Heat/Suns/Nets/Lakers

Astaluego · Post #1 » by **Astaluego** » Sat Apr 12, 2025 6:36 am

HEAT
In:KD/Vincent/#27(Knicks FRP)
Out:Ware/Jazquez/Rozier/Wiggins/#11/#21

Adebayo/Love
KD/Kyle
Highsmith/Jovic
Vincent/Robinson
Herro/D.Mitchell

The Heat are building a contender, getting a teammate for Herro who knows the house and should complement each other well, giving them the star they're missing to be a contender.

SUNS
In:Ware/Jazquez/Hachimura/#11
Out:KD/Future FRP27(wors Jazz/Cle)

Ware/Oso/Richards
Hachimura/Royce
Dunn/Jazquez
Beal/Allen
Booker/#11

They save tons of money, get prospects and a lottery pick for the old KD and a starter (Hachimura)

NETS
In: Rozier/Maxi/Vandervilt/Knecht/#21/FRP27 (SUNS)/Swap 2032(Lakers)
Out:Claxton/#27

They move their cap space to the juicier FA 2026 and get paid for it, they also move their contract higher in Claxton.. they get an interesting prospect in Knecht, they improve the worst of their FRP of 25 and a future pick swap that could be very valuable.. they also get a defensive specialist who is only 25 years old in Vandervilt

LAKERS
In: Claxton/Wiggins
Out: Vincent/Maxi/Hachimura/Knecht/Vandervilt/Swap 2032

Claxton/*Hayes?
LeBron
DFS
Wiggins/Bronny/Goodwin
Luka/Reaves

The Lakers are adapting their team to Luka, getting defense and athleticism... now they would have to build a bench, but with a quintet ready to face anyone.

giberish · Post #2 » by **giberish** » Sat Apr 12, 2025 7:57 am

Feels way too good for the Lakers. I don't think a distant pick swap and Knecht have that much value.

IMO pretty bad for the Nets. Give up Claxton and use a bunch of 2025 cap space (that several teams will want to use to make deals work) for a small trade up, Knecht a very late future 1st and the distant pick swap. Given how little value any of those incentives have I'd hold out for at least one medium asset or just keep Claxton and get a couple other minor assets for cap space rentals.

Post #3 » by **BBallFreak** » Sat Apr 12, 2025 9:36 am

I am deadset against adding KD, especially if you include Ware, I'd pass, personally.

BTW, no team with two starters that limited is a contender,

drchaos · Post #4 » by **drchaos** » Sat Apr 12, 2025 12:48 pm

If the Nets are giving up Claxton to move up in the first round they are going to want that pick # 11.

SA37 · Post #5 » by **SA37** » Sat Apr 12, 2025 1:29 pm

If Miami got to keep Wiggins and instead sent Robinson out....maybe.

I get Hassan Whiteside vibes with Ware, so I am not so opposed to seeing him dealt. I just don't know how valuable Miami thinks he is. Even if Whiteside is the "wrong comp", what is Ware's best-case scenario? Marcus Camby? Brook Lopez? Porzingis? Pau Gasol? Ayton? In any case, my guess is Miami would likely balk at including Ware given Durant's age.

I think Miami's offer here would be more like Robinson, Rozier, Jaquez, Miami's 2025, and maybe the GS pick.

Post #6 » by **BBallFreak** » Sat Apr 12, 2025 2:20 pm

SA37 wrote:If Miami got to keep Wiggins and instead sent Robinson out....maybe.

I get Hassan Whiteside vibes with Ware, so I am not so opposed to seeing him dealt. I just don't know how valuable Miami thinks he is. Even if Whiteside is the "wrong comp", what is Ware's best-case scenario? Marcus Camby? Brook Lopez? Porzingis? Pau Gasol? Ayton? In any case, my guess is Miami would likely balk at including Ware given Durant's age.

I think Miami's offer here would be more like Robinson, Rozier, Jaquez, Miami's 2025, and maybe the GS pick.

I echo your sentiments, though I think he'll be a better overall player than Whiteside was. I would trade him, just not for an elderly Durant.

jredsaz · Post #7 » by **jredsaz** » Sat Apr 12, 2025 9:59 pm

BBallFreak wrote:
SA37 wrote:If Miami got to keep Wiggins and instead sent Robinson out....maybe.

I get Hassan Whiteside vibes with Ware, so I am not so opposed to seeing him dealt. I just don't know how valuable Miami thinks he is. Even if Whiteside is the "wrong comp", what is Ware's best-case scenario? Marcus Camby? Brook Lopez? Porzingis? Pau Gasol? Ayton? In any case, my guess is Miami would likely balk at including Ware given Durant's age.

I think Miami's offer here would be more like Robinson, Rozier, Jaquez, Miami's 2025, and maybe the GS pick.

I echo your sentiments, though I think he'll be a better overall player than Whiteside was. I would trade him, just not for an elderly Durant.

Where is Jovic on the list of Heat prospects? Above or below Ware? Jacques’s shooting struggles really lower his value.

Karmaloop · Post #8 » by **Karmaloop** » Sat Apr 12, 2025 11:49 pm

giberish wrote:Feels way too good for the Lakers. I don't think a distant pick swap and Knecht have that much value.

Feels like the Wiggins/Hachimura swap isn't necessary or wanted by the Lakers. They're losing size in the process, and they're already short on that to begin with. Maybe you could argue that they should add a future FRP, but it's not going to be an unprotected FRP for Claxton.

wadenation305 · Post #9 » by **wadenation305** » Sat Apr 12, 2025 11:53 pm

jredsaz wrote:
BBallFreak wrote:
SA37 wrote:If Miami got to keep Wiggins and instead sent Robinson out....maybe.

I get Hassan Whiteside vibes with Ware, so I am not so opposed to seeing him dealt. I just don't know how valuable Miami thinks he is. Even if Whiteside is the "wrong comp", what is Ware's best-case scenario? Marcus Camby? Brook Lopez? Porzingis? Pau Gasol? Ayton? In any case, my guess is Miami would likely balk at including Ware given Durant's age.

I think Miami's offer here would be more like Robinson, Rozier, Jaquez, Miami's 2025, and maybe the GS pick.

I echo your sentiments, though I think he'll be a better overall player than Whiteside was. I would trade him, just not for an elderly Durant.

Where is Jovic on the list of Heat prospects? Above or below Ware? Jacques’s shooting struggles really lower his value.

Ware
Jovic
Mitchell ( if you want to include him)
Jaquez

And I wouldn't move Ware for KD. Dude is a walking double double that can play next to Bam on a cheap contract. I can totally see him as a 20+ ppg 12+ rpg player easily

jredsaz · Post #10 » by **jredsaz** » Sun Apr 13, 2025 1:20 am

wadenation305 wrote:
jredsaz wrote:
BBallFreak wrote:I echo your sentiments, though I think he'll be a better overall player than Whiteside was. I would trade him, just not for an elderly Durant.

Where is Jovic on the list of Heat prospects? Above or below Ware? Jacques’s shooting struggles really lower his value.

Ware
Jovic
Mitchell ( if you want to include him)
Jaquez

And I wouldn't move Ware for KD. Dude is a walking double double that can play next to Bam on a cheap contract. I can totally see him as a 20+ ppg 12+ rpg player easily

That’s kinda how I figured it too. I was surprised to see him comped to Whiteside in the thread. Dude looks like a very useful player especially next to Bam.

SA37 · Post #11 » by **SA37** » Sun Apr 13, 2025 5:50 am

jredsaz wrote:
wadenation305 wrote:
jredsaz wrote:
Where is Jovic on the list of Heat prospects? Above or below Ware? Jacques’s shooting struggles really lower his value.

Ware
Jovic
Mitchell ( if you want to include him)
Jaquez

And I wouldn't move Ware for KD. Dude is a walking double double that can play next to Bam on a cheap contract. I can totally see him as a 20+ ppg 12+ rpg player easily

That’s kinda how I figured it too. I was surprised to see him comped to Whiteside in the thread. Dude looks like a very useful player especially next to Bam.

"Useful" is very different to what some Heat fans believe, which is that Ware could end up being a franchise player for Miami. Ware is skillful, but he is gangly and a bit awkward. He's got slow reflexes. He gets most of his points off dunks and put-backs.

I have similar issues with Jovic. He's skillful, but he's herky-jerky. He's a bit slow afoot, especially on defense.

In a nutshell, some Heat fans think Miami has Wemby and Peja Stojakovic; I think Miami has (best-case) Brook Lopez and Hedo Turkoglu.

Maybe it will all come together for them. I'd love to be proven wrong.

Post #12 » by **BBallFreak** » Sun Apr 13, 2025 3:44 pm

SA37 wrote:
jredsaz wrote:
wadenation305 wrote:
Ware
Jovic
Mitchell ( if you want to include him)
Jaquez

And I wouldn't move Ware for KD. Dude is a walking double double that can play next to Bam on a cheap contract. I can totally see him as a 20+ ppg 12+ rpg player easily

That’s kinda how I figured it too. I was surprised to see him comped to Whiteside in the thread. Dude looks like a very useful player especially next to Bam.

"Useful" is very different to what some Heat fans believe, which is that Ware could end up being a franchise player for Miami. Ware is skillful, but he is gangly and a bit awkward. He's got slow reflexes. He gets most of his points off dunks and put-backs.

I have similar issues with Jovic. He's skillful, but he's herky-jerky. He's a bit slow afoot, especially on defense.

In a nutshell, some Heat fans think Miami has Wemby and Peja Stojakovic; I think Miami has (best-case) Brook Lopez and Hedo Turkoglu.

Maybe it will all come together for them. I'd love to be proven wrong.

Dude, that would be an amazing tandem. I would never argue against that type of comparison and would be thrilled. I was thinking more Detlef Shrempf and a smarter Whiteside with better passing skills (which would make him a pretty good player). I have no issues trading either or both, but I'm not doing it for a geriatric Durant. It's time to move past that...

jredsaz · Post #13 » by **jredsaz** » Sun Apr 13, 2025 3:59 pm

BBallFreak wrote:
SA37 wrote:
jredsaz wrote:
That’s kinda how I figured it too. I was surprised to see him comped to Whiteside in the thread. Dude looks like a very useful player especially next to Bam.

"Useful" is very different to what some Heat fans believe, which is that Ware could end up being a franchise player for Miami. Ware is skillful, but he is gangly and a bit awkward. He's got slow reflexes. He gets most of his points off dunks and put-backs.

I have similar issues with Jovic. He's skillful, but he's herky-jerky. He's a bit slow afoot, especially on defense.

In a nutshell, some Heat fans think Miami has Wemby and Peja Stojakovic; I think Miami has (best-case) Brook Lopez and Hedo Turkoglu.

Maybe it will all come together for them. I'd love to be proven wrong.

Dude, that would be an amazing tandem. I would never argue against that type of comparison and would be thrilled. I was thinking more Detlef Shrempf and a smarter Whiteside with better passing skills (which would make him a pretty good player). I have no issues trading either or both, but I'm not doing it for a geriatric Durant. It's time to move past that...

But where is 80 year old Pat Reilly on that? You know he is trying for one more before he calls it quits.

Post #14 » by **BBallFreak** » Sun Apr 13, 2025 4:42 pm

jredsaz wrote:
BBallFreak wrote:
SA37 wrote:
"Useful" is very different to what some Heat fans believe, which is that Ware could end up being a franchise player for Miami. Ware is skillful, but he is gangly and a bit awkward. He's got slow reflexes. He gets most of his points off dunks and put-backs.

I have similar issues with Jovic. He's skillful, but he's herky-jerky. He's a bit slow afoot, especially on defense.

In a nutshell, some Heat fans think Miami has Wemby and Peja Stojakovic; I think Miami has (best-case) Brook Lopez and Hedo Turkoglu.

Maybe it will all come together for them. I'd love to be proven wrong.

Dude, that would be an amazing tandem. I would never argue against that type of comparison and would be thrilled. I was thinking more Detlef Shrempf and a smarter Whiteside with better passing skills (which would make him a pretty good player). I have no issues trading either or both, but I'm not doing it for a geriatric Durant. It's time to move past that...

But where is 80 year old Pat Reilly on that? You know he is trying for one more before he calls it quits.

Not arguing that point, but even Riley should be able to see what he's done with Phoenix...

Slim Charless · Post #15 » by **Slim Charless** » Sun Apr 13, 2025 5:30 pm

BBallFreak wrote:
jredsaz wrote:
BBallFreak wrote:Dude, that would be an amazing tandem. I would never argue against that type of comparison and would be thrilled. I was thinking more Detlef Shrempf and a smarter Whiteside with better passing skills (which would make him a pretty good player). I have no issues trading either or both, but I'm not doing it for a geriatric Durant. It's time to move past that...

But where is 80 year old Pat Reilly on that? You know he is trying for one more before he calls it quits.

Not arguing that point, but even Riley should be able to see what he's done with Phoenix...

Numbers wise KD has put up some of the best numbers of his career in PHX. Our win-loss record has nothing to do with how he has played. I think you guys are VERY likely to be in the thick of the KD sweepstakes this summer. What's your opinion on Jovic?

jredsaz · Post #16 » by **jredsaz** » Sun Apr 13, 2025 6:06 pm

BBallFreak wrote:
jredsaz wrote:
BBallFreak wrote:Dude, that would be an amazing tandem. I would never argue against that type of comparison and would be thrilled. I was thinking more Detlef Shrempf and a smarter Whiteside with better passing skills (which would make him a pretty good player). I have no issues trading either or both, but I'm not doing it for a geriatric Durant. It's time to move past that...

But where is 80 year old Pat Reilly on that? You know he is trying for one more before he calls it quits.

Not arguing that point, but even Riley should be able to see what he's done with Phoenix...

I honestly think KD to Miami makes the most sense in the league. Of course, if they can get in on a better/younger player they should but with their assets and franchise timeline KD makes sense. Bam is 28 this season. They make a push with a roster that better fits around KD than what they did in Phoenix.

But I get it, KD isn’t the guy who is going to lead the Heat anywhere. That’s up to Bam, Heat Culture, and whoever else. What KD can do is play some very good basketball.

Post #17 » by **BBallFreak** » Sun Apr 13, 2025 7:53 pm

Slim Charless wrote:
BBallFreak wrote:
jredsaz wrote:
But where is 80 year old Pat Reilly on that? You know he is trying for one more before he calls it quits.

Not arguing that point, but even Riley should be able to see what he's done with Phoenix...

Numbers wise KD has put up some of the best numbers of his career in PHX. Our win-loss record has nothing to do with how he has played. I think you guys are VERY likely to be in the thick of the KD sweepstakes this summer. What's your opinion on Jovic?

So, your best player...

Had nothing to do with your record?

That's more reason not to want him. Those are called empty stats...

Slim Charless · Post #18 » by **Slim Charless** » Sun Apr 13, 2025 8:17 pm

BBallFreak wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
BBallFreak wrote:Not arguing that point, but even Riley should be able to see what he's done with Phoenix...

Numbers wise KD has put up some of the best numbers of his career in PHX. Our win-loss record has nothing to do with how he has played. I think you guys are VERY likely to be in the thick of the KD sweepstakes this summer. What's your opinion on Jovic?

So, your best player...

Had nothing to do with your record?

That's more reason not to want him. Those are called empty stats...

Booker is the best player and it's his fault more than KD's that our record is subpar. Also, you had the EXACT same record as us going into today and your best player is Bam....what does that say about him?

SA37 · Post #19 » by **SA37** » Sun Apr 13, 2025 8:39 pm

jredsaz wrote:
BBallFreak wrote:
jredsaz wrote:
But where is 80 year old Pat Reilly on that? You know he is trying for one more before he calls it quits.

Not arguing that point, but even Riley should be able to see what he's done with Phoenix...

I honestly think KD to Miami makes the most sense in the league. Of course, if they can get in on a better/younger player they should but with their assets and franchise timeline KD makes sense. Bam is 28 this season. They make a push with a roster that better fits around KD than what they did in Phoenix.

But I get it, KD isn’t the guy who is going to lead the Heat anywhere. That’s up to Bam, Heat Culture, and whoever else. What KD can do is play some very good basketball.

If Miami could acquire Durant without giving up Wiggins or Ware (I agree with BBallFreak that Miami is unlikely to include Jovic or Ware in any deal for Durant), Miami has the players to make a solid run:

Ware / Love
Adebayo / Jovic
Durant / Highsmith
Wiggins / Burks
Herro / Mitchell

Miami desperately needs a guy who can create his own offense and draw a lot of defensive attention, and Herro and Adebayo just aren't those guys. Neither is Wiggins.

I think a deal with Rozier, Robinson (who could be cut for ~$9M, potentially getting Phoenix under the 2nd apron), Jaquez, and Miami's 2025 (if Miami ends up with a late lottery pick) and GS's 2025 pick would be a competitive offer. Perhaps a 3rd team would be needed to take Rozier and send back a player making less to get Phoenix under the 2nd apron. (Not sure how much salary Phoenix needs to shed.)

The next move, if I were Phoenix, would be to revisit the reported deal that was discussed that would have sent Beal to Washington (for Middleton + Smart or Holmes?)

So maybe you end up with a 4-team deal including Brooklyn who takes on salary in exchange for assets:

Miami get Durant

Phoenix gets Robinson, Smart, Jaquez, and Miami's 2025 pick (or a future 1st if Miami doesn't have a pick)

Brooklyn gets Rozier, Holmes and GS 2025

Washington gets Beal and a 1st from Phoenix

No idea if that works salary-wise, but:

Richards / Ighodaro
O'Neal / Jaquez
Dunn / Martin
Booker / Allen
Smart / Micic / 2025 pick?

And then whoever Phoenix might add in FA since I assume Robinson would be cut for the financial savings.

Slim Charless · Post #20 » by **Slim Charless** » Sun Apr 13, 2025 9:16 pm

SA37 wrote:
jredsaz wrote:
BBallFreak wrote:Not arguing that point, but even Riley should be able to see what he's done with Phoenix...

I honestly think KD to Miami makes the most sense in the league. Of course, if they can get in on a better/younger player they should but with their assets and franchise timeline KD makes sense. Bam is 28 this season. They make a push with a roster that better fits around KD than what they did in Phoenix.

But I get it, KD isn’t the guy who is going to lead the Heat anywhere. That’s up to Bam, Heat Culture, and whoever else. What KD can do is play some very good basketball.

If Miami could acquire Durant without giving up Wiggins or Ware (I agree with BBallFreak that Miami is unlikely to include Jovic or Ware in any deal for Durant), Miami has the players to make a solid run:

Ware / Love
Adebayo / Jovic
Durant / Highsmith
Wiggins / Burks
Herro / Mitchell

Miami desperately needs a guy who can create his own offense and draw a lot of defensive attention, and Herro and Adebayo just aren't those guys. Neither is Wiggins.

I think a deal with Rozier, Robinson (who could be cut for ~$9M, potentially getting Phoenix under the 2nd apron), Jaquez, and Miami's 2025 (if Miami ends up with a late lottery pick) and GS's 2025 pick would be a competitive offer. Perhaps a 3rd team would be needed to take Rozier and send back a player making less to get Phoenix under the 2nd apron. (Not sure how much salary Phoenix needs to shed.)

The next move, if I were Phoenix, would be to revisit the reported deal that was discussed that would have sent Beal to Washington (for Middleton + Smart or Holmes?)

So maybe you end up with a 4-team deal including Brooklyn who takes on salary in exchange for assets:

Miami get Durant

Phoenix gets Robinson, Smart, Jaquez, and Miami's 2025 pick (or a future 1st if Miami doesn't have a pick)

Brooklyn gets Rozier, Holmes and GS 2025

Washington gets Beal and a 1st from Phoenix

No idea if that works salary-wise, but:

Richards / Ighodaro
O'Neal / Jaquez
Dunn / Martin
Booker / Allen
Smart / Micic / 2025 pick?

And then whoever Phoenix might add in FA since I assume Robinson would be cut for the financial savings.

You have Royce O Neal starting at PF? That seems like a major loss. Think that Jovic would have to be in there if Ware isn't and I think we'd get him. Easily.

To be honest though, I'm not convinced that Riles won't include Ware. He's old and wants to make a title run, what does he care about Jovic or Ware and what they can do 3 years down the road?

Durant when added to Bam and Herro can win a chip next year