what we're focused on."

Barring a drastic late-season turnaround for the Suns, there is anticipation around the league that Phoenix will entertain trade offers for Durant again this summer.

"I'll just say that we're going to evaluate in the offseason," Ishbia said. "We're going to find a way to win, and it's probably a lot easier winning with Kevin Durant than without him. But at the same time, yes, if we're not good enough in this iteration of the Phoenix Suns, we're going to find a way to be better next year. "

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/44237621/next-kevin-durant-devin-booker-phoenix-suns

The article is much longer and I recommend to every fan to read it but I wanted to post some important excerpts.

Thanks for posting this, Saber It was truly a great read.

Makes me wonder if I should pare back my critique of Ishbia's mindset and approach. Perhaps there is merit in it despite the results we've experienced so far.

We traded our unprotected '31 for three weak picks... but looking at the best players in the league today and where they were drafted, perhaps he's not crazy.

Jokic #41
Gilgeous-Alexander #11
Giannis #15
Tatum #3
Doncic #3
Curry #7
James #1
Mitchell #13
Cunningham #1
Wembanyama #1
Durant #2
Davis #1
Edwards #1
Towns #1
Brunson #33
Mobley #3
Booker #13
Jaylen Brown #3
Haliburton #12
Sabonis #11

I've underlined the guys we had the opportunity to draft, and bolded the one we did.

The evidence suggests that if you want a superstar, the #1 pick is great, a #2-3 pick gives you a shot, there tends to be chances in the late-lotto every other year, and you're not completely without hope in the second round.

Tanking won't be an option for several years. I'll tune in next season if they can be, at least, intriguing. Good luck, Mat.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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[Sunsdeuce]

All except two on this list of top 30 players in the league were drafted in the top 15 picks (most were drafted in the top 5) in their respective drafts. If you are counting on drafting a star with the 25th pic in the draft or a second round pick, well I have oceanfront property to sell you in Gilbert, Arizona right now. That’s delusional thinking.

Jokic #41
Gilgeous-Alexander #11
Giannis #15
Tatum #3
Doncic #3
Curry #7
James #1
Mitchell #13
Cunningham #1
Wembanyama #1
Durant #2
Davis #1
Edwards #1
Towns #1
Brunson #33
Mobley #3
Booker #13
Jaylen Brown #3
Haliburton #12
Sabonis #11

The point is Ishbia is a delusional moron. To be blunt.