2025 NBA Draft Discussion Part 7

[RoteSchroder]

I love him too. I would definitely look at trading one of our guards to pick him in the mid-late first

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His scoring is quite ugly here, bball IQ might not quite be there, probably best suited as a defensive role player. His 3 point shooting isn’t where I’d want it to be for an older rookie either. He should be serviceable, but I don’t see anything particularly special on O

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That’s so interesting. I see a lot of finding himself to good looks, fouls and opportunities for his teammates. He also went for 16 pts, 17 rbs, 5 stocks in a win. Check out what Rasheer did this same game… not pretty.

Yaxel is also at like 36% on threes. Not bad for a do it all player that takes a lot of his attempts off the dribble.

I don't want Fleming either

Probably just this game (picked a random one to look at), but Yaxel went 5-16 with 3 AST/7 TO here.

Seems like a role player on O, I wouldn't want him in a large decision making role with the ball in his hands. He averaged 1.9 3PA at 35.7% from the field. The volume seems pretty low. Not sure what his catch-and-shoot splits are, but for an older rookie, I'd want the 3 point shooting to be less theoretical.

I mean, he's perfectly fine with a lower pick, but there are probably several others I'd target before him.

[dohboy_24]

Somebody needs to post a Tahaad highlights in here, i wished i knew how to do it lol

Season Highlights:

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Scouting Report:

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Player Skills Breakdown:

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NBA Draft Combine Hightlights:

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Pro Day Workout:

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[Mark_83]

In another Bargnani thread, someone brought up the old Caliper Profile article, where basically they slobbered all over Bargnani's knob as being the most incredible, elite, fearless demon-monster this side of Wilt Chamberlain. Here's the relevant section:

"The test showed that Bargnani is virtually oblivious to what others think of him. And his tremendous ability to block out such potentially negative pressures enables him to focus completely on the task at hand. So the expectations and anxieties that come with being the No.1 pick, or the only Italian-born player in the league, or even taking a game-winning shot, don't even register with him.

Then, there's this from Dr Greenberg, the founder of the Caliper Test:

That's the kind of thing we're very, very proud of. We did some … I wouldn't say “arm twisting,” because they liked him, but they knew they'd get a lot of criticism for drafting him. I can tell you right now: He will be one of the top eight or ten centers in NBA history.”

The link to a pdf. of the profile itself is here: http://www.caliperonline.com/brochures/Caliper%20Profile%20Users%20Guide.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;.

The majority of my degree work is in neuroscience, but I have a pretty solid basis now in psychology and especially psychometrics because of my general area of interest, so I took a look at what the Caliper Profile actually measures, and whether or not this is pseudoscientific BS.

At any rate, here are the profile aspects: Abstract Reasoning, Accommodation, Aggressiveness, Assertiveness, Cautiousness, Ego-Drive, Ego-Strength Resilience, Empathy, External Structure, Flexibility, Gregariousness, Idea Orientation, Risk Taking, Self-Structure/Self-Discipline, Scepticism, Sociability, Thoroughness and Urgency.

Here's the basketball relevant portion:

Based on what the article says, Bargnani's rated as being oblivious to what others think of him. This seems like a mix of their measure on Ego-Strength Resilience and Accommodation. Both sound like BS models that have no legitimate scientific basis used by the profile. Basically, Bargnani could well have tested very well on this measure. But as a scientist, I would say you should trust this as an accurate description of who he is basically as much as you should trust the opinion of your local witch doctor.

They don't say much else about his test result, but at least in that portion, Bargnani performed well on the equivalent of a dude asking you questions about how much you care what others think about you and then translating this into "he will the the most cold blooded assassin in professional sports."

[BoyzNTheHood]

This whole discourse reminds me of when Bargnani registered the highest ever score for any prospect at the time on the caliper test, and we were told this meant that he had unreal amounts of focus and mental strength. Turns out he likely wasn't affected by failure because he was brain dead and just didn't give a ****.

You seem to think he was used incorrectly, not that he didn’t care.

[Mark_83]

This whole discourse reminds me of when Bargnani registered the highest ever score for any prospect at the time on the caliper test, and we were told this meant that he had unreal amounts of focus and mental strength. Turns out he likely wasn't affected by failure because he was brain dead and just didn't give a ****.

You seem to think he was used incorrectly, not that he didn’t care.

Tell me you score low in reading comprehension without telling me you score low in reading comprehension.

[Brinbe]

so much noise by agents, media, etc. tough to filter who is a legit prospect and who is just hype.

Well and truly Qyntel Woods season. We've been through this for decades at this point. At the end of the day, the tape is the tape on these guys regardless of what they do in open gym highlight film against zero defenders

[RoteSchroder]

Might be a hot take too (maybe not so much anymore) but give me Yang over Malauch. Both 7'2, but ill take skill over length every time

Yang might be a little more skilled right now but he seems a little slow defensively. Your Center needs to be a defensive anchor if you want to be a great defensive team in the NBA.

He averaged 5 blocks per game in the U19 FIBA World Cup, highest in the tournament. He would need to follow the Zubac, Marc Gasol, Brook Lopez style of defense with drop coverage. If it gets bad to the point where he's un-startable, then I think he takes on an Olynyk role as his floor. His interior defense at least should be a plus.

[BoyzNTheHood]

This whole discourse reminds me of when Bargnani registered the highest ever score for any prospect at the time on the caliper test, and we were told this meant that he had unreal amounts of focus and mental strength. Turns out he likely wasn't affected by failure because he was brain dead and just didn't give a ****.

You seem to think he was used incorrectly, not that he didn’t care.

Tell me you score low in reading comprehension without telling me you score low in reading comprehension.

Feel free to educate me on how to reduce my reading comprehension yourself. You’re definitely struggling. You were a Bargnani supporter bud. It’s pretty easy for the average Joe to comprehend, but not everyone’s able to achieve average.

[Grew]

Somebody needs to post a Tahaad highlights in here, i wished i knew how to do it lol

Here you go.

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I don't understand people ranking Jase a full round ahead of Pettiford after watching him play. I just don't see where that gap is.

To me it mostly seems like people can see Jalen Brunson type things in Jase. Pettiford gives me Brandon Jennings vibes. Jase was also ridiculously efficient, with a very high free throw rate. I could see both end up being picked in the teens. They are both nice players, but at that size you have to be sooooo good offensively because people are just going to try and body you, even if they are dogs on D, weight and strength is going to limit them for at least a few years. So Jase being so efficient might point to him being good enough to overcome the fact he will be targeted.

[Grew]

I still haven't had the time to look into Coward. People are calling him this years Jalen Williams but every Jalen highlight from college was him with the ball in his hands, cooking people on the perimeter and dunking all over everyone. From what I'm hearing about Coward he was more of a 3+D guy in college even if he was very efficient at it.

Anyways I guess my point is, he's no Jalen Williams if he can't create with the ball. Maybe he's more of a Nesmith? Does this guy have creation upside or not? What do you think?

[Mark_83]

You seem to think he was used incorrectly, not that he didn’t care.

Tell me you score low in reading comprehension without telling me you score low in reading comprehension.

Feel free to educate me on how to reduce my reading comprehension yourself. You’re definitely struggling. You were a Bargnani supporter bud. It’s pretty easy for the average Joe to comprehend, but not everyone’s able to achieve average.

Guess you're well below the average Joe then, Doughboy. Almost Joe Biden levels of low IQ.

[mtcan]

This seems like self doubt to me. A guy who can get into his own head and destroy his own confidence. Pro athletes need to be almost ignorant to their shortcomings.

That is maturity to me.

Like he says in the short video somewhere a few posts above...as he says 90-95% of guys aren't going to be star players and certainly not right away. You have to hang your hat on something and for him...it's defence. I like that. Especially with his journey to get to the draft...he knows better than anyone else. I appreciate that.

It’s definitely mature… for the average person.

No...it speaks to his journey from a D3 recruit to a guy who is certain to get first round pick or lottery pick money. That is a humbling experience to start from where he started so it shows maturity. Irrational confidence is the flip side and that doesn't always end well.

Self doubt is how a lot of people motivate themselves to be better and to work harder.

I realize I'm not 6'6 with a 7 foot wingspan but we all find different ways to motivate ourselves and whether it's basketball or whatever profession you work in...the pressures to perform and improve are the same. Whether it's putting a ball in a basket vs saving a patient's life vs winning a case for a client in court...we all get up for the occasion when it matters and whatever it takes to get us up to the moment.

[BoyzNTheHood]

Tell me you score low in reading comprehension without telling me you score low in reading comprehension.

Feel free to educate me on how to reduce my reading comprehension yourself. You’re definitely struggling. You were a Bargnani supporter bud. It’s pretty easy for the average Joe to comprehend, but not everyone’s able to achieve average.

Guess you're well below the average Joe then, Doughboy. Almost Joe Biden levels of low IQ.

[Mark_83]

Feel free to educate me on how to reduce my reading comprehension yourself. You’re definitely struggling. You were a Bargnani supporter bud. It’s pretty easy for the average Joe to comprehend, but not everyone’s able to achieve average.

Guess you're well below the average Joe then, Doughboy. Almost Joe Biden levels of low IQ.

Agreed.

[BoyzNTheHood]

That is maturity to me.

Like he says in the short video somewhere a few posts above...as he says 90-95% of guys aren't going to be star players and certainly not right away. You have to hang your hat on something and for him...it's defence. I like that. Especially with his journey to get to the draft...he knows better than anyone else. I appreciate that.

It’s definitely mature… for the average person.

No...it speaks to his journey from a D3 recruit to a guy who is certain to get first round pick or lottery pick money. That is a humbling experience to start from where he started so it shows maturity. Irrational confidence is the flip side and that doesn't always end well.

Self doubt is how a lot of people motivate themselves to be better and to work harder.

I realize I'm not 6'6 with a 7 foot wingspan but we all find different ways to motivate ourselves and whether it's basketball or whatever profession you work in...the pressures to perform and improve are the same. Whether it's putting a ball in a basket vs saving a patient's life vs winning a case for a client in court...we all get up for the occasion when it matters and whatever it takes to get us up to the moment.

Like I said, we’re average people so this is maturity for us. For a pro athlete, not so much.

[mademan]

Coward measures out with real SF size . With his effeciency and maturity, he's one of the few i see as a floor as a starter unless things go horribly wrong. 70 TS% from a wing putting up 5 threes a game is absolutely wild

[BoyzNTheHood]

Guess you're well below the average Joe then, Doughboy. Almost Joe Biden levels of low IQ.

Agreed.

[mtcan]

It’s definitely mature… for the average person.

No...it speaks to his journey from a D3 recruit to a guy who is certain to get first round pick or lottery pick money. That is a humbling experience to start from where he started so it shows maturity. Irrational confidence is the flip side and that doesn't always end well.

Self doubt is how a lot of people motivate themselves to be better and to work harder.

I realize I'm not 6'6 with a 7 foot wingspan but we all find different ways to motivate ourselves and whether it's basketball or whatever profession you work in...the pressures to perform and improve are the same. Whether it's putting a ball in a basket vs saving a patient's life vs winning a case for a client in court...we all get up for the occasion when it matters and whatever it takes to get us up to the moment.

Like I said, we’re average people so this is maturity for us. For a pro athlete, not so much.

Nah...no difference. Whether you are a surgeon, an athlete, a lawyer, a CEO...it's all the same. Human beings with high pressure jobs...and I know enough people that are the best at what they do but constantly feel the need to get better because they don't feel they are good enough yet. To recognize that is a positive trait.

[BoyzNTheHood]

Coward measures out with real SF size . With his effeciency and maturity, he's one of the few i see as a floor as a starter unless things go horribly wrong. 70 TS% from a wing putting up 5 threes a game is absolutely wild

The 70 ts% is based on 6 games

[BoyzNTheHood]

No...it speaks to his journey from a D3 recruit to a guy who is certain to get first round pick or lottery pick money. That is a humbling experience to start from where he started so it shows maturity. Irrational confidence is the flip side and that doesn't always end well.

Self doubt is how a lot of people motivate themselves to be better and to work harder.

I realize I'm not 6'6 with a 7 foot wingspan but we all find different ways to motivate ourselves and whether it's basketball or whatever profession you work in...the pressures to perform and improve are the same. Whether it's putting a ball in a basket vs saving a patient's life vs winning a case for a client in court...we all get up for the occasion when it matters and whatever it takes to get us up to the moment.

Like I said, we’re average people so this is maturity for us. For a pro athlete, not so much.

Nah...no difference. Whether you are a surgeon, an athlete, a lawyer, a CEO...it's all the same. Human beings with high pressure jobs...and I know enough people that are the best at what they do but constantly feel the need to get better because they don't feel they are good enough yet.

I disagree. It’s only a positive trait for average people like us.