Game 4 - Pistons-Knicks - 1pm ET

[Moses ShamMoses]

Who knows if Ivey would have made a big difference in the playoff game outcomes. I sure don't. However, if we want to be better than teams like the knicks someday soon, we'll need someone like Ivey (or possible Ausar) to develop into an all-star to take some pressure off Cade. He needs help beyond what the grizzled vets can provide.

[Kalamazoo317]

Ausar at least needs to develop a competent offensive game. Some of his offensive reps in game 4 could've made the difference in a pretty tight overall game. Just can't have wasted possessions like that in high leverage games.

[VicVinegar]

Crazy how differently the teams scored in Game 4:

Pistons 29/55 from two (53%), 7/29 from three (24%)
Knicks 19/58 from two (33%), 15/33 from three (46%)

[Rockazoids]

Long time Knicks fan coming in peace. There have been some exciting games so far. This was probably the worst officiated game I've seen in a while (on both ends). There were lots of fouls that weren't called -- Knicks just got away with the last one. At least the refs were swallowing the whistle on both ends.

There are calls that might have impacted something.

Respectfully though there is only one that unambiguously determined the outcome of a game.

I’m not saying Knicks fans should feel guilty or anything like that. If the shoe was on the other foot we’d be happily enjoying our win- I appreciate you coming on here to discuss it. But we’ve got sound reason to be upset with the officiating on balance.

I come in peace too, Snakebites but have you seen this clip? If it was reviewed wouldn't they call the first foul on Hart?

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[Snakebites]

Long time Knicks fan coming in peace. There have been some exciting games so far. This was probably the worst officiated game I've seen in a while (on both ends). There were lots of fouls that weren't called -- Knicks just got away with the last one. At least the refs were swallowing the whistle on both ends.

There are calls that might have impacted something.

Respectfully though there is only one that unambiguously determined the outcome of a game.

I’m not saying Knicks fans should feel guilty or anything like that. If the shoe was on the other foot we’d be happily enjoying our win- I appreciate you coming on here to discuss it. But we’ve got sound reason to be upset with the officiating on balance.

I come in peace too, Snakebites but have you seen this clip? If it was reviewed wouldn't they call the first foul on Hart?

Read on Twitter

That seems fairly consistent with things that have gone uncalled all series.

On the other hand we’ve seen Brunson get the call they refused to give THJ on that shot multiple times.

The refs determined this game in one teams favor. I totally get why Knicks fans don’t want that to be the case, and as I said they don’t owe anyone any apologies or explanations. The win is theirs to enjoy. It happens.

But it did happen.

[Rockazoids]

There are calls that might have impacted something.

Respectfully though there is only one that unambiguously determined the outcome of a game.

I’m not saying Knicks fans should feel guilty or anything like that. If the shoe was on the other foot we’d be happily enjoying our win- I appreciate you coming on here to discuss it. But we’ve got sound reason to be upset with the officiating on balance.

I come in peace too, Snakebites but have you seen this clip? If it was reviewed wouldn't they call the first foul on Hart?

Read on Twitter

That seems fairly consistent with things that have gone uncalled all series.

On the other hand we’ve seen Brunson get the call they refused to give THJ on that shot multiple times.

The refs determined this game in one teams favor. I totally get why Knicks fans don’t want that to be the case, and as I said they don’t owe anyone any apologies or explanations. The win is theirs to enjoy. It happens.

But it did happen.

As physical as that was games Brunson had 2 free throws.
THJ should had try to make the shot instead of kicking his leg out looking for a foul right?

[Phenomenonsense]

I'd never expect, nor should anyone expect, to be bailed out on that call at the end of the game. Shouldn't be the way games are decided unless Hart tackled THJ out of the air. Cade had a good shot that he makes very often, happened to miss it, tough loss, but the team didn't deserve to win based off of how they played. Excuses will never help the youngins see what playoff ball is about, and this is the type of scrappy, close series that should lead to harder work in the off-season. Cade has had a very good showing for his first playoff series and I expect us to win the next game, but still I am sticking with Knicks in 6.

[Snakebites]

I come in peace too, Snakebites but have you seen this clip? If it was reviewed wouldn't they call the first foul on Hart?

Read on Twitter

That seems fairly consistent with things that have gone uncalled all series.

On the other hand we’ve seen Brunson get the call they refused to give THJ on that shot multiple times.

The refs determined this game in one teams favor. I totally get why Knicks fans don’t want that to be the case, and as I said they don’t owe anyone any apologies or explanations. The win is theirs to enjoy. It happens.

But it did happen.

As physical as that was games Brunson had 2 free throws.
THJ should had try to make the shot instead of kicking his leg out looking for a foul right?

And I think that'll do it for this exchange.

You present yourself as accepting the facts and just trying to offer a fresh perspective, then turn around and cast doubt on the event in question.

[Dave_R]

Thanks for the civil conversation regarding my post.

bstein wrote "It's different when its on a 3 point jump shot. I don't care if a foul goes uncalled on a rebound or even a drive because that contact can be debatable to a degree... but when someone is taking a jumpshot and you get the defender in the air and they bump into the shooter that's always a foul. That's not something that's allowed even if physical playoff games. Huge difference."

My question is does it also matter if it's a player driving to the basket like Brunson or KAT (or does it only matter on jumpshots)? Remember, when Brunson and Kat drove, they were in the air a lot when there was contact and no calls made. The point being that even though I don't like the no-call (but admittedly as a Knicks fan like the result), at least the refs were generally consistent (and, in my opinion, had MANY HORRIBLE non-calls).

[Cowology]

If your entire argument revolves around something else also being wrong....

C'mon guys. Appreciate the "civil" conversation, but being pleasant while making justifications for an obvious & admitted bad call isn't gong to win you many friends on this board. Maybe try peddling that on the NY board. I'm sure they'd love hear about all the missed calls on KAT and Brunson.

[Snakebites]

If your entire argument revolves around something else also being wrong....

C'mon guys. Appreciate the "civil" conversation, but being pleasant while making justifications for an obvious & admitted bad call isn't gong to win you many friends on this board. Maybe try peddling that on the NY board. I'm sure they'd love hear about all the missed calls on KAT and Brunson.

Particularly when you're going to pivot back to the call not being a REAL foul when pushed on matters.

Knicks fans, you got a gift. And that's fine. But don't come on here and try to tell us it WASN'T a gift. Believe what you want about the call. But don't try and sell it to us as though what we all saw happen wasn't actually what happened.