Official 2025 Offseason Thread

[VFX]

Let's be blunt about NBA roster changes: If you want drastic improvement, you have to re-tool the core of the team. Settling for just moderate gains means you're focused on swapping out starters. Anything less than that, aiming for only minor boosts, is just tinkering with the bench. The level of players you change dictates the potential leap, period.

We have strong tailwinds from player development, so significant improvement could still come without re-tooling, but it's important to be realistic about what the desired acceleration will actually require.

We have our top 3 already. I doubt we add a center.

AB and KCP will need to be moved to open up last starting spot.

We don’t need dramatic change.

You don't trade AB for a starting spot upgrade. Terrible.

You don't trade a bench player who plays 22-24mpg for a starter to balance the starting lineup?

[VFX]

Let's be blunt about NBA roster changes: If you want drastic improvement, you have to re-tool the core of the team. Settling for just moderate gains means you're focused on swapping out starters. Anything less than that, aiming for only minor boosts, is just tinkering with the bench. The level of players you change dictates the potential leap, period.

We have strong tailwinds from player development, so significant improvement could still come without re-tooling, but it's important to be realistic about what the desired acceleration will actually require.

Disagree. Or, it’s not that black and white. Retooling the supporting cast might prove a better fit and overall team product and generate drastic improvements in results. Especially with a young squad.

We haven’t seen how far our big 3 of Paolo/Franz/Suggs could’ve taken us this year. We haven’t seen them with their equivalent of Porzingis and White/JRue in the starting lineup with them, and a reliable Payton Pritchard off the bench. That’s gotta be the next iteration, IMO.

That's fair, and I agree. It just amuses me that the posters which are most critical of this build are the most protective of our core's weakest link.

What are you insinuating?

Are you suggesting that KCP and AB are somehow less movable than Suggs?
Are you saying that those players plus picks wouldnt equate to a starting Point Guard or Center?

Suggs is a 23 year old all-defense guard at 5/$35m .

You arent trading that player unless its for a very significant return that both parties need to be interested in pulling off. If Anthony Black displayed anything remotely at that level next season I would argue for keeping him as well.

Unfortunately, the difference is the timeframe. Weltman says "we need offense" he isnt going to wait 2-3 season hoping Anthony Black can develop a real floor game or significant boost in shooting numbers to make sense in a SL next to those 2-3 guys they have already chosen to invest in monetarily.

[eyriq]

What are you insinuating?

Are you suggesting that KCP and AB are somehow less movable than Suggs?
Are you saying that those players plus picks wouldnt equate to a starting Point Guard or Center?

Suggs is a 23 year old all-defense guard at 5/$35m .

You arent trading that player unless its for a very significant return that both parties need to be interested in pulling off. If Anthony Black displayed anything remotely at that level next season I would argue for keeping him as well.

Unfortunately, the difference is the timeframe. Weltman says "we need offense" he isnt going to wait 2-3 season hoping Anthony Black can develop a real floor game or significant boost in shooting numbers to make sense in a SL next to those 2-3 guys they have already chosen to invest in monetarily.

The core point is that if you want to acquire impactful offense you look to upgrade your third option.

[VFX]

What are you insinuating?

Are you suggesting that KCP and AB are somehow less movable than Suggs?
Are you saying that those players plus picks wouldnt equate to a starting Point Guard or Center?

Suggs is a 23 year old all-defense guard at 5/$35m .

You arent trading that player unless its for a very significant return that both parties need to be interested in pulling off. If Anthony Black displayed anything remotely at that level next season I would argue for keeping him as well.

Unfortunately, the difference is the timeframe. Weltman says "we need offense" he isnt going to wait 2-3 season hoping Anthony Black can develop a real floor game or significant boost in shooting numbers to make sense in a SL next to those 2-3 guys they have already chosen to invest in monetarily.

The core point is that if you want to acquire impactful offense you look to upgrade your third option.

Nonsense.

That’s an arbitrary distinction you’ve propped up to classify “weakest”.

Suggs is an elite third option as a 3&D all defense guard.

Your primary/secondary options need to be more efficient and versatile. It’s arguable that out of the three Paolo is the weakest as classified as a #1 option. Franz in comparison is an elite 2nd option in context.

[Hogified05]

Players I’d like to see us either Sign or Trade for.

Jrue Holiday
Bradley Beal
Naz Reid
Gary Trent Jr.
Coby White

Beal is never going happen unless PHX just buys him out. He is due like 60 million and has a no trade clause. I actually...unlike most ppl...think Beal would be a great fit here. Just have to be a spot up shooter..think he would get motivated coming back to Florida and just being a complimentary piece on Orlando. Think the new atmosphere would do him wonders.

Then again I highly doubt any of this and there are most certainly better options

[fendilim]

What are you insinuating?

Are you suggesting that KCP and AB are somehow less movable than Suggs?
Are you saying that those players plus picks wouldnt equate to a starting Point Guard or Center?

Suggs is a 23 year old all-defense guard at 5/$35m .

You arent trading that player unless its for a very significant return that both parties need to be interested in pulling off. If Anthony Black displayed anything remotely at that level next season I would argue for keeping him as well.

Unfortunately, the difference is the timeframe. Weltman says "we need offense" he isnt going to wait 2-3 season hoping Anthony Black can develop a real floor game or significant boost in shooting numbers to make sense in a SL next to those 2-3 guys they have already chosen to invest in monetarily.

The core point is that if you want to acquire impactful offense you look to upgrade your third option.

Nonsense.

That’s an arbitrary distinction you’ve propped up to classify “weakest”.

Suggs is an elite third option as a 3&D all defense guard.

Your primary/secondary options need to be more efficient and versatile. It’s arguable that out of the three Paolo is the weakest as classified as a #1 option. Franz in comparison is an elite 2nd option in context.

I like Suggs, but I don’t think he’d be a good 3rd option in the long run.

I’d like to keep him though, great leadership and his motor is infectious.

Still, I think I’d rather have him focus his energy on defense where he is elite at. His offense is unreliable to be a 3rd option, imo. Have him be an elite 3 and D.

[SloNick Russia]

Classic playoff rotation is 8 guys, we need to focus on those, rest is expandable.
I liked WCJ in Boston series, he defends well in space, can rebound and solid overall, needs to get his shot back but is playable.
So is JI if he gets to 20 mins per game and shooting fix. His versatility on defense is very valuble. AB could be another guy if improves. We need to replace KCP with an offensive guard with solid ballhandling and shooting. Moe could play in playoffs probably. Still need another solid wing from the bench.

Sent from my SM-S928B using RealGM mobile app

[pepe1991]

Just few thoughts:
- teams at first apron can't do sign & trades if that keeps them on aprons ( meaning, we would have to cut down pretty much all team options to have one)
- only way how we can get full MLE is by dropping team options as well

- Story "first 3 options " gets us nowhere because so far Banchero hasn't been efficient DESPITE fact he shoots for 3 way above his regular season numbers in both playoff series, Franz's efficiency in playoffs drops a lot, his broken looking jumpshot simply doesn't holds and Suggs only was healthy in April once in 4 years, not to mention that neither he was very efficient vs Cavs (14 ppg, 40% FG, 29% for 3 ) on top of that his 3,3 APG- 2,9 TO rate also didn't look that good.

- In some ideal world we find Carter+ KCP + picks = starting level PG formula

- do i believe such trade exists? Not really.

- i do think that we should look how to get Garland

- Warriors post Curry look very similar to our team. Celtics & Cavs being eliminated or at verge of elimination because they can't contain elite PGs isn't accident. Building team without star PG is very hard. Needless to say that both Celtics and Cavs DO have star guards, but Brunson/Haliburton ( Steph before injury) break defense and have gravity that defense can't solve.


- I think league's return of A LOT of physicality brings basketball back to original settins. 5 positions , roster backbones being elite PG and elite defensive C, and versitale SFs who aren't that much on ball.
- I think OKC will win title with most outdated 5 since Thiago Splitter and Tim Duncan started at PF/C.
- I think OKC will also now give blueprint for new rebuiding team what to get: star PG, elite C and few wings ( Pistons, Spurs already started it ).
- i think shooting in playoffs is bit overrated, but you need to have shooters who at least on paper are treats.
OKC ended up with 21 wide open 3s vs Denver, Denver had 20, but due physicality, lack of good rhythm players brick way more shots in playoffs than in RS.

[Skybox]

Just few thoughts:
- teams at first apron can't do sign & trades if that keeps them on aprons ( meaning, we would have to cut down pretty much all team options to have one)
- only way how we can get full MLE is by dropping team options as well

- Story "first 3 options " gets us nowhere because so far Banchero hasn't been efficient DESPITE fact he shoots for 3 way above his regular season numbers in both playoff series, Franz's efficiency in playoffs drops a lot, his broken looking jumpshot simply doesn't holds and Suggs only was healthy in April once in 4 years, not to mention that neither he was very efficient vs Cavs (14 ppg, 40% FG, 29% for 3 ) on top of that his 3,3 APG- 2,9 TO rate also didn't look that good.

- In some ideal world we find Carter+ KCP + picks = starting level PG formula

- do i believe such trade exists? Not really.

- i do think that we should look how to get Garland

- Warriors post Curry look very similar to our team. Celtics & Cavs being eliminated or at verge of elimination because they can't contain elite PGs isn't accident. Building team without star PG is very hard. Needless to say that both Celtics and Cavs DO have star guards, but Brunson/Haliburton ( Steph before injury) break defense and have gravity that defense can't solve.


- I think league's return of A LOT of physicality brings basketball back to original settins. 5 positions , roster backbones being elite PG and elite defensive C, and versitale SFs who aren't that much on ball.
- I think OKC will win title with most outdated 5 since Thiago Splitter and Tim Duncan started at PF/C.
- I think OKC will also now give blueprint for new rebuiding team what to get: star PG, elite C and few wings ( Pistons, Spurs already started it ).
- i think shooting in playoffs is bit overrated, but you need to have shooters who at least on paper are treats.
OKC ended up with 21 wide open 3s vs Denver, Denver had 20, but due physicality, lack of good rhythm players brick way more shots in playoffs than in RS.

I have my doubts about Garland being so small. But he's clearly overshadowed and marginalized by Mitchell...the whole CLE story seems to have taken a regular season break but is right back to all of the questions of last summer...Two fantastic bigs that should both be playing C, two undersized but super-skilled PGs who don't fit together without significant overlap. I guess Atkinson did a masterful job of hiding the issues for 82 games but they continue to exist.

I think they'd consider: Suggs for Garland

or Franz + WCJ for Garland + Allen

but I don't know that I would.

Don't know that they'd consider KCP & #16 for Allen...but I sure would jump on that. I can't stand KCP on ORL, but no doubt he'd help CLE in some role.

[VFX]

The bottom line is that Garland is just an above average point guard relative to what it would take to actually get him.

I can pretty much guarantee Orlando isn’t going to blow up their core 3 guys in a lateral move for a point guard. Everything else is on the table: Picks, KCP, Isaac, Cole, 3 Centers, AB, etc.

The asking price is just too high for what people are expecting in known quantities of fringe all-star guards. You will be disappointed.

Simons, Sexton, Jerome, etc. are the level of players that are attainable.

[eyriq]

The bottom line is that Garland is just an above average point guard relative to what it would take to actually get him.

I can pretty much guarantee Orlando isn’t going to blow up their core 3 guys in a lateral move for a point guard. Everything else is on the table: Picks, KCP, Isaac, Cole, 3 Centers, AB, etc.

The asking price is just too high for what people are expecting in known quantities of fringe all-star guards. You will be disappointed.

Simons, Sexton, Jerome, etc. are the level of players that are attainable.

Your evaluation of Garland is fair, he's not a superstar by any means. However, he is one of the best offensive guards in the league, probably top 10, and he would fit perfectly in our core as a third option.

Suggs currently sits in that third option salary slot. Paying a 3&D "star in his role" player 3rd option money is inherently a sacrifice of offense for defense. We can't add a big ticket 3rd option while paying a premium price for a role player, so you might as well not even bring up the starters and role players we could use as trade chips. It'll have to be Suggs for a major upgrade, just salary cap reality.

[OrlandoDream]

Im not trading Suggs unless its for Booker level player. For Garland? That would make us a significantly worse team. Fans really have short-term memory If cant remember how important suggs is to us. Suggs isn't going anywhere. That contract will look like a steal in 2-3 years with cap going up.

We don't need a Garland, Trae, etc 40mil plus PG to ruin our cap flexibility. There are a couple of mid tier options that would be great fits and would cost significantly less.

[GGforever]

My ideal offseason that is reasonable to assume.
Players out: KCP, Cole, Wendell, Gary
Players in: Anfernee Simons, Walker Kessler, Duncan Robinson, and Walter Clayton with pick 25(if we are able to keep it).

[VFX]

The bottom line is that Garland is just an above average point guard relative to what it would take to actually get him.

I can pretty much guarantee Orlando isn’t going to blow up their core 3 guys in a lateral move for a point guard. Everything else is on the table: Picks, KCP, Isaac, Cole, 3 Centers, AB, etc.

The asking price is just too high for what people are expecting in known quantities of fringe all-star guards. You will be disappointed.

Simons, Sexton, Jerome, etc. are the level of players that are attainable.

Your evaluation of Garland is fair, he's not a superstar by any means. However, he is one of the best offensive guards in the league, probably top 10, and he would fit perfectly in our core as a third option.

Suggs currently sits in that third option salary slot. Paying a 3&D "star in his role" player 3rd option money is inherently a sacrifice of offense for defense. We can't add a big ticket 3rd option while paying a premium price for a role player, so you might as well not even bring up the starters and role players we could use as trade chips. It'll have to be Suggs for a major upgrade, just salary cap reality.

They aren't getting it anyway. Thats my point.

Garland is $37m and my point is that Orlando doesn't need a top 10 point guard within the configuration of this roster.
You dont need to spend that portion of cap space on that position. Orlando doesnt need a home run move right now. They need a double at point guard.

It's kind of hilarious how apparent your agenda is. You claim ALL season how amazing this core is and that the main reason they underachieved is due to injuries and not playing together. THEN you change your tune as soon as AB is thrown into trade ideas as opposed to Suggs. Its also funny you just recently came to an epiphany about the cap situation and aprons.

The bigger issue is paying a bunch of mediocre role players that contribute nothing.

[eyriq]

The bottom line is that Garland is just an above average point guard relative to what it would take to actually get him.

I can pretty much guarantee Orlando isn’t going to blow up their core 3 guys in a lateral move for a point guard. Everything else is on the table: Picks, KCP, Isaac, Cole, 3 Centers, AB, etc.

The asking price is just too high for what people are expecting in known quantities of fringe all-star guards. You will be disappointed.

Simons, Sexton, Jerome, etc. are the level of players that are attainable.

Your evaluation of Garland is fair, he's not a superstar by any means. However, he is one of the best offensive guards in the league, probably top 10, and he would fit perfectly in our core as a third option.

Suggs currently sits in that third option salary slot. Paying a 3&D "star in his role" player 3rd option money is inherently a sacrifice of offense for defense. We can't add a big ticket 3rd option while paying a premium price for a role player, so you might as well not even bring up the starters and role players we could use as trade chips. It'll have to be Suggs for a major upgrade, just salary cap reality.

They aren't getting it anyway. Thats my point.

Garland is $37m and my point is that Orlando doesn't need a top 10 point guard within the configuration of this roster.
You dont need to spend that portion of cap space on that position. Orlando doesnt need a home run move right now. They need a double at point guard.

It's kind of hilarious how apparent your agenda is. You claim ALL season how amazing this core is and that the main reason they underachieved is due to injuries and not playing together. THEN you change your tune as soon as AB is thrown into trade ideas as opposed to Suggs. Its also funny you just recently came to an epiphany about the cap situation and aprons.

The bigger issue is paying a bunch of mediocre role players the contribute nothing.

I value transparency. I probably adequately reflect any elements that see AB and Suggs as very similar players.

[Fortune Teller]

Suggs is really starting to worry me. He's only made it to the finish line in one out of four seasons, and now he's coming off his most significant injury. I don't think anyone would argue his importance to the team when healthy, but do we want to go down the Isaac road again? If you have to qualify your comments about a plyer with "when he's healthy" then how valuable is he to the team? Is that type of player really part of your core? It's just a simple fact that based on four years of data he is more likely than not to be injured and miss significant time next season. I love Suggs as much as anyone but the Magic tend to be too warm and fuzzy when evaluating these types of decisions. Core, continuity, brotherhood, organic growth, natural progression, all of that should be secondary to building a team that can win in the playoffs, period.

[OrlandoNed]

Suggs is really starting to worry me. He's only made it to the finish line in one out of four seasons, and now he's coming off his most significant injury. I don't think anyone would argue his importance to the team when healthy, but do we want to go down the Isaac road again? If you have to qualify your comments about a plyer with "when he's healthy" then how valuable is he to the team? Is that type of player really part of your core? It's just a simple fact that based on four years of data he is more likely than not to be injured and miss significant time next season. I love Suggs as much as anyone but the Magic tend to be too warm and fuzzy when evaluating these types of decisions. Core, continuity, brotherhood, organic growth, natural progression, all of that should be secondary to building a team that can win in the playoffs, period.

I'm with you. Suggs' injury history is concerning especially with how reckless he plays. It's like he plays basketball like a football player.

As much as I love Suggs, it might be best to sell high while we can before he ruins his body. Not saying it is imperative to trade him now, but I would consider him our best trade asset to build around Franz and Paolo.

[Audi]

Ffs just get Simons and start him at PG. His gravity and speed alone will shift the entire look of the SL. Let him run the ball up the court instead of having Paolo or Franz to walk it. Sick of Paolo and Franz’s you go I go iso ball? Pair a quick footed guard who has to be picked up from half court with Suggs and watch Paolo and Franz enjoy 2-3x less defenders crowding the paint. Get an actual ball handler that can pose a threat pulling up for 3 on a pick, or dish to Paolo/Franz in the pocket to get a head of steam downhill where they both thrive instead of forcing them to initiate it against a packed defense that isn’t scrambling. Should've already been done.

[MartinsIzAfraud]

Suggs is really starting to worry me. He's only made it to the finish line in one out of four seasons, and now he's coming off his most significant injury. I don't think anyone would argue his importance to the team when healthy, but do we want to go down the Isaac road again? If you have to qualify your comments about a plyer with "when he's healthy" then how valuable is he to the team? Is that type of player really part of your core? It's just a simple fact that based on four years of data he is more likely than not to be injured and miss significant time next season. I love Suggs as much as anyone but the Magic tend to be too warm and fuzzy when evaluating these types of decisions. Core, continuity, brotherhood, organic growth, natural progression, all of that should be secondary to building a team that can win in the playoffs, period.

I'm with you. Suggs' injury history is concerning especially with how reckless he plays. It's like he plays basketball like a football player.

As much as I love Suggs, it might be best to sell high while we can before he ruins his body. Not saying it is imperative to trade him now, but I would consider him our best trade asset to build around Franz and Paolo.

would be true Magic to ship off a top 3&D guy like suggs because you've refused to pair him with a proper PG to run with while forcing him into a role he just isn't suited for.

[eyriq]

Suggs is really starting to worry me. He's only made it to the finish line in one out of four seasons, and now he's coming off his most significant injury. I don't think anyone would argue his importance to the team when healthy, but do we want to go down the Isaac road again? If you have to qualify your comments about a plyer with "when he's healthy" then how valuable is he to the team? Is that type of player really part of your core? It's just a simple fact that based on four years of data he is more likely than not to be injured and miss significant time next season. I love Suggs as much as anyone but the Magic tend to be too warm and fuzzy when evaluating these types of decisions. Core, continuity, brotherhood, organic growth, natural progression, all of that should be secondary to building a team that can win in the playoffs, period.

I'm with you. Suggs' injury history is concerning especially with how reckless he plays. It's like he plays basketball like a football player.

As much as I love Suggs, it might be best to sell high while we can before he ruins his body. Not saying it is imperative to trade him now, but I would consider him our best trade asset to build around Franz and Paolo.

would be true Magic to ship off a top 3&D guy like suggs because you've refused to pair him with a proper PG to run with while forcing him into a role he just isn't suited for.

He's paid to be a third option and there are doubts about scalability to that level due to inefficiency and durability. Is that a reasonable concern?