2025 NBA Draft Discussion Part 7

[DG88]

One question i have about Noa....The BBL League....Its an ok league but its not really all that strong in competition....And the athletes in the BBL seem to be lacking....Alot of shorter white players....Is it possible he is looking this athletic and dominant because he towers over eveyone else and is the better athlete than majority of them?....I know its a pro league but the comp isn't the greatest out there....

Just would hate to draft a guy this high at 9th for only them to play against equal or better athletes as him and not play as good or able to beat bigger stonger guys in the NBA.... considering he has a 29 % 3 point shot and only hitting 10 on the season as a wing player....

Don't mean to be too nit picky but have to ask these questions if we are going to use such a high draft pick on someone....Because if his ability to get to the rim and finish over players is taken away...He does not have a handle or a jump shot to really save him if he doesn't translate as the athlete he is in the BBL league....And hes very slim and needs to bulk up...He gets by in the BBL being this tiny because the players hes against are not as strong as the NBA and can't jump as high as him..

Usually those leagues have grown men for one and fringe NBA caliber players sprinkled in. On top of that they would run more NBA style sets than college. He also played the Trailblazers in the Preseason and his tools translated.

[Clutch0z24]

One question i have about Noa....The BBL League....Its an ok league but its not really all that strong in competition....And the athletes in the BBL seem to be lacking....Alot of shorter white players....Is it possible he is looking this athletic and dominant because he towers over eveyone else and is the better athlete than majority of them?....I know its a pro league but the comp isn't the greatest out there....

Just would hate to draft a guy this high at 9th for only them to play against equal or better athletes as him and not play as good or able to beat bigger stonger guys in the NBA.... considering he has a 29 % 3 point shot and only hitting 10 on the season as a wing player....

Don't mean to be too nit picky but have to ask these questions if we are going to use such a high draft pick on someone....Because if his ability to get to the rim and finish over players is taken away...He does not have a handle or a jump shot to really save him if he doesn't translate as the athlete he is in the BBL league....And hes very slim and needs to bulk up...He gets by in the BBL being this tiny because the players hes against are not as strong as the NBA and can't jump as high as him..

Usually those leagues have grown men for one and fringe NBA caliber players sprinkled in. On top of that they would run more NBA style sets than college. He also played the Trailblazers in the Preseason and his tools translated.

Ok cool cause i was just watching film on him and noticed in the BBL there are many players way shorter than him and alot of white unathletic guys....So i was just wondering...But yeah he had a decent game against the Blazers....Lets hope if we pick him that does translate well and he can continue to be as athletic as he is in the NBA as he is in the BBL because his athletic ability is crucial for his game to succeed...

[DG88]

One question i have about Noa....The BBL League....Its an ok league but its not really all that strong in competition....And the athletes in the BBL seem to be lacking....Alot of shorter white players....Is it possible he is looking this athletic and dominant because he towers over eveyone else and is the better athlete than majority of them?....I know its a pro league but the comp isn't the greatest out there....

Just would hate to draft a guy this high at 9th for only them to play against equal or better athletes as him and not play as good or able to beat bigger stonger guys in the NBA.... considering he has a 29 % 3 point shot and only hitting 10 on the season as a wing player....

Don't mean to be too nit picky but have to ask these questions if we are going to use such a high draft pick on someone....Because if his ability to get to the rim and finish over players is taken away...He does not have a handle or a jump shot to really save him if he doesn't translate as the athlete he is in the BBL league....And hes very slim and needs to bulk up...He gets by in the BBL being this tiny because the players hes against are not as strong as the NBA and can't jump as high as him..

Usually those leagues have grown men for one and fringe NBA caliber players sprinkled in. On top of that they would run more NBA style sets than college. He also played the Trailblazers in the Preseason and his tools translated.

Ok cool cause i was just watching film on him and noticed in the BBL there are many players way shorter than him and alot of white unathletic guys....So i was just wondering...But yeah he had a decent game against the Blazers....Lets hope if we pick him that does translate well and he can continue to be as athletic as he is in the NBA as he is in the BBL because his athletic ability is crucial for his game to succeed...

I think out the gate he'll be able to run in transition, cut, rebound and be handsy getting steals and deflections. I wouldn't expect him to be a good shooter, defend the post or create.

[Clutch0z24]

Usually those leagues have grown men for one and fringe NBA caliber players sprinkled in. On top of that they would run more NBA style sets than college. He also played the Trailblazers in the Preseason and his tools translated.

Ok cool cause i was just watching film on him and noticed in the BBL there are many players way shorter than him and alot of white unathletic guys....So i was just wondering...But yeah he had a decent game against the Blazers....Lets hope if we pick him that does translate well and he can continue to be as athletic as he is in the NBA as he is in the BBL because his athletic ability is crucial for his game to succeed...

I think out the gate he'll be able to run in transition, cut, rebound and be handsy getting steals and deflections. I wouldn't expect him to be a good shooter, defense the post or create.

Yep i noticed that in film he gets pushed around by guys in the BBL who are not particularly big players....Reason i bring up the athletic stuff cause i am keeping an eye on size on the court and Noa is always the biggest on the court as well in the highlights....Theres maybe 1 guy occasionally taller than him...But going from being the tallest player on the court most nights to not being the tallest i hope doesn't mess with his play too much...

Yeah if you play him at the NBA level hes going to be a transition fast break type of guy until he can hone his craft a little more....

Like i said before i see alot of Josh Childress peak with him and a Dalano Banton Floor (If he doesn't pan out)

Late to the Noa scouting since i didn't think he would even be in our range...

[DG88]

Ok cool cause i was just watching film on him and noticed in the BBL there are many players way shorter than him and alot of white unathletic guys....So i was just wondering...But yeah he had a decent game against the Blazers....Lets hope if we pick him that does translate well and he can continue to be as athletic as he is in the NBA as he is in the BBL because his athletic ability is crucial for his game to succeed...

I think out the gate he'll be able to run in transition, cut, rebound and be handsy getting steals and deflections. I wouldn't expect him to be a good shooter, defense the post or create.

Yep i noticed that in film he gets pushed around by guys in the BBL who are not particularly big players....Reason i bring up the athletic stuff cause i am keeping an eye on size on the court and Noa is always the biggest on the court as well in the highlights....Theres maybe 1 guy occasionally taller than him...But going from being the tallest player on the court most nights to not being the tallest i hope doesn't mess with his play too much...

Yeah if you play him at the NBA level hes going to be a transition fast break type of guy until he can hone his craft a little more....

Like i said before i see alot of Josh Childress peak with him and a Dalano Banton Floor (If he doesn't pan out)

Late to the Noa scouting since i didn't think he would even be in our range...

I agree with the Childress comp and I think we all thought we'd jump or at least stay 7th. I tried to keep an open mind on the possibility we fell a bit. It opens more prospects to us.

[Buff]

How is Maluach a fit? He doesn't play Darko offense, and we neither have a PG to make use of his PnR roll.
He is just people who wants without thinking about the fit.

I also questioned Maluach alot in the past on these boards and i still believe his bust potential is pretty high but to me atm the way im thinking about it is beggers can't be choosers type....I was hard on Maluach cause i was thinking we either stay at 7 or move up to top 4...Maybe 8th....But i never even imagined being at 9th....I liked too many prospects ahead of Maluach at 7 and the top 4 area to even consider Maluach in that area of the draft....

But at 9th when you start talking about Carter Bryant, Fleming, Noa (The boards favs) or potentially guys that want to reach for players that are in the late lotto range...I think if Maluach were to fall to 9th you just have to take him....Not saying i don't like the boards favs its just for me i think they all don't have the maximum potential if they hit their peaks....For the boards favs if they hit their absolute peaks i think they are all just decent role players (Possible to hit OG peak but i even doubt that because OG is prolly the best wing defender in the league none of these guys look like best defenders in the league to me)

And why do we even want another OG? I get we are deseperate for a + Wing defender but when we had OG in our system he didn't really lead us to anything because he is just a complimentary player to the Star (s) you already have if you really want to be a winning team with that kind of player...

Not saying Maluach is or can reach his peak but i feel if Maluach reaches his absolute peak thats a Franchise C vs another good role player....If any team in the league can develop Maluach to be the best player he can be it would be the Raptors imo...If he ends up on the Wizards or something i think he has a lower ceiling but with the Raptors i think there is a chance....

Sadly, I do not see Maluach have franchise C potential, where Embiid and other franchise C are able to create his own shot and make decisions with the ball around that age.

What I think we might do is to trade him to Atlanta, where he would be a good fit with their core and not need to re-sign Capela, and we get back a back two picks from them. However, if that deal is not on the table, we might draft someone we like even he is lower.

You can't have a franchise player in every position, ask yourself instead if KM could be championship C and to me the answer is yes, he can come out to the perimeter, won't have to bench in the crunch due to FT and he will protect the paint. If he can stick 1 in 3 3P on low volume that would seal the deal.

[Buff]

Crazy to think that its possible that Spurs could get Harper + Essengue if his draft stock stays where its at right now...Hes projected around the Spurs pick....Spurs can get Harper + one of the boards favs Noa/Rasheer/Carter With a 2nd pick all while having the best young player in the league in Wemby...All you can do is be envious.

It's a lesson in patience and rebuilding properly, the year they got Wemby we were basically in their slot (5th worst team) before the trade for Poeltl

Had we made the decision to rebuild then instead of like a year later we could have similar young assets to the Spurs

See how quickly you can acquire top end talent when you commit to the real tank for a couple yrs?

probably would have even more assets as FVV/Siakam/OG were all worth more back then too

It's a lesson in getting incredibly lucky in the lottery.

Stupid-ass Masai can't even do the luck.

[WuTang_CMB]

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[WuTang_CMB]

posted in other thread but masai and dan was at this game for fleming
centre court behind score keepers

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[elmer_yuck]

If the draft were held today. I think Fleming would be the pick, if he were available at 9.
I’m also intrigued by Raynaud.
I think there will be many changes from the perceived top 9 by draft day.

[Thaddy]

If the draft were held today. I think Fleming would be the pick, if he were available at 9.
I’m also intrigued by Raynaud.
I think there will be many changes from the perceived top 9 by draft day.

Fleming looks by far the best fit. I don't think he's low potential either. A prospect that fits in immediately as a role player can likely grow past their expected ceiling.

If we look at past picks getting a great role player would be a great outcome. If Fleming looks good we would be able to look for Poeltl + RJ packages for another all star that can fit into the line up.

Fleming
Barnes
Ingram
(star)
IQ

We would surround Barnes with shooters which should hypothetically help him.

I would also add that there is a very low chance Queen is a better contributor at the NBA level. Queen looks like he needs the ball while Fleming flourishs without it. Queen doesn't have 3pt range while Fleming already does, and the defense is clearly leaning towards Fleming. There's only a 5 month difference between them too.

[TNRaps4life]

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/25193838-2025-nba-mock-draft-post-combine-predictions-pro-comps-cooper-flagg-analysis

9. Toronto Raptors: Noa Essengue (Ratiopharm Ulm, PF)
9 of 59
Ratiopharm ulm v Tel Aviv - EuroCup
Harry Langer/DeFodi Images via Getty Images
Size: 6'10", 198 lbs

Age: 18

Nationality: France

Pro Comparisons: Jerami Grant

Big scoring outputs are becoming more common for Noa Essengue in the German BBL.

The easy baskets off rim runs, cuts and offensive rebounds have been consistent all season. But he's looking more comfortable converting off self-created drives and knocking down rhythm threes.

His improving on-ball skill and rising offensive production are becoming notable draft storylines, considering he's the draft's second-youngest prospect who also offers exciting defensive tools and movement.

Team Fit: Essengue already feels pretty Raptors-y. He’s young, long and athletic, and he should shine in the open floor and do some interesting things on defense. He’s also a work-in-progress shooter who lacks polish offensively.

39. Toronto Raptors (via Blazers): Labaron Philon (Alabama, PG)
39 of 59
NCAA BASKETBALL: MAR 29 Div I Men's Championship - Elite Eight - Duke vs Alabama
Rich Graessle/Icon Sportswire via Getty Images
Size: 6'4", 177 lbs

Age: 19

Nationality: USA

Pro Comparisons: Elfrid Payton

Labaron Philon could earn first-round looks from teams that buy his creativity, playmaking and unteachable touch shots around the key. It's difficult to picture anyone reaching early on a 177-pound guard who lacks explosion around the rim and shotmaking firepower. Philon may ultimately work best as more of a Swiss Army knife player than a lead guard.

What's strange is I don't see him listed in the lottery ever unless he's going to us.

Labaron Philon 2025 NBA Draft Combine Measurements
Height (without shoes): 6'2.75" (189 cm)

Weight: 174.6 lbs (79.2 kg)

Wingspan: 6'6.25" (199.3 cm)

Standing Reach: 8'3.5" (251.5 cm)

Hand Length: 8 inches

Hand Width: 8.5 inches

[gbball]

One question i have about Noa....The BBL League....Its an ok league but its not really all that strong in competition....And the athletes in the BBL seem to be lacking....Alot of shorter white players....Is it possible he is looking this athletic and dominant because he towers over eveyone else and is the better athlete than majority of them?....I know its a pro league but the comp isn't the greatest out there....

Just would hate to draft a guy this high at 9th for only them to play against equal or better athletes as him and not play as good or able to beat bigger stonger guys in the NBA.... considering he has a 29 % 3 point shot and only hitting 10 on the season as a wing player....

Don't mean to be too nit picky but have to ask these questions if we are going to use such a high draft pick on someone....Because if his ability to get to the rim and finish over players is taken away...He does not have a handle or a jump shot to really save him if he doesn't translate as the athlete he is in the BBL league....And hes very slim and needs to bulk up...He gets by in the BBL being this tiny because the players hes against are not as strong as the NBA and can't jump as high as him..

Usually those leagues have grown men for one and fringe NBA caliber players sprinkled in. On top of that they would run more NBA style sets than college. He also played the Trailblazers in the Preseason and his tools translated.

Ok cool cause i was just watching film on him and noticed in the BBL there are many players way shorter than him and alot of white unathletic guys....So i was just wondering...But yeah he had a decent game against the Blazers....Lets hope if we pick him that does translate well and he can continue to be as athletic as he is in the NBA as he is in the BBL because his athletic ability is crucial for his game to succeed...

I too was questioning his athleticism before I took a closer look. But he's got elite measurements. He has the same standing reach as Jacob and he's way more athletic. He's more nimble than Scottie. He's very light on his feet and he can run fast. Sometimes he doesn't jump very high to dunk, but he gets the ball to the rim really quick and he really doesn't have to jump that high. He seems to be able to get up higher when he needs to.

I think his combo of centre-like measurables along with elite (for that size) athleticism makes him a bit of a unicorn.

[DreamTeam09]

I've come around to Noa E being #2 on my raps big board after Maluach - like his size length and athletic ability while having good form on that 3, high release point. His face up game could be developed which leads to unlocking his potential. His long strides helps him gets to the rim & he's young

[Clutch0z24]

Usually those leagues have grown men for one and fringe NBA caliber players sprinkled in. On top of that they would run more NBA style sets than college. He also played the Trailblazers in the Preseason and his tools translated.

Ok cool cause i was just watching film on him and noticed in the BBL there are many players way shorter than him and alot of white unathletic guys....So i was just wondering...But yeah he had a decent game against the Blazers....Lets hope if we pick him that does translate well and he can continue to be as athletic as he is in the NBA as he is in the BBL because his athletic ability is crucial for his game to succeed...

I too was questioning his athleticism before I took a closer look. But he's got elite measurements. He has the same standing reach as Jacob and he's way more athletic. He's more nimble than Scottie. He's very light on his feet and he can run fast. Sometimes he doesn't jump very high to dunk, but he gets the ball to the rim really quick and he really doesn't have to jump that high. He seems to be able to get up higher when he needs to.

I think his combo of centre-like measurables along with elite (for that size) athleticism makes him a bit of a unicorn.

Yeah but its a wait and see for me because i watched alot of film today and hes doing it against players sometimes 4 inches shorter than him....Not many big bodies in the BBL....He has a mismatch almost every night because he is almost the tallest player on the court on a nightly basis....Which means he is not finishing over players that actually protecting the rim which makes me look at some of the highlight dunks hes doing with a grain of salt....

In the NBA he will always play against players his size or taller and stronger....Not saying it won't work in the NBA because he does have some good athletic ability.....Im just saying i will remain skeptical till i watch him against better competition....He looks like Giannis in this league because hes bigger than everyone....Even the opposing Cs look either his size or around 6'7" and can't jump with him because no offense alot of them are white and white ppl arn't always the best leapers...I wouldn't bring this up if he had a jumshot and an offensive bag but his offensive game relies so much on him finishing at the rim that i have to nit pick the way he looks in this league...But if Masai picks him gotta trust Masai...

Just hope he translates because he is really raw offensivly so that for me is why i will remain hesitant to want to grab him at 9....Esp if there is a better player at 9...

Watch on YouTube

Just keep an eye on the players on the court around him....They are all way shorter than him....You have your occasional players who is maybe his height but to play against a full defensive lineup that your taller than every single one of them is some sort of a big advantage for him...

[Son Goku 25]

I wonder if Fleming can be like Naz Reid

[WuTang_CMB]

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[tsherkin]

Honestly, at some point, I don't even really care who we pick. I just hope they're good, and better than the level of guys we've mostly been selecting for the past little while. I'd like to really hit on a pick this time. We did pretty well with OG (health and trade notwithstanding) and Siakam (trade notwithstanding), and I think we're in need of that level of success in order to facilitate significant team development here.

[gbball]

Ok cool cause i was just watching film on him and noticed in the BBL there are many players way shorter than him and alot of white unathletic guys....So i was just wondering...But yeah he had a decent game against the Blazers....Lets hope if we pick him that does translate well and he can continue to be as athletic as he is in the NBA as he is in the BBL because his athletic ability is crucial for his game to succeed...

I too was questioning his athleticism before I took a closer look. But he's got elite measurements. He has the same standing reach as Jacob and he's way more athletic. He's more nimble than Scottie. He's very light on his feet and he can run fast. Sometimes he doesn't jump very high to dunk, but he gets the ball to the rim really quick and he really doesn't have to jump that high. He seems to be able to get up higher when he needs to.

I think his combo of centre-like measurables along with elite (for that size) athleticism makes him a bit of a unicorn.

Yeah but its a wait and see for me because i watched alot of film today and hes doing it against players sometimes 4 inches shorter than him....Not many big bodies in the BBL....He has a mismatch almost every night because he is almost the tallest player on the court on a nightly basis....Which means he is not finishing over players that actually protecting the rim which makes me look at some of the highlight dunks hes doing with a grain of salt....

In the NBA he will always play against players his size or taller and stronger....Not saying it won't work in the NBA because he does have some good athletic ability.....Im just saying i will remain skeptical till i watch him against better competition....He looks like Giannis in this league because hes bigger than everyone....Even the opposing Cs look either his size or around 6'7" and can't jump with him because no offense alot of them are white and white ppl arn't always the best leapers...I wouldn't bring this up if he had a jumshot and an offensive bag but his offensive game relies so much on him finishing at the rim that i have to nit pick the way he looks in this league...But if Masai picks him gotta trust Masai...

Just hope he translates because he is really raw offensivly so that for me is why i will remain hesitant to want to grab him at 9....Esp if there is a better player at 9...

Watch on YouTube

Just keep an eye on the players on the court around him....They are all way shorter than him....You have your occasional players who is maybe his height but to play against a full defensive lineup that your taller than every single one of them is some sort of a big advantage for him...

He did get surprised by guys in the NBA and got blocked a few times. But he has the tools to make the adjustment. You could make the same argument about just about any NCAA player. BBL is higher competition and he's already producing at his age. It's not like he'd get to the NBA and be at a disadvantage because of his tools...he's got elite measurables even by NBA standards. He should just get stronger and more athletic as he matures...he might even keep growing.

[tsherkin]

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I hate that mock for us, picking another project. And if we're going with a project pick, I'd rather Fleming, I think, even though he's a little older.