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2025 Draft prospects - thread 2

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Re: 2025 Draft prospects - thread 2 

Post#421 » by 2weekswithpay » Wed Apr 23, 2025 9:00 pm

Indomitable wrote:
drosestruts wrote:
sco wrote:No Ace at all?


I can't think of a single player with that poor of efficiency and who averaged more turnovers than assists, and had such an awful assist to usage ratio. Terrrible BPM. then went on to succeed.

I'm happy letting Ace be someone elses problem.

I get it, he looks like an NBA player. But he doesn't actually do anything well. At all.

This is a strong statement


It's not entirely wrong. Jaylen Brown is the only recent draft pick that I can think of that worked out with the same issues above. With that said, the TOs are an easy fix. No NBA team should be asking Ace to handle the ball. Limit his shot selection, and the efficiency should increase.
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Re: 2025 Draft prospects - thread 2 

Post#422 » by Chi town » Thu Apr 24, 2025 1:44 am

Add this Ant clone to the 26 Draft.

That class is going takeover the NBA.

https://youtu.be/MZuFEf8GH-c?si=NFmhdNl4GkE3_Nsb
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Re: 2025 Draft prospects - thread 2 

Post#423 » by Andi Obst » Thu Apr 24, 2025 9:52 am

I've just recently started to take a closer look at some of the prospects, so I'll have some work to do, but CMB has easily been my favorite in the Bulls range so far. He's a unique player, which is both bad and good and it looks like it might make him available for the Bulls. I absolutely get the "tweener" and the shooting concerns, but all players in this range will have major question marks. CMB's defense is special, though. The kind of guy where you can turn on the game without knowing much about any player on the court and you'll be able to tell he's the best defender out there within a couple of possessions. So smart, so active, strong, never misses a rotation. CMB is a completely different player, of course, but I had a lot of Caruso flashbacks watching CMB blow up plays like it's nothing. That's the kind of guy I'm willing to take a bet on.
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Re: 2025 Draft prospects - thread 2 

Post#424 » by sco » Thu Apr 24, 2025 1:10 pm

Andi Obst wrote:I've just recently started to take a closer look at some of the prospects, so I'll have some work to do, but CMB has easily been my favorite in the Bulls range so far. He's a unique player, which is both bad and good and it looks like it might make him available for the Bulls. I absolutely get the "tweener" and the shooting concerns, but all players in this range will have major question marks. CMB's defense is special, though. The kind of guy where you can turn on the game without knowing much about any player on the court and you'll be able to tell he's the best defender out there within a couple of possessions. So smart, so active, strong, never misses a rotation. CMB is a completely different player, of course, but I had a lot of Caruso flashbacks watching CMB blow up plays like it's nothing. That's the kind of guy I'm willing to take a bet on.

I will say that CMB gives me vibes as the 3rd Thompson twin. If we are keeping Coby, a guy like CMB would have a place in the rotation. I do think he and Maluach are the two draft for need top candidates, but at 12, neither would be a reach.
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Re: 2025 Draft prospects - thread 2 

Post#425 » by Jcool0 » Thu Apr 24, 2025 2:50 pm

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Re: 2025 Draft prospects - thread 2 

Post#426 » by kodo » Thu Apr 24, 2025 2:54 pm

History of the #12 pick
* - All Star

Nikola Topic
Derrick Lively
Jalen Williams *
Joshua Primo
Tyrese Haliburton * (worth noting he tanked his draft by refusing workouts)
PJ Washington
Miles Bridges
Luke Kennard
Taurean Prince
Trey Lyles
Dario Saric
Steven Adams
Jeremy Lamb
Alec Burks
Xavier Henry
Gerald Henderson
Jason Thompson
Thaddeus Young
Hilton Armstrong
Yaroslav Korolev
Robert Swift
Nick Collison
Melvin Ely
Vladimir Radmanovic
Etan Thomas
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Re: 2025 Draft prospects - thread 2 

Post#427 » by drosestruts » Thu Apr 24, 2025 3:53 pm

Pretty cool website with stats/charts/graphs about the draft class - https://www.draftcasual.com/home
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Re: 2025 Draft prospects - thread 2 

Post#428 » by sco » Thu Apr 24, 2025 5:27 pm

In recent mocks, I see guys with starter potential still around from picks 20-25. I wouldn't at all mind seeing if we could get a late first for Smith plus our 2nd...especially if we draft a C early.
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Re: 2025 Draft prospects - thread 2 

Post#429 » by Andi Obst » Fri Apr 25, 2025 7:34 am

drosestruts wrote:Pretty cool website with stats/charts/graphs about the draft class - https://www.draftcasual.com/home


This is great. Thanks for sharing.
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Re: 2025 Draft prospects - thread 2 

Post#430 » by LateNight » Fri Apr 25, 2025 2:01 pm

Eric Dailey Jr is intriguing. Athletic, versatile defender, shows promise as a shooter.
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Re: 2025 Draft prospects - thread 2 

Post#431 » by Chi town » Fri Apr 25, 2025 6:53 pm

My guy Beringer declares for the draft and says he’s 6’11 without shoes.

Hes my pick at 12 if Noa is gone. I could see him being picked above Maluach if he doesn’t do well in workout and Beringer does.


https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/280161/Joan-Beringer-Declares-For-2025-NBA-Draft
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Re: 2025 Draft prospects - thread 2 

Post#432 » by Chi town » Sat Apr 26, 2025 7:36 pm

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Re: 2025 Draft prospects - thread 2 

Post#433 » by sco » Sat Apr 26, 2025 7:50 pm


I like Carter Bryant...seems like he came on late, but has a high ceiling.
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Re: 2025 Draft prospects - thread 2 

Post#434 » by Chi town » Sat Apr 26, 2025 8:43 pm

sco wrote:

I like Carter Bryant...seems like he came on late, but has a high ceiling.


I hate saying this but I don’t think AK will pick a player that comps exactly as Pat if he was good. Where does Pat then play?
How does he rehab his value to be traded?

I do think AK will trade Pat the moment he can without attaching an asset.
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Re: 2025 Draft prospects - thread 2 

Post#435 » by sco » Sat Apr 26, 2025 8:47 pm

Chi town wrote:
sco wrote:

I like Carter Bryant...seems like he came on late, but has a high ceiling.


I hate saying this but I don’t think AK will pick a player that comps exactly as Pat if he was good. Where does Pat then play?
How does he rehab his value to be traded?

I do think AK will trade Pat the moment he can without attaching an asset.

I don't this season's pick is going to be able to find minutes as quickly or as many as Matas did this season, and he was brought along slowly. So that gives Pat plenty of rehab time.
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Re: 2025 Draft prospects - thread 2 

Post#436 » by 2weekswithpay » Sun Apr 27, 2025 3:13 am

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Re: 2025 Draft prospects - thread 2 

Post#437 » by kodo » Sun Apr 27, 2025 6:49 pm

I think it's interesting to go over old draft profiles of those players that succeeded beyond their draft rank within our draft range. Profiles are from The Ringer but generally most of the media sources agree on overall strengths/weaknesses.

Jard McCain (16): Good ballhandler, good shooter, poor athlete
Launches jumpers off the dribble with comfort from all ranges, and he can fire when moving from either side or into a stepback. Methodical ball handler who knows how to use pace, angles, and contact to generate space for himself. Talented, selfless passer who runs a composed pick-and-roll. He’s capable of making any pass and does a good job of reading the floor.

Lacks a quick first step, limiting his ability to create a ton of space. Sometimes he’s unable to turn the corner against longer defenders, which keeps him from getting all the way to the basket. Undersized, below-the-rim finisher who will need to rely on creative finishes to score around NBA length.

Jalen Williams (12): Good ball handler, poor athlete, poor defender
Good ball handler who has improved each year in college. Granted he played at a mid-major, but his height, feel, and vision are translatable at any level. He can facilitate pick-and-rolls and handoffs, or just keep the ball moving when he isn’t involved in an action. Does all the things a role player should do, including being a headsy cutter who runs the floor hard in transition.

Unless he has space to launch, he’s a below-the-rim finisher without much burst off the dribble, so his shot creation could be neutralized. He didn’t pop until his junior season even in the WCC, so there is some risk attached. Gets a bit loose with his left hand, leading to sloppy drives to the rim.

Sluggish moving laterally on defense, which doesn’t bode well early in his career unless he gets significantly quicker during pre-draft training or in his team’s strength and conditioning program.


Sengun (16): Good footwork, good passer, undersized, bad defender
He’s a dancer on the low post. He has unbelievable footwork, doesn’t predetermine his moves, and he can finish through tons of contact using either hand from difficult angles. He lives at the free throw line. Excellent passer with the upside to be an offensive hub. He facilitates from the post, the elbows, and even brings the ball up the court. Untapped shooting potential: He shot nearly 80 percent from the line this past year and has good touch around the rim.

He’s a nonshooter right now, but he has potential if he changes his mechanics—he has inconsistent footwork and it looks like his off-hand might be affecting his shot. He’s undersized as a true center so it might be a challenge for him to battle on the post against larger bigs. What is his position defensively? His slow feet and lack of verticality and length hold him back, meaning he’ll need to learn to be a positional defender.


Austin Reaves (undrafted): Good ballhandler/passer, good shooter, poor athlete
Smooth ball handler who has a good first step and can fluidly change direction, snaking through defenders to get where he wants with the ball. He’s not fast, but he’s shaky. Acrobatic and physical finisher around the rim who can use either hand and mixes in soft floaters away from the basket. Strong catch-and-shoot marksman who also hit 86.5 percent of his free throws as a senior, which bodes well for his future as a shooter. Creative playmaker who sees passing windows before they open, and he can deliver the ball using either hand from awkward angles.

Undersized as a wing standing at just 6-foot-4 with a 6-foot-6 wingspan, so he could be limited defending larger wings and forwards. Lacks the lateral quickness to stick with speedy guards. He could develop enough on defense to earn minutes, but lacks upside.


Haliburton (12): Good ballhandler/passer, good shooter, bad shooting form, bad finisher at the rim, bad defender
Always in control; he lacks lightning speed or explosiveness, but he uses subtle gear changes to throw defenders off balance, create room, and then strike. Creative playmaker with extraordinary vision and ambidextrous handles to deliver passes at all angles; he manipulates defenders with his eyes and dribble in the pick-and-roll, and has pinpoint accuracy on passes to rollers and shooters. Good spot-up shooter with deep NBA range, despite his odd form.

Lack of athleticism and burst limits his upside as a primary shot creator. Generally avoids contact at the rim, which forces him to settle for tough layups or low-percentage floaters. Made progress off the dribble as a sophomore, but still didn’t shoot well, and his stiff form raises concern.
Man-to-man defense: He stands in too much of an upright stance and moves laterally on his heels. Also takes poor angles fighting around screens.


There's definitely a pattern. These players dropped because of athleticism concerns but all had excellent ball control and passing IQ. Of course having both athleticism & IQ is ideal but then you're more looking at top 5 or at least top 10 players. If you're trying to find a gem while dumpster diving, it's been a good bet to look at players undervalued for athleticism issues (which all ended up not being a factor in the NBA).
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Re: 2025 Draft prospects - thread 2 

Post#438 » by Chi town » Sun Apr 27, 2025 8:21 pm

Well said Kodo.

There’s good players every draft at your spot. Just way more that suck. Gotta find em.
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Re: 2025 Draft prospects - thread 2 

Post#439 » by Jcool0 » Mon Apr 28, 2025 1:37 am

kodo wrote:I think it's interesting to go over old draft profiles of those players that succeeded beyond their draft rank within our draft range. Profiles are from The Ringer but generally most of the media sources agree on overall strengths/weaknesses.

Jard McCain (16): Good ballhandler, good shooter, poor athlete
Launches jumpers off the dribble with comfort from all ranges, and he can fire when moving from either side or into a stepback. Methodical ball handler who knows how to use pace, angles, and contact to generate space for himself. Talented, selfless passer who runs a composed pick-and-roll. He’s capable of making any pass and does a good job of reading the floor.

Lacks a quick first step, limiting his ability to create a ton of space. Sometimes he’s unable to turn the corner against longer defenders, which keeps him from getting all the way to the basket. Undersized, below-the-rim finisher who will need to rely on creative finishes to score around NBA length.

Jalen Williams (12): Good ball handler, poor athlete, poor defender
Good ball handler who has improved each year in college. Granted he played at a mid-major, but his height, feel, and vision are translatable at any level. He can facilitate pick-and-rolls and handoffs, or just keep the ball moving when he isn’t involved in an action. Does all the things a role player should do, including being a headsy cutter who runs the floor hard in transition.

Unless he has space to launch, he’s a below-the-rim finisher without much burst off the dribble, so his shot creation could be neutralized. He didn’t pop until his junior season even in the WCC, so there is some risk attached. Gets a bit loose with his left hand, leading to sloppy drives to the rim.

Sluggish moving laterally on defense, which doesn’t bode well early in his career unless he gets significantly quicker during pre-draft training or in his team’s strength and conditioning program.


Sengun (16): Good footwork, good passer, undersized, bad defender
He’s a dancer on the low post. He has unbelievable footwork, doesn’t predetermine his moves, and he can finish through tons of contact using either hand from difficult angles. He lives at the free throw line. Excellent passer with the upside to be an offensive hub. He facilitates from the post, the elbows, and even brings the ball up the court. Untapped shooting potential: He shot nearly 80 percent from the line this past year and has good touch around the rim.

He’s a nonshooter right now, but he has potential if he changes his mechanics—he has inconsistent footwork and it looks like his off-hand might be affecting his shot. He’s undersized as a true center so it might be a challenge for him to battle on the post against larger bigs. What is his position defensively? His slow feet and lack of verticality and length hold him back, meaning he’ll need to learn to be a positional defender.


Austin Reaves (undrafted): Good ballhandler/passer, good shooter, poor athlete
Smooth ball handler who has a good first step and can fluidly change direction, snaking through defenders to get where he wants with the ball. He’s not fast, but he’s shaky. Acrobatic and physical finisher around the rim who can use either hand and mixes in soft floaters away from the basket. Strong catch-and-shoot marksman who also hit 86.5 percent of his free throws as a senior, which bodes well for his future as a shooter. Creative playmaker who sees passing windows before they open, and he can deliver the ball using either hand from awkward angles.

Undersized as a wing standing at just 6-foot-4 with a 6-foot-6 wingspan, so he could be limited defending larger wings and forwards. Lacks the lateral quickness to stick with speedy guards. He could develop enough on defense to earn minutes, but lacks upside.


Haliburton (12): Good ballhandler/passer, good shooter, bad shooting form, bad finisher at the rim, bad defender
Always in control; he lacks lightning speed or explosiveness, but he uses subtle gear changes to throw defenders off balance, create room, and then strike. Creative playmaker with extraordinary vision and ambidextrous handles to deliver passes at all angles; he manipulates defenders with his eyes and dribble in the pick-and-roll, and has pinpoint accuracy on passes to rollers and shooters. Good spot-up shooter with deep NBA range, despite his odd form.

Lack of athleticism and burst limits his upside as a primary shot creator. Generally avoids contact at the rim, which forces him to settle for tough layups or low-percentage floaters. Made progress off the dribble as a sophomore, but still didn’t shoot well, and his stiff form raises concern.
Man-to-man defense: He stands in too much of an upright stance and moves laterally on his heels. Also takes poor angles fighting around screens.


There's definitely a pattern. These players dropped because of athleticism concerns but all had excellent ball control and passing IQ. Of course having both athleticism & IQ is ideal but then you're more looking at top 5 or at least top 10 players. If you're trying to find a gem while dumpster diving, it's been a good bet to look at players undervalued for athleticism issues (which all ended up not being a factor in the NBA).


Tre Johnson. Not a great athlete and not great size but good length. Bad defender. Big time scorer and good ball handler. The Ringer had him 10th on there big board, though he probably goes higher.



Kasparas Jakucionis seems to be dropping do to a lackluster 2nd half. First 15: 16.7 on 51/41/87 (5.1 3PA & 5.1 FTA) with 5.4 rebounds and 5.4 assists. Last 18: 13.7 on 39/23/82 (5.2 3PA & 5.1 FTA) with 5.9 rebounds and 4.2 assists. How bad was the left forearm injury?

Comparison:
Tyrese Haliburton. 2019: first 12: 17.7 ppg on 52/42/75 (6.3 3PA & 2.3 FTA) with 6.3 rebounds and 5.9 assists (2.4 tvo). 7-5 record. Last 10: 12.3 ppg on 46/41/94 (5.1 3PA & 1.7 FTA) with 5.4 rebounds and 4.2 assists (3.2 tvo). 3-7 record.
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Re: 2025 Draft prospects - thread 2 

Post#440 » by DuckIII » Mon Apr 28, 2025 12:56 pm

Jcool0 wrote:Kasparas Jakucionis seems to be dropping do to a lackluster 2nd half. First 15: 16.7 on 51/41/87 (5.1 3PA & 5.1 FTA) with 5.4 rebounds and 5.4 assists. Last 18: 13.7 on 39/23/82 (5.2 3PA & 5.1 FTA) with 5.9 rebounds and 4.2 assists. How bad was the left forearm injury?



I’m not going to pretend to have deeply connected personal contacts in the program. Its friend of a friend stuff so take it for what it’s worth. But a good friend of mine who is a HS varsity basketball coach and is from the Champaign area with a friend in the program said the forearm injury was much worse than revealed to the public and that he was playing through significant pain with borderline medical approval.
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