Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Horst Given Extension

[paulpressey25]

Well, Zach Lowe is back. On on the pod with Simmons last night he picked Giannis as his “change of scenery” candidate.

None of them even talked about Dame’s career being at risk. Just the Bucks are old and suck. Houston has the assets and motivation to deal for him.

[BigO]

Here's what I think will happen for the Bucks:

1) They keep Doc, not willing to make another change.

2) They keep Horst

3) They run it back, thinking injuries were the problem.

It is time for a big move and it is very risky, but the status quo is too predictable to not take the risk. If the team that gets Flagg is willing to trade him to the Bucks, I do it. Flagg is playing hurt and still is the best player on the court. I'm hopng he has a bad final four and Duke loses.

[ShootingtheJ]

Well, Zach Lowe is back. On on the pod with Simmons last night he picked Giannis as his “change of scenery” candidate.

None of them even talked about Dame’s career being at risk. Just the Bucks are old and suck. Houston has the assets and motivation to deal for him.

Of course they did. That's what gets the clicks, talking about the most popular player in the world getting moved. They make more money peddling fantasy than reality.

If Rollins and KPJ continue to progress, then it becomes illogical to bring Dame back.

[emunney]

True, Flagg has had the far more decorated collegiate career. That HS hype for Wiggins persevered, though. Gottlieb is a knob, but I distinctly remember him calling Wiggins a mix of LeBron/KD/T-Mac during the draft process. I fully agree that Flagg is more an AD caliber prospect, but perception matters, and Wiggins was perceived to be a generational athletic talent.

Comparing Wiggins to Flagg is insane. Even a novice basketball fan can tell the difference in their game at the college level. Flagg has been great in the NCAA Tourney while wiggins was awful if i remember.

Flagg is far and away superior, no one is comparing the two as players. Perceived value/potential/hype as prospects is what is being compared. Wiggins underwhelmed at Kansas, but he was still being hyped as a generational 2-way superstar during the draft process. That's all I'm saying. Flagg has been dominant, Wiggins was not, but the hype and potential stuck with him. Perception vs reality.

I hear what you're saying and totally agree, including the comparison to AD. They're not the same type of player, but for both of them, it seems like they can win you a game pretty much any way you need them to on any given night.

The Wiggins hype was absolutely real and I was among those who thought his quickness would make him a better NBA player than college. He never developed the handles to make use of it. I also LOVED Jabari and would have taken Embiid over either of them. What a mess that all turned out to be, in spite of Embiid's erstwhile transcendence.

[ShootingtheJ]

Here's what I think will happen for the Bucks:

1) They keep Doc, not willing to make another change.

2) They keep Horst

3) They run it back, thinking injuries were the problem.

It is time for a big move and it is very risky, but the status quo is too predictable to not take the risk. If the team that gets Flagg is willing to trade him to the Bucks, I do it. Flagg is playing hurt and still is the best player on the court. I'm hopng he has a bad final four and Duke loses.

I think the Kuzma trade will be the end of Horst.

[midranger]

Don’t know how you keep Horst. It’s been a disaster since the championship.

[BigO]

Here's what I think will happen for the Bucks:

1) They keep Doc, not willing to make another change.

2) They keep Horst

3) They run it back, thinking injuries were the problem.

It is time for a big move and it is very risky, but the status quo is too predictable to not take the risk. If the team that gets Flagg is willing to trade him to the Bucks, I do it. Flagg is playing hurt and still is the best player on the court. I'm hopng he has a bad final four and Duke loses.

I think the Kuzma trade will be the end of Horst.

I don't see any sign that Doc, or the owners, think Kuzma is a problem.

As i previously pointed out, the Bucks were on an offenisve roll last night when the Suns called a timeout. The Bucks were 9-11 shooting with Kuzma having the only two misses. So what does Doc do? He sets up another iso for Kuzma out of the timeout.

I have a feeling Doc played a big role in recommending Kuzma and no one wants to acknowledge that the emperor has no clothes. He is athletic, though.

[ReasonablySober]

The important thing to remember about the Wiggins/Embiid/Parker debate is that I was more right than all of you here.

[Profound23]

The important thing to remember about the Wiggins/Embiid/Parker debate is that I was more right than all of you here.

Hey, I was right there with you. There was like three of us who said we worried about his back injuries but Embiid had the biggest upside next to Giannis. The rest of the board argued with us. I will say you were the most confident in Embiid though.

[DingleJerry]

Of course I'd rather Giannis stay and just be the Bucks legend. It would be good to remain competitive/relevant for a few more years while we don't own our picks, and just in general to be entertained by not sucking. I'd also like to see him go to OKC and be their version of KD to GSW where it just makes them overwhelming and he wins 2-3 more titles to cement himself as an all timer. HE seems a perfect there and Chet/picks as foundation of a trade seems sensical. Chances are no more rings are coming here. OTOH, if he couldn't smoothly fit with Dame (theoretical perfect fit) then how's he gonna fit with SGA? So there could be some chunkiness, but I'd guess better coaching gets them past it

[Wonka]

The important thing to remember about the Wiggins/Embiid/Parker debate is that I was more right than all of you here.

Hey, I was right there with you. There was like three of us who said we worried about his back injuries but Embiid had the biggest upside next to Giannis. The rest of the board argued with us. I will say you were the most confident in Embiid though.

I barely remember MY ranking of those three let alone any other poster. You guys are impressive

Think I was Parker-Embiid-Wiggins. Man. Time has FLOWN by...

[Profound23]

The important thing to remember about the Wiggins/Embiid/Parker debate is that I was more right than all of you here.

Hey, I was right there with you. There was like three of us who said we worried about his back injuries but Embiid had the biggest upside next to Giannis. The rest of the board argued with us. I will say you were the most confident in Embiid though.

I barely remember MY ranking of those three let alone any other poster. You guys are impressive

Think I was Parker-Embiid-Wiggins. Man. Time has FLOWN by...

Ironically I joined the forum the day after we drafted Bogut. Was on here saying I wish we had landed in the #3 slot so we could have taken Deron or CP3 instead of choosing between Bogut and Marvin Williams. Got a lot of push back for that statement.

I found the board because I was looking for a way to express my displeasure for taking Bogut over CP3.

[Wonka]

Hey, I was right there with you. There was like three of us who said we worried about his back injuries but Embiid had the biggest upside next to Giannis. The rest of the board argued with us. I will say you were the most confident in Embiid though.

I barely remember MY ranking of those three let alone any other poster. You guys are impressive

Think I was Parker-Embiid-Wiggins. Man. Time has FLOWN by...

Ironically I joined the forum the day after we drafted Bogut. Was on here saying I wish we had landed in the #3 slot so we could have taken Deron or CP3 instead of choosing between Bogut and Marvin Williams. Got a lot of push back for that statement.

I found the board because I was looking for a way to express my displeasure for taking Bogut over CP3.

I think a lot of us either find the board out of pure frustration or out of pure excitement. What happens after that, only God knows

That truly is a crazy piece of Bucks revitionalist history. Doesn't get the same attention the Dirk draft day trade does but that could've been a game changer. It's insane to think how long Bogut has been out of the league while CP3 keeps plucking away.

[German Athens]

My ranking was Embiid, Wiggins, and then Jabari.

I think in hindsight if Jabari could have stayed healthy, or at least not torn his acl the second time, he would have ended up better than what Wiggins became.

It’s absolutely incredible that we still became a contender, and ultimately won a title, when we got nothing from our only high lottery pick in a supposedly stacked draft.

The “what if” of Jabari is still the most sobering part of the last 20 years for me. If he hits, we would’ve won multiple titles between 2019 and now.

[Wonka]

My ranking was Embiid, Wiggins, and then Jabari.

I think in hindsight if Jabari could have stayed healthy, or at least not torn his acl the second time, he would have ended up better than what Wiggins became.

It’s absolutely incredible that we still became a contender, and ultimately won a title, when we got nothing from our only high lottery pick in a supposedly stacked draft.

The “what if” of Jabari is still the most sobering part of the last 20 years for me. If he hits, we would’ve won multiple titles between 2019 and now.

I recently watched a highlight reel of him between ACL 1 and 2. He was doing incredible things on the offensive end—truly unique stuff. He's probably my biggest Bucks fandom "what if" as well.

Found it:

Read on Twitter

[German Athens]

My ranking was Embiid, Wiggins, and then Jabari.

I think in hindsight if Jabari could have stayed healthy, or at least not torn his acl the second time, he would have ended up better than what Wiggins became.

It’s absolutely incredible that we still became a contender, and ultimately won a title, when we got nothing from our only high lottery pick in a supposedly stacked draft.

The “what if” of Jabari is still the most sobering part of the last 20 years for me. If he hits, we would’ve won multiple titles between 2019 and now.

I recently watched a highlight reel of him between ACL 1 and 2. He was doing incredible things on the offensive end—truly unique stuff. He's probably my biggest Bucks fandom "what if" as well.

Found it:

Read on Twitter

JFC. That’s painful to watch.

His explosiveness, not just vertically but also quickness in tight spaces, was absurd. His physicality and explosiveness was kinda like an 85% Zion.

20/6/3 on above league average efficiency at 21.

I know the butterfly effect and all, but I have to think our odds of winning the title any year between 2019-2023 would have been really really high. If everything played out the same, I don’t think we lose when we lose in either 2019 or 2022.

He’s also still just 30.

[Wonka]

My ranking was Embiid, Wiggins, and then Jabari.

I think in hindsight if Jabari could have stayed healthy, or at least not torn his acl the second time, he would have ended up better than what Wiggins became.

It’s absolutely incredible that we still became a contender, and ultimately won a title, when we got nothing from our only high lottery pick in a supposedly stacked draft.

The “what if” of Jabari is still the most sobering part of the last 20 years for me. If he hits, we would’ve won multiple titles between 2019 and now.

I recently watched a highlight reel of him between ACL 1 and 2. He was doing incredible things on the offensive end—truly unique stuff. He's probably my biggest Bucks fandom "what if" as well.

Found it:

Read on Twitter

JFC. That’s painful to watch.

His explosiveness, not just vertically but also quickness in tight spaces, was absurd. His physicality and explosiveness was kinda like an 85% Zion.

20/6/3 on above league average efficiency at 21.

I know the butterfly effect and all, but I have to think our odds of winning the title any year between 2019-2023 would have been really really high. If everything played out the same, I don’t think we lose when we lose in either 2019 or 2022.

He’s also still just 30.

Truly. He is a little less explosive than Zion, but his offensive repertoire was at another level, especially if you want to compare him and Zion when it comes to ball handling and distance shooting. Some of those clips are truly elite offensive sequences. I would give anything to see the simulation of what Giannis, Jabari and Khris could have achieved together.

[chonestown]

Jabari's ACLs weren't the problem. A problem, sure.

His court awareness brings to mind this:

Watch on YouTube

Case clothed.

[WeMajor34]

I recently watched a highlight reel of him between ACL 1 and 2. He was doing incredible things on the offensive end—truly unique stuff. He's probably my biggest Bucks fandom "what if" as well.

Found it:

Read on Twitter

JFC. That’s painful to watch.

His explosiveness, not just vertically but also quickness in tight spaces, was absurd. His physicality and explosiveness was kinda like an 85% Zion.

20/6/3 on above league average efficiency at 21.

I know the butterfly effect and all, but I have to think our odds of winning the title any year between 2019-2023 would have been really really high. If everything played out the same, I don’t think we lose when we lose in either 2019 or 2022.

He’s also still just 30.

Truly. He is a little less explosive than Zion, but his offensive repertoire was at another level, especially if you want to compare him and Zion when it comes to ball handling and distance shooting. Some of those clips are truly elite offensive sequences. I would give anything to see the simulation of what Giannis, Jabari and Khris could have achieved together.

If he stayed healthy, he would've also been the athletic running mate for Giannis that we've always pined for. Just off that video, he and Giannis really could run the floor together. What really jumped off the screen was his quickness and flexibility for his size. He does look very Zion-like (unfortunately both Duke guys plagued with injuries).

He also could create his own shot, which for Giannis' past teammates, is a premium. Khris was the only one who could put the ball on the floor and score when it mattered (Jrue had his moments). Jabari would've been a nice go-between playing alongside Giannis and Khris with his inside and mid-range game along with a decent 3-point clip (36.5% in 16-17, 38% in 17-18).

[Ron Swanson]

Pretty much. Look at every past dynasty or "multiple titles" core and it almost always involved a bit of luck and circumstance in pairing the franchise guy with a top lottery pick (Worthy/Magic, Duncan/D-Rob, and obviously Jordan/Pippen). Jabari was supposed to be the Jamal Murray to Giannis' Jokic. Him wrecking his knees before his 22nd birthday really was the deathblow to any real dynastic run considering the perfectly aligned age of that core. Would have been fun to see a healthy, unimpeded development version of him with a good coach.