Shams: Nuggets Fire Malone & Booth

[OxAndFox]

Every NBA coach is now hoping for Denver and Memphis to lose every single game in the post season. All it will take is one of them to have a semi decent 1st round and this sacking coaches late in the season will become trendy.

[G R E Y]

Well why weren't these offered to keep him? Alternatively, Booth was the best choice? But who else *did* Booth draft vs. who was available? Who gave the massive Murray contract? Let good role players walk - sure they're not doing as well on other teams, but they proved their value to Nugs. I get going younger, but then handing out a huge contract to JM and not landing late picks and not stockpiling any is brutal.

This is a lotto team without Jokic. That's precarious and not sustainable for a contender.

They won an NBA title without Masai and Connelly. By the way, NBA fans are on Masai's neck saying he's become Joe Dumars as a GM, so we need to stop with the revisionist history here. Connelly was called dumb for the Gobert trade, then praised up until the WCF, and then called a moron again once KAT was traded. He also is the one who gave Michael Porter Jr. a max contract extension early, for no reason.

The Nuggets are a promote from within front office. The following guys have been in the GM/VP of Basketball Operations seat, all left for more money or a bigger opportunity at some point:

Pete D'Alessandro
Masai Ujiri
Arturas Karnisovas
Tim Connelly

Calvin Booth was just the latest person in their front office to be promoted after being assistant GM. Their current assistant GM is Tommy Balcetis. I'm guessing, based on the Nuggets history, that he is just going to slide into that job.

Letting Bruce Brown walk is not on the Nuggets, because they didn't let him walk. He opted out and they couldn't beat the Pacers offer. KCP took a better offer than Booth was allowed to make by ownership. If you want to blame him for not being able to convince KCP to leave 10-15 million on the table, so be it. As for the Jamal Murray extension, ownership has to eat that as much as Booth does. They chose to reward someone who was a 1B in their only championship. I'm not going to kill them for that. In his career,Murray has played like a superstar in the playoffs, so maybe they don't care about his lack of regular season dominance (because the NBA regular season does not matter).

Booth drafted players that Malone wouldn't play, that's an issue. Everyone says the players suck. Harteinstein didn't play for Malone (and look at him now). Neither did Jay Huff (and Memphis found value in him). I mean, the Nuggets historically have found good young talent and developed it as it was the only way they could win since they never get anyone in FA.

Most teams are lotto teams without their MVP level talent. That's not saying much. The only one that probably isn't is Boston (and some of that is attributed to being in the East). How good is OKC without Shai? Sacramento level?

Not sure how Ujiri factors into this...

Connelly's work is largely responsible for the roster that won. That he wasn't there anymore is moot.

Wolves are no longer in cap hell and have more flexibility going forward. TC made a choice to give up a lot for Gobert and then made a choice to build around Ant, moving KAT, getting said flexibility in the process.

Booth has been a massive **** up. Massive. Like almost nobody here is surprised his contract would not have been extended this summer.

Contenders that would not be lotto teams without their best player:

Boston

Cleveland

Knicks

OKC

Houston

LAC

LAL

And to lesser extents Minny and GS who bolstered themselves with strong secondary support.

Contenders that are lotto teams without their best player:

Denver

Milwaukee (well kind of unfair with Dame out)

Probably GS - depending on how long Curry would be out if injured, but when he sits, they're not brutal.

Dallas has a strong, balanced team but their two best assets are out but even when one is playing they have better chances of treading water.

So yeah, most of the top tier contenders ensure they can sustain some level of respectable play when a star sits or is out.

[Pointgod]

What are we even doing here??!!!!

[The Master]

I mean, some of Jokic's defensive efforts have been pretty bad. He doesn't contest shots, doesn't close out on shooters. I wouldn't be surprised if some of the teammates were frustrated being constantly lambasted by Malone and Jokic not getting any blame for putting the defense in bad positions.

Yeah, but what teammates would be mad at Jokic? Porter sucks at defense, Gordon regressed defensively as well this year, Russ just wants to have fun, DeAndre is happy to be in the NBA, the rest of this roster is group of some complete randoms. The story is cap, if you are Julian Strawther, you are afraid to even tell your mom that you're mad at Jokic's effort, because she may call you dumb straight into your face.

I don't mind these moves in general, Nuggets have been regressing since their championship, so you have to do something - it's classless to do that against Malone though right now, it's not like his assistant coach 10 days before the playoffs will change anything besides some minor rotations. I guess one of the consequences of players' league is that owners don't give a damn anymore as well, so you can fire the most accomplished coach in the history of your organization just for sake of shock value. Trading Towns after the best season in the history of Wolves organization, trading Doncic, now firing Jenkins and Malone at this point of the season. These are moves that are very difficult to find comparisons for from the past.

[Jazz9]

If the GM and coach were at odds, the environment around the team was toxic and Malone seemingly had already lost the locker room, what were their chances in the playoffs as is anyway?
They're in a free fall and were not going anywhere this year imo so what's the worst that could happen really?
Lose in the playoffs like they were going to?

[Dubnation]

This is so stupid.

Why is always the coaches and never the front office, which 9/10 is the issue.

Also playoffs are about to start.

The Nuggets weren't going anywhere this season anyway.

They were more likely to go 'somewhere' than any team not in Boston, OKC, Cleveland, and maybe LA.

So by that logic. Every other coach in the association needs to go. right?

[Tracymcgoaty]

I mean, some of Jokic's defensive efforts have been pretty bad. He doesn't contest shots, doesn't close out on shooters. I wouldn't be surprised if some of the teammates were frustrated being constantly lambasted by Malone and Jokic not getting any blame for putting the defense in bad positions.

Yeah, but what teammates would be mad at Jokic? Porter sucks at defense, Gordon regressed defensively as well this year, Russ just wants to have fun, DeAndre is happy to be in the NBA, the rest of this roster is group of some complete randoms. The story is cap, if you are Julian Strawther, you are afraid to even tell your mom that you're mad at Jokic's effort, because she may call you dumb straight into your face.

I don't mind these moves in general, Nuggets have been regressing since their championship, so you have to do something - it's classless to do that against Malone though right now, it's not like his assistant coach 10 days before the playoffs will change anything besides some minor rotations. I guess one of the consequences of players' league is that owners don't give a damn anymore as well, so you can fire the most accomplished coach in the history of your organization just for sake of shock value. Trading Towns after the best season in the history of Wolves organization, trading Doncic, now firing Jenkins and Malone at this point of the season. These are moves that are very difficult to find comparisons for from the past.

I haven't looked but i wonder how absurd Jokic on/off is with Denver.

I wonder how much the drop off is on offense when Jokic isn't out there.

Broussard is the one who broke the news. Broussard is usually full of crap. Jokic makes life easier for everyone.

[80HD]

Craziest season in NBA history.

Next up: Timberwolves win the NBA championship.

…yes, the MN Wolves.

[JJ_PR]

I don't think people realize how hard it is to put a good team together in a small market. The firings of Malone and Booth don't make sense to me. They won a championship not too long ago and who knows what would happen this year, any team with Jokic has a chance of going deep.

Perhaps Jokic himself wanted changes, but the timing seems odd.

[azcatz11]

Does anyone know what this means for Vlatko Cancar now that Booth is gone?

[The Master]

I don't think people realize how hard it is to put a good team together in a small market. The firings of Malone and Booth don't make sense to me. They won a championship not too long ago and who knows what would happen this year, any team with Jokic has a chance of going deep.

Perhaps Jokic himself wanted changes, but the timing seems odd.

Let's be honest - Nuggets are not well run organization in the past couple of years. Them changing their GM is very logical, they have to change something.

That being said, Malone is the latest change of the coach ever, Hubie Brown was fired after 79 games as well, but Hawks were out of playoffs already. He also had the highest number of wins for a fired coach, tying Larry Brown. The difference is Larry Brown was fired by the Nets because he agreed to coach Kansas in the NCAA next year what pissed off Nets' owner at that time. This is how unparalleled is this decision.

[GeorgeSears]

This is so stupid.

Why is always the coaches and never the front office, which 9/10 is the issue.

Also playoffs are about to start.

The Nuggets weren't going anywhere this season anyway.

They were more likely to go 'somewhere' than any team not in Boston, OKC, Cleveland, and maybe LA.

So by that logic. Every other coach in the association needs to go. right?

Except they were trending in the wrong direction. Winning a title to 2nd round exit to likely 1st round exit, we saw that trend with the Lakers under Vogel, and Bucks under Bud. He was gone either way. Better to do it now.

[Exp0sed]

Why is it always people who aren't a fan of the team that say things like this?

Literally ever Nuggets fan i've seen on this forum wants him gone. Jokic can only save him for so long.

Every fan of every team wants to fire their coach, including Warriors/Spurs/Heat fans. The worst source for whether a coach should be fired is the fanbase.

Plenty of nuggets fans in this thread have put forth exstensive posts that shows why they're happy Malone is out. I'd much rather trust that than - He won a title how do you fire him?

Doc Rivers won a title too..

for years he was stacking up bottom feeding seasons one after another, then KG, Pierce and Rondo happened and suddenly he was seen nationally as "winner" and coach with "championship pedigree". he's still getting jobs to this day and he's completely clueless and shouldn't be an NBA HC

yeah, when he was a lead assistant for the Warriors back in the day, Dray and Steph gave him some credit but as a HC?
his only headcoaching job before the Nuggets was for the Kings, in his first season they went 28-54, despite having a pretty decent roster and he lasted only a month or two into his second season, with an 11-13 record

then Denver hired him

his first season was Jokic's rookie season, Malone the genius played Nikola just 21 mins per game. per 36 numbers of 20 years old rookie Jokic?
16.5\11.5\4 (almost 4 offensive rebounds!) on 51\33\81 with 1 block per 36 and 1.6 steals. that's on just 12 FGA per 36..

conversely, Towns won a unanimous ROTY that season avging per 36: 20.6\11.8\2.2 on 54\34\81 but worth mentioning he took 15.8 FGA per 36

had Malone recognized Jokic's greatness from the jump, Jokic might have given Towns a run for his money. probably still would have finished 2nd in ROTY but that's something. more importantly, the Nuggets won just 33 games in Malone's first season. had he featured Jokic more heavily and not play him 20 mpg - that team would have won more games for sure

jumping to his 2nd season, Malone still only started Jokic 59 games out of 73, only setted on him being a full time starter mid-season (great coaching) and the Nuggets went 40-42

in his 3rd season, Jokic was 22 and already a star impact player - the Nuggets finish 9th with 46-36 and miss the playoffs. it's unclear how Malone still has a job but I guess the Kroenkes are patient

in his 4th season, Jokic is a superstar. they go 54-28, finish 2nd in the West. you think the difference in this season was Malone's coaching?
Jokic played 80 games, averaged 20\11\7.5 on great splits and finished 4th in MVP voting

Malone has a career because of Jokic and the Nuggets have a banner because of Jokic. Malone would have been canned at the end of Jokic's rookie season (or the next, at worst) had the Nuggets not drafted Jokic.

[guynumber45]

I mean, some of Jokic's defensive efforts have been pretty bad. He doesn't contest shots, doesn't close out on shooters. I wouldn't be surprised if some of the teammates were frustrated being constantly lambasted by Malone and Jokic not getting any blame for putting the defense in bad positions.

Yeah, but what teammates would be mad at Jokic? Porter sucks at defense, Gordon regressed defensively as well this year, Russ just wants to have fun, DeAndre is happy to be in the NBA, the rest of this roster is group of some complete randoms. The story is cap, if you are Julian Strawther, you are afraid to even tell your mom that you're mad at Jokic's effort, because she may call you dumb straight into your face.

I don't mind these moves in general, Nuggets have been regressing since their championship, so you have to do something - it's classless to do that against Malone though right now, it's not like his assistant coach 10 days before the playoffs will change anything besides some minor rotations. I guess one of the consequences of players' league is that owners don't give a damn anymore as well, so you can fire the most accomplished coach in the history of your organization just for sake of shock value. Trading Towns after the best season in the history of Wolves organization, trading Doncic, now firing Jenkins and Malone at this point of the season. These are moves that are very difficult to find comparisons for from the past.

I haven't looked but i wonder how absurd Jokic on/off is with Denver.

I wonder how much the drop off is on offense when Jokic isn't out there.

Broussard is the one who broke the news. Broussard is usually full of crap. Jokic makes life easier for everyone.

It's crazy how bad their offense is without Jokic. These guys look like they don't even know how to play basketball whenever Nikola isn't on the floor. The fact it has looked like this the past 5 years is good enough reason to sack Malone.

[GeorgeSears]

It should also be noted that Mike Malone still hasn't shed the vestiges of the early 2000s era of coaching, the Larry Brown/ Rick Adelman style of raging at players during games and film sessions. That works only when you're winning. Don't be surprised if the players are quietly celebrating this.

Malone's ways of coaching won't be successful anywhere else. This new "player's era" whether you like it or not, has no time for that type of coach. As soon as he starts getting persnickety, he'll be on a short leash.

[Castle Black]

At least we'll always have this moment against the Lakers.

Read on Twitter

[scrabbarista]

Read on Twitter

I promise I'm not Calvin Booth, y'all!

[Doctor MJ]

I agree, I think there's no reason not to at least let Malone coach the playoffs.

And he should bristle. They should've have let KCP go - I think that was a bigger loss than some think - and they didn't adequately replace his role(3&D), signing Westbrook instead. And they didn't bolster their bench enough. Last offseason was just bad for them.

Also, people seem to be criticizing the Murray/MPJ contracts...I find it difficult to criticize when both guys helped win a title, and if those contracts were their market-value...so be it.

Agree, agree, and yeah, makes sense.

I think the Murray/Porter contracts haven't worked out well, but it's hard to say that they were utterly incompetent for them. Literally both players played up to the level of those contract BEFORE they ever signed them, they've just not been able to be consistently on that level after. Sometimes that's how it goes.

The thing is though, while it absolutely makes sense with the cap to decide on your core guys - in this case Jokic/Murray/Porter/Gordon - and not letting the rest of your team get bloated with bigger contracts, if 2 of those 4 core guys aren't working out like they were supposed to, you're really not in a position where you can sacrifice depth and remain competitive.

Further, while no matter how rich the owner is I respect frugality, when you recognize that you now have not just a clear cut franchise player, but by far the best player you'll ever have on this franchise until you die, this isn't the time to cut corners. Maybe you recognize that KCP isn't what you need as your 5th guy going forward and you wan to give Braun a shot, but that doesn't mean you just let talent walk out the door in free agency. When you let a guy go, you want depth in return.

When did MPJ ever live up to his contract before he signed it? In his 2nd year he was 19/7/1 and was horrendous defensively. There is no way that level of play was worth the 25% max and as we’ve seen post-contract signing he’s not been worth that either.

When Murray went down to injury, Porter played like an all-star. Consider his splits for '20-21:

Pre-ASB: 14.6 PPG on 62.7% TS, with on-court/100 of +6.3
Post-ASB: 22.3 PPG on 68.2% TS, with on-court/100 of +11.4

[doogie_hauser]

Knicks now have no excuse not to fire Thibs when they are smacked by the Celtics in the 2nd round

[Darklight]

Shocking.. I expected Booth to be gone because his contract was ending of course not renewed otherwise the owners would need to be lynched, but Malone was gonna be canned after the playoffs since they weren't making the finals no chance. It's crazy that they fired him 1 week before the playoffs.. Atleast this gives them some time to evalute Adelman for the coaching job and others in the summer. The stories that are coming out about Malone and Booth and them being described as "cold war" is insane, but I know that Zack Lowe mentioned that the divide before the season start was uncanny to a high degree between a coach and a GM so not suprised. Still to sabotage the team (Malone) by alienating pickett the way he did in scrimmages and what he did to Zeke is a fireable offense these two morons sabotage a billion dollar org for their egos unbelievable.

Now Booth in a long time hasn't a person been so deserving of being fired, only Nico Harrison, but that **** was rigged by the league unlike Booth's decisions. He has made one **** up after another and deplated the assets of this team. This (Please Use More Appropriate Word) is sending **** spies to spy on the coach wtf.

Bro, if he didn't trade away all our second rounders we could have gotten guys like DFS etc.. Not to mention giving out that horrible murray contract 30% max after him being totally washed.. Since when has 2 timlines ever worked, didn't GSW and Celtics teach this fool anything? He has left Yoke with a team that are one-way players that can't create for themselves or if they can somewhat defend can't play defense with no shooting wtf is this team building!!?
Imagine trusting someone looking like this

Spoiler:

Now when they have cleaned house, in the summer you HAVE TO go for KD no matter what. Jokic needs a legit second star, go get it done and add one more decent veteran aswell.