What would DET need to add for Bam?

[meatwad4343]

Bam is very quickly becoming a bad contract. Detroit doesn't make that move

[Mavrelous]

Duren + Ivey is very close to Bam value, Pistons shouldn't pay more, will the Heat sell at Bam's current valuation is a different question, but they are very close to have to make a rebuild decision.

[Astaluego]

Reaves/Knecht /Hachimura+Lakers31+2 Swap
Would this be a competitive offer?


I don't think he's the player Detroit should sell the farm system for... I think they need a 4 who can shoot (Lauri?)

[oldncreaky]

Reaves/Knecht /Hachimura+Lakers31+2 Swap
Would this be a competitive offer?


I don't think he's the player Detroit should sell the farm system for... I think they need a 4 who can shoot (Lauri?)

I agree we need a 4 that can shoot. But looking at the salary cap over the next few years, it's got to be around the NTMLE range to work for longer than a season or two. Lauri is too expensive.

I'm a lot more interested in someone like Obi Toppin who is a good fit in terms of role/skills/salary

[fanforlife]

Detroit is a rising team with a very young core. This core includes Duren and Ivey, both of whom have had strong seasons until Ivey got hurt. I just don't see the Pistons trading any of their young core at this point. As said by others, their top need is a big shooting 4 and I suspect they will attempt to acquire one during the off season without sacrificing any of their young core.

[Laimbeer]

I do think a GM would be remiss if he overlooked the challenges that paying Bam $50-60M presented in terms of roster construction/maintenance.

Yeah, this is the real issue. How does DET want to allocate the cap. Realistically, until we see contention, you have to target staying under the 1st Apron at 126% of the salary cap.

At this point, I'll be shocked if Cade doesn't make all-NBA, so he'll be 30% of the cap next year. Ausar is a difference maker; a reasonable expectation is he'll be 25% of the cap in 2 years. Those 2 will clearly be paid first, and it doesn't really leave room for a third max salary.

Your last 7 spots are probably going to be filled with players making close to the minimum, amybe some late FRP rookie salaries, so allow 16%

126% - 30% - 25% - 16% = 55%

That leaves about 55% of the cap for 6 players (your last 3 starters, plus your first 3 off the bench). If you devote 30% to a third star like Bam, your starting line-up will have a couple of MLE-level salaries, and your bench will be either rookie contracts or vet minimums.

DET also has tricky decisions coming up over the next 15 months on Ivey and Duren, and Holland projects as a decent starter too. Beef Stew is on a flat MLE-ish deal, and Beasley will likely get a decent bench contract/extension this off-season. There's a good chance that some of those contracts will be better value than reaching for a third star at 30% of the cap.


TL;DR: if you add Adebayo to DET's cap sheet, it becomes really problematic to build out the roster without going well into 1st apron territory as soon as 2026-2027.

Bam will be making 48.7, 52.6, 56.5 the years after Ivey and Duren expire. Do you think they'll be less than that combined?

[tmorgan]

I do think a GM would be remiss if he overlooked the challenges that paying Bam $50-60M presented in terms of roster construction/maintenance.

Yeah, this is the real issue. How does DET want to allocate the cap. Realistically, until we see contention, you have to target staying under the 1st Apron at 126% of the salary cap.

At this point, I'll be shocked if Cade doesn't make all-NBA, so he'll be 30% of the cap next year. Ausar is a difference maker; a reasonable expectation is he'll be 25% of the cap in 2 years. Those 2 will clearly be paid first, and it doesn't really leave room for a third max salary.

Your last 7 spots are probably going to be filled with players making close to the minimum, amybe some late FRP rookie salaries, so allow 16%

126% - 30% - 25% - 16% = 55%

That leaves about 55% of the cap for 6 players (your last 3 starters, plus your first 3 off the bench). If you devote 30% to a third star like Bam, your starting line-up will have a couple of MLE-level salaries, and your bench will be either rookie contracts or vet minimums.

DET also has tricky decisions coming up over the next 15 months on Ivey and Duren, and Holland projects as a decent starter too. Beef Stew is on a flat MLE-ish deal, and Beasley will likely get a decent bench contract/extension this off-season. There's a good chance that some of those contracts will be better value than reaching for a third star at 30% of the cap.


TL;DR: if you add Adebayo to DET's cap sheet, it becomes really problematic to build out the roster without going well into 1st apron territory as soon as 2026-2027.

Bam will be making 48.7, 52.6, 56.5 the years after Ivey and Duren expire. Do you think they'll be less than that combined?

I’d guess close to the same. For 2 starters, not 1, so yeah, it matters.

[tmorgan]

Also worth noting that we already have an undersized defensive specialist center that can shoot a little for 15 mil a year in Stew. Sure, Bam has way better hands and is a way better facilitator, but I’m not paying an extra 35-40 mil for that. We don’t use Stewart as a shooter much now, and I don’t see why that’d change for Adebayo.

Just not the right way to spend our cap.

[DetroitDon15]

Also worth noting that we already have an undersized defensive specialist center that can shoot a little for 15 mil a year in Stew. Sure, Bam has way better hands and is a way better facilitator, but I’m not paying an extra 35-40 mil for that. We don’t use Stewart as a shooter much now, and I don’t see why that’d change for Adebayo.

Just not the right way to spend our cap.

Pretty much agree with you on this point. If the Pistons wanted to utilize an undersized 5, I agree Stew makes the most sense. I still think that Stew is a better option at the 5 long term than Duren. If I could move Duren for a shooting four, I’d do it. I can’t think of one guy available for the Pistons.

If the Pistons move Ivey and Duren in the same deal, I’d want a legit second option at the two next to Cade who can shoot. I’d be perfectly happy to have Stew at the 5. Unless you have a guy like the Joker or AD, I don’t want to max a limited player like Bam. I like Bam but the current Pistons roster does have shooters who compliment Bam’s game.

[tmorgan]

I don’t know if either Duren or Stewart are ready for 34 minutes a game. Keeping them both around for a while makes more sense.

[BBallFreak]

Miami's going to pass. As mentioned, Bam is Heat culture. We're not tearing it down for this.

I think Ware would be a better target...
he fits the timeline better, and overall,
I think a center who can space the floor would do wonders for the Pistons...
Duren to the LAKERS (to get value)...
Knecht (Who, by the way, I also think is a great fit for the Pistons) + Lakers 31 to the PISTONS...

Ivey + Lakers 31 for Ware...
Is this an attractive enough offer for Miami or do they need to send another FRP?

I don't think there's anything you're going to give us that gets Ware out of Miami. Just logically speaking, it makes no sense. You don't give up a cost controlled rookie with that kind of potential unless it's in a package for a star player.

[tmorgan]

Miami's going to pass. As mentioned, Bam is Heat culture. We're not tearing it down for this.

I think Ware would be a better target...
he fits the timeline better, and overall,
I think a center who can space the floor would do wonders for the Pistons...
Duren to the LAKERS (to get value)...
Knecht (Who, by the way, I also think is a great fit for the Pistons) + Lakers 31 to the PISTONS...

Ivey + Lakers 31 for Ware...
Is this an attractive enough offer for Miami or do they need to send another FRP?

I don't think there's anything you're going to give us that gets Ware out of Miami. Just logically speaking, it makes no sense. You don't give up a cost controlled rookie with that kind of potential unless it's in a package for a star player.

Wrong in other ways, too. Why would Detroit trade Duren for a shooter and a pick of dubious value?

The net result of these two deals is Duren and Ivey for Ware and Knecht. That’s just bad. And since Miami doesn’t like it either, that’s just the Lakers robbing everyone blind.

[Astaluego]

Miami's going to pass. As mentioned, Bam is Heat culture. We're not tearing it down for this.

I think Ware would be a better target...
he fits the timeline better, and overall,
I think a center who can space the floor would do wonders for the Pistons...
Duren to the LAKERS (to get value)...
Knecht (Who, by the way, I also think is a great fit for the Pistons) + Lakers 31 to the PISTONS...

Ivey + Lakers 31 for Ware...
Is this an attractive enough offer for Miami or do they need to send another FRP?

I don't think there's anything you're going to give us that gets Ware out of Miami. Just logically speaking, it makes no sense. You don't give up a cost controlled rookie with that kind of potential unless it's in a package for a star player.

Wrong in other ways, too. Why would Detroit trade Duren for a shooter and a pick of dubious value?

The net result of these two deals is Duren and Ivey for Ware and Knecht. That’s just bad. And since Miami doesn’t like it either, that’s just the Lakers robbing everyone blind.

Wouldn't you trade Duren/Ivey for Ware/Knecht? Honestly, I think the Pistons would be a better team... I really like Cade, and I've been following the Pistons a bit lately. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the strong core to build around is... Cade/Thompson/Holland... and Stewart off the bench... right? I thought surrounding those guys with the maximum number of shots would be the way to go.

[tmorgan]

Miami's going to pass. As mentioned, Bam is Heat culture. We're not tearing it down for this.

I think Ware would be a better target...
he fits the timeline better, and overall,
I think a center who can space the floor would do wonders for the Pistons...
Duren to the LAKERS (to get value)...
Knecht (Who, by the way, I also think is a great fit for the Pistons) + Lakers 31 to the PISTONS...

Ivey + Lakers 31 for Ware...
Is this an attractive enough offer for Miami or do they need to send another FRP?

I don't think there's anything you're going to give us that gets Ware out of Miami. Just logically speaking, it makes no sense. You don't give up a cost controlled rookie with that kind of potential unless it's in a package for a star player.

Wrong in other ways, too. Why would Detroit trade Duren for a shooter and a pick of dubious value?

The net result of these two deals is Duren and Ivey for Ware and Knecht. That’s just bad. And since Miami doesn’t like it either, that’s just the Lakers robbing everyone blind.

The only thing good about that exchange is the rookie deals resetting by two years each. Yes, that would be helpful.

You can argue about Duren vs. Ware, I suppose.

Ware is six months younger and two years less experienced, 51 games at 21 mpg, 8.7/6.6/0.9/0.6/1.1, 17.1 PER, 2.8 WS, -0.3 BPM.
Duren’s in his third year but started as the youngest in the league. 67g at 26 mpg, 11.4/10.3/2.5/0.7/1.1, 21.1 PER, 7.9 WS, 2.9 BPM.

I assume Ware is the considerably better defender — the lack of fouls as a rook is impressive. Duren’s the better athlete, better rebounder, better space creator. Ware can go over you, Duren can go over or through you. Duren’s a better passer, highly underrated in that way. The big thing is that Ware has range, but 31% from 3 at under 2 attempts per game isn’t much of a weapon — yet.

That exchange would clearly make us worse in the short run. If you believe Ware is the next Myles Turner, I won’t argue, but this is a current sacrifice on the court to save some money and wait for development. Even then, Duren is a truly elite lob finisher and moves better than Ware, and Cade utilizes it extremely well. I wouldn’t expect Miami to be excited to exchange them, but Detroit isn’t, either. Neutral at best.

I won’t do as big a write-up on Knecht and Ivey. That’s not even close. Knecht can shoot and… that’s it. He contributes nothing else. Ivey can also shoot, drive, finish in transition, pass, etc. Neither is a good defender. The only benefit here is salary savings. Heck, Ivey’s actually younger. This part is terrible.

You’d have to really believe Ware is a future monster to even consider this.

[tmorgan]

We don’t know what the “core” is, by the way. Cade and Ausar, almost certainly. Ivey, Stewart, Duren and Holland are the other candidates, but it’s tbd.

[oldncreaky]

We don’t know what the “core” is, by the way. Cade and Ausar, almost certainly. Ivey, Stewart, Duren and Holland are the other candidates, but it’s tbd.

Completely agree

Even a single playoff series, and how they react the summer following, can be very revealing for young players. Did they improve as the series progressed? Are they driven to improve? Are they complacent?