Free Agent, Trade, Buyout, Extension & Conversion Thread, 2025 con't

[Celts17Pride]

Would hawks consider something around
Jalen Johnson, okongwu for Jaylen?

No. Johnson more untouchable in Atlanta than Trae Young

[stretch]

Here’s what many people miss when they propose moves and trades.

First, our payroll is projected around $225–$227 million, far above the second apron threshold of $207.8 million
The Celtics have to reduce at least $25-27 million in payroll, if they want to resign Luke and Al.

Until they get below the second apron, they can only make one for one trades.
They can’t package players and do two for three or three for two deals. It may work in your trade checker, but not in reality with the second apron.

The simplest way to do that may be to trade Holiday to the Rockets or the Spurs for their 10th or 12th picks, since those teams have the cap space to absorb his salary. Holiday is owed ~$32–37 million per year. He should remain an effective and high-level starting point guard for the next 2 to 4 seasons, due to his elite defense, leadership, and adaptability, even as his offensive numbers decline. The incoming lottery pick should be in the $4 to 5 million salary range. That gets you below the second apron and allows you to do more transactions.

My understanding is they can’t aggregate salary or trade two guys in one deal but they can trade one of their players for multiple players

No, you can’t do that if you’re aggregating salaries. For example, you can’t trade Jrue for 2 to 3 players that add up to his salary.

If you are above the second apron in the NBA, you are limited to one-for-one deals and cannot combine multiple players’ salaries in a trade, whether sending or receiving, to match salaries. That’s why unfortunately most of the trade proposals in this thread won’t work until we get below the second apron. To get under the second apron we have to remove at least 25 million in payroll which means putting one of our starters on a team with cap space and interest. Like Jrue for the 10th or 12th pick.

Second apron teams also cannot use trade exceptions, cannot send cash in trades, and lose access to the mid-level exception.

This is why Wyc told us back in March that they have to get out of the second apron to stay competitive through Tatum and Brown’s primes, because it’s way too restrictive. It’s not about avoiding the tax. They’re willing to pay if it means a championship contender.

[phincsfan]

Here’s what many people miss when they propose moves and trades.

First, our payroll is projected around $225–$227 million, far above the second apron threshold of $207.8 million
The Celtics have to reduce at least $25-27 million in payroll, if they want to resign Luke and Al.

Until they get below the second apron, they can only make one for one trades.
They can’t package players and do two for three or three for two deals. It may work in your trade checker, but not in reality with the second apron.

The simplest way to do that may be to trade Holiday to the Rockets or the Spurs for their 10th or 12th picks, since those teams have the cap space to absorb his salary. Holiday is owed ~$32–37 million per year. He should remain an effective and high-level starting point guard for the next 2 to 4 seasons, due to his elite defense, leadership, and adaptability, even as his offensive numbers decline. The incoming lottery pick should be in the $4 to 5 million salary range. That gets you below the second apron and allows you to do more transactions.

My understanding is they can’t aggregate salary or trade two guys in one deal but they can trade one of their players for multiple players

No, you can’t do that if you’re aggregating salaries. For example, you can’t trade Jrue for 2 to 3 players that add up to his salary.

If you are above the second apron in the NBA, you are limited to one-for-one deals and cannot combine multiple players’ salaries in a trade, whether sending or receiving, to match salaries. That’s why unfortunately most of the trade proposals in this thread won’t work until we get below the second apron.

Second apron teams also cannot use trade exceptions, cannot send cash in trades, and lose access to the mid-level exception.

This is why Wyc told us back in March that they have to get out of the second apron, because it’s way too restrictive. It’s not about avoiding the tax. They’re willing to pay if it means a championship contender.

Pretty sure the 2nd apron team cannot aggregate players when it’s a two team trade. They can take multiple players but can only send one out. If it’s a 3 or more team trade they can send out multiple players.

[stretch]

My understanding is they can’t aggregate salary or trade two guys in one deal but they can trade one of their players for multiple players

No, you can’t do that if you’re aggregating salaries. For example, you can’t trade Jrue for 2 to 3 players that add up to his salary.

If you are above the second apron in the NBA, you are limited to one-for-one deals and cannot combine multiple players’ salaries in a trade, whether sending or receiving, to match salaries. That’s why unfortunately most of the trade proposals in this thread won’t work until we get below the second apron.

Second apron teams also cannot use trade exceptions, cannot send cash in trades, and lose access to the mid-level exception.

This is why Wyc told us back in March that they have to get out of the second apron, because it’s way too restrictive. It’s not about avoiding the tax. They’re willing to pay if it means a championship contender.

Pretty sure the 2nd apron team cannot aggregate players when it’s a two team trade. They can take multiple players but can only send one out. If it’s a 3 or more team trade they can send out multiple players.

Unfortunately the aggregation restriction still applies in multi-team trades - second apron teams cannot aggregate salaries for matching purposes, even in three-team deals. The only way a second apron team can send out multiple players is if each outgoing player’s salary is matched individually with incoming salary, not by combining them to match a larger salary.

You cannot circumvent the aggregation rule by involving more teams; the restriction is on salary aggregation, not the number of teams. There is no loophole for second apron teams to send out multiple players in a multi-team trade if it involves aggregating their salaries for matching purposes.

So before we do anything that any of you have in mind, we have to get under the second apron.

The one path I see to get under the second apron is to send one of our starters to a team with $20-30 million cap room in return for a much cheaper single asset like a lottery pick. Jrue for the 10th or 12th pick gives us a good cost controlled asset and lets us keep the Jays, White, and Porziņģis who should recover next season. Along with Kornet, Hauser, PP and Al. Or it gives us flexibility to do any of the things that you’re all dreaming up

[jayu70]

Would hawks consider something around
Jalen Johnson, okongwu for Jaylen?

Very doubtful Hawks have any interest in moving Jalen Johnson. Can only see him being included as part of a Giannis trade (local Milwaukee kid etc.).

[Celts17Pride]

My opinion, three thoughts.

1. People need to forget about Giannis. In my opinion Giannis would have no interest in coming to Boston with Jayson Tatum out a full year. Giannis could just stay in Milwaukee or go to a lot more favorable situations.

2. We all know there will many Celtics on the move next and I have my opinions but I am clueless like everyone else in this forum on what the Celtics plans are going to be concerning player movement. I think more importantly for the Celtics are changes to the offensive philosophy. I think the Celtics need to get back to a faster style of play and get players that can play that way. The three point shot will always be there. I’m so tired of watching a stagnant offense that ends up with a three point chunk. If Mazzulla is unwilling to change then replace him. Ball movement, player movement and as Tommy Heinsohn use to say, Run, Run, Run!

3. Draft a point guard in the draft that can control the pace of the game and play him 25-30 mpg every game to make the new style a habit

[stretch]

No, you can’t do that if you’re aggregating salaries. For example, you can’t trade Jrue for 2 to 3 players that add up to his salary.

If you are above the second apron in the NBA, you are limited to one-for-one deals and cannot combine multiple players’ salaries in a trade, whether sending or receiving, to match salaries. That’s why unfortunately most of the trade proposals in this thread won’t work until we get below the second apron.

Second apron teams also cannot use trade exceptions, cannot send cash in trades, and lose access to the mid-level exception.

This is why Wyc told us back in March that they have to get out of the second apron, because it’s way too restrictive. It’s not about avoiding the tax. They’re willing to pay if it means a championship contender.

Pretty sure the 2nd apron team cannot aggregate players when it’s a two team trade. They can take multiple players but can only send one out. If it’s a 3 or more team trade they can send out multiple players.

Unfortunately the aggregation restriction still applies in multi-team trades - second apron teams cannot aggregate salaries for matching purposes, even in three-team deals. The only way a second apron team can send out multiple players is if each outgoing player’s salary is matched individually with incoming salary, not by combining them to match a larger salary.

You cannot circumvent the aggregation rule by involving more teams; the restriction is on salary aggregation, not the number of teams. There is no loophole for second apron teams to send out multiple players in a multi-team trade if it involves aggregating their salaries for matching purposes.

So before we do anything that any of you have in mind, we have to get under the second apron.

The one path I see to get under the second apron is to send one of our starters to a team with $20-30 million cap room in return for a much cheaper single asset like a lottery pick. Jrue for the 10th or 12th pick gives us a good cost controlled asset and lets us keep the Jays, White, and Porziņģis who should recover next season. Along with Kornet, Hauser, PP and Al. Or it gives us flexibility to do any of the things that you’re all dreaming up

Every person has interesting trade ideas to retool or rebuild, but none of them seem possible until we overcome this aggregation restriction and get under the second apron.

This is the biggest new change to team building. Until we dump $25 million net, we are over the second apron and pretty much restricted to one for one deals. We can only receive multiple players if each incoming salary is matched individually, or if one is acquired via the minimum salary exception

[Celts17Pride]

Pretty sure the 2nd apron team cannot aggregate players when it’s a two team trade. They can take multiple players but can only send one out. If it’s a 3 or more team trade they can send out multiple players.

Unfortunately the aggregation restriction still applies in multi-team trades - second apron teams cannot aggregate salaries for matching purposes, even in three-team deals. The only way a second apron team can send out multiple players is if each outgoing player’s salary is matched individually with incoming salary, not by combining them to match a larger salary.

You cannot circumvent the aggregation rule by involving more teams; the restriction is on salary aggregation, not the number of teams. There is no loophole for second apron teams to send out multiple players in a multi-team trade if it involves aggregating their salaries for matching purposes.

So before we do anything that any of you have in mind, we have to get under the second apron.

The one path I see to get under the second apron is to send one of our starters to a team with $20-30 million cap room in return for a much cheaper single asset like a lottery pick. Jrue for the 10th or 12th pick gives us a good cost controlled asset and lets us keep the Jays, White, and Porziņģis who should recover next season. Along with Kornet, Hauser, PP and Al. Or it gives us flexibility to do any of the things that you’re all dreaming up

Every person has interesting trade ideas to retool or rebuild, but none of them seem possible until we overcome this aggregation restriction and get under the second apron.

This is the biggest new change to team building. Until we dump $25 million net (like trading Jrue for the 10th or 12th pick), we are over the second apron and pretty much restricted to one for one deals. We can only receive multiple players if each incoming salary is matched individually, or if one is acquired via the minimum salary exception

Zero percent chance the Celtics get the 10th or 12th pick for Jrue Holiday. Maybe a late 20’s pick or even the Celtics have to give up a pick to move him. Holiday has $105 million left on his contract at ages 35, 36 and 37

[stretch]

Zero percent chance the Celtics get the 10th or 12th pick for Jrue Holiday. Maybe a late 20’s pick or even the Celtics have to give up a pick to move him. Holiday has $105 million left on his contract at ages 35, 36 and 37

The thought only came up because you’re dealing with the rockets or spurs who may value Holiday even more. And no other lottery team has the cap space except potentially Brooklyn.

But that’s the challenge facing Brad. To get back any flexibility to retool this roster, he needs to do a one for one deal that allows him to shed at least $25 million, before he can do anything else, including re-signing Luke to a hometown discount. The aggregation constraint of the second apron is ridiculous.

[Celts17Pride]

Zero percent chance the Celtics get the 10th or 12th pick for Jrue Holiday. Maybe a late 20’s pick or even the Celtics have to give up a pick to move him. Holiday has $105 million left on his contract at ages 35, 36 and 37

The thought only came up because you’re dealing with the rockets or spurs who may value Holiday even more

But that’s the challenge facing Brad. To get back any flexibility to retool this roster, he needs to do a one for one deal that allows him to shed at least $25 million.

I’m pretty sure the Celtics can take back multiple players say in a Jrue Holiday deal, the Celtics just can’t add players with Jrue Holiday, take back more money or send out cash. I’m not a CBA expert so who knows?

[FlatearthZorro]

Zero percent chance the Celtics get the 10th or 12th pick for Jrue Holiday. Maybe a late 20’s pick or even the Celtics have to give up a pick to move him. Holiday has $105 million left on his contract at ages 35, 36 and 37

The thought only came up because you’re dealing with the rockets or spurs who may value Holiday even more

But that’s the challenge facing Brad. To get back any flexibility to retool this roster, he needs to do a one for one deal that allows him to shed at least $25 million.

I’m pretty sure the Celtics can take back multiple players say in a Jrue Holiday deal, the Celtics just can’t add players with Jrue Holiday, take back more money or send out cash. I’m not a CBA expert so who knows?

Yes, Celtics cannot take more salary than they send out, you cannot aggregate 2 players' salaries to get 1. They need to shave about 26 mils in salary or else anybody they sign even to a vet min, say Kornett, his 3-4 mils, would cost the team 25 due to penalties. So the situation is dire, and with team's salaries this year, I got no idea how it will get much better. The only team that could take KP outright is BKN and I doubt they would(even Bobby Marks said that)... Makes no sense for them even if we trade both our picks, cause they already got a bunch of picks in this year's draft.

[Celts17Pride]

As I mentioned in the Celtics season thread, I’m expecting Big Al to either play his final two seasons in Boston or finish his career playing two seasons in Houston playing for Udoka or back to OKC. Just my opinion. Going to be an interesting offseason

[Cricket23]

I don't know if either team does it, but there has been plenty of talk about sending Brown home to Atlanta.

Just for arguments sake, this trade is legal-

Boston gets-
Risacher
Okongwu
Mann
Krejci

Atlanta gets-
Brown
Hauser
Tillman

It's legal because you can construct it to be legal as Atlanta has exceptions to take Hauser and Tillman.

Where and what draft picks I don't know.

Anyway, this trade saves Boston 19.7 million next year and is a very good return imo.

Saving 19.7 million in a trade like this would allow Boston to be more selective in a Jrue or KP trade, meaning they could put a little bit of a higher priority on the return, since they wouldn't have to cut as much salary.

I am very high on Risacher, and Krejci is a sneaky good player and contract.

[GoCeltics123]

My opinion, three thoughts.

1. People need to forget about Giannis. In my opinion Giannis would have no interest in coming to Boston with Jayson Tatum out a full year. Giannis could just stay in Milwaukee or go to a lot more favorable situations.

2. We all know there will many Celtics on the move next and I have my opinions but I am clueless like everyone else in this forum on what the Celtics plans are going to be concerning player movement. I think more importantly for the Celtics are changes to the offensive philosophy. I think the Celtics need to get back to a faster style of play and get players that can play that way. The three point shot will always be there. I’m so tired of watching a stagnant offense that ends up with a three point chunk. If Mazzulla is unwilling to change then replace him. Ball movement, player movement and as Tommy Heinsohn use to say, Run, Run, Run!

3. Draft a point guard in the draft that can control the pace of the game and play him 25-30 mpg every game to make the new style a habit

I think they relied more heavily on threes this year because of KP not being effective down low anymore. But I think Joe could use some new assistants with new ideas

[djFan71]

No, you can’t do that if you’re aggregating salaries. For example, you can’t trade Jrue for 2 to 3 players that add up to his salary.

If you are above the second apron in the NBA, you are limited to one-for-one deals and cannot combine multiple players’ salaries in a trade, whether sending or receiving, to match salaries. That’s why unfortunately most of the trade proposals in this thread won’t work until we get below the second apron.

Second apron teams also cannot use trade exceptions, cannot send cash in trades, and lose access to the mid-level exception.

This is why Wyc told us back in March that they have to get out of the second apron, because it’s way too restrictive. It’s not about avoiding the tax. They’re willing to pay if it means a championship contender.

Pretty sure the 2nd apron team cannot aggregate players when it’s a two team trade. They can take multiple players but can only send one out. If it’s a 3 or more team trade they can send out multiple players.

Unfortunately the aggregation restriction still applies in multi-team trades - second apron teams cannot aggregate salaries for matching purposes, even in three-team deals. The only way a second apron team can send out multiple players is if each outgoing player’s salary is matched individually with incoming salary, not by combining them to match a larger salary.

You cannot circumvent the aggregation rule by involving more teams; the restriction is on salary aggregation, not the number of teams. There is no loophole for second apron teams to send out multiple players in a multi-team trade if it involves aggregating their salaries for matching purposes.

So before we do anything that any of you have in mind, we have to get under the second apron.

The one path I see to get under the second apron is to send one of our starters to a team with $20-30 million cap room in return for a much cheaper single asset like a lottery pick. Jrue for the 10th or 12th pick gives us a good cost controlled asset and lets us keep the Jays, White, and Porziņģis who should recover next season. Along with Kornet, Hauser, PP and Al. Or it gives us flexibility to do any of the things that you’re all dreaming up

You have what is considered aggregation wrong,imo. See this thread
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2458826&p=118578184&hilit=Is+it+aggregating#p118577730

[gammajamma]

Here’s what many people miss when they propose moves and trades.

First, our payroll is projected around $225–$227 million, far above the second apron threshold of $207.8 million
The Celtics have to reduce at least $25-27 million in payroll, if they want to resign Luke and Al.

Until they get below the second apron, they can only make one for one trades.
They can’t package players and do two for three or three for two deals. It may work in your trade checker, but not in reality with the second apron.

The simplest way to do that may be to trade Holiday to the Rockets or the Spurs for their 10th or 12th picks, since those teams have the cap space to absorb his salary. Holiday is owed ~$32–37 million per year. He should remain an effective and high-level starting point guard for the next 2 to 4 seasons, due to his elite defense, leadership, and adaptability, even as his offensive numbers decline. The incoming lottery pick should be in the $4 to 5 million salary range. That gets you below the second apron and allows you to do more transactions.

My understanding is they can’t aggregate salary or trade two guys in one deal but they can trade one of their players for multiple players

No, you can’t do that if you’re aggregating salaries. For example, you can’t trade Jrue for 2 to 3 players that add up to his salary.

If you are above the second apron in the NBA, you are limited to one-for-one deals and cannot combine multiple players’ salaries in a trade, whether sending or receiving, to match salaries. That’s why unfortunately most of the trade proposals in this thread won’t work until we get below the second apron. To get under the second apron we have to remove at least 25 million in payroll which means putting one of our starters on a team with cap space and interest. Like Jrue for the 10th or 12th pick.

Second apron teams also cannot use trade exceptions, cannot send cash in trades, and lose access to the mid-level exception.

This is why Wyc told us back in March that they have to get out of the second apron to stay competitive through Tatum and Brown’s primes, because it’s way too restrictive. It’s not about avoiding the tax. They’re willing to pay if it means a championship contender.

You technically wouldn’t be aggregating to salaries. The other team would be assuming they’re not in the second apron.

[cloverleaf]

I don't know if either team does it, but there has been plenty of talk about sending Brown home to Atlanta.

Just for arguments sake, this trade is legal-

Boston gets-
Risacher
Okongwu
Mann
Krejci

Atlanta gets-
Brown
Hauser
Tillman

It's legal because you can construct it to be legal as Atlanta has exceptions to take Hauser and Tillman.

Where and what draft picks I don't know.

Anyway, this trade saves Boston 19.7 million next year and is a very good return imo.

Saving 19.7 million in a trade like this would allow Boston to be more selective in a Jrue or KP trade, meaning they could put a little bit of a higher priority on the return, since they wouldn't have to cut as much salary.

I am very high on Risacher, and Krejci is a sneaky good player and contract.

I don't think they can do multi-player trades from where they are, but I wouldn't want a pack of third-rate players for Brown. I'd rather a first-rate swap.

[djFan71]

KP and Hauser for Mann works and saves $25M range. Proposed by ATl fan in t&t board.

Send Jrue out for multiple players with one going elsewhere and you’re really close / clear of tax. Mann or Jrue return could be kept or flipped for a slightly less salary, a la redslastlaugh and his reverse pen to house trick. Depends on how the numbers work with Al, Luke.

JB gets his surgery, young guys get lots of PT. Low seed in playoffs or late lotto after he comes back. Either works. Then you’re set up for 26-27 with JT.

[Cricket23]

I don't know if either team does it, but there has been plenty of talk about sending Brown home to Atlanta.

Just for arguments sake, this trade is legal-

Boston gets-
Risacher
Okongwu
Mann
Krejci

Atlanta gets-
Brown
Hauser
Tillman

It's legal because you can construct it to be legal as Atlanta has exceptions to take Hauser and Tillman.

Where and what draft picks I don't know.

Anyway, this trade saves Boston 19.7 million next year and is a very good return imo.

Saving 19.7 million in a trade like this would allow Boston to be more selective in a Jrue or KP trade, meaning they could put a little bit of a higher priority on the return, since they wouldn't have to cut as much salary.

I am very high on Risacher, and Krejci is a sneaky good player and contract.

I don't think they can do multi-player trades from where they are, but I wouldn't want a pack of third-rate players for Brown. I'd rather a first-rate swap.

It can be constructed as 3 separate trades if necessary due to Atlanta's exceptions.

Risacher was the #1 pick last year and has star potential. Kong becomes your starting center while the other 2 players are in the rotation. And it saves Boston 19.7 million next year allowing more flexibility.

[FlatearthZorro]

Would hawks consider something around
Jalen Johnson, okongwu for Jaylen?

Very doubtful Hawks have any interest in moving Jalen Johnson. Can only see him being included as part of a Giannis trade (local Milwaukee kid etc.).

Brown's from ATL and I think he'd shine with Trae next to him. With a few tweaks, ATL could challenge the East as nobody is too scary.
However, I do agree, first I doubt the C's trade a dude who averaged 25 for 2 seasons and made all-nba 2nd team, FMVP and maybe it's better for the Hawks to keep their young players. Not a good trade for either team.