The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 2

[lilfishi22]

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I feel like every 2nd player mentions playing in NY, specifically at the Garden.

[lilfishi22]

Sophie Cunningham according to the latest lawsuit

How do we change owners and still get sued

Get rid of the guy. Absolute zero value add to the organisation and being the CEO of the Mercury and getting "entangled" with a player is just super messy. Ishbia drained the swamp and then filled it back up with his own swamp

[lilfishi22]

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Why does this feel like the Terry Porter situation all over again??

So no Dudley nor Ivey

[lilfishi22]

https://youtu.be/cPcrziN8xso?feature=shared

Haynes reports Sweeney, Fizdale, Borrego, Bryant, Ott, Hetzel, Nori and Bliss have moved to the second round.

Suns want the coach to build a brand new program, align with the front office and have a defensive background.

No decision yet on moving KD.

That was a really interesting report.

Ott, Hetzel are the only two that have Michigan's connections and personally didn't know anything about them. I don’t know anything about Sweeney neither.

I know a bit about all the other five candidates. Fizdale and Borrego are the ones with HC experience.

Fizdale has been the last two years on the Suns...I don't know if that's a bad or good thing but I like him. Probably my favorite option from this group.

BTW, I like that we are waiting to get a HC to decide about KD's future on the Suns.

Don't know what to think of Fiz. He wasn't a very good HC but sticking around under two failed HC regimes does say something about him. Maybe he's ready, I dunno

[lilfishi22]

Kellan Olson:

Hetzel started as a Michigan State student manager in 2003. Ishbia's last year on the team was '02 and Gregory's was '03.

(He has also been a NBA assistant since 2014 FWIW and started in player development with the Pistons in '09)

Ott, a NBA assistant since 2018 that stared in video with Atlanta in '13, was with Michigan State from 2006-13.

Say no more

[lilfishi22]

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Just give me Quinn at this point. He's been in the trenches long enough and coached under a HOF HC long enough to deserve a shot. He has a resume I can respect

[lilfishi22]

Obviously we love to do that trade, but I doubt the Heat wants to do it because of Beal's NTC.

Rozier wouldn't start for us because he was literally one of the worst players in the league. He has regressed badly...but at least he is on an expiring deal.

I would keep KD in this scenario, no doubt about it.

Looking at Beal's Basketball Reference stats, I reiterate that IF we trade Kd, we should turn Beal loose at Pg for us this year instead of buying him out... (IF WE CANT TRADE HIM). His stats show no drop off as far as efficiency, just the amount of usage. His minutes per game are down a little and the ball is in his hands to score less. But his shot percentages, rebounds, turnover rate, have not gone out of whack. Being a more focal point without KD and he would still score 20+ a game and be a better defender than Book. We can ride that out rather than buy him out. Beal is out of sorts in his role, so a role change may help still. If you trade KD, start Beal at pg next to Booker (Booker starting at sf made me feel like kicking my tv off the stand), and put guys on the floor that fit. Post/pick guy, lob threat, defenders and let he and Book cook for a year. Beal, Book, Dunn + up-tempo could be fun.

I think it's smartest to keep Beal especially if you have to give up assets to get rid of him. Now if it's a buyout/stretch, I don't really like that either, because I don't want us talking about a near $20 million cap it in 4-5 years. Seems ridiculous to prolong that and not just to open up massive cap space in the summer of 27, and potentially trade him as an expiring the year prior (though that would probably require taking on bad longer contracts).

Of course I expect Ish to try to do anything but what I think is best as we desperately try to hang on to the yesteryears.

$20m a year for the next 5 years IS an asset. I think stretching him is worse than attaching a crappy pick to get rid of him. You can replace picks in other trades but $20m in dead money is written in ink.

[handsome salary]

Who cares.

I'm tired of another season going on how the Suns fans deserve a championship from players, coaches, front office, ownership and national press. It's a sad pathetic joke now. Hope to god to never to hear Barkley go on about how this exact thing. "Best fans ever...so deserving...waited so long..." Eff off.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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[Ghost of Kleine]

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[Ghost of Kleine]

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[Ghost of Kleine]

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This package just isn't getting it done, and the salaries aren't close to matching either as there 7 million off from KDs' 54 million.

[garrick]

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DaRon Holmes II Will Be Massive Addition to Denver Nuggets
The Denver Nuggets are taking on the Oklahoma City Thunder in Game 7 of the second round. Though, they still lack DaRon Holmes II who will make a massive impact next season

The Denver Nuggets' season has been anything but normal. Starting in July, things took a turn. In the NBA Summer League, rookie DaRon Holmes II saw his 2024-25 campaign come to a close with an Achilles injury in Vegas.

From that moment on, the Nuggets' season never had a sense of normalcy. A team that a year ago won 57 games, a tie-breaker away from the No. 1 seed, never truly threatened for the top spot in the Western Conference all year. This led to a coaching change with approximately five minutes to go in the regular season despite Denver being the No. 4 seed.

David Adelman has gotten the most out of his crew, beating the LA Clippers in seven games and now taking the Oklahoma City Thunder to a Game 7, just one win away from taking part in the Western Conference Finals. No matter how Sunday's matinee finishes, this has been a successful postseason run for the Nuggets, given the adversity they have had to fight through.

Some of that adversity? Their shallow rotation. Adelman has only been able to trust six guys and sometimes play seven. Michael Porter Jr. has a football pad on his shoulder as he guts through an injury and now Aaron Gordon is nursing a Grade 2 Hamstring strain with the Nuggets having no one to turn to. On top of the built-in roster flaws of no backup big man.

Denver has the best player in the world, Nikola Jokic, and a battle-tested crew with Jamal Murray and company that is good enough to win a championship this year and already has hoisted the Larry O'Brien trophy.

When teams get to a certain age, questions dance around them of how they improve the roster. For Denver, one of the answers is already on the bench in their red shirt rookie.

Holmes II was the No. 22 pick in the 2024 NBA Draft as the Dayton Product impressed during the predraft process after a stellar season with the Flyers.

Now, Holmes II is connected to the team, always on the bench and going through heavy pre-game workouts with fellow youngsters and assistant coaches. This scribe has been able to watch plenty of said workouts and Holmes II looks as good as advertised.


Not only can the 6-foot-10 big man stretch the floor with his shooting ability, but the aggression and mobility off the catch remain encouraging, along with his soft touch at the rim. In these 3-on-3 pregame runs, he often triggers the half-court possession, showing off his passing chops and how seamless of a fit he will be when he is back on the court next season.

Sure, no matter if this season ends with another NBA Championship or a second-round exit in the Mile High City, the Nuggets will have to do more this summer than just rely on the health of the 22-year-old. But after a year in the shadows, do not forget about how great of a pick Holmes II is for the Denver Nuggets.

This is showing once again the value of having your first round picks even if you're a contending team.

If DaRon Holmes can come back from his Achilles injury I think that should be a big pickup for them since I like the outside inside game he supposedly has. I kind of wish we had not traded him but given our lack of picks it made sense to trade him for extra picks...

https://www.si.com/nba/draft/newsfeed/daron-holmes-ii-will-be-massive-addition-to-denver-nuggets-may-18

[lilfishi22]

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They really missed the boat in turning MPJ into more depth when they had a chance now that he's had his worst playoff run in his career. I was never very high on MPJ but did thought he could be a high risk high reward guy when he fell in the draft because of injury concerns but they really should've "cashed in" last offseason when he had a good but not spectacular playoff run.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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DaRon Holmes II Will Be Massive Addition to Denver Nuggets
The Denver Nuggets are taking on the Oklahoma City Thunder in Game 7 of the second round. Though, they still lack DaRon Holmes II who will make a massive impact next season

The Denver Nuggets' season has been anything but normal. Starting in July, things took a turn. In the NBA Summer League, rookie DaRon Holmes II saw his 2024-25 campaign come to a close with an Achilles injury in Vegas.

From that moment on, the Nuggets' season never had a sense of normalcy. A team that a year ago won 57 games, a tie-breaker away from the No. 1 seed, never truly threatened for the top spot in the Western Conference all year. This led to a coaching change with approximately five minutes to go in the regular season despite Denver being the No. 4 seed.

David Adelman has gotten the most out of his crew, beating the LA Clippers in seven games and now taking the Oklahoma City Thunder to a Game 7, just one win away from taking part in the Western Conference Finals. No matter how Sunday's matinee finishes, this has been a successful postseason run for the Nuggets, given the adversity they have had to fight through.

Some of that adversity? Their shallow rotation. Adelman has only been able to trust six guys and sometimes play seven. Michael Porter Jr. has a football pad on his shoulder as he guts through an injury and now Aaron Gordon is nursing a Grade 2 Hamstring strain with the Nuggets having no one to turn to. On top of the built-in roster flaws of no backup big man.

Denver has the best player in the world, Nikola Jokic, and a battle-tested crew with Jamal Murray and company that is good enough to win a championship this year and already has hoisted the Larry O'Brien trophy.

When teams get to a certain age, questions dance around them of how they improve the roster. For Denver, one of the answers is already on the bench in their red shirt rookie.

Holmes II was the No. 22 pick in the 2024 NBA Draft as the Dayton Product impressed during the predraft process after a stellar season with the Flyers.

Now, Holmes II is connected to the team, always on the bench and going through heavy pre-game workouts with fellow youngsters and assistant coaches. This scribe has been able to watch plenty of said workouts and Holmes II looks as good as advertised.


Not only can the 6-foot-10 big man stretch the floor with his shooting ability, but the aggression and mobility off the catch remain encouraging, along with his soft touch at the rim. In these 3-on-3 pregame runs, he often triggers the half-court possession, showing off his passing chops and how seamless of a fit he will be when he is back on the court next season.

Sure, no matter if this season ends with another NBA Championship or a second-round exit in the Mile High City, the Nuggets will have to do more this summer than just rely on the health of the 22-year-old. But after a year in the shadows, do not forget about how great of a pick Holmes II is for the Denver Nuggets.

This is showing once again the value of having your first round picks even if you're a contending team.

If DaRon Holmes can come back from his Achilles injury I think that should be a big pickup for them since I like the outside inside game he supposedly has. I kind of wish we had not traded him but given our lack of picks it made sense to trade him for extra picks...

https://www.si.com/nba/draft/newsfeed/daron-holmes-ii-will-be-massive-addition-to-denver-nuggets-may-18

If Denver trades for KD, Holmes would have to be in the package. The package would have to be Porter Jr/ Nnaji/ Braun/ Holmes/ Tyson/ DEN 31' 1st.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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Why does this feel like the Terry Porter situation all over again??

So no Dudley nor Ivey

Pretty much! I have to wonder if they turned down the Suns offer themselves? Because they didn't want to sign up to this potential trainwreck!!

[Fo-Real]

There really was never a point in firing Frank Vogel.

It says more about the Suns than anything. Like with this season, Bud was a complete failure but he's never failed to this extent before in his career and it just feels like an issue bigger than him. Likewise with Vogel, I think both have to take some responsibility for disappointing seasons but at the end of the day the buck stops with the Ishbia.

Crazy thing is, Bud was even on the hot seat during the year they beat us for the championship. He saved his job!! Something put him in the crosshairs of that back then and it only bought him 2 more seasons. THATS NOT NOTHING!!

[Ghost of Kleine]

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[lilfishi22]

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Why does this feel like the Terry Porter situation all over again??

So no Dudley nor Ivey

Pretty much! I have to wonder if they turned down the Suns offer themselves? Because they didn't want to sign up to this potential trainwreck!!

On the one hand, I can see how it could be might be a bad step career wise to be a Suns HC right now with expectations still so high but so many things stacked against you which isn't really in their control (ie the direction of the team, big moves with key guys, no salary space).

On the other hand, there are only 30 of these top jobs in the NBA and all of them highly coveted, regardless of which team it is (some are more prestigious and coveted than others). Some ex-players have been trying and failing to get one of these jobs for a decade plus, prime example being Sam Cassell who's been an assistant since he retired in 08 and I can't count the number of HC interviewers he's had over the years. Even Quinn has been in the assistant coaching trenches for a decade now. Both Cassell and Quinn are no strangers to interviews but has never had their names called.

You just never know when you're gonna get the opportunity and I think sometimes you just take it and hope you have the coaching talent and conviction to turn around a seemingly bad job into one you'll be remembered for. If you're gonna wait for the perfect situation, it's probably never going to come

[lilfishi22]

There really was never a point in firing Frank Vogel.

It says more about the Suns than anything. Like with this season, Bud was a complete failure but he's never failed to this extent before in his career and it just feels like an issue bigger than him. Likewise with Vogel, I think both have to take some responsibility for disappointing seasons but at the end of the day the buck stops with the Ishbia.

Crazy thing is, Bud was even on the hot seat during the year they beat us for the championship. He saved his job!! Something put him in the crosshairs of that back then and it only bought him 2 more seasons. THATS NOT NOTHING!!

He would've been fired if he didn't win that one year, I think that was almost a certainty. I just think that both Vogel and Bud have shown themselves to be, at the very least, very competent NBA head coaches who have done great things wherever they've gone. Sure you get to a certain point in your HC tenure with a team when high expectations meets actual team achievement and sometimes that mismatch is enough to get you fired despite not having a bad team per se. I think both Vogel and Bud got to that point with their respective teams before the Suns.

With the Suns, I just feel like it was beyond them. Again, I don't want to take away their responsibility but when you have two ex championship winning coaches getting the boot in back to back seasons and they weren't able to get more out of a relatively talented team, it's really more of a roster/team issue than coaching at that point.