Who was at fault on this Butler injury?

[Indomitable]

Amen was reckless in his attempt to grab his own rebound.... but it was a freak accident. Amen tried to squeeze through Adams and Green but did not have proper footing, literally just shoving his body inbetween them with no footing. Then Adams hip pushes Amen and Amen further trips on Green's leg and Butler is there. Freak accident, but caused by Amen Thompson for being reckless in the paint.

Thompson has no business trying to squeeze through without proper footing under him. Because this is what happens, you lose your footing and trip on the floor and become an injury danger to other players.

Amen has played ball his entire life. It was careless and he is most at fault. I doubt he was trying to hurt anyone but obviously he was not concerned if he did.

[Indomitable]

This just shows me he is just a dirty player and will have 50 more plays like that by the end of his career.

He allowed Herro to get in his head. He definitely let his emotions get the best of him that night. Herro was cooking him all night and let him know about it. Amen let it trigger him and he shouldn't have.

There is a world of difference between that and accidentally falling into Butler. The fact that there are so many Warriors fans running with this 'Amen is dirty and he definitely meant to hurt Butler' narrative **** crazy.

And the poll has more than twice as many people blaming Draymond than Thompson. Not to mention there are still people saying Draymond pushed him, when there is literal video evidence of Draymond holding him back, which is crazy. People are biased, water is wet, news at 11. What are you gonna do.

Most people do not realize Amen and his brother are physical cheap shot type players.

Green has over a decade of nonsense.

[Indomitable]

Copy pasted from another board. Watched the Amen/Butler incident a few times now. Don't think it's completely intentional or accidental. It looks like it Amen wasn't pushed, he moved his body into Butler to add physicality into the play. More reckless than anything. It fits into the gritty style of play of between the teams so I'd chalk it up to an accident.

This means he is at fault. Accidents always has a person who is at fault.

[ryguy613]

There's a better angle that you apparently have not seen. Draymond didn't shove anything. Thompson was hip pushed by Adams and then tripped on Draymond's leg, because Thompson had no feet under him, being reckless trying for his own rebound

I literally just posted a video and gave the exact timecode where you can see Draymond push Thompson... successfully... which is why Thompson ended up on the ground... its not hard to see. Go to 37 seconds into the video. There is no other way to see this. Draymond knew he didnt box Thompson out so he idiotically threw his body weight backwards, knowing that's where Thompson was, to try and push him out of the way. This is not a basketball play. its not boxing out. its not unlucky. Draymond knew where Thompson was and figured hed use some old vet tough playoff moves on him... and he caused the dude to fall on his teammates legs. Thats just what happened people...

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I am no Draymond fan, but I also think you're incorrect here. The replay view posted earlier pretty clearly shows that it is Adams who first makes contact with Thompson as he tries to get around Podz. He (accidentally) hip checks him, which sends him forward. Draymond has his arm and leg out in what appears to me a reasonable attempt to box out, but that then trips Thompson after the bump from Adams. The contact from Thompson spins Draymond around. The little vertical video from a page or two ago pretty clearly shows that Draymond wasn't doing much pushing. The only one that makes it look like it does is this distant, cross court angle where you can't actually see the moment of contact between players.

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Look at seconds 6-7 of the second. It's clearly Adams bumping him that sends him flying over Draymond's leg, not Draymond pushing him. Draymond has pretty much all of his body in front of Thompson, I'm not sure how he even could push him from that exact position.

I feel like we got a real Laurel Yanny situation going on right now. kinda blowing my mind

[MarcusBrody]

I literally just posted a video and gave the exact timecode where you can see Draymond push Thompson... successfully... which is why Thompson ended up on the ground... its not hard to see. Go to 37 seconds into the video. There is no other way to see this. Draymond knew he didnt box Thompson out so he idiotically threw his body weight backwards, knowing that's where Thompson was, to try and push him out of the way. This is not a basketball play. its not boxing out. its not unlucky. Draymond knew where Thompson was and figured hed use some old vet tough playoff moves on him... and he caused the dude to fall on his teammates legs. Thats just what happened people...

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I am no Draymond fan, but I also think you're incorrect here. The replay view posted earlier pretty clearly shows that it is Adams who first makes contact with Thompson as he tries to get around Podz. He (accidentally) hip checks him, which sends him forward. Draymond has his arm and leg out in what appears to me a reasonable attempt to box out, but that then trips Thompson after the bump from Adams. The contact from Thompson spins Draymond around. The little vertical video from a page or two ago pretty clearly shows that Draymond wasn't doing much pushing. The only one that makes it look like it does is this distant, cross court angle where you can't actually see the moment of contact between players.

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Look at seconds 6-7 of the second. It's clearly Adams bumping him that sends him flying over Draymond's leg, not Draymond pushing him. Draymond has pretty much all of his body in front of Thompson, I'm not sure how he even could push him from that exact position.

I feel like we got a real Laurel Yanny situation going on right now. kinda blowing my mind

This is the frame from the moment Adams starts to make contact with Thompson. Draymond's arm, leg, hip, butt are all in front of Amen. There is literally no physical way that he can push him from this position.

And now a moment into the contact, he's now past Draymond, and Draymond is spun a bit - which you interpret as Draymond pushing him - but look at his legs, look at his position compared to a frame before, he is clearly moving forward from contact with Adams rather than Draymond. He's moving in the wrong direction for Draymond to have pushed him. See where the planted front foot is in relation to Thompson's body in the first vs second frame. Even Draymond can't push someone so the move toward rather than away from him.


Adam's collides with Amen, who then trips over Draymond's front leg.

[hugepatsfan]

Looked like Adams was fighting for position in a totally normal basketball way. Thompson was crashing the boards in a totally normal basketball way. They crosses paths and Thompson tripped in a physically natural motion which unfortunately put Butler in a compromising position. I don't really see any "fault" there.

[hugepatsfan]

If you want to "blame" Draymond it looks like he stuck his leg out as opposed to a proper box out - akin to an illegal screen. Thompson then shifted to his right to avoid that which moved him into Adams path which was what knocked him over. I wouldn't call that dirty by Draymond though or anything out of the ordinary (let's not pretend everyone boxes out with perfect form).

[Dick Tate]

Green clearly pulled on Thompson's bicep and sent him off balance towards Butler.

[dhsilv2]

Obviously an accident but looks to me like Green purposely tripped or tried to impede Thompson on the rebound which caused him to undercut Jimmy. Could have been accidental though, happened very quickly

Isn't that called boxing out? Purposely trying to impede.

[Bornstellar]

Obviously an accident but looks to me like Green purposely tripped or tried to impede Thompson on the rebound which caused him to undercut Jimmy. Could have been accidental though, happened very quickly

Isn't that called boxing out? Purposely trying to impede.

Didn't look like a normal box out to me tbh

[Jcity08]

Ive watched thr clips a dozen times at different angles, this was a freak accident.

[dhsilv2]

Obviously an accident but looks to me like Green purposely tripped or tried to impede Thompson on the rebound which caused him to undercut Jimmy. Could have been accidental though, happened very quickly

Isn't that called boxing out? Purposely trying to impede.

Didn't look like a normal box out to me tbh

he kinda had that one leg up...not sure why or how. But isn't a box out normally you widen your arms and legs to impede the guy from getting around you to the ball?

[Bornstellar]

Isn't that called boxing out? Purposely trying to impede.

Didn't look like a normal box out to me tbh

he kinda had that one leg up...not sure why or how. But isn't a box out normally you widen your arms and legs to impede the guy from getting around you to the ball?

[Bobbymcgee]

Draymond knew he was getting beat to the rebound so he stuck his leg out to trip Amen Thompson. Too bad because Draymond just ended up injuring his own teammate with his dirty play.

[MrPainfulTruth]

Some guys in this thread think the players can activate bullet time in critical situations. As if Draymond could possibly calculate how the dominoes fall. It was just an unfortunate fall, i dont see anything malicious here. In this post season alone i've seen much worse. The thing i find the most reckless is diving into players legs or flopping backwards into them. That isnt basketball. But this play here? Its part of the fact that the basket is there and you fight for position on the rebound.

[MrPainfulTruth]

Isn't that called boxing out? Purposely trying to impede.

Didn't look like a normal box out to me tbh

he kinda had that one leg up...not sure why or how. But isn't a box out normally you widen your arms and legs to impede the guy from getting around you to the ball?

There are rules. You are entitled to your cylinder taht is exactly drawn up in the rule book. You can stand a bit over shoulder wide, and have the arms angled upwards, that is the legendary "legal defensive position". If you extend your arms all the way sideways its clearly not legal any more.

[Kiss of Death]

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[DoubleLintendre]

Copy pasted from another board. Watched the Amen/Butler incident a few times now. Don't think it's completely intentional or accidental. It looks like it Amen wasn't pushed, he moved his body into Butler to add physicality into the play. More reckless than anything. It fits into the gritty style of play of between the teams so I'd chalk it up to an accident.

you are completely wrong about this. What are you people watching? Go to 37 seconds into this video. Draymond knows he hasnt properly boxed out Thompson so he very clearly very purposefully throws his body weight behind him in a successful attempt to push Thompson out of the way. This is not a Rorschach test. That literally is just what happened there.

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You're adding an intent and hindsight to your view of the play.

Amen Thompson starts the play behind Draymond and Draymond is attempting to box out everyone in the vicinity. A box out is supposed to keep a player from getting to the basket. There's no reason for Draymond to push Thompson, who is not in his line of sight, towards the basket intentionally.

Thompson took the shot. He's the last person to enter this play. He tried to squeeze through the box out and got tangled up. Bumps into Draymond, bumps into Adam, falls forward into Butler.

Edit: to be clear -- I don't fault Thompson even though he's probably the biggest component of the injury. I view it as an accident and part of physical basketball.

[ryguy613]

Copy pasted from another board. Watched the Amen/Butler incident a few times now. Don't think it's completely intentional or accidental. It looks like it Amen wasn't pushed, he moved his body into Butler to add physicality into the play. More reckless than anything. It fits into the gritty style of play of between the teams so I'd chalk it up to an accident.

you are completely wrong about this. What are you people watching? Go to 37 seconds into this video. Draymond knows he hasnt properly boxed out Thompson so he very clearly very purposefully throws his body weight behind him in a successful attempt to push Thompson out of the way. This is not a Rorschach test. That literally is just what happened there.

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You're adding an intent and hindsight to your view of the play.

Amen Thompson starts the play behind Draymond and Draymond is attempting to box out everyone in the vicinity. A box out is supposed to keep a player from getting to the basket. There's no reason for Draymond to push Thompson, who is not in his line of sight, towards the basket intentionally.

Thompson took the shot. He's the last person to enter this play. He tried to squeeze through the box out and got tangled up. Bumps into Draymond, bumps into Adam, falls forward into Butler.

Edit: to be clear -- I don't fault Thompson even though he's probably the biggest component of the injury. I view it as an accident and part of physical basketball.

Draymond moved his body forcefully in the direction of Thompson, who had gotten behind him before he could box out. he definitely know where Thompson was and was trying to get him off balance. i dont know how people cant see that.

[DoubleLintendre]

you are completely wrong about this. What are you people watching? Go to 37 seconds into this video. Draymond knows he hasnt properly boxed out Thompson so he very clearly very purposefully throws his body weight behind him in a successful attempt to push Thompson out of the way. This is not a Rorschach test. That literally is just what happened there.

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You're adding an intent and hindsight to your view of the play.

Amen Thompson starts the play behind Draymond and Draymond is attempting to box out everyone in the vicinity. A box out is supposed to keep a player from getting to the basket. There's no reason for Draymond to push Thompson, who is not in his line of sight, towards the basket intentionally.

Thompson took the shot. He's the last person to enter this play. He tried to squeeze through the box out and got tangled up. Bumps into Draymond, bumps into Adam, falls forward into Butler.

Edit: to be clear -- I don't fault Thompson even though he's probably the biggest component of the injury. I view it as an accident and part of physical basketball.

Draymond moved his body forcefully in the direction of Thompson, who had gotten behind him before he could box out. he definitely know where Thompson was and was trying to get him off balance. i dont know how people cant see that.

How can you determine what Draymond "definitely" intended to do when he took his eyes off Thompson after the shot attempt?

Draymond is also boxing out Adams, so he will normally move sideways (to get in front of Adams) will then try to hold his ground to seal off any players behind him (Adams or Thompson) from getting the rebound. That's a typical box out.