What is the plan here?

[TheGeneral99]

We're building around Scottie, is that it? I held out hope that Scottie was just a placeholder "franchise player" until we get a top 5-6 pick (pushing Scottie to a number 2 or 3 option) but now that's out the window, where does this team go from here? If Brandon freaking Ingram is our best player over the next 2-3 seasons, we are in for a very long ride. Something has to give



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I'm not sure OP what the point of this thread is?

Quickley - 25 years old
Barrett - 24 years old
Barnes - 23 years old
Ingram - 27 years old
Poeltl - 29 years old
Dick - 21 years old
Walter - 20 years old
Mogbo - 23 years old
Shead - 22 years old
Battle - 24 years old

Our entire core except Poeltl is under 25 years old so the hope is that a few of these guys keep improving. I certainly hope Barnes is not a finished product at 23.

We are going to add the #9 pick who hopefully can be a contributor and you never know...we've seen guys like George, Lillard, Mitchell, Booker, Kawhi, Giannis, Derozan, Shai etc. fall in this range.

I'm not sure what else you want them to do right now? The team tanked this year, landed with the #9 pick.

If the team continues to suck we will get more lottery picks and if Barnes doesn't pan out we can trade him in the future. If Ingram clearly doesn't gel with this team e can also look to trade him.

[nikster]

For anyone comparing this to the DD/Lowry era....or we are entering that era....Idk if that will be the case....Lowry was a great get by BC....Was a true leader, Lead the team, And was a true floor general....We do not have a player close on his level in his prime on this team....

Also them teams were perennial 50 win teams And often the top of the standings in the East for many years....That is alot different than what we are or even close to imo....We are more in the Magic Area with the addition of Ingram (Heath is a major concern here)....DeRozan was also one of the most durable players during his time here....Where we have guys who tend to get injured often....

It will be an uphill battle to even try and re create the success of that era of Raptors basketball imo...

I think we are basically in Get Giannis or die trying mode, hope Shai when hes a FA or close to the end of his contract he wants to come home....If them 2 things do not happen its hard for me to optimistic about the team we have now...

The comparison would be the start of the era. Prior to the Rudy trade things were not looking good. Lowry was not looking like the impactful player he would become, nor did he look like he'd be a leader. They weren't looking like they'd be a perennial 50 win team until Lowry took that leap and they added significant depth.

Not crazy to think Scottie can get at least close to Lowry level impact. By the time of our first 50 win season its not like the rest of the starting lineup was so stacked we can't make up the difference. That team won 56 games with JV and Scola as our front court, and a complete revolving door starting at SF.

While the Lowry had great impact, I feel like the real strength of that era was based on continuity and depth. Our entire starting lineup is young enough to part of the next 5 years, and several pieces could be moved for other opportunities. Our depth is looking good and filled entirely of young guys. We own our draft picks. We don't have any horrible contracts (that first 50 win team handed Carroll a massive contract to watch him play 22 games, which we had to dump with assets later)

[Clutch0z24]

For anyone comparing this to the DD/Lowry era....or we are entering that era....Idk if that will be the case....Lowry was a great get by BC....Was a true leader, Lead the team, And was a true floor general....We do not have a player close on his level in his prime on this team....

Prime lowry was a 2nd/3rd all-nba type guy.

Its unlikely, but no crazy, to think Scottie or Ingram could be an all-nba guy as early as this year.

I am talking about styles on the court...Lowry was a leader....He did things on the court a stat sheet or an "All NBA" doesn't show you....He was a true floor general....We do not have this kind of a player....We do not have a player who can set the tempo to the game and control pace...I think Lowry is more of a difference maker than the guys we have atm on both ends of the floor.

[Pointgod]

The plan…please welcome your Toronto Bulls!

[Scase]

Again, that's a 50+ win team. And like we're an example of in the past, once you;re a 50 win team, you're one trade away from being a contender.

That's a legitimate path to NBA finals success. You either draft a superstar or you build iteratively. That Hawks team was really good they just never made it over the hump.

Like wtf are even doing here? Complaining that we are "only" a 50 win team?

Like my god. Scase signed up in 2008 or whatever but you'd think he started watching in June 2019 with how he views what success is.

Because anything that isn't tanking is wrong. Even when the tanking teams all ended up out of the top 3...

Or you know, the obvious complain about everything all the time.

Maybe check up before making a random claim. Those hawks teams were averaging as a mid 40 win team with a single 53 win season. 37, 47, 53, 44, and 40 wins. If that is what you are content with then so be it, but try and not over exaggerate so much.

Just because I don't share your same low standards doesn't make it a complaint.

[Tripod]

For anyone comparing this to the DD/Lowry era....or we are entering that era....Idk if that will be the case....Lowry was a great get by BC....Was a true leader, Lead the team, And was a true floor general....We do not have a player close on his level in his prime on this team....

Prime lowry was a 2nd/3rd all-nba type guy.

Its unlikely, but no crazy, to think Scottie or Ingram could be an all-nba guy as early as this year.

I am talking about styles on the court...Lowry was a leader....He did things on the court a stat sheet or an "All NBA" doesn't show you....He was a true floor general....We do not have this kind of a player....We do not have a player who can set the tempo to the game and control pace...I think Lowry is more of a difference maker than the guys we have atm on both ends of the floor.

But again, he wasn't early on. Hell he was known as hard to get along with and often overweight. He wasn't an All Star until age 28....and to put that into perspective, that's what BI will be next year as our 2nd oldest rotational guy.

We are just starting our way up. This is far from our finished lineup. But this lineup just went .500 the last half the season resting guys, playing gleaguers, no BI and no #9 pick.

We have not even started the offseason yet at worst are adding a top 10 pick and likely our leading scorer. Relax.

[Clutch0z24]

Prime lowry was a 2nd/3rd all-nba type guy.

Its unlikely, but no crazy, to think Scottie or Ingram could be an all-nba guy as early as this year.

I am talking about styles on the court...Lowry was a leader....He did things on the court a stat sheet or an "All NBA" doesn't show you....He was a true floor general....We do not have this kind of a player....We do not have a player who can set the tempo to the game and control pace...I think Lowry is more of a difference maker than the guys we have atm on both ends of the floor.

But again, he wasn't early on. Hell he was known as hard to get along with and often overweight. He wasn't an All Star until age 28....and to put that into perspective, that's what BI will be next year as our 2nd oldest rotational guy.

We are just starting our way up. This is far from our finished lineup. But this lineup just went .500 the last half the season resting guys, playing gleaguers, no BI and no #9 pick.

We have not even started the offseason yet at worst are adding a top 10 pick and likely our leading scorer. Relax.

Lol...I am not saying we won't be an okay team i am just not high on our "Top guys" let me say it that way....Barnes while good he does not impact the game like Lowry ever could...Hes still young but so far i have not seen that kind of impact....Ingram i like him but he is notoriously injured and prolly is still dealing with that ankle issue to this day.....DeRozan and Lowry were iron men if you look at it....They were not injured much during their runs...

I just don't see a peak unless we upgrade on our top end talent.....If you believe Barnes will be a top player in the league thats cool...I just don't believe that and with me not a beliver in that its hard for me to see the peak of this team being that great...Good sure but not great...

[Duffman100]

Like wtf are even doing here? Complaining that we are "only" a 50 win team?

Like my god. Scase signed up in 2008 or whatever but you'd think he started watching in June 2019 with how he views what success is.

Because anything that isn't tanking is wrong. Even when the tanking teams all ended up out of the top 3...

Or you know, the obvious complain about everything all the time.

Maybe check up before making a random claim. Those hawks teams were averaging as a mid 40 win team with a single 53 win season. 37, 47, 53, 44, and 40 wins. If that is what you are content with then so be it, but try and not over exaggerate so much.

Just because I don't share your same low standards doesn't make it a complaint.

So they didn't win 50 games? Oh wait they did.

[Spates]

For anyone comparing this to the DD/Lowry era....or we are entering that era....Idk if that will be the case....Lowry was a great get by BC....Was a true leader, Lead the team, And was a true floor general....We do not have a player close on his level in his prime on this team....

Also them teams were perennial 50 win teams And often the top of the standings in the East for many years....That is alot different than what we are or even close to imo....We are more in the Magic Area with the addition of Ingram (Heath is a major concern here)....DeRozan was also one of the most durable players during his time here....Where we have guys who tend to get injured often....

It will be an uphill battle to even try and re create the success of that era of Raptors basketball imo...

I think we are basically in Get Giannis or die trying mode, hope Shai when hes a FA or close to the end of his contract he wants to come home....If them 2 things do not happen its hard for me to optimistic about the team we have now...

The comparison would be the start of the era. Prior to the Rudy trade things were not looking good. Lowry was not looking like the impactful player he would become, nor did he look like he'd be a leader. They weren't looking like they'd be a perennial 50 win team until Lowry took that leap and they added significant depth.

Not crazy to think Scottie can get at least close to Lowry level impact. By the time of our first 50 win season its not like the rest of the starting lineup was so stacked we can't make up the difference. That team won 56 games with JV and Scola as our front court, and a complete revolving door starting at SF.

While the Lowry had great impact, I feel like the real strength of that era was based on continuity and depth. Our entire starting lineup is young enough to part of the next 5 years, and several pieces could be moved for other opportunities. Our depth is looking good and filled entirely of young guys. We own our draft picks. We don't have any horrible contracts (that first 50 win team handed Carroll a massive contract to watch him play 22 games, which we had to dump with assets later)

That's how good Lowry was. If Scottie gets to Lowry level impact that's a best case scenario. Would be pretty crazy imo

[Tripod]

I am talking about styles on the court...Lowry was a leader....He did things on the court a stat sheet or an "All NBA" doesn't show you....He was a true floor general....We do not have this kind of a player....We do not have a player who can set the tempo to the game and control pace...I think Lowry is more of a difference maker than the guys we have atm on both ends of the floor.

But again, he wasn't early on. Hell he was known as hard to get along with and often overweight. He wasn't an All Star until age 28....and to put that into perspective, that's what BI will be next year as our 2nd oldest rotational guy.

We are just starting our way up. This is far from our finished lineup. But this lineup just went .500 the last half the season resting guys, playing gleaguers, no BI and no #9 pick.

We have not even started the offseason yet at worst are adding a top 10 pick and likely our leading scorer. Relax.

Lol...I am not saying we won't be an okay team i am just not high on our "Top guys" let me say it that way....Barnes while good he does not impact the game like Lowry ever could...Hes still young but so far i have not seen that kind of impact....Ingram i like him but he is notoriously injured and prolly is still dealing with that ankle issue to this day.....DeRozan and Lowry were iron men if you look at it....They were not injured much during their runs...

I just don't see a peak unless we upgrade on our top end talent.....If you believe Barnes will be a top player in the league thats cool...I just don't believe that and with me not a beliver in that its hard for me to see the peak of this team being that great...Good sure but not great...

And that is all fair to say.

But again, at age 23 when Lowry was overweight, hard to deal with, and a 27% 3pt shooter, few saw Lowry's future playing out like it did.

We are just starting this era. It doesn't happen overnight. And who knows, maybe none of these guys end up as the "leaders" long term and are moved. Let's see what this offseason brings first...then next year....and go from there.

[Scase]

Because anything that isn't tanking is wrong. Even when the tanking teams all ended up out of the top 3...

Or you know, the obvious complain about everything all the time.

Maybe check up before making a random claim. Those hawks teams were averaging as a mid 40 win team with a single 53 win season. 37, 47, 53, 44, and 40 wins. If that is what you are content with then so be it, but try and not over exaggerate so much.

Just because I don't share your same low standards doesn't make it a complaint.

So they didn't win 50 games? Oh wait they did.

Yeah man, everyone refers to a team that won 50+ games once in 5 seasons a 50 win team, you're totally right!!

Again, not everyone shares your low standards, if you don't have anything worth saying, don't bother replying.

[Duffman100]

Maybe check up before making a random claim. Those hawks teams were averaging as a mid 40 win team with a single 53 win season. 37, 47, 53, 44, and 40 wins. If that is what you are content with then so be it, but try and not over exaggerate so much.

Just because I don't share your same low standards doesn't make it a complaint.

So they didn't win 50 games? Oh wait they did.

Yeah man, everyone refers to a team that won 50+ games once in 5 seasons a 50 win team, you're totally right!!

Again, not everyone shares your low standards, if you don't have anything worth saying, don't bother replying.

Yes ... because they won 50 games. That would literally make them a 50 win team. lol.

[YogurtProducer]

So they didn't win 50 games? Oh wait they did.

Yeah man, everyone refers to a team that won 50+ games once in 5 seasons a 50 win team, you're totally right!!

Again, not everyone shares your low standards, if you don't have anything worth saying, don't bother replying.

Yes ... because they won 50 games. That would literally make them a 50 win team. lol.

Is now a bad time to mention that the 40 win Hawks was in a 66 game season which is a 50-win pace in a 82 game season? So really they averaged 47.6 wins per year over that pace, and broke the 50 win (pace) twice in 5 years.

Or should we also ignore that they parlayed the final year of the Iso Joe Hawks into a 60 win team 24 months later...

Like something Scase and others seem to really, really, really struggle to comprehend is that just because someone is on our team on May 14, 2025 does not mean they are here in 1, 2, 3, or 4 years. You constantly make moves. Maybe just not as big as they like.

[tsherkin]

That's how good Lowry was. If Scottie gets to Lowry level impact that's a best case scenario. Would be pretty crazy imo

I'd be very thrilled if he got to Lowry's level.

[Spates]

That's how good Lowry was. If Scottie gets to Lowry level impact that's a best case scenario. Would be pretty crazy imo

I'd be very thrilled if he got to Lowry's level.

I won't hold out hope but after a few years of watching him live out his driveway basketball fantasies I find him hard to project. My hope is that he's dialed into his strengths and willing to sacrifice his wants for team success.

[Duffman100]

That's how good Lowry was. If Scottie gets to Lowry level impact that's a best case scenario. Would be pretty crazy imo

I'd be very thrilled if he got to Lowry's level.

I won't hold out hope but after a few years of watching him live out his driveway basketball fantasies I find him hard to project. My hope is that he's dialed into his strengths and willing to sacrifice his wants for team success.

One thing you can say about Lowry, he was whatever the team needed him to be.

[Raps in 4]

That's how good Lowry was. If Scottie gets to Lowry level impact that's a best case scenario. Would be pretty crazy imo

I'd be very thrilled if he got to Lowry's level.

Lowry was a top-20, arguably top-15 player, in his prime.

If Scottie miraculously develops a shot, he can get there. But his current trajectory does not make me hopeful.

[Clutch0z24]

I got to see a championship in my lifetime. I just want to watch a fun team that competes, even if that team never wins a title. Last year was just terrible as a Raptors fan. Don't know how many more of those type of seasons I can stomach without tuning out completely.

Given the state of the east, anything is possible. It's likely going to be a Knicks/Pacers east final and neither of those teams are world beaters with multiple hall of famers. Both teams just made a lot of smart trades, made some good picks later in the draft and they have rosters that work hard and compete.

Yeah alot of this rides on Scottie Barnes shoulders and the health of Ingram....Even if Ingram plays all star level basketball....If Barnes does not take another leap idk if we can even compete with the Pacers or the Knicks....We would be on maybe the Magics/Pistons level as a team....Barnes has to have himself his best season next year....Knicks & Pacers are pretty stacked and have better top end guys in Brunson/OG/KAT/-Hali/Siakam/Turner....It would be fun to make the playoffs again but if you just make the playoffs to get slapped around in the first round do you really accomplish anything & is that fun to watch? I will be rooting for the guys though...And hope Barnes is worth building around...

[OakleyDokely]

I got to see a championship in my lifetime. I just want to watch a fun team that competes, even if that team never wins a title. Last year was just terrible as a Raptors fan. Don't know how many more of those type of seasons I can stomach without tuning out completely.

Given the state of the east, anything is possible. It's likely going to be a Knicks/Pacers east final and neither of those teams are world beaters with multiple hall of famers. Both teams just made a lot of smart trades, made some good picks later in the draft and they have rosters that work hard and compete.

Yeah alot of this rides on Scottie Barnes shoulders and the health of Ingram....Even if Ingram plays all star level basketball....If Barnes does not take another leap idk if we can even compete with the Pacers or the Knicks....We would be on maybe the Magics/Pistons level as a team....Barnes has to have himself his best season next year....Knicks & Pacers are pretty stacked and have better top end guys in Brunson/OG/KAT/-Hali/Siakam/Turner....It would be fun to make the playoffs again but if you just make the playoffs to get slapped around in the first round do you really accomplish anything & is that fun to watch? I will be rooting for the guys though...And hope Barnes is worth building around...

I tihnk you need to be flexible and adoptable. If the Barnes/Ingram core works and it looks like they can be a 45ish win team, then maybe you look to add more established talent to try to become a 50+ team. If the core doesn't work and they look more like a mid-high 30s win team, then maybe you start to sell off guys like Ingram, Barrett etc and position yourself for a better pick and hope for lottery luck like everyone else. As long as the Raps have their own 1sts, they can pretty much take any direction they want from year to year.

[tsherkin]

That's how good Lowry was. If Scottie gets to Lowry level impact that's a best case scenario. Would be pretty crazy imo

I'd be very thrilled if he got to Lowry's level.

Lowry was a top-20, arguably top-15 player, in his prime.

If Scottie miraculously develops a shot, he can get there. But his current trajectory does not make me hopeful.

Yeah, it's nothing I expect; my opinion on Scottie is well-known at this point, so I didn't come for a re-state. I just wanted to note that it would be awesome if it happened, you know?

I got to see a championship in my lifetime. I just want to watch a fun team that competes, even if that team never wins a title. Last year was just terrible as a Raptors fan. Don't know how many more of those type of seasons I can stomach without tuning out completely.

I'm with that. I don't have patience for a crap squad at this point in my life; too many better options for things to do than follow a garbage team. But I would love to watch them if they were good enough to be consistently in the playoffs and occasionally advancing, like the Demar/Lowry team. As you say, we got to see a title team once already. A good chunk of the league doesn't even have one, so that's something off the ol' bucket list, I guess. Now it's just about watching decent ball.