2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V

[BobbieL]

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Beal ain’t the issue. The issue is Booker/KD/jones/Ishbia. KD gonna run anyway, him and Ishbia relationship seems dead so that problem is gonna be gone because KD is gonna make it happen.

Booker is a tick who is gonna suck this organization dry because Ishbia thinks too much of him/over values Bookers presence both local and nationally. So that problem ain’t getting fixed.

Jones gonna be fired. Ishbia will fire him. You can count on it. Jones was just collecting pay checks anyway. He hasn’t brought any real value and drained this organization dry of assets well before Ishbia.

Ishbia ain’t going anywhere so that’s not breaking news.

When it’s all said and done, this team is just going to regurgitate a different/unbalanced roster around Booker again and there is going to be another .500 or worse ball club next year because the leadership offers no real leadership on this team. Fixing half the problems isn’t fixing THE problem!

Preach!!

Wolf and Luke were saying "its great that Booker is so loyal so lets play it out one more year and see what happens"

You play it out one more year - the market for Booker might get smaller and his value will go down. And yes, booker is overvalued by the local media and personalities.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Ya'll are crazy. We have a player who is still top in his position, wanting to play here long term and loyal! Yall are crying. I don't think we need a full on rebuild. Just KD and Beal need to be gone.

So -- give me some ideas of the roster around Booker

(for the record I am pro trading Booker, but)

Whats the best we could realistically expect in return from Houston for KD? Could we get Green, Smith, Eason, and one of our picks? Part of me feels like we probly only get three of those four assets or its Whitmore instead of Eason, but maybe? I can think of a few places to reroute Green and maybe even Eason if all that was on the table.

For KD to Houston, the best realistic package we could get would be some combination of D Brooks or J Green ( *due to his 30 million salary increase being a sizable trade filler)/ Maybe J Smith Jr/ Whitmore/ 2 of our picks back.

Or maybe D Brooks/ Sheppard/ J Smith Jr/ Whitmore/ 3 1sts. With Eason, it'd be an either or scenario of either JSmith Jr or Eason but not both. And if getting KD, they'd prefer to keep Eason and give up Smith Jr be the KD will be filling that spot anyways.

And they're strength is predicated upon their incredible defensive versatility at multiple positions. They'd most likely prefer to surround KD with high end defenders.

Also with Houston, it'd be all three picks and large mediocre fillers like Van Vleet/ Landale/ Whitmore and our 25, 27, and 29 1sts back.

Or 2-3 young core players and fillers and only one of our 1sts back. Maybe two if lucky?? Overall the very best value package we could possibly pull would be:

KD for J Green/ J Smith Jr/ Landale/ Whitmore/ PHX 25' 1st/ PHX 27' 1st.

Or

KD for D Brooks/ Sheppard/ J Smith Jr/ Eason/ PHX 25' 1st.................Maybe???

[BobbieL]

So -- give me some ideas of the roster around Booker

(for the record I am pro trading Booker, but)

Whats the best we could realistically expect in return from Houston for KD? Could we get Green, Smith, Eason, and one of our picks? Part of me feels like we probly only get three of those four assets or its Whitmore instead of Eason, but maybe? I can think of a few places to reroute Green and maybe even Eason if all that was on the table.

For KD to Houston, the best realistic package we could get would be some combination of D Brooks or J Green ( *due to his 30 million salary increase being a sizable trade filler)/ Maybe J Smith Jr/ Whitmore/ 2 of our picks back.

Or maybe D Brooks/ Sheppard/ J Smith Jr/ Whitmore/ 3 1sts. With Eason, it'd be an either or scenario of either JSmith Jr or Eason but not both. And if getting KD, they'd prefer to keep Eason and give up Smith Jr be the KD will be filling that spot anyways.

And they're strength is predicated upon their incredible defensive versatility at multiple positions. They'd most likely prefer to surround KD with high end defenders.

Also with Houston, it'd be all three picks and large mediocre fillers like Van Vleet/ Landale/ Whitmore and our 25, 27, and 29 1sts back.

Or 2-3 young core players and fillers and only one of our 1sts back. Maybe two if lucky?? Overall the very best value package we could possibly pull would be:

KD for J Green/ J Smith Jr/ Landale/ Whitmore/ PHX 25' 1st/ PHX 27' 1st.

Or

KD for D Brooks/ Sheppard/ J Smith Jr/ Eason/ PHX 25' 1st.................Maybe???

I want the picks back - even 27 and 29

[Ghost of Kleine]

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Beal ain’t the issue. The issue is Booker/KD/jones/Ishbia. KD gonna run anyway, him and Ishbia relationship seems dead so that problem is gonna be gone because KD is gonna make it happen.

Booker is a tick who is gonna suck this organization dry because Ishbia thinks too much of him/over values Bookers presence both local and nationally. So that problem ain’t getting fixed.

Jones gonna be fired. Ishbia will fire him. You can count on it. Jones was just collecting pay checks anyway. He hasn’t brought any real value and drained this organization dry of assets well before Ishbia.

Ishbia ain’t going anywhere so that’s not breaking news.

When it’s all said and done, this team is just going to regurgitate a different/unbalanced roster around Booker again and there is going to be another .500 or worse ball club next year because the leadership offers no real leadership on this team. Fixing half the problems isn’t fixing THE problem!

Oh I completely agree that Beal isn't the problem here. He's a part of many critical issues this franchise has, but nowhere near the biggest that created this outcome.


Also, I'm adamantly against trading him and attaching draft assets just to get him off our books two yrs early when it doesn't really change the calculus much at all.

I'm also staunchly opposed to waiving and stretching him when he dan just as easily be brought off the bench in a super 6th man role/ nuclear scoring weapon to help put games away.

The smartest thing that we could do would be to hold onto him.until he's an enormous expiring which would create a very desirable trade asset with that contract.

Or simply let him expire and cash in on the cap flexibility ourselves. The very biggest issues are the ones that you just stated so eloquently man. And for the reasons that you mentioned!

KD is gone! That's just the reality of the situation. Jones has to go because he's crippled this franchise with his lack of ability to value the draft and young athletic, explosive players that actually have size, length, and physicality, etc.

I personally don't dislike Booker, but recognize the glaring futility of keeping him just for a feel good situation so he could retire here. But he honestly won't stay anyways as we struggle much more significantly in the next two years.


And we keep getting blown out and ge gets frustrated and demands out finally. Then that feel good moment will sour quickly anyways. Many are just deluding themselves to that reality.

Our best and most logical pathway to getting back on track very quickly is to move BOTH KD and Booker while their market value is apexed!

The longer we choose to delusionally hold onto them just to pointlessly treadmill as a 11th- 13th seeded late lottery team, and give up all of our assets to opposing teams as a result, the longer our painful rebuild will become.

[Puff]

These trades fo KD sound very good. FVV, Eason and Smith + what I want in addition our 25 and 27 draft picks sound very good.

What happens if Houston does not want to make that trade?

KD and Book, are not our biggest problem. Bradley Beal is the biggest problem. If somehow, we can move him via buy out, how much money would we have to spend. That would include waving Richards, Micic and Martin while also not resigning Lee, Jones, Morris and Bol Bol?

Basically retaining only KD, Book, Oso, Dunn, Gillespie, Allen and O'Neale. Would we have enough money to add to players to that group that would make us playoff competitive?

I say this because I am no convinced that Houston is going to offer as much as we might think. However, if we get into a position where it might not be so bad for us to keep KD, we might be able to add leverage to the deal with Houston.

Let me be clear, the Houston trade looks pretty good, with our 25 and 27 draft picks returned to us.

It is going to be an interesting summer to say the least. I just hope our front office does a better job this summer.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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[BobbieL]

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That was the clip referencing earlier and I truly could care less about how loyal Booker is -- so you give the team a year for Booker to decide that he wants to go and you might lose all ability to get maximum value for Booker

Its a business. I am not trying to just treat these players as robots but trades in the NBA do happen. Teams try to improve their roster. So sure, Booker may be a loyal guy but that shouldn't preclude the team from
1) at least talking about trading him
2) seeing what his value is around the league

I am going to say it again, I think they can build a better team around Bradley Beal for next year trading Booker and Durant than around Booker trading Beal and Durant.

[lilfishi22]

I must be a dumb arse or something but for the ppl who say Book is not a #1 option, who was the best player when they were in the Finals a couple years ago? Who was the one everybody and their mama was saying he's a killer like Kobe, even Kobe himself said he's a killer like himself. Stop disrespecting this man, Book needs winners around him especially at the PG, it doesn't have to be superstars just players who are leaders and care about winning

It's because he's not Jokic, Luka, Bron and Giannis. Someone who could singlehandedly carry an average team. He spearheaded a well balanced and talented team to the Finals as the #1 option but could also argue CP3 was the 1B option in 2 of the 4 series.

But even then, basically no one player can carry a team to the Finals without help. Bron did it once in 06 but he was an absolute basketball god in that run. Jokic couldn't do it when we went to the Finals. Luka did it once with Kyrie. Giannis got to the Finals once and that's with a very well balanced and talented team.

It's clear Book is at least 1 tier below these elite superstars but I don't think that's a good enough reason to move on from a Suns legend.

[lilfishi22]

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Waiving and stretching Beal is the absolute worst of the options imo.

[lilfishi22]

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Kevin Durant is like a really expensive car you buy on finance after you get a fat work bonus that you put towards the down payment and monthly payments aren't too much of a financial burden at the time. Times have changed now, the money isn't coming in like it used to and as much as we don't want to sell the car to get out of the contract, there is no choice otherwise you face having to liquidate real assets to continue to pay for this nice car or financial ruin. Selling the car is the right thing to do

[dremill24]

So -- give me some ideas of the roster around Booker

(for the record I am pro trading Booker, but)

Whats the best we could realistically expect in return from Houston for KD? Could we get Green, Smith, Eason, and one of our picks? Part of me feels like we probly only get three of those four assets or its Whitmore instead of Eason, but maybe? I can think of a few places to reroute Green and maybe even Eason if all that was on the table.

For KD to Houston, the best realistic package we could get would be some combination of D Brooks or J Green ( *due to his 30 million salary increase being a sizable trade filler)/ Maybe J Smith Jr/ Whitmore/ 2 of our picks back.

Or maybe D Brooks/ Sheppard/ J Smith Jr/ Whitmore/ 3 1sts. With Eason, it'd be an either or scenario of either JSmith Jr or Eason but not both. And if getting KD, they'd prefer to keep Eason and give up Smith Jr be the KD will be filling that spot anyways.

And they're strength is predicated upon their incredible defensive versatility at multiple positions. They'd most likely prefer to surround KD with high end defenders.

Also with Houston, it'd be all three picks and large mediocre fillers like Van Vleet/ Landale/ Whitmore and our 25, 27, and 29 1sts back.

Or 2-3 young core players and fillers and only one of our 1sts back. Maybe two if lucky?? Overall the very best value package we could possibly pull would be:

KD for J Green/ J Smith Jr/ Landale/ Whitmore/ PHX 25' 1st/ PHX 27' 1st.

Or

KD for D Brooks/ Sheppard/ J Smith Jr/ Eason/ PHX 25' 1st.................Maybe???

I think all that might be a little rich for Houston, but as an aside, Im curious why you think moving Brooks instead of Green as principal salary would make them willing to part with so much more? I know Green is younger but I'd have Brooks as a significantly better player right now and a much better fit with KD.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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Kevin Durant is like a really expensive car you buy on finance after you get a fat work bonus that you put towards the down payment and monthly payments aren't too much of a financial burden at the time. Times have changed now, the money isn't coming in like it used to and as much as we don't want to sell the car to get out of the contract, there is no choice otherwise you face having to liquidate real assets to continue to pay for this nice car or financial ruin. Selling the car is the right thing to do

[Slim Charless]

So -- give me some ideas of the roster around Booker

(for the record I am pro trading Booker, but)

Whats the best we could realistically expect in return from Houston for KD? Could we get Green, Smith, Eason, and one of our picks? Part of me feels like we probly only get three of those four assets or its Whitmore instead of Eason, but maybe? I can think of a few places to reroute Green and maybe even Eason if all that was on the table.

As previously posted here...

KD to Rockets for FVV, and a selection from Green, Eason and Smith... and Suns 2027 pick back.


Then go to Pistons and trade Booker for Ausar Thompson, Ivey and Harris... and a couple of first rounders, Pistons likely to put protections but so be it.

Suns don't trade Beal or waive him... because it's a waste. Use Beal and give him the Booker role and he will bring his value back up. Then come 2027, his expiring will be coveted by a few teams... get them to give picks or youth as well as their big salary.

I more or less agree with you, but I think the Rockets would want to keep FVV as their only other option is making Reed their starting PG in championship or bust season.

I think they'll wanna use Dillion Brooks as matching salary for KD. Which I'm fine with too as we can likely send him with Booker onto to DET for another 1st or Stewart.

[Slim Charless]

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Waiving and stretching Beal is the absolute worst of the options imo.

It's so dumb. Such a dumb idea.

Bradley Beal is far from our biggest problem here. He can still put up points if given time and opportunity. He and Booker are just the same versions of each other.

He'll slot perfectly into Booker's role and with what we get from that trade, we'd be fine.

[BobbieL]

(for the record I am pro trading Booker, but)

Whats the best we could realistically expect in return from Houston for KD? Could we get Green, Smith, Eason, and one of our picks? Part of me feels like we probly only get three of those four assets or its Whitmore instead of Eason, but maybe? I can think of a few places to reroute Green and maybe even Eason if all that was on the table.

As previously posted here...

KD to Rockets for FVV, and a selection from Green, Eason and Smith... and Suns 2027 pick back.


Then go to Pistons and trade Booker for Ausar Thompson, Ivey and Harris... and a couple of first rounders, Pistons likely to put protections but so be it.

Suns don't trade Beal or waive him... because it's a waste. Use Beal and give him the Booker role and he will bring his value back up. Then come 2027, his expiring will be coveted by a few teams... get them to give picks or youth as well as their big salary.

I more or less agree with you, but I think the Rockets would want to keep FVV as their only other option is making Reed their starting PG in championship or bust season.

I think they'll wanna use Dillion Brooks as matching salary for KD. Which I'm fine with too as we can likely send him with Booker onto to DET for another 1st or Stewart.

Great point about moving Brooks as he would have more value on another team. This is why the Suns need to get under apron levels to make real trades and not the on the margin trades

[Ghost of Kleine]

(for the record I am pro trading Booker, but)

Whats the best we could realistically expect in return from Houston for KD? Could we get Green, Smith, Eason, and one of our picks? Part of me feels like we probly only get three of those four assets or its Whitmore instead of Eason, but maybe? I can think of a few places to reroute Green and maybe even Eason if all that was on the table.

For KD to Houston, the best realistic package we could get would be some combination of D Brooks or J Green ( *due to his 30 million salary increase being a sizable trade filler)/ Maybe J Smith Jr/ Whitmore/ 2 of our picks back.

Or maybe D Brooks/ Sheppard/ J Smith Jr/ Whitmore/ 3 1sts. With Eason, it'd be an either or scenario of either JSmith Jr or Eason but not both. And if getting KD, they'd prefer to keep Eason and give up Smith Jr be the KD will be filling that spot anyways.

And they're strength is predicated upon their incredible defensive versatility at multiple positions. They'd most likely prefer to surround KD with high end defenders.

Also with Houston, it'd be all three picks and large mediocre fillers like Van Vleet/ Landale/ Whitmore and our 25, 27, and 29 1sts back.

Or 2-3 young core players and fillers and only one of our 1sts back. Maybe two if lucky?? Overall the very best value package we could possibly pull would be:

KD for J Green/ J Smith Jr/ Landale/ Whitmore/ PHX 25' 1st/ PHX 27' 1st.

Or

KD for D Brooks/ Sheppard/ J Smith Jr/ Eason/ PHX 25' 1st.................Maybe???

I think all that might be a little rich for Houston, but as an aside, Im curious why you think moving Brooks instead of Green as principal salary would make them willing to part with so much more? I know Green is younger but I'd have Brooks as a significantly better player right now and a much better fit with KD.

Because for Houston, they're already loaded with wing defenders. And need more dynamic scoring to help make them more competitively potent. Now by moving D Brooks, it allows them two key things ( in terms of fit):

First offensively, they'd have an offensive duo of J Green and Durant for more frontcourt/ backcourt scoring balance. Similar to our strategy around Booker and KD in having two dynamic scoring option/ shot creators, but also having multiple defenders as well.

And although J Green isn't nearly as efficient as Booker from the midrange, he's still a very potent 3 level scorer that could play well off off of Durant.

And second, defensively. D Brooks is obviously a good wing defender, but again, they're already loaded with high end/ elite defenders, like Thompson, Eason, Van Vleet, Adams, etc. So in moving D Brooks over Green, they can have:

PG- Van Vleet- Good defender.
SG - J Green- Potent scorer/ shot creator.
SF- Amen Thompson- Elite defender.
PF- KD - Elite scorer/ creator.
C- Sengun- Versatile scorer/ playmaker with solid defense and rim protection.

Again better balance between offense and defense throughout the lineup. This would allow them to surround KD with high end defenders.

And by keeping J Green over Brooks, that would also give them an explosive backcourt scoring option ( shot creator) so that the opposition couldn't focus in on KD as easily as if it were D Brooks who's a good spot up shooter but not really a creator.

Van Vleet/ J Green/ Thompson/ KD / Sengun.
Holiday/ Sheppard/ Eason/ Landale/ Adams? I'm sure they'd like to move J Green's salary though ( to your point) and honestly I'd much rather have him in the deal because I see him having star potential ( maybe not superstar though)?? And would prioritize keeping him to see what he could become for us.

But I think the rockets will strongly consider the alternative too for the reasons that I've mentioned above.

[Ghost of Kleine]

(for the record I am pro trading Booker, but)

Whats the best we could realistically expect in return from Houston for KD? Could we get Green, Smith, Eason, and one of our picks? Part of me feels like we probly only get three of those four assets or its Whitmore instead of Eason, but maybe? I can think of a few places to reroute Green and maybe even Eason if all that was on the table.

As previously posted here...

KD to Rockets for FVV, and a selection from Green, Eason and Smith... and Suns 2027 pick back.


Then go to Pistons and trade Booker for Ausar Thompson, Ivey and Harris... and a couple of first rounders, Pistons likely to put protections but so be it.

Suns don't trade Beal or waive him... because it's a waste. Use Beal and give him the Booker role and he will bring his value back up. Then come 2027, his expiring will be coveted by a few teams... get them to give picks or youth as well as their big salary.

I more or less agree with you, but I think the Rockets would want to keep FVV as their only other option is making Reed their starting PG in championship or bust season.

I think they'll wanna use Dillion Brooks as matching salary for KD. Which I'm fine with too as we can likely send him with Booker onto to DET for another 1st or Stewart.

This 100000000!!!

[Ghost of Kleine]

(for the record I am pro trading Booker, but)

Whats the best we could realistically expect in return from Houston for KD? Could we get Green, Smith, Eason, and one of our picks? Part of me feels like we probly only get three of those four assets or its Whitmore instead of Eason, but maybe? I can think of a few places to reroute Green and maybe even Eason if all that was on the table.

As previously posted here...

KD to Rockets for FVV, and a selection from Green, Eason and Smith... and Suns 2027 pick back.


Then go to Pistons and trade Booker for Ausar Thompson, Ivey and Harris... and a couple of first rounders, Pistons likely to put protections but so be it.

Suns don't trade Beal or waive him... because it's a waste. Use Beal and give him the Booker role and he will bring his value back up. Then come 2027, his expiring will be coveted by a few teams... get them to give picks or youth as well as their big salary.

I more or less agree with you, but I think the Rockets would want to keep FVV as their only other option is making Reed their starting PG in championship or bust season.

I think they'll wanna use Dillion Brooks as matching salary for KD. Which I'm fine with too as we can likely send him with Booker onto to DET for another 1st or Stewart.

I'd love this honestly! But it'd be much too clever and logical for our front office! And especially not something that James Jones could ever envision.

Because it would be an incredible value outcome. Hopefully Jones is gone fast and a real GM is brought in to handle this summer.

[Ghost of Kleine]

(for the record I am pro trading Booker, but)

Whats the best we could realistically expect in return from Houston for KD? Could we get Green, Smith, Eason, and one of our picks? Part of me feels like we probly only get three of those four assets or its Whitmore instead of Eason, but maybe? I can think of a few places to reroute Green and maybe even Eason if all that was on the table.

For KD to Houston, the best realistic package we could get would be some combination of D Brooks or J Green ( *due to his 30 million salary increase being a sizable trade filler)/ Maybe J Smith Jr/ Whitmore/ 2 of our picks back.

Or maybe D Brooks/ Sheppard/ J Smith Jr/ Whitmore/ 3 1sts. With Eason, it'd be an either or scenario of either JSmith Jr or Eason but not both. And if getting KD, they'd prefer to keep Eason and give up Smith Jr be the KD will be filling that spot anyways.

And they're strength is predicated upon their incredible defensive versatility at multiple positions. They'd most likely prefer to surround KD with high end defenders.

Also with Houston, it'd be all three picks and large mediocre fillers like Van Vleet/ Landale/ Whitmore and our 25, 27, and 29 1sts back.

Or 2-3 young core players and fillers and only one of our 1sts back. Maybe two if lucky?? Overall the very best value package we could possibly pull would be:

KD for J Green/ J Smith Jr/ Landale/ Whitmore/ PHX 25' 1st/ PHX 27' 1st.

Or

KD for D Brooks/ Sheppard/ J Smith Jr/ Eason/ PHX 25' 1st.................Maybe???

I want the picks back - even 27 and 29

That's why I'm willing to take back a lesser value package of D Brooks/ Sheppard/ J Smith Jr/ Landale/ Whitmore. **Landale and Whitmore instead of Eason in exchange for an extra pick back?

[KdoubleDees23]

Yall crazy with the let’s get a bunch of picks . We can’t draft worth a dam$! Only think I would do is package all the picks for something