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The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1

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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1 

Post#961 » by Ghost of Kleine » Fri Apr 25, 2025 9:10 pm

BobbieL wrote:
ChuckS wrote:
BobbieL wrote:
Durant - better player, no question

CP3 - better player next to Booker as a teammate. Elevates his teammates game

The goal is to win the last I checked and with CP 3 - Devin Booker was winning more games.


I mostly agree. But I've never seen two superstars mesh so favorably that both finished a season with nearly identical 27PPG averages. This suggested to me that they were able to co-exist without sacrificing their immense talents, by deferring only to the hot hand. It could be argued that they are both better mid range players, but they shoot threes so well that I think that is a plus, as is the ability of all great players to ISO.

On the other hand, I believe that a good point guard maximizes the worth of any scorer. And CP3 is one of the best. I think, next to overall size, that has been our biggest weakness. I liked Jones but thought he was poor at getting the ball to our best player when necessary. This was less harmful to Booker as a combo guard. A big is more affected. In one Milwaukee game, after we blew a lead and fell behind in the last few minutes, Eddie Johnson plaintively pleaded: "Get the ball to Durant -- please". We did and KD hit a long three to go back in the lead, Two plays later we were down again with seconds to go. Johnson said something like: They won't let KD beat them. Look for Booker. Sure enough Book hit the game winner. I believe that we are better with both and a good point guard. Most of all I think those who believe KD and Book are our problems should listen more to someone like Johnson who has reason to know better.


I understand there will be a new coach - and sure - maybe, that coach can get more out of the team
But if you are keeping Booker and Durant - the roster is not improving
Even if you trade Beal -- what are you getting back and what is the cost to trade him?

So yes, Book and Durant will still score there 25+ ppg game - but what will the record be and will they be in the playoffs?
I don't see it


They won't make the playoffs though. IF keeping BOTH KD and Booker, at best we may be able to make incremental improvements on the margins that "MAYBE" could bring in an additional 4-5 wins if lucky?? But then what, Even with both of them playing, we've still gotten progressively worse each season.

And is great as KD has been/ is, he's only getting older and he'll inevitably fall off a cliff at any point in the next couple of seasons and won't be the true needle mover needed to validate his salary, etc.

His value will become neutral at best with his contractual cost, Booker will be closer to 30, and we'll still be fighting to just make the play in tournament IF everything goes verybright for us and we stay healthy too. This is just one of those examples of being in severe denial and rationalizing very mediocre outcomes to satiate feelings of sentiment towards what might have been.

But in the end, each season we hold onto this is ine more year added to our INEVITABLE rebuild!! It's utterly pointless and exponentially damaging to our long term future as well. :-?
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1 

Post#962 » by BobbieL » Fri Apr 25, 2025 9:16 pm

Ghost of Kleine wrote:
BobbieL wrote:
ChuckS wrote:
I mostly agree. But I've never seen two superstars mesh so favorably that both finished a season with nearly identical 27PPG averages. This suggested to me that they were able to co-exist without sacrificing their immense talents, by deferring only to the hot hand. It could be argued that they are both better mid range players, but they shoot threes so well that I think that is a plus, as is the ability of all great players to ISO.

On the other hand, I believe that a good point guard maximizes the worth of any scorer. And CP3 is one of the best. I think, next to overall size, that has been our biggest weakness. I liked Jones but thought he was poor at getting the ball to our best player when necessary. This was less harmful to Booker as a combo guard. A big is more affected. In one Milwaukee game, after we blew a lead and fell behind in the last few minutes, Eddie Johnson plaintively pleaded: "Get the ball to Durant -- please". We did and KD hit a long three to go back in the lead, Two plays later we were down again with seconds to go. Johnson said something like: They won't let KD beat them. Look for Booker. Sure enough Book hit the game winner. I believe that we are better with both and a good point guard. Most of all I think those who believe KD and Book are our problems should listen more to someone like Johnson who has reason to know better.


I understand there will be a new coach - and sure - maybe, that coach can get more out of the team
But if you are keeping Booker and Durant - the roster is not improving
Even if you trade Beal -- what are you getting back and what is the cost to trade him?

So yes, Book and Durant will still score there 25+ ppg game - but what will the record be and will they be in the playoffs?
I don't see it


They won't make the playoffs though. IF keeping BOTH KD and Booker, at best we may be able to make incremental improvements on the margins that "MAYBE" could bring in an additional 4-5 wins if lucky?? But then what, Even with both of them playing, we've still gotten progressively worse each season.

And is great as KD has been/ is, he's only getting older and he'll inevitably fall off a cliff at any point in the next couple of seasons and won't be the true needle mover needed to validate his salary, etc.

His value will become neutral at best with his contractual cost, Booker will be closer to 30, and we'll still be fighting to just make the play in tournament IF everything goes verybright for us and we stay healthy too. This is just one of those examples of being in severe denial and rationalizing very mediocre outcomes to satiate feelings of sentiment towards what might have been.

But in the end, each season we hold onto this is ine more year added to our INEVITABLE rebuild!! It's utterly pointless and exponentially damaging to our long term future as well. :-?


Preaching to the choir. And if they extend Booker - won't say he is untradeable but the value might go down as teams have to take on that contract.
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1 

Post#963 » by Ghost of Kleine » Fri Apr 25, 2025 9:20 pm

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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1 

Post#964 » by Ghost of Kleine » Fri Apr 25, 2025 9:24 pm

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As I briefly mentioned before, The New Orleans Pels could be an intriguing team to watch for in the pursuit of Giannis for a swap of Giannis for Zion/ Murray, picks, etc.
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1 

Post#965 » by Ghost of Kleine » Fri Apr 25, 2025 9:26 pm

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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1 

Post#966 » by BobbieL » Fri Apr 25, 2025 9:29 pm

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She is right but I think Booker is more interested in 2/149 than winning an NBA Title
Ishbia will guarantee him another 150m
Going to the Rockets doesn't guarantee that
Also in Phoenix - he will be the star of the team. I think he likes that

Said it earlier - you want to test the loyalty of DBook - just don't offer that extension - my guess, Houston would be looking pretty damn good to him
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1 

Post#967 » by Sunsdeuce » Fri Apr 25, 2025 9:46 pm

BobbieL wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
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She is right but I think Booker is more interested in 2/149 than winning an NBA Title
Ishbia will guarantee him another 150m
Going to the Rockets doesn't guarantee that
Also in Phoenix - he will be the star of the team. I think he likes that

Said it earlier - you want to test the loyalty of DBook - just don't offer that extension - my guess, Houston would be looking pretty damn good to him

Booker is all about Booker. He cares about his stats. He doesn’t care about the Suns or the history of the Suns. All he cares about is seeing his name on the top of a list associated with the Suns. I’m over him and his game. He ain’t loyal to the Suns. He’s loyal to the Suns money.
I am such a lucky NBA fan. 8647 My favorite team went from the most greedy and racist owner to the most ego driven dumbass owner in all of sports fdt.

Only a fan of Arizona teams!
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1 

Post#968 » by BobbieL » Fri Apr 25, 2025 9:59 pm

Sunsdeuce wrote:
BobbieL wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
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She is right but I think Booker is more interested in 2/149 than winning an NBA Title
Ishbia will guarantee him another 150m
Going to the Rockets doesn't guarantee that
Also in Phoenix - he will be the star of the team. I think he likes that

Said it earlier - you want to test the loyalty of DBook - just don't offer that extension - my guess, Houston would be looking pretty damn good to him

Booker is all about Booker. He cares about his stats. He doesn’t care about the Suns or the history of the Suns. All he cares about is seeing his name on the top of a list associated with the Suns. I’m over him and his game. He ain’t loyal to the Suns. He’s loyal to the Suns money.


I am kind of like you but I actually think Durant leaving will be better for the Suns, the team and Booker.
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1 

Post#969 » by Rebound Mound » Fri Apr 25, 2025 10:43 pm

BobbieL wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Read on Twitter


She is right but I think Booker is more interested in 2/149 than winning an NBA Title
Ishbia will guarantee him another 150m
Going to the Rockets doesn't guarantee that
Also in Phoenix - he will be the star of the team. I think he likes that

Said it earlier - you want to test the loyalty of DBook - just don't offer that extension - my guess, Houston would be looking pretty damn good to him


I do not know whether he is still in a relation with one of the members of the satanic family. But that talks loud about his preferences in life.
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1 

Post#970 » by Rebound Mound » Fri Apr 25, 2025 10:50 pm

Sabonis is one of those players that you love and would like to have in your team, but I am not sure whether he is like a yellow convertible for two when you ar a father in a family of 5. I mean, he is likeable, but is he really the C we need.

He is 6-10 with excellent foot work, strong, good rebounder. But too short for the C spot, although a tremendoues passer (just behind Jokic and possibly, Sengun). He is not a shooter, although some improvement could be attained there.

So, if he is going to play with an athletic PF who can shoot, then he is a good option and those two would be a great fit. I mean, if Sabonis is going to play with Jabari, then it is a good, solid inside option with room to develop.

How can we obtain both when we have KD, Beal, ONeale, Allen and Richards to trade? I do not think we can trade Beal to the KIngs, as they already have Lavine, in addition. I do not think they are going to accept a deal for small pieces for Sabas. Unless they want to rebuild, but we do not have expirings or picks to donate.

Can we ship KD to Houston for Jabari and VV and ship VV to the KIngs for Sabas?
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1 

Post#971 » by BobbieL » Fri Apr 25, 2025 11:21 pm

Rebound Mound wrote:
BobbieL wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Read on Twitter


She is right but I think Booker is more interested in 2/149 than winning an NBA Title
Ishbia will guarantee him another 150m
Going to the Rockets doesn't guarantee that
Also in Phoenix - he will be the star of the team. I think he likes that

Said it earlier - you want to test the loyalty of DBook - just don't offer that extension - my guess, Houston would be looking pretty damn good to him


I do not know whether he is still in a relation with one of the members of the satanic family. But that talks loud about his preferences in life.


he is not dating Jenner anymore
but I do think Booker likes the notoriety
I think he likes being the best player on the Suns , points leader, getting paid
and that is fine, let him get the bag
just have it on another team as I don't think he is the leader the suns need - meaning he is not a player to build around
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1 

Post#972 » by thamadkant » Sat Apr 26, 2025 12:50 am

BobbieL wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Read on Twitter


She is right but I think Booker is more interested in 2/149 than winning an NBA Title
Ishbia will guarantee him another 150m
Going to the Rockets doesn't guarantee that
Also in Phoenix - he will be the star of the team. I think he likes that

Said it earlier - you want to test the loyalty of DBook - just don't offer that extension - my guess, Houston would be looking pretty damn good to him


This.

Booker wants that ultra max... winning be damned... considering he wouldn't be main star on a good contender
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1 

Post#973 » by bwgood77 » Sat Apr 26, 2025 1:00 am

BobbieL wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
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Thats just nonsense if Ishbia thinks he can get close to what he paid for Durant

I think that is just news for the media to send a message about Durant and his value


This is absurd, so par for the course for Ishbia. First of all, it's one of the worst trades of all time. We gave away basically 8 unprotected firsts, 5 seconds, an unprotected swap and Cam Johnson.

Also, he had just extended for 4 years, so we knew he was under contract and could not leave for quite a while.

Now he's 2 1/2 years older (and he was already old), and has 1 year left on his contract.

We will be lucky to get 2 1sts, 2 prospects and filler. But probably 1 first, 2 prospects and filler, or 2 firsts, one prospect and filler.

Ishbia will probably refuse to trade him, give him a huge extension, and then he will have a career ending injury.
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1 

Post#974 » by Ghost of Kleine » Sat Apr 26, 2025 2:41 am

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Brought Trent Jr up as a potential vet minimum signing option for if we trade Allen. Not bad production for a minimum guy. :wink:
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1 

Post#975 » by Ghost of Kleine » Sat Apr 26, 2025 3:16 am

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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1 

Post#976 » by BobbieL » Sat Apr 26, 2025 3:25 am

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Thanks for posting… still hope for Bob Myers

Beal - stay strong Brad - don’t take the buyout

Get max cap space in 2027
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1 

Post#977 » by Ghost of Kleine » Sat Apr 26, 2025 5:48 am

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Add another team in Denver to the list of multiple KD suitors this summer! Once they get bounced early, out of fear of losing a frustrated Jokic, they'll be pretty desperate for sure!

Give me a package of Porter Jr/ Nnaji/ Westbrook/ Braun/ Holmes/ Hunter/ DEN 31' 1st.
** Trade Allen/ Holmes to Charlotte for Mark Williams/ CHO 25' 2nd (33rd pick) / NOP 25' 2nd (33th pick).
** Trade O'neale for Sochan.
** Sign Chris Paul and Gary Trent Jr in free agency (Vet minimum).

29- Yaxel Lendeborg or Alex Condon.
33- Adou Thiero.
34- Rocco Zisarky or Ryan Kalkbrenner.
54- John Tonje or Cedric Coward.

RW / Booker/ Dunn/ Porter Jr/ M Williams.
Paul/ Trent Jr/ Sochan/ Nnaji/ Richards.
Gillespie/ Braun/ Thiero/ Oso/ Kalkbrenner.

G league development ( two way contracts)
1- Yaxel Lendeborg.
2- John Tonje.
3- Obinna anuchili Killen.
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1 

Post#978 » by Saberestar » Sat Apr 26, 2025 11:47 am

Another high risk high reward player would be Mark Williams from the Hornets.

I know that the Lakers canceled the trade but he kept playing after the trade deadline with some game DNP here and there and he was the same very good starting C anytime he played for his team.

Not sure about what is the biggest concern about his health, probably some foot issues, but he is an impactful young player. Can he play over 60 games per season in his prime?

Next year it will be his 4th season in the league and he would want a new contract. If we can get him we would have his rights to match any offer and we can see how injury prone he is o he isn't for real.

We can send Cody Martin back to Charlotte next to our two late FRPs available for a trade.

I think they would want more for him
Knetch and 1 unprotected FRP is much more than the offer that I said but probably his value is lower this summer. Just an idea to try a different thing.
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1 

Post#979 » by Frank Lee » Sat Apr 26, 2025 12:05 pm

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whotf is Duane Rankin I asked… looked him up and see that he is a columnist for the Az rep… who is Rachel nichols… another tv mouthpiece… so we have an obvious genius moment from Nichols that’s been recycled for the past month and now quoted by a lazy azz clickbait reporter ….and it’s spoon fed to the hungry fan junkies who gobble it up as if it’s news or some justification revelation.

What a joke mass media has made of journalism.
What ? Me Worry ?
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1 

Post#980 » by sunsfan1o1 » Sat Apr 26, 2025 1:28 pm

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Add another team in Denver to the list of multiple KD suitors this summer! Once they get bounced early, out of fear of losing a frustrated Jokic, they'll be pretty desperate for sure!

Give me a package of Porter Jr/ Nnaji/ Westbrook/ Braun/ Holmes/ Hunter/ DEN 31' 1st.
** Trade Allen/ Holmes to Charlotte for Mark Williams/ CHO 25' 2nd (33rd pick) / NOP 25' 2nd (33th pick).
** Trade O'neale for Sochan.
** Sign Chris Paul and Gary Trent Jr in free agency (Vet minimum).

29- Yaxel Lendeborg or Alex Condon.
33- Adou Thiero.
34- Rocco Zisarky or Ryan Kalkbrenner.
54- John Tonje or Cedric Coward.

RW / Booker/ Dunn/ Porter Jr/ M Williams.
Paul/ Trent Jr/ Sochan/ Nnaji/ Richards.
Gillespie/ Braun/ Thiero/ Oso/ Kalkbrenner.

G league development ( two way contracts)
1- Yaxel Lendeborg.
2- John Tonje.
3- Obinna anuchili Killen.

That team is awful. Not making the play in with that

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