Post Mortem #23 - Cleveland Cavaliers

JujitsuFlip · Post #61 » by **JujitsuFlip** » Wed May 14, 2025 11:36 am

tmorgan wrote:Mobley got 87 shots in 9 playoff games. Highly, highly effective but under 10 shots a game.

I get that some of it is on him, as he’s not a naturally super-assertive personality. But that’s just not proper utilization of a really talented guy. Mitchell just took over the reins and wouldn’t let them go. I know Garland was hobbled, but Mitchell himself wasn’t fully healthy and he just wouldn’t pass. 125 shots, 19 assists in a five game series. Blame who you want, Donovan himself or Atkinson, but that’s awful, especially since he didn’t shoot well at all.

No Cavs fan is blaming Kenny for the Cavs losing during the playoffs... Only RGM Pistons fans and a select few RGM Magic fans are doing that.

HardenGoat · Post #62 » by **HardenGoat** » Wed May 14, 2025 12:09 pm

Agree the weakest link is Garland at that price tag. Mainly a playoff durability and defensive thing.

phraoh · Post #63 » by **phraoh** » Wed May 14, 2025 12:19 pm

This team is soft both mentally and physically and current big 4 roster makeup will NEVER be a playoff winner. Look, its been 4 years in a row with this core 4 including play in tournament 4 years ago where they couldn't win one of two home games as the 7 seed. Every playoff they have been bullied by whoever they play, even in the Orlando series last year that they won. Repeating the same mistake over and over is definition of stupidity and if they come back with both Allen and Garland that will be really stupid.

Post #64 » by **Inigo Montoya** » Wed May 14, 2025 12:24 pm

Cavs fans are beginning to experience what Jazz fans went through. Can't remember the last time a Mitchell-led team didn't end their playoffs run in a non-disappointing, non-humuliating way, even when it's not his fault. For whatever reason it keeps happening.

pepe1991 · Post #65 » by **pepe1991** » Wed May 14, 2025 12:32 pm

Inigo Montoya wrote:Cavs fans are beginning to experience what Jazz fans went through. Can't remember the last time a Mitchell-led team didn't end their playoffs run in a non-disappointing, non-humuliating way, even when it's not his fault. For whatever reason it keeps happening.

Memory of game 6 vs Mavs, missing 9 out of 10 threes (by team, not Donovan) in 4th quarter still lives rent free in my head.

I also remember Gobert having butterhands for whole series and fumbling some of most basic passes possible.

Post #66 » by **Inigo Montoya** » Wed May 14, 2025 12:39 pm

pepe1991 wrote:
Inigo Montoya wrote:Cavs fans are beginning to experience what Jazz fans went through. Can't remember the last time a Mitchell-led team didn't end their playoffs run in a non-disappointing, non-humuliating way, even when it's not his fault. For whatever reason it keeps happening.

Memory of game 6 vs Mavs, missing 9 out of 10 threes (by team, not Donovan) in 4th quarter still lives rent free in my head.

I also remember Gobert having butterhands for whole series and fumbling some of most basic passes possible.

Unfortunately there are many more examples. The thing is I don't think anyone excepts anything from Gobert other than playing defense, grab some rebounds and make his free dunks. And now he's like the third or fourth best player on his team. Again, it's not always Mitchell's fault but for whatever reason his teams keep getting bounced in a disappointing and often humiliating fashion from the playoffs.

holdenwait · Post #67 » by **holdenwait** » Wed May 14, 2025 12:44 pm

Sixers in 4 · Post #68 » by **Sixers in 4** » Wed May 14, 2025 1:36 pm

The problem is Strus felt he needed to send that message. He shouldn't have had to been that guy.

JujitsuFlip · Post #69 » by **JujitsuFlip** » Wed May 14, 2025 1:39 pm

Sixers in 4 wrote:The problem is Strus felt he needed to send that message. He shouldn't have had to been that guy.

Agreed, i don't fault the guy for trying to fire up his teammates.

DowJones · Post #70 » by **DowJones** » Wed May 14, 2025 1:58 pm

Cleveland has limited options as a second apron team, which restricts the moves they can make. That said, the core is young and under contract, and they were a very good team this year. I still believe they can count on internal improvement. That’s why you stay the course. The Eastern Conference will be weaker next season, so if the Cavs keep grinding and developing, they should be firmly in the mix.

DowJones · Post #71 » by **DowJones** » Wed May 14, 2025 2:02 pm

Inigo Montoya wrote:Cavs fans are beginning to experience what Jazz fans went through. Can't remember the last time a Mitchell-led team didn't end their playoffs run in a non-disappointing, non-humuliating way, even when it's not his fault. For whatever reason it keeps happening.

This Cleveland team is significantly more talented than that Utah team. I believe the issues this year were largely due to injuries—they were simply worn down. I don’t think there’s anything inherently wrong with Mitchell; it’s just incredibly difficult to reach the conference finals or NBA Finals. Cleveland just needs to keep improving. They still have a strong 3–5 year window ahead.

Post #72 » by **Inigo Montoya** » Wed May 14, 2025 2:15 pm

DowJones wrote:
Inigo Montoya wrote:Cavs fans are beginning to experience what Jazz fans went through. Can't remember the last time a Mitchell-led team didn't end their playoffs run in a non-disappointing, non-humuliating way, even when it's not his fault. For whatever reason it keeps happening.

This Cleveland team is significantly more talented than that Utah team. I believe the issues this year were largely due to injuries—they were simply worn down. I don’t think there’s anything inherently wrong with Mitchell; it’s just incredibly difficult to reach the conference finals or NBA Finals. Cleveland just needs to keep improving. They still have a strong 3–5 year window ahead.

It's not him, it's just that it's happening to him. Like, every post season. I think the Cavs were favorites and should have won this series, injuries or not.

JujitsuFlip · Post #73 » by **JujitsuFlip** » Wed May 14, 2025 2:35 pm

DowJones wrote:
Inigo Montoya wrote:Cavs fans are beginning to experience what Jazz fans went through. Can't remember the last time a Mitchell-led team didn't end their playoffs run in a non-disappointing, non-humuliating way, even when it's not his fault. For whatever reason it keeps happening.

This Cleveland team is significantly more talented than that Utah team. I believe the issues this year were largely due to injuries—they were simply worn down. I don’t think there’s anything inherently wrong with Mitchell; it’s just incredibly difficult to reach the conference finals or NBA Finals. Cleveland just needs to keep improving. They still have a strong 3–5 year window ahead.

Not 3 to 5. Cavs have a 2 year window, then they need to stay outta the 2nd apron for 3 years in a row.

Next season you see if this core can do it, if not, ya start shifting pieces around.

Iwasawitness · Post #74 » by **Iwasawitness** » Wed May 14, 2025 2:38 pm

phraoh wrote:This team is soft both mentally and physically and current big 4 roster makeup will NEVER be a playoff winner. Look, its been 4 years in a row with this core 4 including play in tournament 4 years ago where they couldn't win one of two home games as the 7 seed. Every playoff they have been bullied by whoever they play, even in the Orlando series last year that they won. Repeating the same mistake over and over is definition of stupidity and if they come back with both Allen and Garland that will be really stupid.

Okay, but again, as many others have pointed out throughout this thread, Cleveland’s very limited on options here. They’re going to be a second apron team now. Their trade options are horribly limited. It’s not a matter of repeating the same mistake over and over again, they pretty much don’t have a choice.

Crunch 99 · Post #75 » by **Crunch 99** » Wed May 14, 2025 3:21 pm

Unlike the second round exit Jazz teams, Cleveland has a very young, improving All Star to pair with Mitchell --- Evan Mobley. If they can pull off difficult trades involving Garland or Allen that clearly makes them better, go for it, but rolling the same team back with an expanded offensive role for Mobley is a good option too.

Jadoogar · Post #76 » by **Jadoogar** » Wed May 14, 2025 3:26 pm

great regular season. Playoffs, whether due to injuries or poor play, were a big let down.
On one hand, they have a lot of duplication in Garlan/Mitchell and Mobley/Allen. It would be beneficial to come someone for a wing. This team in going to be very expensive.

On the other hand, the East is going to be pretty weak next year. You could run it back, hope for better injury luck and easily make the conference finals at the very lease.

Jadoogar · Post #77 » by **Jadoogar** » Wed May 14, 2025 3:27 pm

LethalRangee wrote:Most overrated 60+ win team in history. I just knew their offense would collapse under playoff defense.

Atlanta Hawks erasure.

Jadoogar · Post #78 » by **Jadoogar** » Wed May 14, 2025 3:29 pm

Iwasawitness wrote:3. I personally think this is the best route to go... you do the same thing as above but with Garland/Mitchell, where Mitchell starts and Garland is his backup, especially if you lose Jerome. Strus is better suited being your starting two guard anyways, and you can still go with Hunter as your starting SF if you wanted. And even if you manage to lose Jerome and Merrill, you are still left with a bench unit of Garland/Okoro/Tyson/Wade. The only issue with this is that Mitchell is simply not a natural PG. And while he may be a talented passer, he can't run an offense like Garland can. But we also can't deny that a Darius Garland coming off the bench would be pretty deadly, and that the Cavaliers are much better defensively when the two small guards don't play together.

This sounds great on paper but you have to remember these are human beings with egos. It's could to be very hard to convince a player of Garland's caliber (and salary) to become a bench player.

kenwood3333 · Post #79 » by **kenwood3333** » Wed May 14, 2025 3:31 pm

Losing 4 1 is embarrassing. The Cavs simply got out-coached in the series. They got little to no production from their bigs and wings. They need to get better in the coaching department. It shows the COY award is for the regular season not the playoff.

NoDopeOnSundays · Post #80 » by **NoDopeOnSundays** » Wed May 14, 2025 3:33 pm

Inigo Montoya wrote:Cavs fans are beginning to experience what Jazz fans went through. Can't remember the last time a Mitchell-led team didn't end their playoffs run in a non-disappointing, non-humuliating way, even when it's not his fault. For whatever reason it keeps happening.

The Cavs and Jazz have both made the same critical mistake with Mitchell, which is playing him next to a PG that has no size. I didn't want Mitchell in the trade, largely because a Brunson/Mitchell backcourt pairing is entirely too small, the same way a Conley or Garland / Mitchell pairing was too small. I get that he's not a great playmaker, but he needs to be next to someone like Dyson Daniels that can handle the ball a little, act as a connector and can defend multiple positions, your starting backcourt can't be 6'1" and 6'2" in this era. He should have been built around in the same way Steph was, with two 3 & D players and the connector playmaker.

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