Jakob Poeltl might be our most impactful player

[WaltFrazier]

You're telling me Yak can hold Embiid to 0 points in a game? You're telling me that Yak is a better passer than Marc Gasol?

There isn't a single basketball skill Yak is better than Gasol at, even 35 year-old Gasol.

Man I really wonder if Shakril is related to Jakob. He is not even moderately rational in these conversations

2019 Gasol was still arguably a top 10 center in the league. He took a smaller role with us, but he was still putting up 16/9/5 in MEM prior to the trade, and he is arguably the best defensive center we ever had. Gasol was simply a force defensively and he orchestrated an offense at a level Poeltl just simply cannot.

Put 2019 Gasol on our roster instead of Poeltl since that trade and we are an improved team.

And it's no knock against Poeltl, Poeltl is a good center.

Gasol was just a beast and during his prime, an All NBA, All Star, DPOY and on the MVP list.

I agree with you and Yogurt about Gasol, but I don't knock Shakril. I respect his continual promotion of Jak and often agree with it

[M3tro]

Classic case of taking what you have for granted.

I'm cool with him retiring a Rap at this point. Starts for another 1-2 seasons before moving to the bench on the back-end of his career.

[MiamiSPX]

Gasol:
1x DPOY
3x All-Star
2x All NBA
1x All Defensive
1x champ (vital piece of that team)

I figured his HoF chances would be higher when you factor in all his international accolades, but Basketball Reference only has him at 4.2% probability. However, that is still 4.3% higher chances than Poeltl.

I repeat, no team with Poeltl as a full time starter has ever made the playoffs. Now, they are not missing the playoffs because of him, but they are also not sniffing the playoffs because of him. He is what he is, a good Center on a good value contract, whose importance on our team is amplified by the FO's disinterest in that position over the last several years.

[ConSarnit]

Jak can't guard Embiid like Marc could in those playoffs. Jak is a very good passer Marc was an elite passer. And Jak has never performed at the highest level of playoffs like 2019 was. It's not his fault he's on a lottery team, I realize, but he's never shown he can play at that level.

And yes sure shooting too

Good to see you’ve come around on this. I remember you would compare Jak’s passing to Gasol.

Gasol was such an elite passer and a very important piece to our championship run.

And random Yak hate in a Yak positive thread, typical.

Gasol was 34 at the time he played for us, 5 years older than Yak. That's FIVE more years for Poeltl to develop better skills in every aspect. Gasol wasn't even shooting threes at Yaks age.

Gasol was a better passer in MEM when he was younger than Poeltl is now.

And if you’re going to go by seasons and not age, Gasol was averaging double the assists Poeltl did in year 9.

No matter how you cut it Gasol is clearly a better passer than Poeltl. It’s not even debatable.

[ConSarnit]

Man I really wonder if Shakril is related to Jakob. He is not even moderately rational in these conversations

2019 Gasol was still arguably a top 10 center in the league. He took a smaller role with us, but he was still putting up 16/9/5 in MEM prior to the trade, and he is arguably the best defensive center we ever had. Gasol was simply a force defensively and he orchestrated an offense at a level Poeltl just simply cannot.

Put 2019 Gasol on our roster instead of Poeltl since that trade and we are an improved team.

And it's no knock against Poeltl, Poeltl is a good center.

Gasol was just a beast and during his prime, an All NBA, All Star, DPOY and on the MVP list.

I agree with you and Yogurt about Gasol, but I don't knock Shakril. I respect his continual promotion of Jak and often agree with it

Can I ask why? Shakril is completely irrational when it comes to Poeltl. In this thread they claimed Poeltl was better than Gasol at everything outside of 3pt shooting. Why respect someone who is either trolling or doesn’t know what they’re talking about?

[Duffman100]

And it's no knock against Poeltl, Poeltl is a good center.

Gasol was just a beast and during his prime, an All NBA, All Star, DPOY and on the MVP list.

I agree with you and Yogurt about Gasol, but I don't knock Shakril. I respect his continual promotion of Jak and often agree with it

Can I ask why? Shakril is completely irrational when it comes to Poeltl. In this thread they claimed Poeltl was better than Gasol at everything outside of 3pt shooting. Why respect someone who is either trolling or doesn’t know what they’re talking about?

For me, at least it's better than the never ending negativity of others. I'd rather have the Shakril's irrational love of Poeltl, Boogie's irrational love of RJ and Boucher (though it comes with negativity of others) and a few other people who love players beyond their actual output.

Than reading about how all of our players are all garbage.

[tsherkin]

I agree with you and Yogurt about Gasol, but I don't knock Shakril. I respect his continual promotion of Jak and often agree with it

Jak is legit a good center. I think we get in the habit of being displeased with the timing of his re-acquisition more than anything else, and tWo can't have loved him because he helps us win, you know what I mean? But he's a quality rebounder who defends well enough, moves well without the ball and just plays the way you want from a good roleplayer big. His only real issue, aside from not being a dominant player, is lack of ability to fade into the corner for 3s enough to clear the paint.

[Nebuchadnezzar]

Good to see you’ve come around on this. I remember you would compare Jak’s passing to Gasol.

Gasol was such an elite passer and a very important piece to our championship run.

And random Yak hate in a Yak positive thread, typical.

Gasol was 34 at the time he played for us, 5 years older than Yak. That's FIVE more years for Poeltl to develop better skills in every aspect. Gasol wasn't even shooting threes at Yaks age.

Gasol was a better passer in MEM when he was younger than Poeltl is now.

And if you’re going to go by seasons and not age, Gasol was averaging double the assists Poeltl did in year 9.

No matter how you cut it Gasol is clearly a better passer than Poeltl. It’s not even debatable.

Assists total are secondary, as they don't capture how a player contributes before the pass that leads to the score - something Yak is masterful at. The way he operates in the high post creating space, setting others up, and diving is elite for his position. His assist totals are also impacted by Scottie being in the front court with him.

Gasol was primarily passing out of double teams at that point, and not the same playmaker as Yak.

[DreamTeam09]

Time for him to mentor one of Maluach or Queen

[Basketball_Jones]

There’s this one signature play by Gasol that always brings back memories. The one where a bounce pass is kicked out to him and he lets it roll and back steps all the way out to the 3 point line where he’s open only to swing it to someone else to shoot. Stuff like that really changed our offense when he replaced JV. Anyways, many things Yak can do that Gasol could never do either, different type of players.

[Shakril]

I am just impressed how underrrated Poeltl still is after this season - and thats from their own fans. This is either simply hate or not understanding how the game of Basketball is beeing played.

I personally believe (hope), that because of the title in 2019 Gasol is getting gloryfied (overrated). Nothing else makes sense.

[ConSarnit]

And random Yak hate in a Yak positive thread, typical.

Gasol was 34 at the time he played for us, 5 years older than Yak. That's FIVE more years for Poeltl to develop better skills in every aspect. Gasol wasn't even shooting threes at Yaks age.

Gasol was a better passer in MEM when he was younger than Poeltl is now.

And if you’re going to go by seasons and not age, Gasol was averaging double the assists Poeltl did in year 9.

No matter how you cut it Gasol is clearly a better passer than Poeltl. It’s not even debatable.

Assists total are secondary, as they don't capture how a player contributes before the pass that leads to the score - something Yak is masterful at. The way he operates in the high post creating space, setting others up, and diving is elite for his position. His assist totals are also impacted by Scottie being in the front court with him.

Gasol was primarily passing out of double teams at that point, and not the same playmaker as Yak.

This is a really bad take. I have to question whether you’ve actually watched Gasol play.

[ConSarnit]

There’s this one signature play by Gasol that always brings back memories. The one where a bounce pass is kicked out to him and he lets it roll and back steps all the way out to the 3 point line where he’s open only to swing it to someone else to shoot. Stuff like that really changed our offense when he replaced JV. Anyways, many things Yak can do that Gasol could never do either, different type of players.

Outside of offensive rebounding (which is partly due to Gasol actually being able to space the floor) name these things.

Gasol is superior to Poeltl in almost every aspect. I don’t know if people are only remembering 2020 Gasol but prior to that Gasol was a much better player than Poeltl. Like, it’s not even close.

[Tha Cynic]

Is the same person posting from two different accounts in this thread?

[Basketball_Jones]

There’s this one signature play by Gasol that always brings back memories. The one where a bounce pass is kicked out to him and he lets it roll and back steps all the way out to the 3 point line where he’s open only to swing it to someone else to shoot. Stuff like that really changed our offense when he replaced JV. Anyways, many things Yak can do that Gasol could never do either, different type of players.

Outside of offensive rebounding (which is partly due to Gasol actually being able to space the floor) name these things.

Gasol is superior to Poeltl in almost every aspect. I don’t know if people are only remembering 2020 Gasol but prior to that Gasol was a much better player than Poeltl. Like, it’s not even close.

I don’t remember Gasol a lot in his prime but I have a hard time believing his finishing around the basket and floater touch was any good as a roller for catch and finishes

[WaltFrazier]

And it's no knock against Poeltl, Poeltl is a good center.

Gasol was just a beast and during his prime, an All NBA, All Star, DPOY and on the MVP list.

I agree with you and Yogurt about Gasol, but I don't knock Shakril. I respect his continual promotion of Jak and often agree with it

Can I ask why? Shakril is completely irrational when it comes to Poeltl. In this thread they claimed Poeltl was better than Gasol at everything outside of 3pt shooting. Why respect someone who is either trolling or doesn’t know what they’re talking about?

Duffman gave a good reply. I'd just add that getting Jak a competent center was a necessity at the time. The front office had foolishly and stubbornly gone with no centers for two and a half years, forcing Scottie/Pascal/OG to guard big C's, until Birch came in. Getting Jak was long overdue and a breath of fresh air.

[Tha Cynic]

I agree with you and Yogurt about Gasol, but I don't knock Shakril. I respect his continual promotion of Jak and often agree with it

Can I ask why? Shakril is completely irrational when it comes to Poeltl. In this thread they claimed Poeltl was better than Gasol at everything outside of 3pt shooting. Why respect someone who is either trolling or doesn’t know what they’re talking about?

Duffman gave a good reply. I'd just add that getting Jak a competent center was a necessity at the time. The front office had foolishly and stubbornly gone with no centers for two and a half years, forcing Scottie/Pascal/OG to guard big C's, until Birch came in. Getting Jak was long overdue and a breath of fresh air.

Looking back - the Poeltl, Siakam, Barnes, OG, FVV lineup would have been a strong team in this current version of the East, especially under Darko, and with developed young players. But the timing was bad, the contracts probably would not have worked out, and i get the sense a couple of players wanted out by that point. The lack of player development during the Nurse era is what really killed this team, and you can kind of see that he was terrible as a people leader.

Marc Gasol was vastly overrated during his time here, but he was great from a defensive matchup perspective in the flexibility he gave Toronto. He basically removed any weakness this team had, and enhanced our defense by allowing them to switch back and forth between him and Ibaka. He was a great fit, but in terms of individual play, he wasn't as great as people make him out to be, especially by that point.

[Tacoma]

Gasol:
1x DPOY
3x All-Star
2x All NBA
1x All Defensive
1x champ (vital piece of that team)

I figured his HoF chances would be higher when you factor in all his international accolades, but Basketball Reference only has him at 4.2% probability. However, that is still 4.3% higher chances than Poeltl.

I repeat, no team with Poeltl as a full time starter has ever made the playoffs. Now, they are not missing the playoffs because of him, but they are also not sniffing the playoffs because of him. He is what he is, a good Center on a good value contract, whose importance on our team is amplified by the FO's disinterest in that position over the last several years.

If you don't play in the NBA, you have zero chance to make the HoF, but Poeltl is below zero at -0.1%? That's cold!

He was brought here to make the playoffs. We were in the playoffs the year before Poeltl was traded back here but haven't made the playoffs since that trade. Poeltl is solid, consistent and reliable but if he's the most impactful player on this team, that says more about the state of the team than of Poeltl.

[ConSarnit]

There’s this one signature play by Gasol that always brings back memories. The one where a bounce pass is kicked out to him and he lets it roll and back steps all the way out to the 3 point line where he’s open only to swing it to someone else to shoot. Stuff like that really changed our offense when he replaced JV. Anyways, many things Yak can do that Gasol could never do either, different type of players.

Outside of offensive rebounding (which is partly due to Gasol actually being able to space the floor) name these things.

Gasol is superior to Poeltl in almost every aspect. I don’t know if people are only remembering 2020 Gasol but prior to that Gasol was a much better player than Poeltl. Like, it’s not even close.

I don’t remember Gasol a lot in his prime but I have a hard time believing his finishing around the basket and floater touch was any good as a roller for catch and finishes

It’s tough to parse out but I guess id say Poeltl is better finisher around the basket. Gasol had great hands but his offensive usage was higher and different (more post-ups and self created attempts) so it’s difficult to really know how Gasol would fair as a finisher if he was in the same role as Poeltl. We don’t really have floater data on Gasol.

Gasol had greater responsibility as a creator for him self and others so his efficiency compared to Poeltl is not exactly and apples to apples comparison imo. Poeltl is definitely a very good finisher so I’d probably give him the edge as a roll man finisher.

[WaltFrazier]

Can I ask why? Shakril is completely irrational when it comes to Poeltl. In this thread they claimed Poeltl was better than Gasol at everything outside of 3pt shooting. Why respect someone who is either trolling or doesn’t know what they’re talking about?

Duffman gave a good reply. I'd just add that getting Jak a competent center was a necessity at the time. The front office had foolishly and stubbornly gone with no centers for two and a half years, forcing Scottie/Pascal/OG to guard big C's, until Birch came in. Getting Jak was long overdue and a breath of fresh air.

Looking back - the Poeltl, Siakam, Barnes, OG, FVV lineup would have been a strong team in this current version of the East, especially under Darko, and with developed young players. But the timing was bad, the contracts probably would not have worked out, and i get the sense a couple of players wanted out by that point. The lack of player development during the Nurse era is what really killed this team, and you can kind of see that he was terrible as a people leader.

Plus Norm. If Masai could have got Jak sooner and given that core a chance together, right after Kyle left, it would have been interesting. Maybe it wouldn't have worked, and they would've needed another PG to back up Fred. And contracts would have been the issue as you say. But that core deserved a better chance to try it together, as Norm himself has expressed.

Marc Gasol was vastly overrated during his time here, but he was great from a defensive matchup perspective in the flexibility he gave Toronto. He basically removed any weakness this team had, and enhanced our defense by allowing them to switch back and forth between him and Ibaka. He was a great fit, but in terms of individual play, he wasn't as great as people make him out to be, especially by that point

You said all the good things Gasol provided. The part about being overrated as an individual - well he shouldn't be judged as an individual. It's how he fit into, and solidified the team that made him such a key piece. I acknowledge though, in the bubble despite losing weight and looking so fit, he wasn't the same as 2019 or even early in the 2019-20 season.