Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Horst Given Extension

[paulpressey25]

why are people still talking about fred vanvleet. is it the ptsd?

Negative value asset and salary to get close to matching Dame's in a trade, is the general thought. At this point not sure you'd be able to convince them to pick up his club option to then pay to get off of it.

I understand the board looks at FVV’s shooting percentage and equates his value as worse than Bryn Forbes, but somehow, someway he’s the starting PG on a 52-28 Houston squad at a team leading 35 minutes per game. Given the fact his contract only has next year as a team option, he’s not a negative asset in any sense.

Do I think Houston is a better team with Lillard as their PG? Maybe. Maybe not. I don’t see it as a clear cut case either way.

[German Athens]

I like FVV. He’s still a good player.

If it were Dame for FVV, Reed, and Jabari I’d take that and run.

We’d get a capable stop-gap pg for a year who’s expiring. We could have Reed be a regular part of the rotation and continue to learn under him for a year, and then Jabari would hopefully, finally, give us that two way forward we’ve been looking for alongside Giannis.

Re-sign KPJ, Rollins, and Brook.

Use Kuzma, Pat, 1st, swap, and 2nds to fill in at starting 3, and maybe a starting 5.

FVV Reed
KPJ Rollins
Someone Green AJJ
Giannis Jabari
Brook someone

[Ron Swanson]

"Simply existing on a good team" has caused a lot of wild valuations of players over the years and it's not in and of itself any sort of meaningful, intangible skill. FVV is a still decent player/starter, but probably the most overpaid dude in the league relative to his actual on-court performance. He's absolutely a negative asset even as an expiring and it's wild to assert otherwise. This is "Raptors view Bruce Brown as an asset" all over again.

[Bucksmaniac]

"Simply existing on a good team" has caused a lot of wild valuations of players over the years and it's not in and of itself any sort of meaningful, intangible skill. FVV is a still decent player/starter, but probably the most overpaid dude in the league relative to his actual on-court performance. He's absolutely a negative asset even as an expiring and it's wild to assert otherwise. This is "Raptors view Bruce Brown as an asset" all over again.

I’m with you, in addition to his declining shooting pct, at his weight I don’t think he will age well as he advances through his 30s.

[raferfenix]

What’s the over under on Dame returning?

High stakes gambling on Doc not being completely full of sh*t.

More broadly if the top of the franchise is straight lying about this 2 years in a row all involved deserve accountability for abusing the fan community.

All those caveats aside…if he were to actually return wouldn’t that be sweet.

"Everything is still progressing positively," Rivers told reporters on Thursday. "Last test was fantastic. So, you know, that's about all I have. Fingers crossed."

Lillard, 34, last played on March 18 and remains out indefinitely, making a return for the playoffs is possible but probably unlikely.

"(The timeline) definitely has changed, medically," Rivers told reporters over the weekend. "Which is good. The location of it is very important as well. And it is, it's lower. But, it still could be six months. We just don't know."

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/25183317-damian-lillard-progressing-positively-after-blood-clot-diagnosis-bucks-rivers-says

[midranger]

Why do people think that it would be impossible to get Tari Eason in a Dame trade?

[Baddy Chuck]

Why do people think that it would be impossible to get Tari Eason in a Dame trade?

On/off.

[emunney]

"Simply existing on a good team" has caused a lot of wild valuations of players over the years and it's not in and of itself any sort of meaningful, intangible skill. FVV is a still decent player/starter, but probably the most overpaid dude in the league relative to his actual on-court performance. He's absolutely a negative asset even as an expiring and it's wild to assert otherwise. This is "Raptors view Bruce Brown as an asset" all over again.

I hate getting myself caught up in nit-picking a generally correct point. Dude is super overpaid and I 100% believe he was signed to the contract he was, like Bruce Brown was, to serve as a big-salary conduit to which assets could later be attached in a trade for a bigger-salary star. But I can't let you forget about Bradley Beal, a guy who was super-maxed in earnest, given a no-trade clause, and promptly managed to fall off the edge of a round Earth.

[emunney]

Why do people think that it would be impossible to get Tari Eason in a Dame trade?

It wouldn't be. The Rockets know they're not going to get something for nothing. Whether Dame is a guy they'd go after is a separate question.

Eason is an outstanding roleplayer but there's nothing in the way they're using him that suggests they think he is or ever will be more than that.

[fansinceforever]

I think it's impossible when you factor in who they'd have to include in addition to Tari Eason to make the trade work.

What's Dame's contract next season? 58 million?

[ShootingtheJ]

"Simply existing on a good team" has caused a lot of wild valuations of players over the years and it's not in and of itself any sort of meaningful, intangible skill. FVV is a still decent player/starter, but probably the most overpaid dude in the league relative to his actual on-court performance. He's absolutely a negative asset even as an expiring and it's wild to assert otherwise. This is "Raptors view Bruce Brown as an asset" all over again.

I’m with you, in addition to his declining shooting pct, at his weight I don’t think he will age well as he advances through his 30s.

Yes, and Houston can likely clear enough salary to take on Dame while declining FVVs option.

Part of the idea of moving Dame is to let KPJ and Rollins be the PGs, and then we can use Dame to acquire players at SG and SF who aren't replacement level or worse.

[paulpressey25]

"Simply existing on a good team" has caused a lot of wild valuations of players over the years and it's not in and of itself any sort of meaningful, intangible skill. FVV is a still decent player/starter, but probably the most overpaid dude in the league relative to his actual on-court performance. He's absolutely a negative asset even as an expiring and it's wild to assert otherwise. This is "Raptors view Bruce Brown as an asset" all over again.

As to his contract? Yes overpaid when you look at dollars per year. He's not a $40mm a year guy. But remember he didn't get one of those five-year super-max things. Was a short deal with a team option. And that will pay off, as Houston now has a $40mm salary slot to trade, a slot which only has one year on it if Houston picks up his option for next year. Was a damn smart deal.

And on the court the guy brings a ton of experience and leadership. I mean he's playing 35 minutes a night on the #2 team in the West as their starting PG.

[Ron Swanson]

Yeah....nah. Tobias Harris has made a living playing on good teams and yet there was no way someone would argue that he wasn't negative to nuetral at best value on a $39 million expiring last year. You like FVV as a player, I get it. He's also a 31-year old, midget PG who's currently in the midst of a completely standard age regression stretch that guys of his limited talent, size, and skill always see at the end of their careers. If people are worried about Dame going into his age-35 season, than I don't know how on earth you can actually advocate for Freddy. The price to have that $44 million dumped on you with the new CBA is an extra asset or two.

[Turk Nowitzki]

What’s the over under on Dame returning?

High stakes gambling on Doc not being completely full of sh*t.

More broadly if the top of the franchise is straight lying about this 2 years in a row all involved deserve accountability for abusing the fan community.

All those caveats aside…if he were to actually return wouldn’t that be sweet.

"Everything is still progressing positively," Rivers told reporters on Thursday. "Last test was fantastic. So, you know, that's about all I have. Fingers crossed."

Lillard, 34, last played on March 18 and remains out indefinitely, making a return for the playoffs is possible but probably unlikely.

"(The timeline) definitely has changed, medically," Rivers told reporters over the weekend. "Which is good. The location of it is very important as well. And it is, it's lower. But, it still could be six months. We just don't know."

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/25183317-damian-lillard-progressing-positively-after-blood-clot-diagnosis-bucks-rivers-says

I swear Doc is a compulsive liar with this kind of stuff. I don't think Dame is anywhere near coming back.

[GoldenAntlers]

What’s the over under on Dame returning?

High stakes gambling on Doc not being completely full of sh*t.

More broadly if the top of the franchise is straight lying about this 2 years in a row all involved deserve accountability for abusing the fan community.

All those caveats aside…if he were to actually return wouldn’t that be sweet.

"Everything is still progressing positively," Rivers told reporters on Thursday. "Last test was fantastic. So, you know, that's about all I have. Fingers crossed."

Lillard, 34, last played on March 18 and remains out indefinitely, making a return for the playoffs is possible but probably unlikely.

"(The timeline) definitely has changed, medically," Rivers told reporters over the weekend. "Which is good. The location of it is very important as well. And it is, it's lower. But, it still could be six months. We just don't know."

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/25183317-damian-lillard-progressing-positively-after-blood-clot-diagnosis-bucks-rivers-says

I swear Doc is a compulsive liar with this kind of stuff. I don't think Dame is anywhere near coming back.

6 months brings us to mid-October.

If that is the case, do we really want another no-basketball activity summer from Dame?

[Ron Swanson]

The fact that our most used 5-man lineup on the season is still Dame/Ajax/Prince/Giannis/Brook with a -2.5 net-rating is so **** stupid. The fact that all the regular starters minus Giannis still have a negative on/off is such an indictment on Doc and this coaching staff. We're an easy 50-win team without touching anything on the roster just by getting a coach that plays the right guys with the starters. This is why it's so tough trying to actually analyze this roster and why we end up hinging our entire hopes on two vet minimum young guys we got off the scrap heap just because they've provided a glimpse of potential.

[Prez]

The fact that our most used 5-man lineup on the season is still Dame/Ajax/Prince/Giannis/Brook with a -2.5 net-rating is so **** stupid. The fact that all the regular starters minus Giannis still have a negative on/off is such an indictment on Doc and this coaching staff. We're an easy 50-win team without touching anything on the roster just by getting a coach that plays the right guys with the starters. This is why it's so tough trying to actually analyze this roster and why we end up hinging our entire hopes on two vet minimum young guys we got off the scrap heap just because they've provided a glimpse of potential.

It's why I have little confidence in us winning a playoff series even against the Pacers, who are nothing special and should be beatable if we had a coach with a functioning brain. Intentionally starting a bad lineup and playing it heavy minutes is just not something you're going to overcome in a playoff series when you're already down your 2nd best player.

Dame/Beasley/Crowder/Giannis/Brook last year was a +15.6 net rating lineup literally just because it made some shred of sense positionally and in terms of having enough shooting around Giannis/Dame. Just basic **** competence in lineup management like....starting an actual shooting guard, not starting essentially 3 power forwards, not starting a 29% 3PT shooter at SF...would completely change things. We erased a 24 point deficit and had a 40-13 quarter when we benched the 2 guys Doc has been starting at the 2/3 for weeks, and he proceeded to start them the very next game. He's actively sabotaging the team with this stuff.

[German Athens]

Gambo mentioned that the package for Durant would probably be Jalen Green, Eason and a PHX 1st.

For Dame would you rather bring back

FVV, Reed, And Jabari

Or

Jalen Green, Eason, and Landale

[-Jragon-]

Sooooo do we all want the 5th seed now? Is it unanomous?

[Bernman]

Gambo mentioned that the package for Durant would probably be Jalen Green, Eason and a PHX 1st.

For Dame would you rather bring back

FVV, Reed, And Jabari

Or

Jalen Green, Eason, and Landale

The latter, because Green's a #2 option. But Houston aren't giving up Green for guys in their mid 30's, while they have a young core. If they're trying to go for it now w/ mid 30's vets, it'd not be at the expense of their core, rather more like the 1st option - a vet &/or a couple role players.