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2025 Draft Thread - Part 2

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Re: 2025 Draft Thread - Part 2 

Post#1061 » by AFM » Tue May 20, 2025 1:19 am

WizarDynasty wrote:
Dat2U wrote:If were talking about engines, only true engine in this draft is Harper. Queen is an engine in theory only and he would have to transform his body to truly become one.

While I dont agree with WizD on Maluach and knee damage, I do think he's at risk for a lower body injury right now. You see some uncoordinted movements where he's switched on a guard and his knees automatically buckle and go inward but then you see the athleticism to use his 250 ib from to recover and use his momentum to block a shot from behind. :eek2:

Problem is, his knees buckle alot. The amount of torque its takes for him change directions is just something in the back of my head that I worry about. Doesn't mean its a deal breaker, but working on his lower body so it can better accomodate his frame will need to be a priority for the team that drafts him IMO.



Yeah I agree Harper is definitely an Engine. Wow I wish we could get him but we needed the 2nd pick. 18th is not enough to get us there. Remember if you start hearing other boards use engine all of sudden. Or you hear nba commentary start using the word engine, they stole it from me lol.


Thoughts on Tre Johnson? I guess he doesn’t fit your engine criteria
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Re: 2025 Draft Thread - Part 2 

Post#1062 » by WizarDynasty » Tue May 20, 2025 1:33 am

AFM wrote:
WizarDynasty wrote:
Dat2U wrote:If were talking about engines, only true engine in this draft is Harper. Queen is an engine in theory only and he would have to transform his body to truly become one.

While I dont agree with WizD on Maluach and knee damage, I do think he's at risk for a lower body injury right now. You see some uncoordinted movements where he's switched on a guard and his knees automatically buckle and go inward but then you see the athleticism to use his 250 ib from to recover and use his momentum to block a shot from behind. :eek2:

Problem is, his knees buckle alot. The amount of torque its takes for him change directions is just something in the back of my head that I worry about. Doesn't mean its a deal breaker, but working on his lower body so it can better accomodate his frame will need to be a priority for the team that drafts him IMO.



Yeah I agree Harper is definitely an Engine. Wow I wish we could get him but we needed the 2nd pick. 18th is not enough to get us there. Remember if you start hearing other boards use engine all of sudden. Or you hear nba commentary start using the word engine, they stole it from me lol.


Thoughts on Tre Johnson? I guess he doesn’t fit your engine criteria


Very rare to have a guard as engine. If they didn't score close to 50 percent and lead the nation in scoring, highly likely they are going to do it in the pros. Bigs take much longer to develop than guards but you usually see traits that elite from a big like being able to palm the ball, elite foot work, high motor. An engine normally has a physical trait that creates a longlasting advantage like kevin durant standing reach 9'3 against small forwards or Brunson stop and go with power. Shai length and burst, highly coordinated stop and go, elite dribbling with both hands, and can score with both hands. This guy Tre I don't see anything physical about him that gives him a lasting advantage in the playoffs. To me, he is definitely a tweener shooting guard that plays below the rim. I don't see alot of body control with the ball, or the ability to rise above bigs and score consistently. 8'5 standing reach means that he is long for a point guard, not a shooting guard. Very small hands, i doubt he can palm the ball on offensive moves aka jordan, Dr. J.
Maybe I am wrong. But i don't see engine potential at all. Maybe a gimmick spark player off the bench for offensive when you need quick shots. I don't see a guy who can take over a game athletically against shot blockers like a Jordan or Anthony Edwards to get you deep into the playoffs. MOst didn't see it Brunson either though but he did play like an engine in college.
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Re: 2025 Draft Thread - Part 2 

Post#1063 » by SUPERBALLMAN » Tue May 20, 2025 1:38 am

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I want these 2 on the Wizards!!! :pray: :wizard:
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Re: 2025 Draft Thread - Part 2 

Post#1064 » by doclinkin » Tue May 20, 2025 1:41 am

I’m at the point in the draft process where I like too many players. My brain shorts out. I give up. Let’s just draft them all.
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Re: 2025 Draft Thread - Part 2 

Post#1065 » by dckingsfan » Tue May 20, 2025 1:51 am

dobrojim wrote:
dckingsfan wrote:
tontoz wrote:If he had more on offense I would have been advocating for him at 2. He is so limited on offense I just couldn't do it, and it isn't hard to find defensive Cs later in the draft or in free agency.

Well, what I am seeing.

He is going to be a really good defensive C. Drafted at age 19, he rebounds well, blocks shots well and was getting pretty adept at defensive rotations. He is working on his body, foot speed and quickness and I think it is going to translate well to switchability.

On the offensive side of the ball he was "limited" especially early in the season. Then in February he posted a .653 TS, followed by a .571 in April (those are the highlight). That and his picks got progressively better as the season moved along. The real ugly part is his FT percentage - he started out shooting .750ish and then fell into the high .500s. Ouch.

Point two as it pertains to this draft. As Doc mentioned this one is deep with bigs. I really think we should be using one of our FRPs to take at least one big. Several seem to be on the same level as Clingan.

We need someone to play C so Sarr can get non-C minutes, like Chet and Mobley get. Or maybe Dawkins will hope Vuc is able to do that.

Either way, with the abundance of seemingly attractive Bigs, we need to get one.

Violent agreement. We have 3 picks. Only (IMO) is Khaman Maluach reasonable at #6. But there are many good options when you get to 18, Sorber if he is there, Beringer (project) and Kalkbrenner. And I think there will be one (or maybe two) that fall all the way to 40 (Raynaud and Yang for example).

I have to believe that one of the three picks will be a big. And maybe a big and one of these interesting PFs.

Gonna be interesting...
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Re: 2025 Draft Thread - Part 2 

Post#1066 » by WallToWall » Tue May 20, 2025 4:51 am

Would you consider drafting VJ Edgecombe given that we have AJ Johnson?
To me, they seem quite similar. I would rather keep AJ and pass on VJ.
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Re: 2025 Draft Thread - Part 2 

Post#1067 » by Chocolate City Jordanaire » Tue May 20, 2025 6:17 am

AFM wrote:
nate33 wrote:
AFM wrote:
Not really. When Maluach flunks the sprints and agility drills, it's OK because he fits the Gargantuan Oaf Archetype. When Queen flunks, it's because fat boy isn't disciplined and eats too much cake. And even worse for Queen, basketball isn't a game about putting the ball in the basket (something he's good at), it's about agility drills and shuttle sprints and measurements.

It's simple. Centers are involved in something like 50% of defensive possessions. Most offenses are schemed to pit their team's best and quickest ball handler against the opponent's slowest player. If a team has a really slow player who is also not a long and tall shot blocker, then your team will absolutely suck defensively, at least in the playoffs when the team has the time to work out a scouting report to exploit your slow non-shot-blocker.

In most cases, it's impossible for your center to be so good offensively that he can overcome this massive, team-killing weakness on defense. Look around at the offensively gifted but defensively compromised centers in this league, guys like Vucevic, Nurkic, Bryant, Valanciunas. In every case, their team sucks with them on the floor even if they post good numbers. And Queen is shorter than those guys.

Even Sabonis and Sengun, who are step quicker than the guys I mentioned as well as being the most adept offensively, haven't won a playoff series yet. Jokic is the only exception, and that's because he is the greatest offensive player of all time and he has also improved his conditioning tremendously so that he at least moves well on defense and is in the right place. Also, his ball handling and high post game allow the Nuggets to play through him on virtually every possession. Most good centers are still reliant on quality entry passes or blown pick-and-roll coverage to get the ball so they are unable to carry a high enough usage to alter the game even if they are great offensively when they do get the ball.

The only hope for Queen to be a playoff starter is if he has a radical body transformation like what Julius Randle, Naz Reid, and Udonis Haslem did so that he could move to power forward and guard the position. There's certainly a small chance that could happen, but I wouldn't bet the #6 pick on it.


I don't see why losing 15 lbs is more of a pipe dream than Player A learning to shoot or Player B learning to drive or whatever we say about the dozens of prospects we analyze every year on this board. Either way, I agree with CCJ that the Wizards will not draft him. He will go after 6 but before 18, IMO.
This.

He'll be a Millsap at worst. We'll revisit these negative assessments.
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Re: 2025 Draft Thread - Part 2 

Post#1068 » by Northwest Roddy » Tue May 20, 2025 7:06 am

When does Nivek coming out with Yoda? I need another draft fix!
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Re: 2025 Draft Thread - Part 2 

Post#1069 » by Northwest Roddy » Tue May 20, 2025 7:25 am

Maybe Derek Queen isn’t an engine. Maybe he’s a diesel.
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Re: 2025 Draft Thread - Part 2 

Post#1070 » by Northwest Roddy » Tue May 20, 2025 8:09 am

Question. Maybe the combine should have a bench press test for strength like the NFL. Wes wasn't quick or fast but was strong like bull. Moses was also not quick but very strong. If Queen measured out as having elite strength, would that make a difference?
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Re: 2025 Draft Thread - Part 2 

Post#1071 » by TheBlackCzar » Tue May 20, 2025 10:08 am

Northwest Roddy wrote:Question. Maybe the combine should have a bench press test for strength like the NFL. Wes wasn't quick or fast but was strong like bull. Moses was also not quick but very strong. If Queen measured out as having elite strength, would that make a difference?


Basketball has changed alot in 4 decades......
To make Queen's combine worse is that he allegedly lost weight (10-15lbs) and still was slow as molasses..... That is what should be the concerning part, that even with the weight loss he was still highly unathletic.....
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Re: 2025 Draft Thread - Part 2 

Post#1072 » by doclinkin » Tue May 20, 2025 11:10 am

Northwest Roddy wrote:Question. Maybe the combine should have a bench press test for strength like the NFL. Wes wasn't quick or fast but was strong like bull. Moses was also not quick but very strong. If Queen measured out as having elite strength, would that make a difference?


They used to. Scrapped it after Kevin Durant couldn’t push it once. Then proceeded to destroy the NBA with his play.
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Re: 2025 Draft Thread - Part 2 

Post#1073 » by TGW » Tue May 20, 2025 11:14 am

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Re: 2025 Draft Thread - Part 2 

Post#1074 » by popper » Tue May 20, 2025 11:46 am

TGW wrote:
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Good luck blocking that shot.
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Re: 2025 Draft Thread - Part 2 

Post#1075 » by AFM » Tue May 20, 2025 11:54 am

Maluach and Sarr would be an interesting combo. Two tall ass skinny mfers.
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Re: 2025 Draft Thread - Part 2 

Post#1076 » by Jay81 » Tue May 20, 2025 12:01 pm

I would be very surprised if Kon is not a top 5 pick
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Re: 2025 Draft Thread - Part 2 

Post#1077 » by closg00 » Tue May 20, 2025 1:03 pm

Honest question about Maluach, had he not played for Duke, would have garnered this much attention, will Maluach and Missi have similar ceilings in 4 years? Missi does not have the shooting potential that Maluach has apparently. Meal is definitely on my list.
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Re: 2025 Draft Thread - Part 2 

Post#1078 » by Rafael122 » Tue May 20, 2025 1:22 pm

closg00 wrote:Honest question about Maluach, had he not played for Duke, would have garnered this much attention, will Maluach and Missi have similar ceilings in 4 years? Missi does not have the shooting potential that Maluach has apparently. Meal is definitely on my list.


I mean you can't teach size and perhaps in another school, Maluach would have played more.
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Re: 2025 Draft Thread - Part 2 

Post#1079 » by Jay81 » Tue May 20, 2025 2:25 pm

Rafael122 wrote:
closg00 wrote:Honest question about Maluach, had he not played for Duke, would have garnered this much attention, will Maluach and Missi have similar ceilings in 4 years? Missi does not have the shooting potential that Maluach has apparently. Meal is definitely on my list.


I mean you can't teach size and perhaps in another school, Maluach would have played more.

There’s a lot of good size players that suck ass
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Re: 2025 Draft Thread - Part 2 

Post#1080 » by dobrojim » Tue May 20, 2025 2:27 pm

AFM
Maluach and Sarr would be an interesting combo. Two tall ass skinny mfers.


Maluach is at the top of my list. I think he checks a lot of boxes. That said, I'm just a fan
sitting at home going on the web and watching games. If Dawkins thinks there is a better
choice, it's probably because he knows a lot more than I do ie he's an expert and I'm not.

Jay
I would be very surprised if Kon is not a top 5 pick


He might be better than many are concluding, but I would be very surprised if he was top 5.
Maybe 8-20 somewhere?
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