2025 Draft Thread - Part 2

[DCZards]

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Decent handle for a big and a nice stroke on that 3.

I know nothing about this kid personally...but I get the distinct vibe that he'll work is a** off to become a great player.

[WizarDynasty]

Honest question about Maluach, had he not played for Duke, would have garnered this much attention, will Maluach and Missi have similar ceilings in 4 years? Missi does not have the shooting potential that Maluach has apparently. Meal is definitely on my list.

I mean you can't teach size and perhaps in another school, Maluach would have played more.

There’s a lot of good size players that suck ass

I don't think I have ever seen Maluach catch the ball with one hand. A coordinated big with giant hands should be able to palm the ball i.e. Michael Jordan, Leonard.
Not having coordinated hands as a big or small hands and can't palm the ball effectively are huge red flags for post work. But despite all of that, I still think he is top 10. I would draft in Wizard Org. unless I had solid plan for developing him. Now me, personally, if he had the work ethic, i would transform him into a Hakeem or a Kareem...but that's because I actually know the muscles and coordination needed to play that way lol. But it takes years to develop hand and finger coordination.

[nate33]

I would be very surprised if Kon is not a top 5 pick

He might be better than many are concluding, but I would be very surprised if he was top 5.
Maybe 8-20 somewhere?

Interestingly, the mock draft tracker that doc posted a while ago now has Knueppel ahead of Johnson:

https://nbadraftnetwork.com/consensus-big-board

[nate33]

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Decent handle for a big and a nice stroke on that 3.

I know nothing about this kid personally...but I get the distinct vibe that he'll work is a** off to become a great player.

I thought his handle was pretty bad in that video. The shooting stroke looked okay though.

[AFM]

I would be very surprised if Kon is not a top 5 pick

He might be better than many are concluding, but I would be very surprised if he was top 5.
Maybe 8-20 somewhere?

Interestingly, the mock draft tracker that doc posted a while ago now has Knueppel ahead of Johnson:

https://nbadraftnetwork.com/consensus-big-board

I would be very happy if this was the case. Johnson is a 40% shooter from 3 on 7 3s a game. 87% FT shooter. 43% from the field and many of those were really, really tough shots. He has Kobe/Jordan-esque footwork (obviously not comparing the two as prospects, just aesthetically) which is rare at his age. His scoring game is really mature. I see him as having a long career as a potent shooter. I'm way more excited for him than Knueppel, or really anyone after the consensus 5.


I'm sure you can figure out who the other player here is, but just a quick comparison between 2 prospects:

[nate33]

He might be better than many are concluding, but I would be very surprised if he was top 5.
Maybe 8-20 somewhere?

Interestingly, the mock draft tracker that doc posted a while ago now has Knueppel ahead of Johnson:

https://nbadraftnetwork.com/consensus-big-board

I would be very happy if this was the case. Johnson is a 40% shooter from 3 on 7 3s a game. 87% FT shooter. 43% from the field and many of those were really, really tough shots. He has Kobe/Jordan-esque footwork (obviously not comparing the two as prospects, just aesthetically) which is rare at his age. His scoring game is really mature. I see him as having a long career as a potent shooter. I'm way more excited for him than Knueppel, or really anyone after the consensus 5.


I'm sure you can figure out who the other player here is, but just a quick comparison between 2 prospects:

I have no idea who you are comparing there, but I agree with you that I'd be happy if Tre fell to #6.

[dckingsfan]

I’m at the point in the draft process where I like too many players. My brain shorts out. I give up. Let’s just draft them all.

So this. I feel for those in a FO like Brooklyn that has to really continue to pay attention. There must be some interesting debate going on - love to be a fly on the wall...

[nate33]

I’m at the point in the draft process where I like too many players. My brain shorts out. I give up. Let’s just draft them all.

So this. I feel for those in a FO like Brooklyn that has to really continue to pay attention. There must be some interesting debate going on - love to be a fly on the wall...

I usually go the other way at this time of year. I find flaws in everyone and have trouble envisioning any of these guys as full time NBA starters except Flagg and Harper.

[The Consiglieri]

Joan Beringer is a Javale McGee run & jump athlete with ridiculously long arms and elite mobility for 6-10. He had two startling drives to the rim that looked Giannis'esque but for the most part, there isnt much offensive skill but alot of mobility and activity on defense. He projects as a switchable rim runner but is a couple of years away. Early 2nd round is ideal for him.

Watch on YouTube

Everything I've read suggests Beringer is going 12-26, definitely not round 2.

[AFM]

Interestingly, the mock draft tracker that doc posted a while ago now has Knueppel ahead of Johnson:

https://nbadraftnetwork.com/consensus-big-board

I would be very happy if this was the case. Johnson is a 40% shooter from 3 on 7 3s a game. 87% FT shooter. 43% from the field and many of those were really, really tough shots. He has Kobe/Jordan-esque footwork (obviously not comparing the two as prospects, just aesthetically) which is rare at his age. His scoring game is really mature. I see him as having a long career as a potent shooter. I'm way more excited for him than Knueppel, or really anyone after the consensus 5.


I'm sure you can figure out who the other player here is, but just a quick comparison between 2 prospects:

I have no idea who you are comparing there, but I agree with you that I'd be happy if Tre fell to #6.

I thought the rebounding numbers would give it away that's Beal's college numbers. Point being Johnson is a way better shooter than Beal was coming out of college.

[nate33]

Joan Beringer is a Javale McGee run & jump athlete with ridiculously long arms and elite mobility for 6-10. He had two startling drives to the rim that looked Giannis'esque but for the most part, there isnt much offensive skill but alot of mobility and activity on defense. He projects as a switchable rim runner but is a couple of years away. Early 2nd round is ideal for him.

Watch on YouTube

Everything I've read suggests Beringer is going 12-26, definitely not round 2.

The mock draft consensus tracker has him going 30th.

[The Consiglieri]

Noa Essengue is a hard read for me. His production at his age is terrific. He is a physically imposing 6-10 and moves unsually well for his size. He draws fouls at an astronomical rate over multiple leagues. He creates defensive events all over the court and willingly shoots 3s.

What gives me pause? His hands. There are alot of instances where he doesn't catch passes cleanly. He also lacks polished perimeter skills. He is really raw as wing/forward skill wise and I dont know if the foul drawing rafe translates against better athletes who arent overwhelmed by Noa's size/athleticism.

I'm not interested in Essengue. I was intrigued at first with his physical attributes, but he doesn't look like he'll be NBA ready anytime soon if ever. Too awkward, too many holes in his game, lack of perimeter skill and too thin to play on the interior. Doesn't take contact well, has a kind of lackadaisical style of play. Even the interviews I've seen of him he comes across as aloof.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Well in terms of aloof, dude is French.

I'm interested, raw as hell, helps the tank, has a high ceiling and low floor. I'll consider that at 18. Both he and Beringer (and Traore to a lesser extent) have been primary targets for me because I see them as 2-3 year plan prospects that won't hurt the tank in '25-'26 or '26-'27, and offer long term upside potential, and yeah, the floor is much lower than virtually every preferred 2nd round target on this board, but nearly all those targets I've heard about offer the same that we already have in spades and is typically cheap in FA: Competent, floor prospects that provide some utility and zero chance at stardom or even "very goodness".

For me, with zero future stars on the roster currently (although probably 2 of them still have some minute degree of that potential in Sarr, Bilal, and now that I think of it, even AJ), we need to take big fat swings, not settle for walks, and singles. I don't care if we have a great 5th guy on an average team, that is meaningless (other than as a trade chip, which I concede will have value), I'm hunting for hidden stars, even if the chances of that are only 3-8%, look at Dallas/San Antonio/Philly winning this lottery (Cough), that was 1 in 1000 or rigged. So yeah, I'll swing for the fences, period, until we have our star(s), at which point I think we can afford to try and grab singles, doubles and even walks.

[nate33]

I thought the rebounding numbers would give it away that's Beal's college numbers. Point being Johnson is a way better shooter than Beal was coming out of college.

Interesting. Here is their statistical comparison from Tankathon. The numbers are a bit different, not sure why. Tankathon is using per 36:



Beal looks a little better across the board, thanks largely to his superior 2P% and FTA rate, but Tre's ability to shoot threes with accuracy and volume almost makes up for it. Tre Johnson also has a 1.5-inch height advantage and a 2.5-inch wingspan advantage. Once he fills out, he should be able to man the SF position in a pinch, something Beal never really could do.

[dckingsfan]

I’m at the point in the draft process where I like too many players. My brain shorts out. I give up. Let’s just draft them all.

So this. I feel for those in a FO like Brooklyn that has to really continue to pay attention. There must be some interesting debate going on - love to be a fly on the wall...

I usually go the other way at this time of year. I find flaws in everyone and have trouble envisioning any of these guys as full time NBA starters except Flagg and Harper.

Same. But this year is a bit of an exception for me.

I see a bunch of bigs that could be pretty good rotation players that might become good starters. I also see a few good two way players with length that will become good rotation players and possibly good starters.

I think this will end up going down as a pretty decent draft - not a great draft but solid. Who wins? Those teams that are already good and are selecting later in the first round that know how to draft. So, not a great draft for the Wizards as some teams like SA & OKC will get more separation from us. And of course Brooklyn has out done us with the number of picks.

[TGW]

Maluach and Sarr would be an interesting combo. Two tall ass skinny mfers.

Maluauch does not look skinny to me. Dude is suprisingly swoll (pause).

[nate33]

Well in terms of aloof, dude is French.

I'm interested, raw as hell, helps the tank, has a high ceiling and low floor. I'll consider that at 18. Both he and Beringer (and Traore to a lesser extent) have been primary targets for me because I see them as 2-3 year plan prospects that won't hurt the tank in '25-'26 or '26-'27, and offer long term upside potential, and yeah, the floor is much lower than virtually every preferred 2nd round target on this board, but nearly all those targets I've heard about offer the same that we already have in spades and is typically cheap in FA: Competent, floor prospects that provide some utility and zero chance at stardom or even "very goodness".

For me, with zero future stars on the roster currently (although probably 2 of them still have some minute degree of that potential in Sarr, Bilal, and now that I think of it, even AJ), we need to take big fat swings, not settle for walks, and singles. I don't care if we have a great 5th guy on an average team, that is meaningless (other than as a trade chip, which I concede will have value), I'm hunting for hidden stars, even if the chances of that are only 3-8%, look at Dallas/San Antonio/Philly winning this lottery (Cough), that was 1 in 1000 or rigged. So yeah, I'll swing for the fences, period, until we have our star(s), at which point I think we can afford to try and grab singles, doubles and even walks.

I'm generally leery of the French. I think they have been consistently disappointing as NBA players. Here is a list of French players drafted in the last 25 years:



I highlighted the few times that their team was actually happy with the draft pick. Every other pick was either a total bust or a modest disappointment. The jury is still out on Risacher.

Wemby was obviously a big success, but that's just because he is a total outlier physical specimen. Other than that, Bilal is the only guy in the last decade who wasn't either a total bust or a significant disappointment relative to his draft.

[WizarDynasty]

I thought the rebounding numbers would give it away that's Beal's college numbers. Point being Johnson is a way better shooter than Beal was coming out of college.

Interesting. Here is their statistical comparison from Tankathon. The numbers are a bit different, not sure why. Tankathon is using per 36:



Beal looks a little better across the board, thanks largely to his superior 2P% and FTA rate, but Tre's ability to shoot threes with accuracy and volume almost makes up for it. Tre Johnson also has a 1.5-inch height advantage and a 2.5-inch wingspan advantage. Once he fills out, he should be able to man the SF position in a pinch, something Beal never really could do.

8'5 standing reach is not good for a shooting guard, let alone a small forward. 8'11 to 9'1 is elite for small forward. 8'8 to 8'11 is elite for a shooting guard. Standing reach rules for front court positions s/f through center.

[The Consiglieri]

I’m at the point in the draft process where I like too many players. My brain shorts out. I give up. Let’s just draft them all.

So this. I feel for those in a FO like Brooklyn that has to really continue to pay attention. There must be some interesting debate going on - love to be a fly on the wall...

I usually go the other way at this time of year. I find flaws in everyone and have trouble envisioning any of these guys as full time NBA starters except Flagg and Harper.

To me what makes this year unusual is there is such a strong mix of high floor pretty decent upside guys, with guys that have crazy ceilings and crazy floors, and that it's somewhere in the neighborhood of everybody 6-28ish, which produces this weird sense of: how to handle this class? Someone posted about their disappointment about how weak it is after the top 2/top 4, and my counter yesterday and today, is that it isn't that its weak, its just immensely deep in attractive options that are so so so similar in terms of value and/or risk, that you end up with a good 10-15 guys with really high floors and utility, and a much larger group than usual of high ceiling guys with really crappy floors.

What do you do with a Fears? A kid that young that took over Oklahoma, and unlike the Harper/Bailey team at Rutgers, actually took them to NCAA tournament? What do you do with Kon? I don't want him, but normally that guy is probably more attractive. What do you do with these Euro's, especially with word that next years suck? What do you do with the pile of interesting but limited guys, or the scary PG's with low floors like Demin and Kasparas? What do you do with Queen, what do you do with the insane profile but limited minutes of Carter Bryant, or the guy I constantly mix him up with: Murray-Boyles? There are SO MANY guys that would typically go in a lot of drafts in that 9-15 zone: I feel like there are around 20-25 guys this year that would be comfortably in the bottom of the top 10 to bottom of the teens in most drafts, but are all just piled into a clown car in this draft, and will thus flow downward to the end of round 1 and possibly early round 2. This might have been a much better draft to have an early 2nd than usual, I'm a bit annoyed we gave ours to Boston.

[AFM]

I thought the rebounding numbers would give it away that's Beal's college numbers. Point being Johnson is a way better shooter than Beal was coming out of college.

Interesting. Here is their statistical comparison from Tankathon. The numbers are a bit different, not sure why. Tankathon is using per 36:



Beal looks a little better across the board, thanks largely to his superior 2P% and FTA rate, but Tre's ability to shoot threes with accuracy and volume almost makes up for it. Tre Johnson also has a 1.5-inch height advantage and a 2.5-inch wingspan advantage. Once he fills out, he should be able to man the SF position in a pinch, something Beal never really could do.

8'5 standing reach is not good for a shooting guard, let alone a small forward. 8'11 to 9'1 is elite for small forward. 8'8 to 8'11 is elite for a shooting guard. Standing reach rules for front court positions s/f through center.

Well, Beal had an 8'4 standing reach...

[dckingsfan]

Well in terms of aloof, dude is French.

I'm interested, raw as hell, helps the tank, has a high ceiling and low floor. I'll consider that at 18. Both he and Beringer (and Traore to a lesser extent) have been primary targets for me because I see them as 2-3 year plan prospects that won't hurt the tank in '25-'26 or '26-'27, and offer long term upside potential, and yeah, the floor is much lower than virtually every preferred 2nd round target on this board, but nearly all those targets I've heard about offer the same that we already have in spades and is typically cheap in FA: Competent, floor prospects that provide some utility and zero chance at stardom or even "very goodness".

For me, with zero future stars on the roster currently (although probably 2 of them still have some minute degree of that potential in Sarr, Bilal, and now that I think of it, even AJ), we need to take big fat swings, not settle for walks, and singles. I don't care if we have a great 5th guy on an average team, that is meaningless (other than as a trade chip, which I concede will have value), I'm hunting for hidden stars, even if the chances of that are only 3-8%, look at Dallas/San Antonio/Philly winning this lottery (Cough), that was 1 in 1000 or rigged. So yeah, I'll swing for the fences, period, until we have our star(s), at which point I think we can afford to try and grab singles, doubles and even walks.

I'm generally leery of the French. I think they have been consistently disappointing as NBA players. Here is a list of French players drafted in the last 25 years:



I highlighted the few times that their team was actually happy with the draft pick. Every other pick was either a total bust or a modest disappointment. The jury is still out on Risacher.

Wemby was obviously a big success, but that's just because he is a total outlier physical specimen. Other than that, Bilal is the only guy in the last decade who wasn't either a total bust or a significant disappointment relative to his draft.

Filtering the list and taking out the SRPs, it isn't that bad, no?