PG: Thibs B Gone

[nedleeds]

The people calling Thibs a good coach given he hasn't done anything relevant since his 1st year in Chicago are just baffling. He won fake coach of the year when all other coaches and players mailed it in to covid. And made a conference final his first year with MVP Derrick Rose. That's it. Few other failures like him have been given this much runway. He's still here because he's a CAA client. This entire roster and all the moves are just a mediocre money laundering operation to either pay, or puff and pay CAA clients. That's it.

[god shammgod]

I knew Thibodeau would at some point be a problem when he had Frank sit every minute of a playoff game until the final possession of the game to defend Trae Young on the final possession.

Thibodeau makes no adjustments throughout games, and when it comes to substitutions he only plays bench players against bench players, and starters against starters.

Forced Quickley to be a point guard, when he was more productive getting his instead of having to make sure everyone got their points.

This man waited until Game 3 of the Playoffs to finally take Elfrid Payton out of the starting lineup.

this is not a serious place

[3toheadmelo]

Wait, I wouldnt go that far, this team has Brunson

That team had Prime Melo too lol

They gave prime Melo a broken down Amare, washed vets, knucklehead JR Smith but the problem was Woodson switched too much and Melo did too much iso. The triangle and a young modern coach Derek Fisher would fix that.

And then we tried to fix that mistake with another modern coach in Jeff hornacek. What the fans want never works.

[god shammgod]

for me, i'm not arguing for or against thibs. i'm arguing that no coach can fix the problems this roster has. the constant harping on thibs is a distraction from the real issues.

[3toheadmelo]

for me, i'm not arguing for or against thibs. i'm arguing that no coach can fix the problems this roster has. the constant harping on thibs is a distraction to the real issues.

If we swapped coaches with Boston they’re still sweeping us

[JayTWill]

Is it possible that the team is not a championship contender with or without Thibs but they still need to move on from Thibs since he is not maximizing the current team or helping to develop the players for the future? What is the point of keeping Thibs around? To grind the players down so we are sitting here with a bunch of expensive broken down vets and underdeveloped youth? What are the positives of keeping Thibs?

This is so false. How many “for the first time in franchise history” or “for the first time in x amount of years” have we gotten out of this group this season? Whether individual or team accomplishments there’s been a bunch of things this group has done that hasn’t been done for a long time in franchise history. They are obviously being maxed out. I’m not sure what else you are looking for out of a group that isn’t a contender. You can’t say they aren’t a contender then at the same time expect contender like results. Otherwise they would be a contender.

And if development was really a priority then the front office shouldn’t have punted on so many draft picks. First of all there is a league for development, it’s literally called the development league aka DLeague aka the GLeague. That’s where you can develop your rookies who need it and aren’t ready.

What are the positives of keeping this team? If you come to terms they aren’t contender why are you focusing on the coach instead of asking for actual roster changes? If you know the roster isn’t good enough then what’s the point of it? What are the positives?

I have no clue what you are talking about as far as "the first time in franchise history" as if that means something. You don't think this years' team could be better in any possible way?

Do you believe this team has a chance to contend this year? If not what is the point of playing the starters so many minutes, shortening the rotation and not playing the young guys while investing time in guys that probably won't be here next year? Is Thibs building something going forward that I just can't see?

I'm very open to roster changes but i'm not exactly sure how they do that now and get better? By selling low on Mikal after overpaying for him? Admitting that KAT is a bad fit at the 5 but hoping someone else likes him at the 5 after Thibs wears his body down? Trading the young guys with no value that have been glued to the bench all year so many people are assuming they suck? Hoping that some quality player is watching how Thibs uses his bench and wants to come play his beautiful brand of basketball for the vet min or the small taxpayer MLE that they couldn't find anyone with last summer?

The entire roster has changed since his first playoff appearance in year 1 and almost all of the youth and draft picks have been traded away yet the team may still get bounced in round 1 just like it did 5 years ago.

[HEZI]

for me, i'm not arguing for or against thibs. i'm arguing that no coach can fix the problems this roster has. the constant harping on thibs is a distraction to the real issues.

If we swapped coaches with Boston they’re still sweeping us

Joe Mazzulla after trying to find a defensive scheme that works for KAT

[Capn'O]

for me, i'm not arguing for or against thibs. i'm arguing that no coach can fix the problems this roster has. the constant harping on thibs is a distraction from the real issues.

You can just say they need to trade KAT


From my vantage point, I was always skeptical on this reunion but wanted to give them the year and it's still clunky. So you either move KAT or fire Thibs and try to get a guy who can maximize this group offensively.

And they're not moving KAT.

[Red Vines]

Dolan on the Roommates podcast said the next step is for this team to grow together with the coach...so Rose needs to decide pretty quickly if Thibs is still the long-term answer. I think the obvious answer is no.

[GettinitDone]

This is also NO schedule loss

The 72 win Bulls team had schedule losses to Nuggets and expansion Raptors team, but in losses the Bulls showed fight, the Nugz and Rapz just had to play a PERFECT game to pull off the Ws

There's NO PERFECT GAME needed for the Hornets to beat us, they hardly even tried and they had a double digit lead in 1st QUARTER

We will be swept in the 1st round by a lower seed at this rate and maybe 1st time in NBA history Vegas would put us the higher seed as the underdogs in the 1st round

for me, i'm not arguing for or against thibs. i'm arguing that no coach can fix the problems this roster has. the constant harping on thibs is a distraction from the real issues.

Like "no coach could fix the Cavs"?? The Cavs fans were discussing whether they should trade Garland, DMitch, or Allen, and rebuild around Mobley... and look where they are

JJ Redick transformed the horrible Lakers even before the Luka trade

[3toheadmelo]

for me, i'm not arguing for or against thibs. i'm arguing that no coach can fix the problems this roster has. the constant harping on thibs is a distraction to the real issues.

If we swapped coaches with Boston they’re still sweeping us

Joe Mazzulla after trying to find a defensive scheme that works for KAT

[god shammgod]

for me, i'm not arguing for or against thibs. i'm arguing that no coach can fix the problems this roster has. the constant harping on thibs is a distraction from the real issues.

You can just say they need to trade KAT


From my vantage point, I was always skeptical on this reunion but wanted to give them the year and it's still clunky. So you either move KAT or fire Thibs and try to get a guy who can maximize him offensively.

And they're not moving KAT.

no. that won't fix everything. and you'd have to replace him with a guy who scores like a 2nd option, can hit the 3 and plays passable defense. you'd still have no bench. you'd need a 2nd play maker, another center and probably a big backup wing.

plus he costs so much that very few teams would be that interested. the wolves just traded him and our offer was the best they could get. he's now a year older, more expensive and has further been exposed for his defensive deficiencies. so trading him for what you need in return would be hard.

has he not been maximized offensively ? he's having one of his best statistical years. what more do you think there is ? he'll be 30 later this year. there's nothing more to unlock.

[HEZI]

Is it possible that the team is not a championship contender with or without Thibs but they still need to move on from Thibs since he is not maximizing the current team or helping to develop the players for the future? What is the point of keeping Thibs around? To grind the players down so we are sitting here with a bunch of expensive broken down vets and underdeveloped youth? What are the positives of keeping Thibs?

This is so false. How many “for the first time in franchise history” or “for the first time in x amount of years” have we gotten out of this group this season? Whether individual or team accomplishments there’s been a bunch of things this group has done that hasn’t been done for a long time in franchise history. They are obviously being maxed out. I’m not sure what else you are looking for out of a group that isn’t a contender. You can’t say they aren’t a contender then at the same time expect contender like results. Otherwise they would be a contender.

And if development was really a priority then the front office shouldn’t have punted on so many draft picks. First of all there is a league for development, it’s literally called the development league aka DLeague aka the GLeague. That’s where you can develop your rookies who need it and aren’t ready.

What are the positives of keeping this team? If you come to terms they aren’t contender why are you focusing on the coach instead of asking for actual roster changes? If you know the roster isn’t good enough then what’s the point of it? What are the positives?

I have no clue what you are talking about as far as "the first time in franchise history" as if that means something. You don't think this years' team could be better in any possible way?

Do you believe this team has a chance to contend this year? If not what is the point of playing the starters so many minutes, shortening the rotation and not playing the young guys while investing time in guys that probably won't be here next year? Is Thibs building something going forward that I just can't see?

I'm very open to roster changes but i'm not exactly sure how they do that now and get better? By selling low on Mikal after overpaying for him? Admitting that KAT is a bad fit at the 5 but hoping someone else likes him at the 5 after Thibs wears his body down? Trading the young guys with no value that have been glued to the bench all year so many people are assuming they suck? Hoping that some quality player is watching how Thibs uses his bench and wants to come play his beautiful brand of basketball for the vet min or the small taxpayer MLE that they could find anyone with last summer?

The entire roster has changed since his first playoff appearance in year 1 and almost all of the youth and draft picks have been traded away yet the team may still get bounced in round 1 just like it did 5 years ago.

Nope they can’t be better. With every rotation “solution” a new problem is created so while you think you fixed one thing you do so by breaking something else. That’s because the roster is constructed in such a way that coaching won’t fix the issues.

Nope they don’t have a chance to contend. Thibs is doing his job which is to coach to win every game. That’s what he gets paid to do with each paycheck. He’s not the GM or trainer or doctor or all these other things you believes a coach is responsible for, he just coaches.

The roster will have to be fixed by the same guy who put the team together. At least roster changes are realistic. Expecting an NBA coach to teach these soon to be 30 year olds how to shoot, dribble and defend at this stage in their careers and fix all the problems with the team is unrealistic.

[Clyde_Style]

for me, i'm not arguing for or against thibs. i'm arguing that no coach can fix the problems this roster has. the constant harping on thibs is a distraction from the real issues.

You can just say they need to trade KAT


From my vantage point, I was always skeptical on this reunion but wanted to give them the year and it's still clunky. So you either move KAT or fire Thibs and try to get a guy who can maximize this group offensively.

And they're not moving KAT.

Exactly. They're not going to eat bitter on KAT, so it will be Thibs. That does not make Thibs a scapegoat. He deserves to be removed. He can't handle this. It is simply a necessary remedy to working with the personnel we've got or will have alongside Brunson and KAT, because Thibs cannot adjust to make them work.

Per Sham, this is not a binary equation. There can be both roster issues and coaching issues. And they may have to fix both. One issue does not negate the other.

Minny had Gobert next to KAT and they made it work. Whether it is Mitch or anyone else at C, this team will need a starting Center to let KAT play the 4 and a coach who understands how to maximize that arrangement.

[WaltFrazier]

for me, i'm not arguing for or against thibs. i'm arguing that no coach can fix the problems this roster has. the constant harping on thibs is a distraction from the real issues.

You can just say they need to trade KAT


From my vantage point, I was always skeptical on this reunion but wanted to give them the year and it's still clunky. So you either move KAT or fire Thibs and try to get a guy who can maximize him offensively.

And they're not moving KAT.

no. that won't fix everything. and you'd have to replace him with a guy who scores like a 2nd option, can hit the 3 and plays passable defense. you'd still have no bench. you'd need a 2nd play maker, another center and probably a big backup wing.

plus he costs so much that very few teams would be that interested. the wolves just traded him and our offer was the best they could get. he's now a year older, more expensive and has further been exposed for his defensive deficiencies. so trading him for what you need in return would be hard.

has he not been maximized offensively ? he's having one of his best statistical years. what more do you think there is ? he'll be 30 later this year. there's nothing more to unlock.

I'd say no he hasn't been maximized, in the sense that the offense doesn't get him enough easy looks. He has to work so hard to drive through traffic so often. And in many stretches he just doesn't get touches, especially when JB was playing. A different offense could get more out of him.

Agree with the rest of your points

[ctorres]

Read on Twitter

[Jay10]

I knew Thibodeau would at some point be a problem when he had Frank sit every minute of a playoff game until the final possession of the game to defend Trae Young on the final possession.

Thibodeau makes no adjustments throughout games, and when it comes to substitutions he only plays bench players against bench players, and starters against starters.

Forced Quickley to be a point guard, when he was more productive getting his instead of having to make sure everyone got their points.

This man waited until Game 3 of the Playoffs to finally take Elfrid Payton out of the starting lineup.

this is not a serious place

i was just using an example of him having no sense of flow throughout games.

No head coach would take a player that was sitting on the bench for 47+ minutes and put them into a game and expect a positive outcome on the last possession to get a stop on the defensive end.

I could've used him waiting until Fournier getting injured when everyone knew Grimes should've been starting.

Elfrid starting in the playoffs when he could've had Derrick or Alec Burks, instead of waiting until Game 3 to make the change.

Obi should've gotten more minutes in the playoffs in his rookie season.

Instead of forcing Quickley to be a PG, he could've used RJ as the PG and allow Quickley to just worry about scoring.

[JBreezeNY]

This is also NO schedule loss

The 72 win Bulls team had schedule losses to Nuggets and expansion Raptors team, but in losses the Bulls showed fight, the Nugz and Rapz just had to play a PERFECT game to pull off the Ws

There's NO PERFECT GAME needed for the Hornets to beat us, they hardly even tried and they had a double digit lead in 1st QUARTER

We will be swept in the 1st round by a lower seed at this rate and maybe 1st time in NBA history Vegas would put us the higher seed as the underdogs in the 1st round

for me, i'm not arguing for or against thibs. i'm arguing that no coach can fix the problems this roster has. the constant harping on thibs is a distraction from the real issues.

Like "no coach could fix the Cavs"?? The Cavs fans were discussing whether they should trade Garland, DMitch, or Allen, and rebuild around Mobley... and look where they are

JJ Redick transformed the horrible Lakers even before the Luka trade

Nah this is facts there was a HUGE discourse about getting rid of either Donovan or Garland and how Allen was hurting the team as well.

I’m not trying to hear this sh*t that this team is unfixable, that’s cap.

[JBreezeNY]

for me, i'm not arguing for or against thibs. i'm arguing that no coach can fix the problems this roster has. the constant harping on thibs is a distraction from the real issues.

You can just say they need to trade KAT


From my vantage point, I was always skeptical on this reunion but wanted to give them the year and it's still clunky. So you either move KAT or fire Thibs and try to get a guy who can maximize him offensively.

And they're not moving KAT.

no. that won't fix everything. and you'd have to replace him with a guy who scores like a 2nd option, can hit the 3 and plays passable defense. you'd still have no bench. you'd need a 2nd play maker, another center and probably a big backup wing.

plus he costs so much that very few teams would be that interested. the wolves just traded him and our offer was the best they could get. he's now a year older, more expensive and has further been exposed for his defensive deficiencies. so trading him for what you need in return would be hard.

has he not been maximized offensively ? he's having one of his best statistical years. what more do you think there is ? he'll be 30 later this year. there's nothing more to unlock.

Respectfully Shamm, this is cap. He has not been utilized correctly even with his numbers.

[god shammgod]

You can just say they need to trade KAT


From my vantage point, I was always skeptical on this reunion but wanted to give them the year and it's still clunky. So you either move KAT or fire Thibs and try to get a guy who can maximize him offensively.

And they're not moving KAT.

no. that won't fix everything. and you'd have to replace him with a guy who scores like a 2nd option, can hit the 3 and plays passable defense. you'd still have no bench. you'd need a 2nd play maker, another center and probably a big backup wing.

plus he costs so much that very few teams would be that interested. the wolves just traded him and our offer was the best they could get. he's now a year older, more expensive and has further been exposed for his defensive deficiencies. so trading him for what you need in return would be hard.

has he not been maximized offensively ? he's having one of his best statistical years. what more do you think there is ? he'll be 30 later this year. there's nothing more to unlock.

I'd say no he hasn't been maximized, in the sense that the offense doesn't get him enough easy looks. He has to work so hard to drive through traffic so often. And in many stretches he just doesn't get touches, especially when JB was playing. A different offense could get more out of him.

Agree with the rest of your points

well he's been in other offenses and this is about the best he's ever played. the last time he shot this well from both the field and 3 was 17-18. guess who his coach was that year ?