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2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg

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Re: 2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg 

Post#1401 » by playa-hater » Mon May 5, 2025 10:26 pm

Dogen wrote:CBS Sports mock has Clayton Jr. going to Spurs in lotto at #14: https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/2025-nba-mock-draft-cooper-flagg-khaman-maluach-kon-knueppel-give-duke-three-freshmen-in-top-six-selections/

That's pretty high, but that's a nice fit for the Spurs. I could also see Orlando snagging him in the first round to add some needed shooting.

Celtics are tagged to Philon at #28. Not that it really means anything, but Vecenie makes that association too. Philon definitely worth bringing in for a workout to see how that shot looks. He's a guy that has enough length that you can put him on the floor with Payton, giving us a defender with ability to handle and distribute the ball. Just needs to fill out a bit and work on the three ball.


As currently constructed, Philon would not be high on my wish list. But with Jrue's age and potential Cap casualty/trade etc, it makes sense to draft a player who is "Jrue like ". This is one where I will just trust Stevens and that he has both short- and long-term reasons to draft him.

But.. another guard for Alabama??? It will give me draft PTSD as well. :o :(
2 things need to go.. my lack of spell check and Joe.. :nod:
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Re: 2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg 

Post#1402 » by redslastlaugh » Mon May 5, 2025 10:44 pm

playa-hater wrote:
Dogen wrote:CBS Sports mock has Clayton Jr. going to Spurs in lotto at #14: https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/2025-nba-mock-draft-cooper-flagg-khaman-maluach-kon-knueppel-give-duke-three-freshmen-in-top-six-selections/

That's pretty high, but that's a nice fit for the Spurs. I could also see Orlando snagging him in the first round to add some needed shooting.

Celtics are tagged to Philon at #28. Not that it really means anything, but Vecenie makes that association too. Philon definitely worth bringing in for a workout to see how that shot looks. He's a guy that has enough length that you can put him on the floor with Payton, giving us a defender with ability to handle and distribute the ball. Just needs to fill out a bit and work on the three ball.


As currently constructed, Philon would not be high on my wish list. But with Jrue's age and potential Cap casualty/trade etc, it makes sense to draft a player who is "Jrue like ". This is one where I will just trust Stevens and that he has both short- and long-term reasons to draft him.

But.. another guard for Alabama??? It will give me draft PTSD as well. :o :(

Another cbs reporter (this time, Adam Finkelstein) released a mock today that also has Philon to Boston
https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/2025-nba-mock-draft-dukes-cooper-flagg-goes-no-1-arizonas-carter-bryant-surges-into-top-10/

Labaron Philon is maybe an outlier from the shooters Joe loves, but I'd be excited with a Philon selection. He didn't shoot it great (31%) but more concerning is he's really light (listed 177lbs) but his selling point is that he's just very fidgety & unpredictable with the ball, like less athletic Rondo but with an elite touch on floaters. Floater-Rondo sounds fun to me, so sign me up, lol!!!
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Re: 2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg 

Post#1403 » by Hal14 » Tue May 6, 2025 5:55 pm

Read on Twitter


Intersting. That's 2 players now I have heard had a workout with Boson this year. Small and PJ Haggerty.

Both of them are combo-guards. They're both about 6'3. Both are a little bit on the older side, but not crazy old either (Haggerty will be 21.2 on draft night, Small will be 22.5).

Obviously it's only 2 guys..and last year Boston worked out like 40 guys so there will be many more players coming in, so don't want to jump to conclusions based on just 2 guys.

*But* this does seem to possibly signal that Jrue is gone..gonna get traded. So we're looking to draft a guard to backfill that spot..Pritchard moves up a spot to the 2nd guard on the depth chart..so then we need someone to be the 3rd guard, backfilling Pritchard's spot.

Then again, both Haggerty and Small are long shots to get drafted. Neither is on the top 60 of many draft boards/mock drafts. Some folks on Twitter are pretty high on Small and have him as a 1st round pick. But maybe they're just a couple of guys to kick the tires on as 2nd rounders or UDFA..perhaps just guys to come in and compete for some mins, give some extra guard depth. Which may be needed even more if Jrue is dealt.

Edit: Ok, looking closer now at the stats for Small, (and also thinking about the types of players that Small and Haggerty are) and he seems to be a legit candidate for Jrue replacement. Not saying he'd be as good as Jrue. But Small could potentially be Jrue-lite. Like a similar player - just not as good.

-Small is the better defender than Haggerty
-Haggerty is more of like a high usage, ball dominant type of PG. Crazy high FTr so really good driver. Drives the ball at will. Can shoot it pretty well but doesn't take a ton of 3's..Small shoots the 3 on higher volume than Haggerty.
-Small had way higher assist %. 35% for Small, 20% for Haggerty. So Haggery seems more like a 2-guard..like a microwave scorer off the bench type of guy who can really drive the ball and can shoot it a little bit.
-Small is more like a guard who can handle the ball but less ball dominant, more of a distributor. But also shoots the 3 on high volume, can make 3's. Good defender. Can drive it pretty well but not as good a driver as Haggerty.

I'd also add that if we trade Jrue and draft a guard..we really need to make sure it's a guard who can defend. Small seems to be a good defender..and he can shoot (35% from 3 this season, 37% the year before that. over 8 3PA/40 mins this season. Last 3 years FT%: 85, 86, then 88.

C'mon now..tell me this doesn't *kind of* look like Jrue Holiday:
Read on Twitter


Ok, this guy is growing on me:
Read on Twitter
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Re: 2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg 

Post#1404 » by phincsfan » Tue May 6, 2025 7:44 pm

phincsfan wrote:
phincsfan wrote:This is the time of year that upperclassmen have one last chance to shine.

Broome, Clifford, Jones, Small, Nelson, Sears, Brea, Robinson, Clayton Jr


WVU out so no Javon Small in the dance


Small is an Indiana kid, maybe Stevens giving a local kid a look.

I checked out a bunch of upperclassmen highlights before the dance. WVU got snubbed though and turned down the NIT invite which is always ballsy.

The one thing I noticed about Small was he definitely gave off the impression of a guy who punches in his timecard and gets to work. Nothing flashy, but could develop in the G.
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Re: 2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg 

Post#1405 » by djFan71 » Tue May 6, 2025 7:56 pm

Hal14 wrote:*But* this does seem to possibly signal that Jrue is gone..gonna get traded. So we're looking to draft a guard to backfill that spot..Pritchard moves up a spot to the 2nd guard on the depth chart..so then we need someone to be the 3rd guard, backfilling Pritchard's spot.

I know you said "possibly", but c'mon. This means nothing in the context of the existing roster. There are a million reasons we bring him in that don't depend on Jrue being gone. Just plain due diligence in scouting. Joe could just be doing a WVU guy a solid. Or they really like him and could bring him in to battle JD for the 4th PG spot. I like the rest of the info you provided, but it's just a huge, unwarranted leap to draw any conclusions from this.
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Re: 2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg 

Post#1406 » by Smart2Nesmith43 » Tue May 6, 2025 10:15 pm

djFan71 wrote:
Hal14 wrote:*But* this does seem to possibly signal that Jrue is gone..gonna get traded. So we're looking to draft a guard to backfill that spot..Pritchard moves up a spot to the 2nd guard on the depth chart..so then we need someone to be the 3rd guard, backfilling Pritchard's spot.

I know you said "possibly", but c'mon. This means nothing in the context of the existing roster. There are a million reasons we bring him in that don't depend on Jrue being gone. Just plain due diligence in scouting. Joe could just be doing a WVU guy a solid. Or they really like him and could bring him in to battle JD for the 4th PG spot. I like the rest of the info you provided, but it's just a huge, unwarranted leap to draw any conclusions from this.

I appreciate Hal's optimism. It's a welcome change from the constant negativity on here. But where he loses me is when he starts comparing random future late second rounders/UDFAs to hall of fame players. Nothing against Small, I don't know the kid and I wish him all the best but let's be real. He'll be the same age on draft night than Holiday was when he made his first All Star team. Like those two things are not the same. I can understand the impulse to make stylistic comparisons to current players but at some point the gap in ability is so huge that it renders that comparison moot. Like Holiday's best attribute as an NBA player is his versatility, the odds Small develops even one NBA level skill (let alone enough to be a versatile NBA guy) are very low, so what does that comparison accomplish ?

You want to tell me that one of those prospects play like Tyler Zeller, Brandon Bass or Jordan Mickey fine, I'll bite. But I cringe every time I see someone say this dude here at the end of the first round is going to be an Al Horford or a Jrue Holiday replacement.
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Re: 2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg 

Post#1407 » by djFan71 » Tue May 6, 2025 11:47 pm

Smart2Nesmith43 wrote:
djFan71 wrote:
Hal14 wrote:*But* this does seem to possibly signal that Jrue is gone..gonna get traded. So we're looking to draft a guard to backfill that spot..Pritchard moves up a spot to the 2nd guard on the depth chart..so then we need someone to be the 3rd guard, backfilling Pritchard's spot.

I know you said "possibly", but c'mon. This means nothing in the context of the existing roster. There are a million reasons we bring him in that don't depend on Jrue being gone. Just plain due diligence in scouting. Joe could just be doing a WVU guy a solid. Or they really like him and could bring him in to battle JD for the 4th PG spot. I like the rest of the info you provided, but it's just a huge, unwarranted leap to draw any conclusions from this.

I appreciate Hal's optimism. It's a welcome change from the constant negativity on here. But where he loses me is when he starts comparing random future late second rounders/UDFAs to hall of fame players. Nothing against Small, I don't know the kid and I wish him all the best but let's be real. He'll be the same age on draft night than Holiday was when he made his first All Star team. Like those two things are not the same. I can understand the impulse to make stylistic comparisons to current players but at some point the gap in ability is so huge that it renders that comparison moot. Like Holiday's best attribute as an NBA player is his versatility, the odds Small develops even one NBA level skill (let alone enough to be a versatile NBA guy) are very low, so what does that comparison accomplish ?

You want to tell me that one of those prospects play like Tyler Zeller, Brandon Bass or Jordan Mickey fine, I'll bite. But I cringe every time I see someone say this dude here at the end of the first round is going to be an Al Horford or a Jrue Holiday replacement.

Agree on the bolded, not trying to dog you here, Hal.

I do think lots of people do the rest - it's fun to get excited. Heck, I already have Fleming making Hauser unnecessary in my mind, lol (mainly due to $, but still). But, there's limits. :)
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Re: 2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg 

Post#1408 » by djFan71 » Tue May 6, 2025 11:49 pm

Swish theory new mock.
https://theswishtheory.com/2025-nba-draft-articles/2025/05/2025-nba-mock-draft-3-0/

Kalk, Bittle and Darrion are, um, a wee bit higher than others have them.

And, related to the above, they have Small at 33.
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Re: 2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg 

Post#1409 » by redslastlaugh » Wed May 7, 2025 1:39 am

I like the swish theory guys, I like that they rank guys apart from consensus rankings. But Nate Bittle is a name, I've barely seen projected as a second round draftworthy prospect. That they have him going to the Celtics in the first round, seems pretty far out there.

As an aside, relating to the 2nd apron stuff, I wonder if Brad is considering offering roster contracts to undrafted prospects to fill out the 13th and 14th roster spots. A rookie minimum is $1.25 million but a vet minimimum is $2.2. As I understand it, Brad can free up more than a million to use towards re-signing Al Horford by just signing a couple undrafted guys to roster contracts rather than NBA vets.

There's an ineffiency we could exploit because players can decline two-way contracts. If another team wants to draft a player we like, the player's agent can say, "if you draft us, you have to offer a standard contract." When the team isn't offering a roster contract, you end up with Austin Reaves types choosing to go undrafted and then sign a two-way from the team of their choosing.

But Brad could target a rookie on the board and tell that players agent, "if your player goes undrafted" we will offer a full roster deal starting at $1.25 rather than $650k which is a two way. You may be able to land a player who is a top 45 guy if you are simply willing to offer a standard deal if the teams picking in the late 40s and 50s are only able to offer two ways...


djFan71 wrote:Swish theory new mock.
https://theswishtheory.com/2025-nba-draft-articles/2025/05/2025-nba-mock-draft-3-0/

Kalk, Bittle and Darrion are, um, a wee bit higher than others have them.

And, related to the above, they have Small at 33.
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Re: 2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg 

Post#1410 » by Hal14 » Wed May 7, 2025 3:16 am

Smart2Nesmith43 wrote:I appreciate Hal's optimism. It's a welcome change from the constant negativity on here. But where he loses me is when he starts comparing random future late second rounders/UDFAs to hall of fame players. Nothing against Small, I don't know the kid and I wish him all the best but let's be real. He'll be the same age on draft night than Holiday was when he made his first All Star team. Like those two things are not the same. I can understand the impulse to make stylistic comparisons to current players but at some point the gap in ability is so huge that it renders that comparison moot. Like Holiday's best attribute as an NBA player is his versatility, the odds Small develops even one NBA level skill (let alone enough to be a versatile NBA guy) are very low, so what does that comparison accomplish ?

You want to tell me that one of those prospects play like Tyler Zeller, Brandon Bass or Jordan Mickey fine, I'll bite. But I cringe every time I see someone say this dude here at the end of the first round is going to be an Al Horford or a Jrue Holiday replacement.

Relax. This is literally what I said, "Not saying he'd be as good as Jrue. But Small could potentially be Jrue-lite. Like a similar player - just not as good."

And I made sure to emphasize *kind of* when posting a couple of clips and saying that in those clips Small looked *kind of* like Jrue.

And I obviously meant Jrue, as in the player Jrue is today. Jrue, the player he is today is not a hall of famer. Neither is Al Horford..they're solid role players. Which is what we're looking for in the draft - some solid role players.

Derrick White is also a role player. He is better right now than Jrue is. Yet D-white was 23 when drafted. And he was the 29th pick..so it's not out of the realm of possibility that a guy (Javon Small) who was just went 33rd in a mock yesterday and is 22, could *possibly* be kind of like Jrue, but not as good, which is all I said..jeesh..

Lastly, age obviously does matter with evaluating draft prospects but I think we should be careful to not weigh it too heavily. These guys were all 22+ on draft night: Pascal Siakam, Sam Hauser, Pritchard, Kornet, Derrick White, Desmond Bane, Max Strus, Cam Johnson, Austin Reaves, Malcolm Brogdon, Caleb Martin, Fred Vanvleet, Alex Caruso, Kornet, Herb Jones, etc.

Meanwhile, these guys were all 18/19 on draft night: Juhann Begarin, Jaden Springer, Jordan Walsh, Georgios Papagiannis, Dzanan Musa, Mario Hezonja, Marvin Bagley, James Wiseman, Josh Primo, Josh Jackson, Romeo Langford, Dragan Bender, Greg Brown, etc.
Nothing wrong with having a different opinion - as long as it's done respectfully. It'd be lame if we all agreed on everything :)
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Re: 2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg 

Post#1411 » by winsomme2 » Wed May 7, 2025 11:15 am

Hal14 wrote:
Read on Twitter


Ok, this guy is growing on me:
Read on Twitter


Wow he really does move and play a lot like Jrue. I love finding out about prospects that have flown under the radar. TP Thanks.
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Re: 2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg 

Post#1412 » by winsomme2 » Wed May 7, 2025 2:32 pm

Anybody intrigued by Nate Bittle?

He seems to have a stronger base than I initially thought. Wondering how he would handle the physicality of the pros but does seem to have an ability to hit threes in a 7 foot frame.
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Re: 2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg 

Post#1413 » by ThePigeon » Wed May 7, 2025 3:05 pm

winsomme2 wrote:Anybody intrigued by Nate Bittle?

He seems to have a stronger base than I initially thought. Wondering how he would handle the physicality of the pros but does seem to have an ability to hit threes in a 7 foot frame.


Nice
If Small can be a lesser Jrue, Bittle can be Kornet light. Goofy, bad hands, nice passer, decent shot blocker
He looks like he is in his 30s
Sign me up!

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Re: 2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg 

Post#1414 » by Hal14 » Wed May 7, 2025 4:05 pm

lol, yeah Bittle does look like he's in his 30's. Moves like it too. Idk, I might throw him a SL invite..
Nothing wrong with having a different opinion - as long as it's done respectfully. It'd be lame if we all agreed on everything :)
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Re: 2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg 

Post#1415 » by jonige94 » Thu May 8, 2025 9:59 am

Do whatever it takes to get Flagg, please.
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Re: 2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg 

Post#1416 » by Kalela » Thu May 8, 2025 6:43 pm

djFan71 wrote:Budget JoJo. I just skimmed, but any time you got that size/wingspan, I get interested, lol.
At 6’7.75” in shoes, 7-foot-4 wingspan.

https://edemirnba.substack.com/p/obinna-anochili-killen-scouting-report


I am sucker for players for those kinds of Wingspans. Isn't JoJo going back to school, though? Anyway I was shocked to find out Rasheer Fleming has a 7'5" wingspan as well.

Read on Twitter
Edit: Extend Mazzulla
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Re: 2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg 

Post#1417 » by djFan71 » Thu May 8, 2025 7:37 pm

Kalela wrote:
djFan71 wrote:Budget JoJo. I just skimmed, but any time you got that size/wingspan, I get interested, lol.
At 6’7.75” in shoes, 7-foot-4 wingspan.

https://edemirnba.substack.com/p/obinna-anochili-killen-scouting-report


I am sucker for players for those kinds of Wingspans. Isn't JoJo going back to school, though? Anyway I was shocked to find out Rasheer Fleming has a 7'5" wingspan as well.

Spoiler:
Read on Twitter


Not sure on JoJo. He should, imo, though. I was a tad underwhelmed in the games I watched.
But, yeah that wingspan, hustle and 3pt% are why I've been on the Rasheer train for quite a while. His range in mocks seems to be anywhere from 12 to 30, but a few frustratingly have him at 27. Feels like we'd need to move up a tiny bit at least, but it's possible he falls to us.

Though, he seems like a really slow jumper at the beginning of that video.
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Re: 2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg 

Post#1418 » by Dogen » Thu May 8, 2025 11:50 pm

I don't see Fleming slipping past Brooklyn's picks. There are actually a few teams in that 15-27 range that would be in a position to take a shot on him. 6'9" guy with 7'5" and can shoot it a bit? Why not Orlando, OKC or BKN?

He might be worth moving up a bit for, but Brad may be able to get similar talent at a different position by standing pat.

If Fleming and Philon are there at 28 and 32, that would be so very, very nice, imo. Very, very unlikely too, but could happen.
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Re: 2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg 

Post#1419 » by Hal14 » Fri May 9, 2025 1:43 pm

Kalela wrote:
djFan71 wrote:Budget JoJo. I just skimmed, but any time you got that size/wingspan, I get interested, lol.
At 6’7.75” in shoes, 7-foot-4 wingspan.

https://edemirnba.substack.com/p/obinna-anochili-killen-scouting-report


I am sucker for players for those kinds of Wingspans. Isn't JoJo going back to school, though? Anyway I was shocked to find out Rasheer Fleming has a 7'5" wingspan as well.

Read on Twitter

Yeah, Tugler is returning to Houston for another year of college ball.

Side note, I played pickup last night with a guy who looks kind of like Tugler in the face, hair and kind of the build. He's only like 6'0" or 6'1" though lol.

Fleming's wingspan is rumored to be around 7'4" or 7'5"..we'll find out for sure at the combine in a few days.
Nothing wrong with having a different opinion - as long as it's done respectfully. It'd be lame if we all agreed on everything :)
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Re: 2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg 

Post#1420 » by Hal14 » Fri May 9, 2025 1:50 pm

My updated big board.

Read on Twitter


I'm pretty high on Markovic. Was watching a game the other day vs Partizan (a EuroLeague team, has a few former NBA players on the team). I saw him hit a smooth catch and shoot 3, I saw him with a really nice, polished post move, back his man down, running hook shot across the lane. And I saw him attack a closeout, take it in to the rim, and finish at the rim. He also had a play where he looked very quick/fluid for a dude that size while rolling to the basket, caught the ball in the paint and in 1 fluid motion, turned to the basket and threw down a strong dunk.

19 years old..with a crazy high TS%.

Can dribble, pass, shoot, at 6'11". If he's there still when we pick, I'm taking him.
Nothing wrong with having a different opinion - as long as it's done respectfully. It'd be lame if we all agreed on everything :)

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