2025 Regular/Offseason Season Thread Vol. 10

[Grumpy Heat Fan]

I don't want to follow the HEAT if they are going to just be like, "We got our titles, we good"

I thought Micky Arison + Pat Riley wanted to build something like the Lakers, Celtics, etc... relentless pursuit of more championships and franchise glory.

As much as I hate the Lakers, at least they are never ending hustle and hunger.

[greg4012]

Bam is played at C out of necessity too. We don't have anyone behind him or Ware. If you noticed during the play in and first 2 games of the playoffs, people were getting so mad that he and Ware weren't getting more minutes together. I had to kindly remind them that that meant if they sat at the same time, we'd have no bigs at all on the floor. So yes, a lot of times Bam played C. But if we had any actual bigs behind either of them, that wouldn't need to happen to the extent it did. Also, again, we do hide him on offense. That's something that still happened, despite Ware getting minutes next to Bam. We played guys like Jovic and Highsmith at 4 to space the floor where Bam could not.

And no, no one despises Bam. Being critical of him and/or combating lies to blame literally everyone else on the team about his performance on the court is not despising. He is the only one on the team that if you say anything about, people feel the need to come to his defense and remind you about what he does for us on defense, even if that is not the conversation. He is protected more than anyone on the team and has been for years. If you can't see that then we'll just have to agree to disagree.

I don't want the mods to do anything but be fair. Some of this stuff is obvious, but they have a tough job and it's up to them how to decide to reel things in, not mine. I just want a feature to where I don't have to see people on my ignored lists' posts tbh.

You can call it necessity. But reality is that, more often than not, Bam playing center has been a top 5 center in the NBA. That's schematic opportunity. That doesn't mean that's all he does, and that doesn't mean Miami can't benefit from having more functional size on the court and allowing Bam to evolve his game.

I can tell you with certainty that Miami is not better off having your average backup center logging 18-20 mpg in rotation with Ware at the center position rather than having Bam play those minutes. I'll go further, Miami is absolutely not better off having your average starting center logging 18-20 mpg in rotation with Ware at the center position rather than having Bam play those minutes.

He was literally just playing center for the gold medal team USA. Both with AD on the court (where they split a lot of responsibility) and without. Multiple all-stars at center.

Now, none of that is to say that it's advantageous in a vacuum to have your biggest guy on the court be 6'9, but that doesn't mean that the 6'9 player on the court isn't effective at doing what he's doing. It just means having more functional size around him can provide more advantage if done right.

I'm one of the biggest advocates for Ware and his development and a plus fit in developing a frontcourt of Bam and Ware.

"Be fair"----I don't see any injustices occurring on this board

Whatever your personal opinion on Bam being a top 5 center, he was played there out of necessity. We legitimately have no depth there. So whether he's top 5 or bottom 15, his minutes were what they were out of necessity. Either way, I think if your argument is based on Bam winning in the Olympics with the best basketball players in the world around him while playing C, then we have a fundamental difference that doesn't really warrant the back and forth. Give me a real C that is logging 35-40 minutes a night and Bam at the 4 logging the same. Whatever sporadic minutes he plays at C after that means very little to me, and I'd even be in support depending on the matchups.

I don't see where I ever made the claim that there were any injustices happening. You asked what the mods should do, I said just be fair. You really like this word, injustice, huh?

A bit of misdirection and logical fallacies aside, here are some bullet point to get at the core:

- According to lineup data, Bam Adebayo has played 85% of his NBA minutes at center (including 80% of his minutes this season). YOu can call it necessity, but that's a bit of circular logic because the Heat CHOOSE to have Bam as their center and thus it's inherent that a team NEEDS their center to play center. The results speak for themselves despite what shewasfly thinks. With that said, Miami has a promising young center that will earn more minutes and likely have Bam playing closer to 50% PF and 50% C next season.

- A total of TWO players designated at center and 6'10+ averaged 35 minutes or more per game this season (so IDK what Center you're looking for to play 40 minutes a night, but it doesn't exist)

- According to the Thesaurus, the antonym (opposite) of FAIRNESS is INJUSTICE. You calling for fairness on here (and thus insinuating a lack of it) is the same as affirmatively claiming injustice. Unless, you meant to suggest that the status quo is perfectly fair, in which case I agree, but I'm unsure why you brought it up in this context then.

[Beenie]

Watch on YouTube

[unowen85]

Original bad boy Joe Dumars calls Andy this offseason and wants a package around Bam (+ non Ware youngin’, expiring, and draft compensation) for Zion. You guys making that deal and resetting around a volatile yet box office talent? Non-player fans only pls

Done deal. And quite frankly, the old Pat Riley does this deal.

And I know you’re gonna say “Pat doesn’t make the deals anymore.” But y’all know what I mean.

[Shewasfly]

You can call it necessity. But reality is that, more often than not, Bam playing center has been a top 5 center in the NBA. That's schematic opportunity. That doesn't mean that's all he does, and that doesn't mean Miami can't benefit from having more functional size on the court and allowing Bam to evolve his game.

I can tell you with certainty that Miami is not better off having your average backup center logging 18-20 mpg in rotation with Ware at the center position rather than having Bam play those minutes. I'll go further, Miami is absolutely not better off having your average starting center logging 18-20 mpg in rotation with Ware at the center position rather than having Bam play those minutes.

He was literally just playing center for the gold medal team USA. Both with AD on the court (where they split a lot of responsibility) and without. Multiple all-stars at center.

Now, none of that is to say that it's advantageous in a vacuum to have your biggest guy on the court be 6'9, but that doesn't mean that the 6'9 player on the court isn't effective at doing what he's doing. It just means having more functional size around him can provide more advantage if done right.

I'm one of the biggest advocates for Ware and his development and a plus fit in developing a frontcourt of Bam and Ware.

"Be fair"----I don't see any injustices occurring on this board

Whatever your personal opinion on Bam being a top 5 center, he was played there out of necessity. We legitimately have no depth there. So whether he's top 5 or bottom 15, his minutes were what they were out of necessity. Either way, I think if your argument is based on Bam winning in the Olympics with the best basketball players in the world around him while playing C, then we have a fundamental difference that doesn't really warrant the back and forth. Give me a real C that is logging 35-40 minutes a night and Bam at the 4 logging the same. Whatever sporadic minutes he plays at C after that means very little to me, and I'd even be in support depending on the matchups.

I don't see where I ever made the claim that there were any injustices happening. You asked what the mods should do, I said just be fair. You really like this word, injustice, huh?

Too much misdirection, logical fallacies, and kinda silly williness to get into it all. So, here are some bullet points.

- According to lineup data, Bam Adebayo has played 85% of his NBA minutes at center (including 80% of his minutes this season). YOu can call it necessity, but that's a bit of circular logic because the Heat CHOOSE to have Bam as their center and thus it's inherent that a team NEEDS their center to play center. The results speak for themselves despite what shewasfly thinks. With that said, Miami has a promising young center that will earn more minutes and likely have Bam playing closer to 50% PF and 50% C next season.

- A total of TWO players designated at center and 6'10+ averaged 35 minutes or more per game this season (so IDK what Center you're looking for to play 40 minutes a night, but it doesn't exist)

- According to the Thesaurus, the antonym (opposite) of FAIRNESS is INJUSTICE. You calling for fairness on here (and thus insinuating a lack of it) is the same as affirmatively claiming injustice. Unless, you meant to suggest that the status quo is perfectly fair, in which case I agree, but I'm unsure why you brought it up in this context then.

That's a long way of saying it's out of necessity but you choose to frame it in it a different way, but alright.

Hope we also agree that going small has been a primary gripe of the fan base over recent years, and that Bam is one of the biggest reasons (he's actually the biggest reason, but let me keep it cute) for that. That said, if you think its a winning formula because Bam is a top 5 center in the league, and this is not just an attempt to refute what you took to be a slight against Bam, I strongly suggest you take this stance that we need to stick with small ball more vocally in the very frequent threads and frequent posts that complain about small ball. I assure you its not just me, even if you love my posts the most.

As far as the rest, reading comprehension is still a thing. Not lying would help too. You quoted my post about not wanting Bam at C and for him to remain at the 4 because he's not good enough to cater the entire roster to/build around. I assured you that what I was saying about not catering the roster to non-#1s was true for both Bam AND Herro, because a comparison between the two is what every conversation about Bam boils into, all because of one of the player fans whom you agree with more often than not, makes it that way on this board. Other posters in this very thread have echoed the same. YOU then asked what mods should do and I simply said be fair. This has now turned into you lying about me calling for fairness when I just answered a question you asked, along the thought process you started.

You also threw out injustice! the last debate randomly, because posters were discussing Tyler's offense and not being able to get by his man. Literally no one said it or hinted at it but you.

[Hallstar]

Lol at outscored, in a game that was done in the second quarter. Did Bam take a shot while the game was relevant? I just knew you would try to sneak that in.

Herro got locked up in the home games, only scored 4pts in the final game, and still outscored Bam for the series

not really a time to brag about Bam's offense

I’m not even bragging, the entire team was dog **** but when you don’t bring anything to the table but scoring and a little playmaking and you want $50M a year on an extension you better be doing worlds better offensively than a guy who “has no bag” “Joel Anthony if he wore 13” etc. Especially when your being defended by Sam Merrill and Max Strus.

Man please be quiet, everyone watched that abomination of a series, Herro was the focus of the defense. Who was focussed in defending Bam other than a guard stripping him when he attempted a "move". The commentators were begging for him to attack cause he was facing one on one matchups.

[Tim_Hardawayy]

I disagree that playing Bam at center necessarily constitutes small ball. It depends on the entirety of the lineup. For example, if you had a LeBron or Giannis at the 4, and size at the guards/small forward, I wouldn't consider that a small ball lineup.

The Lakers have lineups with LeBron at center, now that's some serious small ball.

Now, when you put Haywood Highsmith or Jimmy in the past at the 4, that's much closer to small ball, although in the modern era I wouldn't even consider it that extreme. But I don't think Bam is small or undersized on the whole for the center position in this league. Context is key.

Actually, comparing it back to the big 3 Heat, I'd consider Bam more of a center than Bosh, who played plenty of center for us. And part of the reason Ware works next to Bam is both guys kinda sorta can hit the 3, so neither one is spending all their time down low. Bottom line, unless you're going to the extremes I do think as a team its better to find ways to get the most talent on the court as possible as opposed to rigidly defining positions. Size helps, but it only helps to mask talent deficits it doesn't overcome them.

[al bondiga]

I don't want to follow the HEAT if they are going to just be like, "We got our titles, we good"

I thought Micky Arison + Pat Riley wanted to build something like the Lakers, Celtics, etc... relentless pursuit of more championships and franchise glory.

As much as I hate the Lakers, at least they are never ending hustle and hunger.

It takes many year's to build something like that... I'm comparing it to soccer franchise competition in england... In spain there is only two clubs that REALLY Fight for it all... So I guess maybe we are set with lakers and celtics.

[al bondiga]

I disagree that playing Bam at center necessarily constitutes small ball. It depends on the entirety of the lineup. For example, if you had a LeBron or Giannis at the 4, and size at the guards/small forward, I wouldn't consider that a small ball lineup.

The Lakers have lineups with LeBron at center, now that's some serious small ball.

Now, when you put Haywood Highsmith or Jimmy in the past at the 4, that's much closer to small ball, although in the modern era I wouldn't even consider it that extreme. But I don't think Bam is small or undersized on the whole for the center position in this league. Context is key.

Actually, comparing it back to the big 3 Heat, I'd consider Bam more of a center than Bosh, who played plenty of center for us. And part of the reason Ware works next to Bam is both guys kinda sorta can hit the 3, so neither one is spending all their time down low. Bottom line, unless you're going to the extremes I do think as a team its better to find ways to get the most talent on the court as possible as opposed to rigidly defining positions. Size helps, but it only helps to mask talent deficits it doesn't overcome them.

bam It's the same size as Lebron... think bam might be even smaller to me It was Obvious so much small ball almost killed bam I hope he can recover.

[Shewasfly]

We go small because Bam cannot reliably score outside the paint and certainly not from 3. For most normal offenses of today, this is something you can typically take from your C. When having this limitation outside of the C, designing offense becomes much harder when presumably both the PF and C position struggle outside the paint. So we put him at C and put smaller 3-D players at 4. Thus...small ball. We have never had a LeBron or Giannis type at 4--not even just in talent, but size--so it's irrelevant imo. (I would not want Bam at C next to Giannis either tbh. Horrible spacing).

I am surprised we are debating this, especially in this era. Goes to what I said about the fanbase being very generous to and defensive of Bam. Not saying this is a bad thing, just makes the idea that he's despised even more crazy to me.

[al bondiga]

We go small because Bam cannot reliably score outside the paint and certainly not from 3. For most normal offenses of today, this is something you can typically take from your C. Outside of the C, designing offense becomes much harder when presumably both the PF and C position struggle outside the paint. So we put him at C and put smaller 3-D players at 4. We have never had a LeBron or Giannis at 4 type, so it's irrelevant. (I would not want Bam at C next to Giannis either tbh. Horrible spacing).

I am surprised we are debating this, especially in this era. Goes to what I said about the fanbase being very generous to and defensive of Bam. Not saying this is a bad thing, just makes the idea that he's despised even more crazy to me.

bam Can't shoot
Because he was instructed as the center... From early on he knew he didn't have to develop many skills

[3ammy3uck3ts]

Herro got locked up in the home games, only scored 4pts in the final game, and still outscored Bam for the series

not really a time to brag about Bam's offense

I’m not even bragging, the entire team was dog **** but when you don’t bring anything to the table but scoring and a little playmaking and you want $50M a year on an extension you better be doing worlds better offensively than a guy who “has no bag” “Joel Anthony if he wore 13” etc. Especially when your being defended by Sam Merrill and Max Strus.

Man please be quiet, everyone watched that abomination of a series, Herro was the focus of the defense. Who was focussed in defending Bam other than a guard stripping him when he attempted a "move". The commentators were begging for him to attack cause he was facing one on one matchups.

A bunch of nothing from you again lol. What about when they were talking about the Cavs loading up on Bam and packing the paint when he gets touches?

Your boy literally got clamped by Sam Merrill and Max Strus. There is not a single perimeter player on the Cavs that comes to mind when you think of being a good perimeter defender (outside of Dean but the casual PPG fan wouldn’t know much about him) and they had him in a straight jacket

Be better, I’m running laps around you today.

[Wiltside]

Can't believe I'm seeing Kendrick Nunn in here. My goodness.

Herro stank it up bad, but he's 10x the player Nunn is. Nunn is also about the same age as Andrew Wiggins.

Cmon now.

[Wiltside]

Ware and Bam are fine, IMO. The trio of Ware, Bam and Jovic works. The problem is that Ware is too raw, and Niko too inconsistent at this point in their careers. Hopefully that changes.

Another offseason, another chance at improvement. Ware needs to work on his strength and filling out his frame, and his 3pt shot needs to become a weapon. Niko needs to have more on ball responsibilities and work on his finishing ability in the paint. Also post ups, as he can see over the defense with his passing ability from the post.

I'm expecting significant changes to the supporting cast. Rozier and Duncan are goners, and they were significant negative contributors this season. Davion possibly stays, depending on the offers he gets. Wiggins possibly stays, or is part of a bigger deal.

Jaquez, if he's here, needs to go back to Summer League. This should not be below him after the turd season he just had. If he wants to stick in the league, this is a really important offseason for him.

[Wiltside]

If Giannis is available, we should be going all in though. Having said that, it doesn't seem likely he would end up here.

[3ammy3uck3ts]

20 centers attempted over 220 3s this year, Bam ranked 13th in percentage at 35.7% made.

Post all star break 15 centers attempted 87 or more 3s, Bam ranked 1st in percentage made at 44.8%.

Mind you this is just his 1st year of adding the 3 ball to his game. Not only is he getting the volume, he’s knocking them down at a damn good rate too.

You all say stupid **** like “We go small because Bam cannot reliably score outside the paint and certainly not from 3.” I correct it because it’s blatantly wrong and then I’m the bad guy, rinse and repeat.

[Flash4thewin]

If Giannis is available, we should be going all in though. Having said that, it doesn't seem likely he would end up here.

He would most likely cost us Bam, Herro, Ware and multiple unprotected draft picks. That’s a going all in move, that’s assuming the Bucks have interest.

[wadenation305]

Heat reset and tank. Not sure this is even realistic, and obviously would need some tweaking to make it work

[oreon]

An alltime choke job by Bucks in OT. Ofcourse its a Doc Rivers coached team.
Giannis my brother time to put in that trade request

[3ammy3uck3ts]

An alltime choke job by Bucks in OT. Ofcourse its a Doc Rivers coached team.
Giannis my brother time to put in that trade request

And also if the goal is to be good next year after making a big splash we need to be targeting GTJ and Lopez on cheap deals this summer. We just watched Giannis last game as a Buck